Why Aren't More People Using This?! - an OU RMT

'Sup, folks. Well, let me tell you, I value originality a lot. There's nothing more boring then fighting a generic (sand/rain) OU team with Pokemon including Gliscor, Ferrothorn, Rotom-W, Tyranitar, Breloom, Heatran, Skarmory, Politoed, Tentacruel, Magnezone... All the generic guys that you've seen so many countless times in OU. And granted, popularity is often well-deserved-- they're effective, when used properly. But not everything that's popular is effective, and not everything that's effective is necessarily popular.

I didn't think myself terribly original when I constructed this team a while back, but as the metagame grew onward I began to realize that it was a bit more unusual and anti-metagame than I thought. It's by no means perfect and I wouldn't even go so far as to so that it's a great team, but it is surprisingly effective and has served me reasonably well, and I do think it's accurate to say that this is certainly one of the best teams I've ever constructed entirely myself. (I'm not particularly good at team-building, so take that with a grain of salt, haha.) So, I hope you enjoy hearing about the unusual tactics I've been running.

Development:
The team was conceived as a hazard-shuffling team with Restalk Milotic as the central focus, and little has changed in that regard. Other members of the team have come and go until I found what I needed to suit my needs.





Final Lineup:


Team Breakdown:


Teralith
Aerodactyl @ Focus Sash
[Pressure] Jolly Nature
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt
- Rock Slide
- Earthquake

Summary: 'Lead' Pokemon are considered to be pretty much dead in the 5th Gen. Old Aerodactyl here was one of the top leads in Gen 4 for his ability to get rocks out quickly and prevent opponents from getting theirs up. He still does that as well now as he did then, so what's changed? Why isn't anyone using this guy? After trying out a bulky spread, I reverted to the classic sweeper EVs. Unlike the traditional suicide lead Aero, I actually go out of my way to keep this guy around if I can possibly switch him out after setting SR and/or Taunting, and he often does a great job of cleaning up weakened teams or revenging fast mons like the Genies/Therians. I have Rock Slide over Stone Edge for accuracy and flinch chance, and it works well against opposing leads to wear them down if not KO outright (especially Ninetales). Aero is mainly here to reliably set up Stealth Rock as well as prevent it going up on our side, and when saved for later, he makes a good revenger as well.


Palanock
Forretress @ Leftovers
[Sturdy] Sassy Nature
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
- Spikes
- Rapid Spin
- Volt Switch
- Counter

Summary: Forretress fills many valuable roles on my team-- first and foremost, he clears out hazards from my side of the field, ensuring that Aero's Focus Sash stays intact and that Volcarona comes in safely. Secondly, he sets up Spikes on anything that's unable to do significant damage to him, especially other spikers (whose hard work he can easily get rid of while setting up alongside them). And thirdly, he sponges powerful Outrages and Draco Meteors aimed at the likes of Milotic and the team's more fragile members. Forretress' usefulness isn't relegated to just that, however; Volt Switch allows it to be an effective pivot, and to escape Magnezone on a predicted switch-in, forcing more switches onto the hazards he helps lay. Counter is a weird, very situational, very underappreciated skill on Forretress... Its primary use is for stopping the rampage of physical setup sweepers, or other wall breakers with powerful attacks, like CB Haxorus and the like, at which it excels, surviving due to Sturdy (or even just on the merit of its bulk) and KOing back. Forretress can even set up hazards alongside boosting sweepers like Conkeldurr and Scizor, then simply Counter for the KO when they reach +6 (or on a predicted hit beforehand). If all else fails and I Counter too early, spamming it forces opponents to choose between KOing themselves on Forretress' counter, or switching out and losing the boosts-- a win either way. Forry rarely finds himself needing to use it, but after trying out other moves in that slot, nothing else quite works on this team like Counter does.


