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Pokémon Movepool Oddities & Explanations
- Thread starter Kurona
- Start date
Every pokemon has EV gain, even mythicals, starters and event-only ones that you have never been able to actually fight.
It's prolly just futureproofing in case they get added as encounters, or spawned via hacks.
I remember someone pointing out in a conversation here that the names weren't really "names" in Japanese either, but kind of presented as names regardless. Like how the futuer paradoxes dont have spacing and how the past paradox names are shown as a single "word" but are a phrase?
Maybe I'm getting some stuff mixed up, though. My bad.
Ah, if I remember correctly, that was me explaining to another user what makes Paradox Pokemon names unusual in Japanese, as they didn't see how they were. In English, we would put spaces to distinguish Japanese words that have been romanized, but Japanese doesn't normally use spaces at all in sentences, which contributed to the confusion. While we might write, say, Roaring Moon's JP name as "Todoroku Tsuki", in katakana it'sトドロクツキ, and for someone unfamiliar with Japanese word structures, it's basically indistinguishable from any other name. But it's actually pretty much equivalent to how Roaring Moon appears compared to other English names.
Ceruledge not having Sharpness and Armarouge not having Mega Launcher is a missed opportunity both from a flavor sense and in-game text, especially the latter because Mega Launcher has only been available on the Clauncher line currently.
Bitter Blade gets boosted by Sharpness, too. Would have been pretty sweet.
yeah it's really weird. When I first saw Sharpness was an abilitiy, I thought for sure it would be on Ceruledge . And hell, Armarouge already has all the major Pulse moves: Aura Sphere, Dark Pulse, Dragon Pulse
It's not like they don't have room, either, the whole line only has 2 abilities. Just give Charcadet some misc third ability that becomes them.
I think they might have hit the text limit. As far as I know, Fossilized Drake is one of the longest Item names being 16 letters long (counting the space). Fossilized Plesio would be 17 letters long, and I don't think "Plesi" or "Pleso" would sound quite right. At the end of the day they just decided to go with "Dino", my guess focusing on the "Saur" part of "Plesiosaur" as a compromise.
Not only can Me First be used while holding an Assault Vest, but apparently it can trigger Sucker Punch and isn't blocked by Taunt. Seemingly the only time this status move actually behaves like a status move is when it's being boosted by Prankster.
From what it looks like, most birds which get it are Dark-type, most other non-Dark-type Pokemon which get it are mammalian (notably canids & felines) with a few alligators or other big lizards. The Japanese name of the move is "Bark Out" (the actual Japanese name being a transliteration: Baku Auto). So it seems like GF may have a very specific sound they're thinking about when it comes to that move, probably something akin to a rough bark or low growl. However it is a decent Dark-type Move so they also don't want to lock out any Dark-type which could make use of it. So, in that regard, I think these are the true oddities who do get it: G-Slowking, Seviper, H-Braviary, Golisopod, Cinderace.
Gen 8 & Gen 9 marked a big shift in how they looked at Snarl, which was generally just the Dark Type + Dog(/Dog Adjacent) move. Now things like the Spoink line, Slowking-G, Cinderace, etc etc all get it. Notable Chatot also got the move in LA (the only Pokemon that wasn't dark, related to dark, a dog or could become Dark type) , so really Squawkabilly should get the move, especially since it's a jerk pokemon. It even gets Parting Shot, which is basically Snarl's move cousin.
Also, another thing against Squawkabilly getting it: Category. Squawkabilly's Attack stat is way higher than its Special Attack. Yes, Snarl's decrease of Special Attack is a handy utility move, but with Squawkabilly also having a low Special Defense I don't think it'll make a difference. If Squawkabilly wants Dark-type coverage, Thief would be its go-to move (which arguably has a better utility as stolen item can't be returned by switching out); Foul Play if you're banking on the opponents you plan to use it on having higher Attack. And while Parting Shot may not do damage, it decreases both Attack & Special Attack be 1 stage while also switching out Squawkabilly, which considering its defenses it would very much like to do if it faces an opponent which hits hard.
Most things only run Snarl for the Special Attack drop, specifically in doubles where it hits both opponents. The damage was never the point.
Also they give moves out like this all the time. They do things just as much for flavor as they do support to others or support to self.
For example Squawkabilly has several special moves despite abysmal special attack...which is nothing new to the series!
Right, I forgot Snarl hit both opponents.
