Battling 101 Redesign

[Exarius]

@ Pink:
I myself joined smogon just to get tutored, since I had got myself Shoddy, and was a noob. At that time, if I wouldn't have get tutored, I guess I would have just dropped the whole thing and left this place. Now, I plan to start tutoring when I get good enough. So as twash said, it can be the gateway to new people.

And on that regard, I agree with it that you should have to write a bit more that what usually people have on these rounds. I myself have written up the application on notepad so I can just c/p it when the sign-up comes. Fast'n'easy. But some people have, as said, written close to nothing so they get the spot. So the current system kinda shoots itself in the leg.

 

[Blue Kirby]

The revamp is going to effect tutor applications, but I will elaborate on that when the system is 100% in concrete and the time of completion is a bit closer. I have every intention of making the sign-up process a little more "picky", as I'm tired of watching people sign up, get tutored and disappear never to be seen again; don't worry about that.

 

[Pink]

Good to hear Blue Kirby.

And Exarius, I'm glad to hear that. I realize the tutoring program can be a great gateway into the Smogon community, which can be rather intimidating at first. So, It's good to see that you came and stayed through this program. That's why I was reluctant to voice my concerns about people dissapearing, because the people that stay can learn a lot through the program. Some tutees have even gone on to be great additions to the site. I've just seen too many people come to be tutored, and have a single post, being their application, then never return.

But, I see that Blue Kirby has something in mind. So, again, thanks for the great work you guys are putting into this program. Hopefully we all can enjoy its changes soon!

 

[Objection]

Yes; I was being tutored by KG and I got in baaad trouble with my parents... didnt see my computer for a long time.

I meant has a tutor moved on to another tutee before, not has a tutee gone inactive for whatever reason.

 

[Redostrike]

I just want to respond to the post's (i know it's been told that it would not matter on your post count). I'm one of the lurkers, i've been here reading a bit on the forums. Never posted anything, just because of one thing. I know NOTHING about the competitive gameplay. So how would someone add something to the community if they dont know anything? That would not be fair to people wanting to learn and spread it later. Everyone needs to start somewhere and ok there are a few guides you should read but still the metagame changes. And if you read a bit on the forums you get to know a few things here and there. I've been reading here for a while now and still dont know how to make a decent team so how in the world would i be able to contribute as i dont know anything. (no offence intended).

It looks like you guys are covering alot, are you already busy implementing things on the forums/site as of now or still in the baby fase with it? Maybe a bit of a foolish question and i think i already know the answer but still any idea when the new system would be up and running? (answer: It will be done when it's done?).

Thanks.

 

[Despotar]

I'm not trying to sound like an elitist asshole hear, but there is one thing that has always bothered me with the battling 101 sign ups. This is the fact that often there is a huge influx of people with their first or second post in the sign up threads, who we later never see again. Personally, I find this annoying because when people whom are committed to the community sign up, they often miss out from the overwhelming amount of new posters signing up for battling 101, then never posting on Smogon again.

I'm not trying to say we shouldn't allow new members to sign up, as this is what the program is most prominently directed at. However, I think the establishment of a minimum post count could benefit the process as a whole. This could help cut down the size of the incoming queue for the tutors to have to work through, as well as making it less difficult for members who are committed to the site to sign up. I've been here since 2007 and was tutored a while ago, as well as signing up this past time. It's just bothersome to see myself get rejected from the tutoring because there weren't anymore tutors, and that the majority of the tutors were tutoring members that joined that day/week, and then those tutees never return.

Just a suggestion. I understand why this might not be a consideration, because you might not want to put a limit on helping people, but it's and idea I had. Do with it what you will.

Finally, thanks for the updates. It's great to see so much work going into this already big project. Keep it up guys!

I did not join to be tutored,
and I agree, if only say, 50 post minimum,
it would really help out with the flooding,
and if you really wanted to learn,
and you liked competitive battling you should have no problem posting.

 

[mtr]

I think that something like a 50-post minimum would be arbitrary and maybe not very helpful simply because of the "wifidiot" phenomenon where people rapidly gain posts by posting in the Wifi forum. Instead, we could establish a more complex criterion like: have been a member for 1 month and made a minimum 15 posts in Stark Mountain/RMT or whatever. I'm not sure if you're taking input or not, but just a thought.