Regalacida
Milotic @ Leftovers
[Marvel Scale] Bold Nature
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
- Scald
- Dragon Tail
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Summary: The all-purpose wall and unabashed star of the team. Milotic is the all-purpose glue that holds the entire team together. Seriously, why don't more people run Milotic?! THIS THING NEVER DIES except to crits and the like. I've had her take +2 Outrages from Salamence WITHOUT Marvel Scale and survive before. Specs Jolteon/Rotom-W is the only foe this regal serpent fears, taking all else with impunity, Resting it off, shuffling foes around, and scalding physical attackers left and right. If she falls, it's likely that the rest of them will soon follow-- which is good, because Milotic is really, really, really hard to eliminate. A year or so ago, Milotic was all over the place in OU, so I have to wonder what exactly happened...? Why are people so surprised when Milotic is so difficult to bring down? Aero and Forry set the hazards, and this beauty makes sure everyone on the opposing team gets his face slung into them time and time again.


Deildegast
Gengar @ Leftovers
[Levitate] Timid Nature
4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Substitute
- Disable

Summary: The spin blocker and other sweeper-stopper. Sub-Disable Gengar is hands-down Gengar's best set this generation, and no team could be better suited to its talents than this one. Gengar utterly shuts down the likes of (Poison Heal) Breloom, Gliscor, and Conkeldurr, and Toxicroak that foolishly dare to run only 2 attacking moves. The combination of Gengar's offensive power, his ability to wall certain sweepers, and his propensity to force switches around makes him an extremely valuable offensive and defensive threat, and anyone not sufficiently prepared to deal with him can potentially be swept away by the subtle power of his trickery. As far as spinblocking goes, he can deal with most spinners sufficiently, though Tentacruel can be problematic due to how long it takes Gengar to KO it, and if Tentacruel runs Water/Ice coverage, then Gengar's survival is not always guaranteed.


Ulgamoth
Volcarona @ Leftovers
[Flame Body] Modest Nature
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpDef
- Quiver Dance
- Fiery Dance
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Rock]

Summary: Forget Reuniclus. Forget Conkeldurr. Volcarona is one of the most deadly sweepers in all of OU. True, that power comes at quite a high price, but the results are well worth the risk, as anyone without Rain support or Scarf Terrakion / Landorus / Tyranitar (or other fast Rock-attack user) is instantly swept away by the overwhelming might of this solarian insect. I switch this guy in on Scizor or any special attacker without a super-effective attack and boost like mad, and its great physical bulk often allows it to take several priority attacks (many of which it resists) and persist with its thorough and deadly sweep. Now, I know what you're thinking... 'You don't use Bug Buzz? What are you, an idiot?' Well, maybe, but that's beside the point. Fire/Grass/Rock is better neutral coverage in OU than anything else Volcarona could run, to be perfectly frank. Yes, it struggles against Psychic-types like Reuniclus and Lati@s without STAB Bug Buzz, but frankly, Volcarona just likes to set up in their faces anyway (though it does need to watch out for Psyshock, but unless I get into a boosting war with them, Volcarona's physical bulk is usually enough to take it. The real draw of this set is the ability to land surprise KOs on Pokemon that would normally counter Volcarona, like Politoed, Gastrodon, and Terrakion (after two boosts if it's scarfed), many of whom don't care about Volcarona's STABs and can threaten its survival in one way or another. Giga Drain's healing is extremely useful as well, since Volcarona usually takes a bit of a beating setting up-- devouring a big, tasty Hippowdon or something fixes that right up. HP Rock is utilized to gain maximum neutral and super-effective coverage, hitting Fire-types and Dragons super-effectively, and getting a neutral hit on Heatran, Hydreigon, and the Lati-twins. Blissey/Chansey and specially-defensive Heatran tend to give Volcarona the most trouble; the latter can take its hits with ease and cripple it via Thunder Wave or Toxic, and Heatran can take HP Rocks all day and just Roar it out or Toxic it.


