Starcraft 2

[matty]

Well not sure how many of you play or follow RTS games, but the Starcraft 2 Beta just released on Thursday. I'm a huge Starcraft Nut (ask Tangerine) and have been following this game very closely for the last two years. And with the advent of decent streaming sites, I've been keeping up with the new game through friends of mine who got keys. If you'd like to watch some of the streams, please visit teamliquid.net. On the right hand side of the forums there will be a section for streamers and find one that has [SC2] in front of their name.

So far the games looks "good", but it sure has a lot of changes to go. I'm somewhat disappointed to be honest. I was expecting this epic game (since the thing has been in production for god knows how long). However, the people I've chatted to about the game say it runs very smoothly.

Anyway, thoughts and comments are appreciated. I'll try and add onto the OP regularly including all the changes that have happened since Brood War.

 

[lilyhollow]

I'd probably try and follow this if I'd ever had the chance to play it, but oh well.

 

[Outlaw]

Well, how would you define epic in the multiplayer part of an RTS without the clashing sides having extensive knowledge of the new mechanics?

Give it time for people to get a hang of it.

As for the single player part..I haven't really heard much about it nor do I care for what I have heard. The only part that I have liked so far were the huge stone zealots.

 

[Quaily]

I keep myself under a rock for things like this so I don't have to go through some obscene 2 year wait. All I know is the lead developer worked on command and conquer, which I could never get into.

 

[Firestorm]

All I know is I wish I had a beta key because it seems to go for $300 on eBay. You crazy nutters, you.

 

[keloggsequent]

don't know how i feel about this anymore. too many "hard" counters it seems and i find myself wishing that they released this game with the same exact content as bw but with the updated graphics.

so has anyone that opted in actually gotten a key yet?

 

[Hot Nikkels]

Did they keep in that ridiculous Lair tech Queen that pumps Larvae production? That was the last big argument I remember hearing (besides the shitty Mothership).

To be honest, I'll probably find myself really enjoying the campaign and cutscenes, but will most likely stick with Brood War for a year or two before playing SC2 in any kind of competitive atmosphere. Between expansions, patching, and SEVERE hardware issues on my computer, I'll probably be playing BW for a little while.

But please post all you know or have opined on the game as I'm very interested.

 

[Veldurak]

I'm a HUGE Starcraft fan! :D The wait for this game has been so long, I really hope they get it out in 2010. I still occasionally play Brood War, but its age shows. It'd be great to get my hands on a beta key, but that's not gonna happen.

 

[lol permanent name]

i got myself a cracked starcraft 2 beta

shits amazing, even if i cant play online

also the data/map editor is gonna be OFF THE CHAIN http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joNPrnY4K_4

 

[d2m]

I'm a part of the beta. I play Protoss mainly and it's a helluva lot of fun (backdooring with Warp Prisms + Warp-in is sooo great) Stalkers are great for microing, Colossi are absolutely devastating.

The Mothership, however, is underwhelming. Immortals are amazing defensive units but have HUGE cost (250 min 100 gas) for the fact they are required to counter Roaches (Think Zerglings with range attack and 2 armor) and Marauders (Terran units that fire missles that do double damage to machines). Dark Templar are underwhelming as you have to build a Dark Spire that contains no tech upgrades and has no other purpose other than to build them, plus they have increased cost from the original game.

The Mothership is utterly amazing, although for the same reasons Arbiters were in the first game. The cloak mechanic combined with Colossi devastates everything when they don't have detectors and Recall is fun as ever. It doesn't feel like an "EPIC" unit, but it's hardly underpowered.

Carriers feel nerfed, mostly because they are utterly outclassed by Colossi with AA support. Phoenixes are the only Protoss counter to mutalisks, but that is also all they're good for, which kinda makes them useless. Void Rays are fun early, but so easy to take down in team battles they're really only good for quickly decimating unguarded expansions.

On the other races: Terrans usually go Marines/Marauders/Medivacs (think dropships with medic heal) and that's all they ever really have to do all game. Sure seige tanks are still nice, but Marauders do more damage to mechanical units than tanks in seige mode for the cost. Thors (Gigantic robots) are underpowered as they die really, REALLY fast to any decent sized army (2 Colossi would kill 2 Thors without one dying).

Zerg have an amazing early game, but suffer later as all they can really do is mass Mutas/Hydras due to the fact Ultralisks are too expensive currently for their utility, Infestors got recently changed to have a permanent Mind Control (Neural Parasite) akin to the Protoss Dark Archon MC from SC which in theory is awesome when Colossi or Thors are involved, but it's never happened in any game I've played because if it was vs Zerg, it was all determined by the rush.

 

[Hot Nikkels]

Marauders have Vulture-like speed and harass potential, correct? And can jump cliffs? I've kind of made it a point not to keep up to date since everything kept changing and fans were complaining about EVERYTHING earlier on in the theory stage of development, so I'm a bit out of the loop.