 

[Flamewheeler]

I did not join to be tutored,
and I agree, if only say, 50 post minimum,
it would really help out with the flooding,
and if you really wanted to learn,
and you liked competitive battling you should have no problem posting.

Well, I LOVE battling competetively, but the posting really isn't my forte. I do post, obviously, but I'd rather play than waste my time posting here. Don't take "waste" too harshly guys. I only mean wasting my battling time ;P.

 

[Mrobinson587]

Well, I LOVE battling competetively, but the posting really isn't my forte. I do post, obviously, but I'd rather play than waste my time posting here. Don't take "waste" too harshly guys. I only mean wasting my battling time ;P.

I would rather play than post. Our post counts reflect this and we have both qualified to vote for suspect so we have battled plenty even if our post count doesn't reflect that.

You have 2 ears and 1 mouth and they should be used in that proportion :nerd:

 

[mtr]

I would rather play than post. Our post counts reflect this and we have both qualified to vote for suspect so we have battled plenty even if our post count doesn't reflect that.

To be honest, though, there's a difference between you guys and the guys whose first or second post is in the Tutoring Application thread. The idea is that a minimal filter might cut out a lot of the latter. Something like 10-15 posts in Stark isn't asking for a lot. The downside to this is that it could invite post spamming (although mods could arguably delete unsubstantive posts), but no idea is without its faults.

 

[iKitsune]

One way of illustrating someone's intent/commitment is to get them to write a paragraph about them self as well as the current requirement. If they can be bothered to write something which takes longer than 2 mins then that should weed out those who aren't really that interested.

 

[Exarius]

To be honest, though, there's a difference between you guys and the guys whose first or second post is in the Tutoring Application thread. The idea is that a minimal filter might cut out a lot of the latter. Something like 10-15 posts in Stark isn't asking for a lot. The downside to this is that it could invite post spamming (although mods could arguably delete unsubstantive posts), but no idea is without its faults.

Depends on the person. Myself, I have 24 posts (this included). maybe 1 or 2 is from stark. Rest are from other places around here. I'd say 5-10 posts and a wellthought paragraph about themselves in the sign-up form, something that shows you'd continue in Smogon if you get the chance to get inside the doors. 5 would be quite easy to get, while it prevents people from just joining, posting in the tutor-thread and leaving. And a well-thought paragraph shows that you want to learn something from this and you'd like to stay here.

Also, it could be that you can sign-up for tutoring, but you wouldn't be tutored until you get 5 posts or more. Don't know how it would work though.

 

[Blue Kirby]

Don't worry so much about the specifics of the process, such as how any restrictions will be imposed. I'll make sure it's as fair as possible for everyone involved. :)

The purpose of this thread wasn't to rile people up about how things are going to work, just to let you know what we're doing. I'm not going to be leaving anything to chance, relax.

 

[Tsunami]

Don't worry so much about the specifics of the process, such as how any restrictions will be imposed. I'll make sure it's as fair as possible for everyone involved. :)

The purpose of this thread wasn't to rile people up about how things are going to work, just to let you know what we're doing. I'm not going to be leaving anything to chance, relax.

Thanks BlueKirby, I really want the chance to get in next round

 

[Despotar]

Thanks BlueKirby, I really want the chance to get in next round

Same here!
My computer isn't working with any downloads so shoddy isn't working D:
When the new Windows 7 system comes out (around a week)
it'll be back up, so I hope it isn't too soon.

 

[Lusitania]

Hee, I feel like getting in on this discussion.


As a relative newbie, I'm not on the smogon forum a lot. But I play shoddy every day, and go on AIM every day. Most people I know who play pokemon are on AIM all the time, when they're shoddying/whatever. I honestly joined cuz I badly needed a team rated, but that team is now irrelevant due to it doesn't stand up to the opponents I face on my ladder rating, which is also relatively low (a bit over 1200). I don't honestly agree with the post limit, as that cuts out the main demographic of the program; newbies who really need pointers.

Rambling aside, there are two points that I want to make in this post. Firstly, you could just make it very picky when it comes to sign ups. Make them right a paragraph or two about why they want to join, their expereince when it comes to battling, what they want to be tutored about, et cetera.

Another point I want to bring up, and I don't know if this happens a lot already, as I'm pretty much a Smogon noob, is that the tutee and the tutor use AIM or MSN or whatever to contact and do the main amount of tutoring over that. It'/s much faster than PM and isn't a problem at all if both people are in relatively similar time zones and are both active.