Myrmeleon
Flygon @ Choice Scarf
[Levitate] Jolly Nature
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- U-Turn
- Fire Blast / Superpower

Summary: Ahhh, Flygon... The has-been of the century. For all the good it has in it, in typing, movepool, and ability, it just doesn't pack enough speed or power to compete with the OU dragons anymore, does it? As much as I love Flygon (which is a lot, it's actually my favorite Pokemon), I'll be the first to admit that Flygon's offensive capabilities are pretty underwhelming. However, after Garchomp was banned (as he previously occupied this spot on the team), I realized that I still needed a revenger with a ground immunity and the STAB coverage of a Dragon-- thus, Flygon got the job. Even as offensively-weak as Flygon is compared to everything else in OU, especially when running Scarf instead of Band, I found him to be very useful on my team, combining the Dragon STAB attacks of Garchomp with Landorus' ability to switch in on Earthquakes and scout with U-turn (albeit in a slightly weaker package). Ultimately, the fact that he's so weak didn't matter too terribly much, and Flygon still does a great job of revenging threats that my team needs taken out, especially when they've been weakened by so many layers of hazards. Unless Garchomp were to be unbanned, I can't see anyone else doing Flygon's job quite like he can.

I do, however, have trouble choosing his fourth move. Fire Punch does jack-all to Ferrothorn and Skarmory, so I've been trying out Fire Blast as well... I hate its accuracy, but at least it works better on those two. Bulky mons like Togekiss give the whole team trouble, and with Aero gone, only Flygon's Stone Edge seems up to the task, so that's one option... I haven't tried out Superpower yet, though I think I'm going to try that next, as it would at least get a decent hit on any wise-ass, Balloon-carrying Heatran, in addition to Ferrothorn. Gotta test it out to see how it is.
 
Hey There!

I had to comment on this team since it flaunts one of my favorite pokemon looking back in Gen4 UU - Milotic. Obviously it's since to see a team as different as this once in a while.

To be quite frank, your Aero set is confusing me. You have a speedy spread with max HP but yet you have focus sash? It seems like a waste to me because 80 base HP is pretty decent and should be able to survive at least one non-SE hit. Whirlwind is kinda odd too. To me it's like putting Whirlwind on something like Crobat. I would really consider Azelf to get up stealth rocks, or, if you're absolutely set on using Aero, you should probaby use leftovers and roost over whirlwind.

Forretress seems okay, but I would suggest trying toxic spikes over counter because it appears it can be beneficial to your team and you really don't have any form of status currently. In particular, it shortens the life of common substitute users such as terrakion which can potentially rip though your team because it is not forced out by dragon tail.

This is a very classic Milotic set your using, but because you have marvel scale I don't think max Defense is necessary. I reccomend a spread of 252 HP/ 196 Def / 56 SDef to ensure you are never 2HKO'd by Choice Specs Politoed's Hidden Power Grass (or electric for that matter) after stealth rock. Also, I know this team is based around Milotic, but you might want to try Dragonite's Parashuffler set since it is very similar. I know Dragonite is a pretty common sight today but it is a very underrated set. Milotic has a good base speed, but you might actually ant to try a speed reducing nature like relaxed to so you have a better chance of breaking Dragon's substitutes, but I guess it isn't necessary.

Gengar's set is pretty standard so it's good. A more defensive sin blocker seems to fit this team better, especially because it seems as though Aero will more often than not be dead mid-match, so it can be difficult to get up hazards again if a spin should occur. Jellicent is quite redundant with Milotic, so it's probably best this way.

If your using 3 attacks on Volcarona, you might as well go for an offensive spread because without morning sun or Chesto-Rest you can't set up to +5 or +6 which makes these sets popular. Instead with this set you just get to +2 or +3 at best and deal much less damage than you would with an offensive spread. Most attackers like Jirachi, Scizor, Ferrothorn and the like can't really touch Volcarona to begin with.

Again Landorus is pretty standard, and with Milotic and Gengar you really don't fear gliscor too much. However, you can use HP Ice to get a 100% hit on Dragonite and Salamence while not having to rely on Stone Edge. Just a thought. Explosion is really for more of a life orb or choice band set, but if it works for you then obviously keep it.

The biggest threat I see is opposing substitute users and teams with wish support / recovery / regenerator pokemon since these pokes can heal before they are phazed with Dragon Tail. A more reliable taunter can be fit somewhere here because it an prevent recovery and substitutes (Taunting substitutes are more tricky however).

