VGC 17 Talonflame

Adamant Zoroark

catchy catchphrase
is a Contributor Alumnus

The bravest birb

QC: Carbonific / Jio
GP: Kris

[OVERVIEW]

* Gale Wings grants priority to all of Talonflame's Flying-type moves at full HP, giving it access to priority Tailwind, thus almost guaranteeing that it will set up said move.
* Talonflame also gets priority on Flying-type Z-Moves, giving it a very powerful move to use for revenge killing.
* Thanks to its Fire typing, it also functions as an effective check to Steel-types like Kartana and Celesteela.
* Gale Wings only working at full HP is especially problematic given that Talonflame's best STAB moves cause recoil damage, thus ensuring that it only gets two or three turns out of Gale Wings at most.
* Talonflame's frailty in combination with the recoil of its attacks severely limits how long it can survive in a battle.
* It also has a below-average Attack stat, although the high Base Power of its attacks somewhat remedies this.

[SET]
name: Tailwind Support
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Flare Blitz
move 3: Tailwind
move 4: Protect / Taunt / Will-O-Wisp
item: Flyinium Z
ability: Gale Wings
nature: Adamant
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

* Brave Bird is Talonflame's strongest Flying-type STAB move and is therefore used as the base move for Supersonic Skystrike. This gives it a one-time 190-Base Power priority STAB move, while Brave Bird is reasonably powerful on its own after Supersonic Skystrike has been used. However, the recoil damage means that Brave Bird will only have priority on the first use.
* Despite breaking Gale Wings, Flare Blitz is still Talonflame's best Fire-type STAB move, OHKOing Kartana and 2HKOing Celesteela and Metagross.
* Tailwind doubles the Speed of Talonflame and its allies for four turns, and thanks to Gale Wings, Talonflame virtually guarantees setting it up.
* Protect grants Talonflame a turn of protection while its teammate handles a threat like Tapu Koko or Nihilego. The protection from damage is also useful for keeping Gale Wings intact.
* Taunt allows Talonflame to stop Trick Room and opposing Tailwind from being set up.
* Will-O-Wisp allows Talonflame to cripple opposing physical attackers, such as Garchomp and Snorlax.

Set Details
========

* Talonflame should be using an EV spread of 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe, as it wants to be both as strong and as fast as possible, and any investment in bulk won't help it much given its frailty.
* Gale Wings is the only ability that Talonflame should be using, as it is what allows Talonflame to use priority Tailwind, Supersonic Skystrike, and Brave Bird.
* Flyinium Z is necessary to enable the use of Supersonic Skystrike. No other item should be considered on Talonflame, as access to a priority Z-Move is one of Talonflame's biggest selling points.
* Talonflame can afford to run an Adamant nature in order to help patch up its below-average Attack stat, as its base Speed is already so high that it outspeeds Kartana and Alolan Ninetales by exactly one point without a Speed-boosting nature, while there is nothing particularly noteworthy that Talonflame must run Jolly in order to beat.

Usage Tips
========

* If you bring Talonflame to a match, it should generally be used as a lead so it can set up Tailwind as soon as possible.
* That being said, should the foe have very fast, offensive Pokemon like Pheromosa, Golduck, and Lilligant, or a setup sweeper like Gyarados, it's a good idea to consider keeping Talonflame in the back, keeping it at maximum HP so it can strike these threats with Supersonic Skystrike at the right moment.
* Leading Talonflame alongside a Fake Out user assists it in setting up Tailwind, enabling it to safely get Tailwind up even against threats like Tapu Koko.
* Talonflame should be brought against opposing Tailwind setters like Mandibuzz and Drifblim so that it can match their Tailwind at a minimum.
* Given that Flare Blitz's recoil will break Gale Wings, it's best to avoid using it unless absolutely necessary.