BTW, I do agree Squawkabilly should get it, I'm just thinking why GF wouldn't have given Snarl to it initially. I also wouldn't be surprised if odd exclusions & inclusions are done because batches of Pokemon are handled by one/two/few people and its their sole decision which Moves the Pokemon they were assigned get. So it's not all of GF that decided Squawkabilly shouldn't get Snarl, it's just this one/two/few people at the time of giving it its moves decided Snarl's flavor didn't fit Squawkabilly. And while there's likely a second group which checks movesets, it's easier to spot an odd move which was given than a move which wasn't included but would fit.
So I was looking at Tentacruel's movepool and noticed it can learn Hex.
Naturally, I thought this was weird due to the move's flavor. You would think this would be restricted to Ghosts and other occult-flavored Pokémon, not a squid/jellyfish thing. However, the direct translation of the move's name (according to Bulbapedia) is Evil Eye, and while some other weird Pokémon get it (like Nidoking and Nidoqueen), you can kind of see how that would make a tiny bit of sense. So the qualifications seem to be "vaguely sinister" and "has a face". I didn't think much of it. Then I scrolled down Bulbapedia's page on Hex to see what else can learn the move and saw Nihilego.
Nihilego doesn't have a face, let alone eyes. How is it using Hex.
Oh and Dhelmise too, I guess. But it's a Ghost-type with round glass parts that can pass for eyes so whatever.
Naturally, I thought this was weird due to the move's flavor. You would think this would be restricted to Ghosts and other occult-flavored Pokémon, not a squid/jellyfish thing. However, the direct translation of the move's name (according to Bulbapedia) is Evil Eye, and while some other weird Pokémon get it (like Nidoking and Nidoqueen), you can kind of see how that would make a tiny bit of sense. So the qualifications seem to be "vaguely sinister" and "has a face". I didn't think much of it. Then I scrolled down Bulbapedia's page on Hex to see what else can learn the move and saw Nihilego.
Nihilego doesn't have a face, let alone eyes. How is it using Hex.
Oh and Dhelmise too, I guess. But it's a Ghost-type with round glass parts that can pass for eyes so whatever.
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You mean like Venoshock?
A bunch of random Poison-types do get Hex, but it's still weird when they have a move for that specific scenario already.
Except the term "evil eye" is meant to be a turn of phrase for giving a funny look, and is a Ghost-type attack for its other meaning related to supernaturally-fueled misfortune. Nihilego fits neither criteria. It's basically an alien parasite.
Nihilego do have "eyes", they're at the ends of some of their tentacles. It's more noticable with Mother Beast Lusamine.
Honestly since Hex is meant to synergize with Pokemon associated with trickery, cruelty, and status moves, the bigger question is why Dunsparce, Castform, Gallade, and Iron Valiant learn it, especially those last two since the other members of the Ralts line don't learn it despite the entire line having some Ghost moves most Psychic types don't normally get.
Honestly since Hex is meant to synergize with Pokemon associated with trickery, cruelty, and status moves, the bigger question is why Dunsparce, Castform, Gallade, and Iron Valiant learn it, especially those last two since the other members of the Ralts line don't learn it despite the entire line having some Ghost moves most Psychic types don't normally get.
It's worth noting that all non-Nihilego jellyfish mons (tentacool line, frillish line, toedscool line) all learn Hex by level, so Nihilego getting it by TM could just be that the move is associated with its body type. Not sure if those are supposed to be eyes in the base form as Mother Beast is also shown with bubbles at the end of some tentacles entirely distinct from the eye patterns (also, were those used to manipulate her pokeballs in her battle intro or am I misremebering?)
Castform shares design inspiration with Shuppet, and only learns Hex by breeding.
If I had to guess for Gallade and Valiant, it would be that they focus more on their opponents compared to Gardevoir being entirely focused on protecting their charge. It's interesting to note that Gallade did not learn Hex in gen 8 despite both the mon and the TM existing, so Gallade may have gotten it in response to Valiant getting access.
Castform shares design inspiration with Shuppet, and only learns Hex by breeding.
If I had to guess for Gallade and Valiant, it would be that they focus more on their opponents compared to Gardevoir being entirely focused on protecting their charge. It's interesting to note that Gallade did not learn Hex in gen 8 despite both the mon and the TM existing, so Gallade may have gotten it in response to Valiant getting access.
RE: Hex
I generally take TM moves to be a lot looser in adhering to flavor than natural learnset. In the case of Hex, my explanation would be that natural learners tend to be Pokemon who can/will themselves give you a stare down or intimidating look based on their face and biology. Tentacruel and most of the ghosts seem self-explanatory enough on this front.