Sun teams also look a bit bad because the Grass + Fire coverage does a number on your team. Play carefully in Rain because your only water resist is Milotic, and while it is durable, it cant survive that many boosted hits.

Good Luck with the team!
 
If you want a Pokemon to replace Volcarona that is not too common but is still a set up sweeper I recommend Dragon Dance Salamence. DD Salamence is not as weak to Stealth Rock, and also is immune to [Toxic]Spikes, unlike Volcarona. Salamence also takes neutral hits from Fire attacks in the Sun and Water attacks in the Rain, unlike your Volcarona. I have used DD Salamence and it is a great success.

Salamence @ Life Orb (Or Leftovers if you like durability at the cost of power)
Naive (or Hasty, if you want to retain Special Bulk instead of Physical)
252 Spe/252 Atk/4 HP
Intimidate (To make setting up easier, which is worth more than an attack boost IMO)
-Dragon Dance
-Outrage
-Earthquake
-Fire Blast

Adding Salamence would compound your Ice weakness though, so to patch that up you could replace Aerodactyl with Stealth Rock Metagross. Metagross has great bulk and resistances, and can take care of many threats.

Metagross @ Leftovers
Adamant
252 HP/252 Atk/4 Def
Clear Body
-Meteor Mash
-Ice Punch
-Hammer Arm
-Stealth Rock

I also second the use of Toxic Spikes over Counter on Forretress

Good luck with the team man, GO ANTI-METAGAME!
 
You shouldn't run explosion on Landorus. You'll never be able to really use it. With the dominance of stall types, a easy protect will counter it. With Landorus' speed with scarf, it can just use any of the other move to outspeed and kill or u-turn and switch. Also, if you use explosion and it ends in a draw, it's self-KO clause and it's still a loss. I would definitely run HP ice. With HP ice and scarf, it outspeeds most dragons after a DD and can revenge kill. Also, it can deal with the problematic gliscor.


As Demo_ mentioned, adding a dragonite or salamence would be a good option. The metagross would also be very good but also consider a suicide lead infernape.

GL on your team. I'm really liking these unique non-weather teams. Gives more of a variety in team building!
 
Oh a resttalk Milotic! Had success on her for two month last Jaunary but stopped playing since. She fills so many holes on a team.
 
Nice team, Banryu. It seems well built generally and the RMT is also very well written. As a replacement for Landorus, I would suggest a Scarfed Flygon. The main reason to use it over Landorus is access Dragon STAB, which your team currently lacks. Plus, it really appreciates entry hazards for late game clean up. If you choose to use this, I would also use the Metagross set DEMo suggested, although I wouldn't use Flygon with Salamence since that would be 2 4x ice weaknesses + redundant move coverage (although the fire coverage is something to consider if you're really desperate).

Flygon (M) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 3 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Stone Edge/Fire Blast

On the subject of Volcarona, a potential replacement could be a bulky DD Gyarados. Although it lacks Volcarona's Special bulk after it sets up, Intimidate gives it much more Physical bulk, which can also support the rest of your team. Access to Taunt is a useful way to prevent setting up once Aerodactyl is down (or if you replace it w/ Metagross). The combination of Taunt and Intimidate also fits nicely with a hazard based team, as it forces a lot of switches. If you go with Gyarados, definitely use Fire Blast over Stone Edge on Flygon, as Gyarados already has access to it and you need a way to get around those pesky Steel types.

Gyarados (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 176 HP / 128 Atk / 204 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge
- Taunt
 
Your not using Volcarona correctly, because your running the bulky set you want to run some sort of recovery to help you set up. If you want to go 3 attacks use a more offensive ev spread and nature, also hp electric is redundant on bulky water except for gyarados, bug buzz has 135 base power on things like milotic and Politoed practically the same as hp electric. I would run hidden power ground, it hits Tentacruel for the same as Hp electric but also let's you take put heatran and Terrakion, 2 massive Volc counters/checks, alternatively you can run psychic to get very good damage on Tentacruel and Terrakion, also hitting Dragonite for damage than bug buzz or fiery dance but you lose to heatran.
 