Team Options
========

* Pretty much any Pokemon can benefit from Tailwind support, but Pokemon with low-to-average Speed like Tapu Fini, Alolan Marowak, and Alolan Muk especially benefit from Tailwind support, as it enables them to outspeed Pokemon that they otherwise wouldn't be able to.
* Given that Rock-types like Gigalith and Nihilego are huge thorns in Talonflame's side, Ground-, Water-, and Steel-types like Garchomp, Tapu Fini, and Kartana make for good teammates. Talonflame also allows Garchomp to use Earthquake without worrying about damaging its teammate, although it likely won't survive long enough to grant Garchomp this luxury for a whole match.
* Consider running a second Fire-type for an additional check to Steel-types; options include Arcanine, Alolan Marowak, and Salazzle. This allows Talonflame to use Flare Blitz as a last resort against these Pokemon, as opposed to it being the only option to handle these Pokemon.
* Lightning Rod support from the likes of Alolan Marowak or Togedemaru helps Talonflame by protecting it from Electric-type moves, especially those from Tapu Koko.
* Grass-types like Kartana and Tapu Bulu assist Talonflame by beating Water-types like Tapu Fini and Gastrodon.
* Using one or two of Tapu Koko, Tapu Bulu, or Tapu Fini is strongly recommended, as they can clear the field of Psychic Terrain to allow Talonflame to use Supersonic Skystrike on grounded Pokemon.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

* Talonflame's shallow movepool means that it does not have too many other options; almost anything not listed on the set is really pushing it.
* Overheat OHKOes Kartana and still does considerable damage to other Steel-types like Celesteela and Metagross without causing recoil damage to Talonflame, thus preserving Gale Wings.
* Flamethrower also OHKOes Kartana while preserving Gale Wings, but does pitiful damage to any other Steel-type.
* Quick Guard allows Talonflame to protect itself and its teammates from priority attacks, especially Fake Out.
* Roost gives Talonflame a recovery option that could potentially enable it to reactivate Gale Wings. However, it will generally be taking too much damage to be able to take advantage of this option.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Rock-type Pokemon**: Gigalith and Nihilego resist both of Talonflame's STAB moves, thus allowing them to take any attack and OHKO with Rock Slide and Power Gem, respectively.

**Water-type Pokemon**: Tapu Fini, Milotic, and Gastrodon all threaten to do substantial damage to or OHKO Talonflame with their Water-type STAB moves. However, as they do not resist Flying-type moves, they will still take heavy damage from Supersonic Skystrike.

**Tapu Koko**: Tapu Koko outspeeds and OHKOes Talonflame with Thunderbolt while not being OHKOed by anything in Talonflame's arsenal. However, it does risk taking huge damage from Flare Blitz on the switch-in.

**Tapu Lele**: Tapu Lele's Psychic Surge ability will set up Psychic Terrain, which will prevent Talonflame from using Supersonic Skystrike against any grounded Pokemon at full HP, although Talonflame will still be able to use priority Tailwind. However, Tapu Lele risks being 2HKOed by Flare Blitz as it switches in.

**Intimidate**: Intimidate users like Gyarados and Arcanine lower Talonflame's already meager Attack stat, reducing its damage output. Furthermore, these Pokemon threaten to OHKO Talonflame with Waterfall and Wild Charge, respectively, although Talonflame has a chance to OHKO both with Supersonic Skystrike, depending on their EV spreads, if it is unaffected by Intimidate.
 
Last edited:
Yeah, Talonflame already had limited options in past years but now it is even more limited as LO or CB are no longer viable aswell as Quick Guard being not AS useful anymore.

Focus Sash is probably an option with similar concept as in past; set up Tailwind, tank a hit and then get one attack off and die. Against Tapu Koko it sounds in theory OK, but yea just like before its still kinda ehh. Other than that, i dont even know, MAYBE Firium-Z if one hates Celesteela *that* much.
 

dhelmise

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[OVERVIEW]

* Gale Wings grants priority to all of Talonflame's Flying-type moves at full HP, giving it access to priority Tailwind, thus almost guaranteeing that it will set up Tailwind said move.
* Talonflame is also the only fully-evolved Pokemon in the game to get also gets priority on a Z-Move Flying-type Z-Moves, giving it a very powerful move to use for revenge killing.
* Thanks to its Fire typing, it also functions as an effective check to Steel-types like Kartana and Celesteela.
* Gale Wings only working at full HP is especially problematic given that Talonflame's best STAB moves cause recoil damage, thus ensuring that it only gets two or three turns out of Gale Wings at most.
* Talonflame's frailty in combination with the recoil of its attacks severely limits how long it can survive in a battle.
* It also has a below-average (AH) Attack stat, although the high Base Power of its attacks somewhat remedies this.