 

[Exarius]

^just to point out 1 thing: I've been tutored twice. both times were over MSN, and battling in shoddy. so no worries about that part, it is been done.

 

[tripe]

Hee, I feel like getting in on this discussion.


As a relative newbie, I'm not on the smogon forum a lot. But I play shoddy every day, and go on AIM every day. Most people I know who play pokemon are on AIM all the time, when they're shoddying/whatever. I honestly joined cuz I badly needed a team rated, but that team is now irrelevant due to it doesn't stand up to the opponents I face on my ladder rating, which is also relatively low (a bit over 1200). I don't honestly agree with the post limit, as that cuts out the main demographic of the program; newbies who really need pointers.

Rambling aside, there are two points that I want to make in this post. Firstly, you could just make it very picky when it comes to sign ups. Make them right a paragraph or two about why they want to join, their expereince when it comes to battling, what they want to be tutored about, et cetera.

Another point I want to bring up, and I don't know if this happens a lot already, as I'm pretty much a Smogon noob, is that the tutee and the tutor use AIM or MSN or whatever to contact and do the main amount of tutoring over that. It'/s much faster than PM and isn't a problem at all if both people are in relatively similar time zones and are both active.

One could also try IRC, a method which is convenient for most people, but most new people don't even know about. I chose my tutor this round specifically, because I can speak with him on irc.

 

[Setsuna]

Casually I was talking with Bloo about the 'Redesign' a few days ago, and now I do really wanna see the new model come up.

 

[Caroline]

I've been waiting a few weeks for you guys to launch your new program, and I see where you guys are coming from (wouldn't want people to randomly drop in here without commitment). But I've personally been not posting in Stark because I don't feel I know enough about Pokémon to contribute to the discussion about the metagame and all of that stuff going on. I'm not saying there's a better way to do it (maybe registration date or something like that), but what's someone like me to do in this kind of situation, where I don't know enough to post in Stark, but if I had to learn enough to add anything of substance then I probably wouldn't need the Tutoring program?

Maybe I'm overestimating a little how "serious" Stark is, or underestimating the intricacies of the Pokémon game. In which case, sorry. I'm sure you guys will figure everything out in time for me to sign up. Or I'll get impatient and try and figure it out myself :P

 

[Marlin]

...but what's someone like me to do in this kind of situation, where I don't know enough to post in Stark, but if I had to learn enough to add anything of substance then I probably wouldn't need the Tutoring program?

Caroline, thank you. That is exactly the position I find myself in. Good to know I'm not alone on this one.

I've been spending some time hanging out on #stark and listening to some of the discussion. And when I think I've learned something of value, I boot up Shoddy and fight a couple rounds. But overall, the learning is slow when the only feedback I get is whether I win or lose, which may have nothing to do with what I was trying to learn in the first place.

C'est la vie...

 

[Da Letter El]

Yeah, I've been tutored twice (well, technically 3, but one time I had jx7 the two weeks that he had family issues, and ironically that was the time I did best in the tutee tournament), but I'd really like another go at this, as I feel just so lost in the new metagame and have no idea where to start. I've tried signing up the past I believe 3-4 times, and each time missed the "deadline" where the thread gets locked by like 6 hours tops. I don't think that my wanting to join should preclude someone in a situation where they're literally just trying to grasp competitive pokemon, but yeah, I'm very curious to see what the revamp holds in store for the tutoring program.

 

[jaehutch]

I've really wanted to become tutored for some time now to enhance my competitive battling skills and hopefully I can get in this time with this great,new,redesigned tutoring program!

 

[tripe]

I've really wanted to become tutored for some time now to enhance my competitive battling skills and hopefully I can get in this time with this great,new,redesigned tutoring program!

Hopefully you'll get your chance when the program is revamped.

 

[blaziken662]

Ok, i'm trying to understand how the new sign up process will be made, but maybe could be nice try to avoid keep tutoring the same people more than 2 times (or even once), maybe this could be something harsh but that issue can ensure more new people can join to the tutoring program... I know some people sometimes don't get all what they want/need with just one tutor but those "missing" knowledge can be achieved by personal experience, or maybe (and forgive me if my crazy ideas are just so non sense) could be nice make another "rank" or "grade" of tutoring to help all those people that feel a little incomplete at their competitive battling career...

Thanks