I'm not sure how I like the idea of the Medivac. While combining just about any unit with a Dropship seems good, I also feel like this makes Terran more micro intensive (at least in this particular scenario) than in BW, where even then T is considered to be the all-around most micro-intense race. Where in BW Medics could heal each other in their off time, now you have to bring SCVs along for the ride, which in turn lowers the actual number of units you can drop. I also don't know where in the tech tree they are, but based on the fact that it's mech, and drop tech to boot, I assume it'll take much longer, or be more dangerous, to do any sort of 1 Rax MnM. If Zerg still has the option to build something akin to a BW 3Hatch tech, will T just need to wait it out and try to scout and be safe until midgame? Or is there a more aggressive response, similar to a BW 2-3Rax Academy push? Or perhaps Marauders are the new answer to this...If in fact they do micro similarly to Vultures.

Few more questions...

Are Thors that Goliath/Valkyrie combination that has the Siege-like feature where they can become AA air units as well as "bulky" ground units? Or did that just get scrapped altogether?

And Immortals are the new Archons?

 

[matty]

No your thinking of Reapers. And actually so far, they are so weak and if you mess up your harass, your usually pretty behind.

And the thing I hate about Medivacs is that they are so far down the tech tree. You need a gd starport. Really?!? That means you are obligated each game to make a Factory regardless if you just wanted to go straight MNM like in BW.

Goliath was replaced by the Viking. Thors are like a AA Seige Tank / good for taking down locked down positions.

I'm not really sure what they were trying to accomplish with the Immortals

 

[d2m]

No your thinking of Reapers. And actually so far, they are so weak and if you mess up your harass, your usually pretty behind.

And the thing I hate about Medivacs is that they are so far down the tech tree. You need a gd starport. Really?!? That means you are obligated each game to make a Factory regardless if you just wanted to go straight MNM like in BW.

Goliath was replaced by the Viking. Thors are like a AA Seige Tank / good for taking down locked down positions.

I'm not really sure what they were trying to accomplish with the Immortals

Immortals are our only defense against Roaches and Seige Tanks. They are FAR too expensive for their utility, however.

Archons are the new Archons.

 

[MystiKal]

I gotta wait till April till they hand out beta keys for Mac users.

:[

 

[matty]

Ya I've seen immortals in streams, but I'm not very impressed. I think a fast tech to Collusus is almost better in every situation possible. Sure you can make one or two while your Robotic Support Bay warps in, but after that, there isn't anything to upgrade on them and Colllosus roll Terran balls and Zerg units so nicely.

And ya, I'm with you there Mystikal. But hey, hopefully the game will be more balanced by the time we get it ;D

 

[d2m]

Ya I've seen immortals in streams, but I'm not very impressed. I think a fast tech to Collusus is almost better in every situation possible. Sure you can make one or two while your Robotic Support Bay warps in, but after that, there isn't anything to upgrade on them and Colllosus roll Terran balls and Zerg units so nicely.

And ya, I'm with you there Mystikal. But hey, hopefully the game will be more balanced by the time we get it ;D

Until they get air. Mass Mutas are only countered by grabbing 6+ Phoenixes, which are useless otherwise. Protoss are very air weak with the loss of Dragoons (Immortals cannot attack air and neither can colossi) and the Stalker is more of a striker unit than a hardy one like the Dragoon.

Photon cannons are ridiculously weak, I had one killed by 3 Reapers once. They rushed my base while I was teching (it was 2v2 and my buddy was supposed to cover me...he failed) and destroyed my Nexus in about 15 seconds, gg.

Unless you proxy pylon, build a gateway there and 2 at your base, then research warp gate very fast and mass zealot rush, you have no early game.

 

[Optimusje]

God I wish I had a key :(, I seriously can't wait to play this ^^

Anyone willing to trade one for a heroes of newerth key :P?

 

[Mike B]

Summer of 09 used to be a release estimate. I wonder how it was.

 

[Dwarfspider]

I am waiting for this game more than any other coming about in the next five years. I played alot of wc3 back in the day, and if the worldeditor is even more powerful then wc3's then the custom maps will be more amazing than sex (well maybe not, but close!)

I could play a mean wc3, but I kept almost entirely to the custom maps. Though for some reason I never liked DoTA, I always thought of it as a lesser ToB with a huge number of assholes playing it.

 

[d2m]

All beta testers just received extra keys to give to friends. Mine are spoken for, so harass whoever you know that's in the beta.

 

[Mike B]

I assume the extra keys are tied to the originate account. What happens if one pisses mods off and posts CP? I wouldn't give them away if one gets banned then all get banned.

 

[Optimusje]

Oh sweet, guess im gonna try and find someone to trade me a key on gamefaqs or something :)

 

[Pablo]

A friend of mine just told me I could have his original beta key, so hopefully he comes through. I doubt I'll be able to run it on this comp though but we'll see. I'm so excited can't wait for him to give me the details.

 

[jad]

With Blizzard's incredibly good track record of quality games as well as the very long development period and the pressure to live up to one of the best RTS games ever made, I think SC2 will turn out well. The question is will it play similarly to SC or will it be a whole new beast. I haven't had the chance to play the beta so I wouldn't know, but I'll be buying it on day one for sure.

 

[d2m]

With Blizzard's incredibly good track record of quality games as well as the very long development period and the pressure to live up to one of the best RTS games ever made, I think SC2 will turn out well. The question is will it play similarly to SC or will it be a whole new beast. I haven't had the chance to play the beta so I wouldn't know, but I'll be buying it on day one for sure.

It is very similar. All the same skills are necessary, just the strategies and aesthetics are a bit different.