Alllll righty, folks. I've done some more testing since the first couple of feedback comments and this is what I have to say about everything.

  • Regarding Aerodactyl: YES, FOCUS SASH IS NECESSARY. x< I stupidly followed the suggestion of 'use lefties on Aero if you have max HP' and immediately got killed by a Scizor Bullet Punch, thus reminding me why I had that. I did try out Roost, and that's been working pretty well since it lets him stay alive longer against opponents who can't do more than 3-4HKO, like non-Stone Edge Tyranitar.

    That and, y'know, the idea of most of the team is to catch people off-guard with unusual but decent sets. :I So all you suggesting max attack and whatnot.... no thanks. That's what everyone expects and it's ridiculously easy for opponents to remove. What EV spread do you think I started with in the first place, kids? With that said... the metagame HAS changed a lot, so maybe it's worth retrying the offensive spread with EQ or Aqua Tail over Roost. I'll give it a shot, I suppose it can't hurt to try.

    As for other lead suggestions, I still have yet to try out the likes of Azelf/Infernape/Metagross. Azelf might be good, but he dies more easily to lead TTar (who carries Crunch more often than Stone Edge). Metagross might last longer, but he can't prevent opposing leads from setting SR. Infernape sounds like the best bet; SR/Fake Out/Taunt/U-Turn (not necessarily all of them) are good tools for a lead. I'll give them a shot eventually, but for now I'm trying to avoid any replacements that require me to drastically rework the entire team.
  • Regarding Forry: I'm saying a flat no to the 'Tspikes over Counter' suggestion. Forry often has enough trouble setting up all 3 layers of spikes, and the extra entry hazard damage is more important to the team than the stalling bonus of Tspikes (not the this is NOT a stalling team! The main goal is to force as many switches as possible or otherwise just sweep). Counter, again I will say, I've found too valuable to get rid of. It's situational, yes, but it's always worth it to eliminate a cocky Dragonite or Scizor who thinks he can set up on Forry, who would otherwise cause massive problems for the rest of the team. I have been using Volt Switch over Gyro Ball and while he can't kill anything, which is frustrating, getting him out of sticky situations from the likes of Magnezone has been quite useful. Again, though, Counter. It's the shit. Give it a try before you knock it at least; it's difficult to use properly, but setting up Spikes while some jackass Scizor boosts to +6 and then Countering his ass with Sturdy holding fast is ohhh sooo satisfying, believe you me. =w=
  • Regarding Milotic: I'll give the more balanced spread a shot, but surviving Dragonite Outrages and Terrakion CCs/SEs WITHOUT Marvel Scale up is reeeally reeeally important for Milo, and I dunno if she can still do that with the spread. I'll check the calcs to see how much of a threat they are with the other spread.

  • Regarding Gengar: This guy is the shit and it's good to see that people know it. xD With just him and Milo, I've come back from being down 2-6 after getting all my hazards up. He's nearly as good at forcing switches as Milo is.

  • Regarding Volcarona: I don't run Morning Sun because Rain and Sand are everywhere, and they wreck that. :| Even ruling that out, I rely on Volcarona to KO EVERYTHING. 2 Attacks just doesn't cut that, and the sweeper EV spread is way too prone to being revenged by Dragonite Extremespeeds and even Scizor Bullet Punches of all things (who bulky Volcarona laughs at and sets up on as they get burned). I run the set the way I run it for a damn good reason, so don't you tell me that 'my not using Volcarona correctly', Razza. :I

    That said, you make a good point regarding the redundant power of HP Electric. However, HP Ground/Rock don't cut it, because they fail to effectively deal with Dragonite and Terrakion respectively, leaving Volcarona totally at their mercy with nothing even neutral on the both of them... HP Electric at least could manage that much. Psychic might be worth using since it at least damages Dragonite more than HP Electric, and Terrakion supereffectively, so I'll try that.
    ...but I'm keepin' the damn bulky EV spread.

