Victim of the Week v2, Kyurem

[ShootingStarmie]

To be honest, I like to think that a lot of Pokemon in the BW2 metagame are un-counter able. Like the above poster said, Haxorus can get past Skarmory, considered to be it's best counter. That being said, in BW2 OU, we often find ourselves checking threats with priority, faster Pokemon, or bulky hard hitters. So, the best way to deal with Haxorus is with a Choice Scarf user, or priority. Here are some examples

Mamoswine @ Life Orb
Trait: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Ice Shard
- Icicle Spear
- Earthquake
- Superpower

Mamoswine easily beats Haxorus one on one with it's powerful Ice Shard. While Mamoswine can't switch in directly, it easily forces it out. Mamoswine can even revenge kill boosted Haxorus, thanks to priority ignoring speed tiers.

Scizor @ Choice Band
Trait: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 HP / 4 SDef
Adamant Nature
- U-turn
- Bullet Punch
- Pursuit
- Superpower

Scizor is probably one of Haxorus' best checks, as it can come in on Haxorus' attacks pretty nicely, and can revenge kill Haxorus even if it has set up. It also makes the Haxorus user think twice before spamming Outrage.

Garchomp (M) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
Jolly Nature
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Dragon Claw

Garchomp naturally out speeds Haxorus, and easily forces it out as even at +1 thanks to Choice Scarf making it faster still. Garchomp is bulky enough to switch into Haxorus' attacks bar Outrage, so it's a pretty decent check.

So yeah, checking Haxorus is a much easier job than outright countering it.

 

[Alter]

Cresselia @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SAtk
Bold Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SAtk / 30 Spd
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Moonlight
- Thunder Wave / Reflect

Obviously this is to be used under Sun but it is a really great Haxorus check. It has a full-out immunity to Earthquake which forces Haxorus to use Outrage which, by the way, Cresselia can easily heal the damage of with Moonlight. The is the standard OU Cress set apart from Thunder Wave used of Haxorus to screw it up if it tries to sweep later and lets Cresselia use its attacks first. Ice Beam is the tool used to hurt Haxorus, dishing out enough damage to 2-3hko Haxorus. While Haxorus does around 73% on average with its +2 outrage, it can get stalled out with Moonlight + leftovers and has the chance of hitting itself in confusion. Obviously running Reflect completely halves the damage that Haxorus can do to Cresselia, allowing it to even take on the boosted variants of Haxorus. All in all, Cresselia is a great check to physical dragons and Haxorus is no exception to this rule. The most troublesome set would probably be one with Taunt but Ice Beam manages to 2hko 4 / 0 variants anyway after rocks 100% of the time anyway.

 

[pom]

Cresselia @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SAtk
Bold Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SAtk / 30 Spd
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Moonlight
- Thunder Wave / Reflect

Obviously this is to be used under Sun but it is a really great Haxorus check. It has a full-out immunity to Earthquake which forces Haxorus to use Outrage which, by the way, Cresselia can easily heal the damage of with Moonlight. The is the standard OU Cress set apart from Thunder Wave used of Haxorus to screw it up if it tries to sweep later and lets Cresselia use its attacks first. Ice Beam is the tool used to hurt Haxorus, dishing out enough damage to 2-3hko Haxorus. While Haxorus does around 73% on average with its +2 outrage, it can get stalled out with Moonlight + leftovers and has the chance of hitting itself in confusion. Obviously running Reflect completely halves the damage that Haxorus can do to Cresselia, allowing it to even take on the boosted variants of Haxorus. All in all, Cresselia is a great check to physical dragons and Haxorus is no exception to this rule. The most troublesome set would probably be one with Taunt but Ice Beam manages to 2hko 4 / 0 variants anyway after rocks 100% of the time anyway.

Mold Breaker makes Haxo ignore Levitate, so it can be hit by EQ. Still though, Cress bulks it well.

 

[Prinz]

will update things tomorrow :)

 

[Prinz]

Ok so the next victim is Kyurem (not Kyurem-B, the "normal" form), will update everything later I guess, you guys can begin to discuss bout it even now, if you want. Sorry for the delay.

The next victim is Haxorus! You can start by now to discuss bout it, I will edit the op in the weekend with all the stuff (sorry, I am really busy these days :C)

Kyurem
125 Hp / 130 Atk / 90 Def / 130 Satk / 90 Spd / 95 Spe
Ability: Pressure

Kyurem isn't a bad mon in general, it has a good bulk and powerful STAB to hit hard opps, in BW2 it also gains Roost and Earth Power which are reeeally useful, Roost allows to recover some HP and it makes the SubRoost set p good, while Earth Power allows to hit Steel-types like Jirachi for a decent damage. It's weak to Stealth Rock and to priority moves but it's still a cool choice for many teams nowadays.​

 

[ShootingStarmie]

Right...Kyurem. Here's my counter...

Scizor!

Scizor @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 HP / 4 SDef
Adamant Nature
- U-turn
- Bullet Punch
- Pursuit
- Superpower

Scizor resists both of Kyurem STABs and easily OHKOs with Bullet Punch after Stealth Rock. The worst Kyurem can do to Scizor is hit it with a Focus Blast or an Earth Power. Focus Blast has shaky accuracy and doesn't even 2HKO most of the time. Earth Power come no where near close to 2HKOing. Scizor can also gain a ton of momentum if the Kyurem user switches, and if Kyurem is at low enough health, Scizor can even Pursuit trap it.

