Nope. The main reason snorlax won is because gsc snorlax is better than ANY pokemon in ANY generation.IIRC, the main reason Snorlax beat out Tyranitar for #1 was that it actually existed in Gen 1.
Jellicent, if we use your idea of basing this list on a Pokemon's entire history, this list would need to be completely restructured. IIRC, the main reason Snorlax beat out Tyranitar for #1 was that it actually existed in Gen 1. Also, this is extremely biased toward dominant newer-gen Pokemon; why not Heatran at #1 then?
I think you missed that part...I think a Pokemon that has consistently dominated since its inception is a better pick for this than something that existed longer, dominated the same length of time, but also flopped during its existence.
Right, the idea was to swing either the consistency argument, or the dominance. I'm much more in favor of exeggutor being a top 10, albeit I don't see how you can say dnite is "BL" in RBY, that's like saying alakazam is ou in gsc (i.e. historically). dnite is only "bl" in rby on the basis of inconsistent rulesets, but this is smogon. And dragonite, anyway you look at it, is a better pokemon than blissey in GSC.Dragonite is hardly a "perennial" OU. It's historically BL in RBY and even now is still kind of seen as a gimmick, it's BL by name in GSC (and its OU power is very debatable), and it's been overshadowed by Mence in ADV and DPP. As a result, it's decisively BL in ADV and is only considered a top-tier OU threat in recent DPP now that all the better dragons are banned.
As for Egg, there's a far better argument for him. Basically mandatory on an RBY team, and a top-tier offensive threat in GSC. I think the biggest points against it are 1) its extremely sharp drop-off after GSC, which I'd say hurts it enough to be worse than just not existing for two generations; and 2) the variance of its performance in GSC that makes its position as a "top 5" quite debatable.
Say what you will about Blissey being nothing more than setup bait, but it's a known quantity in every match and the best at what it does. Offenses NEED to have a way to deal with it to be successful in ADV and DPP (it's basically an automatic member of most stall teams in these generations), and it was good enough in early GSC to make SkarmBliss a thing (and a moderately successful thing at that), even if the modern bias toward offense in GSC would lead you toward thinking it's total shit (which it isn't, that's hyperbole and you know it).
I'm going to expand on my decision of Raikou at #9; basically, imo it is a shoe-in for that slot. It's got top 3 status in GSC, is one of the most fearsome sweepers of ADV, and is apparently still pretty good in DPP. It doesn't have Eggy's severe drop-off; its peak is way more impressive than Blissey's (Blissey was always just kind of there, never outright defining a metagame but constantly shaping it in some way); and I'm not even going to dignify Dragonite because the fat dragon has no business on this list. Other things it could compare to include Jirachi, which Kou matches or surpasses in peak dominance and which Kou has beat on generation count; Forretress, which has always been a one-trick pony and not even necessarily the best at its job (just the most specialized); and Cloyster, which people seem inclined to dignify like Dragonite even though it faces an Egg-like drop-off in usefulness without ever really being as good as Egg was in RBY/GSC.
I'm more open to #10. However, on the surface, it feels wrong not to include Blissey, but I feel like that's in part because it has the stats and movepool to make it the perennial go-to special wall for generations to come, and not just because of its performance in GSC-DPP. That being said, the only real competitors I see for Blissey's slot are Jirachi and Forretress. Mayyybe Salamence too, although on second thought not really because it's kind of average in RSE whereas its dominance in DPP was very brief and the result of a metagame where tiering decisions were constantly in flux. As for other things people are bringing up, Egg's drop-off is too severe and everything else was never good enough to begin with.
On the other hand, it's probably unfair to utterly disrespect Chansey's status in RBY when talking about Blissey. Just saying. Maybe we can include Blissey in the top ten specifying that it made the list because RBY Chansey gave it a nudge.and i think that any pokemon that's a bl or lower counts as a "does not exist". I don't think it should count AGAINST the pokemon.
I haven't chimed in on this thread yet, but I am 100% in agreement with this - it's weird to "have" to ignore Chansey, and I think it's a nice compromise to give Blissey a little asterisk explaining the nudge (compromise in the sense that if we counted Chansey and Blissey together from the start the list might have shaken out differently, but at least nudging Blissey into 10 with an asterisk is the compromise).On the other hand, it's probably unfair to utterly disrespect Chansey's status in RBY when talking about Blissey. Just saying. Maybe we can include Blissey in the top ten specifying that it made the list because RBY Chansey gave it a nudge.
Even better idea, actually. Puts the Blissey debate to rest, allows us to focus elsewhere for the 9-10 spots, and respects Chansey from RBY. Can we agree on that and call it a day on Blissey?A nudge/asterisk would be 11. i.e. honorable mention. Sir. And that's really what bliss/chan deserves.
I honestly think it's werid that a thread about dominance ignores ubers, who are uber because of their dominance.I haven't chimed in on this thread yet, but I am 100% in agreement with this - it's weird to "have" to ignore Chansey, and I think it's a nice compromise to give Blissey a little asterisk explaining the nudge (compromise in the sense that if we counted Chansey and Blissey together from the start the list might have shaken out differently, but at least nudging Blissey into 10 with an asterisk is the compromise).
There's your answer.before it got thrown into ubers