    As for Volcarona replacement suggestions, again, I'll try these guys out eventually. Dragonite/Salamence seem like good options except for the fact that that multiplies my team's ice weakness by about 1 billion, requiring further changes to the team. Gyarados might work since he's at least neutral, and again, will test him later.
  • Regarding Landorus: If we're talking about Explosion... let's face it, no one is going to predict an Explosion from Landorus (unless they've fought this team already haha), and thus they're not gonna be switching to any steels/ghosts or using Protect in anticipation of it (if we're talking about blind luck, all bets are off). And granted, I haven't been terribly stupid with it... I only use it on relatively-frail Pokemon that don't resist it, and with a couple of switch-ins to my hazards, it can even kill bulkier mons like Latias and Rotom-W and so forth. Many of the opposing Pokemon I use it on are CMers, which my team otherwise has a lot of trouble with. I recognize that it's not the best option, but it's more powerful and more accurate than Stone Edge... (which I did end up replacing with HP Ice, making the set EQ/HP/U-Turn/Splosion)

    Landorus has been working out all right, though I am still looking for replacements. And while I love Flygon to death, it being one of my favorites, it really seems to me like it's just too weak to compete in today's metagame... the only thing it has over Landorus is Dragon STAB, but Landorus is much faster and more powerful. I'll give it a shot because I love Flygon, but I'm skeptical about how effective he will be.

Gonna see if I can quit being lazy and put up a threat list soon, that should help you guys give (even? :D') more effective feedback. Keep it coming, I appreciate it, thanks.

In the meantime, I've been having a lot of issues with substitute sweepers. Without someone to use Whirlwind/Roar, Milotic can't phaze them and they walk all over me. Gliscor and Breloom are easily handled by Gengar, but special sweepers like Latias and even Sub-mono attack Dragonite have really been giving me hell. Gengar can't properly wall most CMers and Dragonite, and Forry can't Counter them through their Sub so I have little that can deal with them.
 
Hey man, cool team! Looks pretty solid but i do think that sun teams can get pretty annoying if played right. Sun sweepers, especially venusaur and heatran, can be nuisances, since only one or two pokemon on your team counter either, and if they go down you're fair game. Grass and Fire attacks in general can get the better of this team pretty easily, and with most of the common sun abusers using those it can become a problem pretty quickly. Anyways, Scarf Terrakion over Landorus seems like a solid idea to fix that, since it outspeeds most Chlorophyll abusers and KOes with Earthquake and Stone Edge. It also can clean up very nicely with Close Combat if you need it to. Hope this suggestion helps, and GL with the team!
 
Weather teams do occasionally give me trouble, yeah. My team has few switch-ins to Rain-boosted Water moves aside from Milotic, and no one resists Tornadus' Hurricanes, so that can be problematic too... though if I can handle those two, I can usually beat them.

Sun is troublesome though, yeah. If Venusaur/Victreebel get a chance to set up, I can't really stop them, and Heatran hasn't typically been much of an issue, though defensive variants are annoying.

Unfortunately, Terrakion > Landorus doesn't work for me, since without it, I lack an Electric immunity/resistance to safely switch Milotic out of. My best option for a scarfer without having to rework the entire team would need to be a Ground-type. I'm giving Flygon a try, despite my misgivings about it. ;w; <3 I doubt it'll be more powerful than Landorus though, it CAN kill Ferro/Forry with Fire, but apart from that the only advantage is STAB Outrage. We'll see how it goes.
 
In all honesty I like the idea of a more bulky volcarona but the spreads make it a bit to slow and and even after 1 dance it wont be doing much perhaps going with this

Volcarona@leftovers
Flame body
Timid: 128hp, 252satk,128spe
Quiver dance
F-Blast, Flamethrower, or Fiery dance
Hp Ground
Bug buzz

the ev investements make volc a little bulky while keeping it mostly offensive you can choose between fire blast flamethrower or fiery dance depends on your preference and hp ground for heatrans
 

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