So yeah, best offensive counter imo

 

[Dr Ciel]

Alright, my turn

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 224 SDef / 32 Spd
Careful Nature
- Iron Head
- Body Slam
- Wish
- Stealth Rock

Jirachi resists both of Kyurem-C's STAB moves & takes them both nicely, then out-speeding everything but the Choice Scarf set (Correct me if I'm wrong) & 2HKOing it with a STAB Iron Head. The worst thing Kyu-C can do to this thing is a Modest Earth Power, which only is a 3HKO, even after Stealth Rock, meanwhile, if using the Scarf set, Focus Blast has shaky accuracy, as previously mentioned, & even if it does hit, it does barely 30%. So while Kyu-C is struggling to KO this thing, Jirachi just summons a Wish & recovers health, which makes it all the harder for the ice beast to beat the pixie.

 

[ShootingStarmie]

out-speeding everything but the Choice Scarf set (Correct me if I'm wrong)

Since you asked me to, Kyurem runs a minimum of 224 speed on standard sets, so no, you don't out speed it.

 

[Nysyr]

SpDef roost scizor is a better counter than Bandzor.

 

[Halcyon.]

Yeah, Banded Scizor isn't that good of a counter to Kyurem in my experience. Whenever I was using Kyurem and Scizor would switch in, I would obviously just sub up on the switch, meaning I could just Earth Power the next turn. It's also important to note that Scizor can switch into Stealth Rock only once before it is 2HKOed by Earth Power. This means that the situation normally goes like this:

Kyurem comes in
Pokémon A gets forced out and switches to Scizor
Kyurem uses Substitute
Scizor Bullet Punches and breaks the Sub
Kyurem uses Earth Power
Kyurem switches out, taking advantage of Scizor being locked into BP

Now Scizor cannot switch in again or it faces a large 87% chance of being KOed by the next round of SR + Earth Power. In my experience, Nysyr is correct, SDef Scizor with Roost / BP / Bug Bite / SD is a much better counter to Kyurem. It doesn't get 2HKOed by Earth Power, and isn't forced to switch out because it isn't locked into BP. In fact, it can actually set up on Kyurem!

 

[magic123]

Hey guys,can you think of a full-on counter to a specs set of Draco Meteor/Earth Power/HP Fire/Ice Beam?I mean,the Substitute set is pretty easy to check to be honest.Here are a few random calcs:

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 236+ SpD Jirachi: 236-278 (58.41 - 68.81%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 236+ SpD Jirachi: 184-218 (45.54 - 53.96%) -- 50.78% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 216 SpD Scizor: 476-564 (138.37 - 163.95%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Hidden Power Fire vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Scizor in rain: 296-352 (86.29 - 102.62%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

(Assuming that 2 Draco Meteors have a total power of 210 Base,lets say Move 1 is a 210 base power special dragon move)

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem (Move 1) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Tyranitar in sand: 271-319 (67.07 - 78.96%)

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem (Move 1) vs. 180 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in sand: 376-444 (97.4 - 115.02%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Tyranitar in sand: 156-184 (38.61 - 45.54%) -- 76.56% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and (1 Layer of)Spikes

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Earth Power vs. 180 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in sand: 216-256 (55.95 - 66.32%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Just considering one set defeats the purpose of this thread.Consider other sets as well.

EDIT:Whoops,forgot to include leftovers on Tyranitar.I really don't feel like picking up my calculator right now,but I think its like a 50% chance to 2HKO with Draco without Stealth rock.

EDIT:The calculations are now fixed because they now include sand.Some other Tyranitar sets are also included.

 

[Halcyon.]

Hey guys,can you think of a full-on counter to a specs set of Draco Meteor/Earth Power/HP Fire/Ice Beam?I mean,the Substitute set is pretty easy to check to be honest.Here are a few random calcs:

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 236+ SpD Jirachi: 236-278 (58.41 - 68.81%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 236+ SpD Jirachi: 184-218 (45.54 - 53.96%) -- 50.78% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 216 SpD Scizor: 476-564 (138.37 - 163.95%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Hidden Power Fire vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Scizor in rain: 296-352 (86.29 - 102.62%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

(Assuming that 2 Draco Meteors have a total power of 210 Base,lets say Move 1 is a 210 base power special dragon move)

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem (Move 1) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Tyranitar: 406-478 (100.49 - 118.31%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ SpA Choice Specs Kyurem Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Tyranitar: 234-276 (57.92 - 68.31%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Just considering one set defeats the purpose of this thread.Consider other sets as well.

EDIT:Whoops,forgot to include leftovers on Tyranitar.I really don't feel like picking up my calculator right now,but I think its like a 50% chance to 2HKO with Draco without Stealth rock

Your calcs on Tyranitar also didn't include sandstorm. In sand, Kyurem needs Focus Blast to OHKO fully specially defensive Tyranitar.

 

[magic123]

Your calcs on Tyranitar also didn't include sandstorm. In sand, Kyurem needs Focus Blast to OHKO fully specially defensive Tyranitar.

Thanks for that.Corrected

 

[Prinz]

oook i'll upload everything tomorrow even if i guess this thread is going to die soon due to xy. if staff wants i can do a similiar thing with xy whenever the tierlist is stable (i think it will take a bit lol)

 

[ShootingStarmie]

Yeah, I'm in support of doing something similar for X/Y. I'd be pretty interested in helping maintain the thread too.

 

[Prinz]

everything is o.k now, do you guys want to continue this thread or to wait a while and open a similiar thread for XY? I mean, this thread isn't really useful anymore...

 

[ShootingStarmie]

Yeah, I'd wait until at least December, because the metagame is gonna be pretty weird until then.

 

[Prinz]

yeah that's obv.