For TM learners of the move, the move comes from the Pokemon itself inspiring intimidation in the recipient whether or not the Pokemon is trying to put on such an appearance. Several learners don't necessarily allude to being directly aggressive like Galarian Moltres or Crobat (Crobat's entries even play up heavily that it preys on creatures stealthily to the point of sometimes being missed whilst biting a victim), but if you see the sight of them, it's incredibly unnerving knowing what they are and what they do (Galarian Moltres definitely looking very sinister compared to its more benign/majestic Kanto counterpart). Nihilego could fit into this category simply because the lack of a conventional face and its bizarre alien behavior is unnerving, on top of the simple fear of "oh my god flying 1m Jellyfish Aliens are trying to eat me" most people would see with them or the Mother Beast.
I generally take TM moves to be a lot looser in adhering to flavor than natural learnset. In the case of Hex, my explanation would be that natural learners tend to be Pokemon who can/will themselves give you a stare down or intimidating look based on their face and biology. Tentacruel and most of the ghosts seem self-explanatory enough on this front.
For TM learners of the move, the move comes from the Pokemon itself inspiring intimidation in the recipient whether or not the Pokemon is trying to put on such an appearance. Several learners don't necessarily allude to being directly aggressive like Galarian Moltres or Crobat (Crobat's entries even play up heavily that it preys on creatures stealthily to the point of sometimes being missed whilst biting a victim), but if you see the sight of them, it's incredibly unnerving knowing what they are and what they do (Galarian Moltres definitely looking very sinister compared to its more benign/majestic Kanto counterpart). Nihilego could fit into this category simply because the lack of a conventional face and its bizarre alien behavior is unnerving, on top of the simple fear of "oh my god flying 1m Jellyfish Aliens are trying to eat me" most people would see with them or the Mother Beast.
I definitely concur with Valiant, given it's supposed to be an incredibly vicious and cruel Pokemon, the sight of it SHOULD terrify a weakened-by-status opponent especially. Gallade meanwhile could be explained as being a more direct/offensive protectiveness: if they happen upon you injured by a wild Pokemon, Gardevoir would jump to your defense with stuff like barriers or getting you away, while Gallade would probably beat down the opponent to keep them off you. If I really wanted to go English-student on this, this could even reflect in the effectiveness of the stat totals; Gallade is noble so an angry look from him is rarer and less foreboding, while Iron Valiant is a killing machine so just the idea it will attack you is more plausible and more dangerous a thought.
I just looked through the Treasures of Ruin's Abilities and noticed something odd.
Chi-Yu (Bead Fire Fish)'s Ability decreases Special Defense, which goes with it having a high Special Attack stat.
Chien-Po (Sword Snow Weasel)'s Ability decreases Defense, which goes with it having a high Attack stat.
Makes sense so far, but then:
Wo-Chien (Tablet Plant Snail)'s Ability decreases Attack, but it's highest defense stat is Special Defense (though has a respectable Defense stat).
Ting-Lu (Vessel Rock Elk)'s Ability decreases Special Attack, but it's highest defense stat is physical Defense with a moderate Special Defense (though it has a lot of HP)
So, was this a mistake or purposely done to help their lower defense stat?
Chi-Yu (Bead Fire Fish)'s Ability decreases Special Defense, which goes with it having a high Special Attack stat.
Chien-Po (Sword Snow Weasel)'s Ability decreases Defense, which goes with it having a high Attack stat.
Makes sense so far, but then:
Wo-Chien (Tablet Plant Snail)'s Ability decreases Attack, but it's highest defense stat is Special Defense (though has a respectable Defense stat).
Ting-Lu (Vessel Rock Elk)'s Ability decreases Special Attack, but it's highest defense stat is physical Defense with a moderate Special Defense (though it has a lot of HP)
So, was this a mistake or purposely done to help their lower defense stat?
Should be done on purpose.
For offensive pokemon, being "mixed" doesn't really solve anything, requires too much investment to be able to hit on both sides. So being focused on a single type (special/phisical) is optimal.
For defensive ones however, being able to sponge both sides is a premium. It is not uncommon to invest in the lower defensive stat rather than the higher one if one is already very high since it's often better to turn a 2hko in a 3hko (or prevent 1hkos) than to turn a 3hko in a 4hko, unless a mon is designed to be a dedicated special/phis wall and the meta requires one.
Ultimately being able to sponge both sides with high effectiveness is more productive than being able to hit from both sides.
Works much better for Ting-Lu since it has a decent typing and isn't passive though, Wo-Chien's 4x U-Turn weakness is kinda unfortunate on a defensive mon, no matter how much you can beef that defense...