[SET]
name: Tailwind Support
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Flare Blitz
move 3: Tailwind
move 4: Protect / Taunt / Will-O-Wisp
item: Flyinium Z
ability: Gale Wings
nature: Adamant
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

* Brave Bird is Talonflame's strongest Flying-type STAB move and is therefore used as the base move for Supersonic Skystrike. This gives it a one-time 190-Base (AH) Power priority STAB move, while Brave Bird is reasonably powerful on its own after Supersonic Skystrike has been used. However, the recoil damage means that Brave Bird will only have priority on the first use.
* Despite breaking Gale Wings, Flare Blitz is still Talonflame's best Fire-type STAB move, OHKOing Kartana and 2HKOing Celesteela and Metagross.
* Tailwind doubles the Speed of Talonflame and its allies for four turns, and, (RC) thanks to Gale Wings, Talonflame virtually guarantees setting it up.
* Protect grants Talonflame a turn of protection while its teammate handles a threat like Tapu Koko or Nihilego. The protection from damage is also useful for keeping Gale Wings intact.
* Taunt allows Talonflame to stop Trick Room and opposing Tailwind from being set up.
* Will-O-Wisp allows Talonflame to cripple opposing physical attackers, such as Garchomp and Snorlax.

Set Details
========

* Talonflame should be using an EV spread of 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe, as it wants to be both as strong and as fast as possible, and any investment in bulk won't help it much given its frailty.
* Gale Wings is the only ability that Talonflame should be using, as it is what allows Talonflame to use priority Tailwind, Supersonic Skystrike, and Brave Bird.
* Flyinium Z is necessary to enable the use of Supersonic Skystrike. No other item should be considered on Talonflame, as access to a priority Z-Move is one of Talonflame's biggest selling points.
* Talonflame can afford to run an Adamant nature in order to help patch up its below-average (AH) Attack stat, as its base Speed is already so high that it outspeeds Kartana and Alolan Ninetales by exactly one point without a Speed-boosting nature, while there is nothing particularly noteworthy that Talonflame must run Jolly in order to beat.

Usage Tips
========

* If you bring Talonflame to a match, it should generally be used as a lead so it can set up Tailwind as soon as possible.
* That being said, should the foe have be facing down very fast, offensive Pokemon like Pheromosa, Golduck, and Lilligant, or a setup sweeper like Gyarados, it's a good idea to consider keeping Talonflame in the back, keeping it at maximum HP so it can strike these threats with Supersonic Skystrike at the right moment.
* Leading Talonflame alongside a Fake Out user assists it in setting up Tailwind, enabling it to safely get Tailwind up even against threats like Tapu Koko.
* Talonflame should be brought against opposing Tailwind setters like Mandibuzz and Drifblim so that it can match their Tailwind at a minimum.
* Given that Flare Blitz's recoil will break Gale Wings, it's best to avoid using it unless absolutely necessary.

Team Options
========

* Pretty much any Pokemon can benefit from Tailwind support, but Pokemon with low-to-average Speed like Tapu Fini, Alolan Marowak, and Alolan Muk especially benefit from Tailwind support, as it enables them to outspeed Pokemon that they otherwise wouldn't be able to.
* Given that Rock-types like Gigalith and Nihilego are huge thorns in Talonflame's side, Ground-types, Water-types, (RC) Ground-, Water-, (AC) and Steel-types like Garchomp, Tapu Fini, and Kartana make for good teammates. Talonflame also allows Garchomp to use Earthquake without worrying about damaging its teammate, although it likely won't survive long enough to grant Garchomp this luxury for a whole match.
* Consider running a second Fire-type for an additional check to Steel-types; options include Arcanine, Alolan Marowak, and Salazzle. This allows Talonflame to use Flare Blitz as a last resort against these Pokemon, as opposed to it being the only option to handle these Pokemon.
* Lightning Rod support from the likes of Alolan Marowak or Togedemaru helps Talonflame by protecting it from Thunderbolts Electric-type moves, especially those from Tapu Koko.
* Grass-types like Kartana and Tapu Bulu assist Talonflame by beating Water-types like Tapu Fini and Gastrodon.
* Using one or two of Tapu Koko, Tapu Bulu, or Tapu Fini is strongly recommended, as they can clear the field of Psychic Terrain to allow Talonflame to use Supersonic Skystrike on grounded Pokemon.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

* Talonflame's shallow movepool means that it does not have too many other options; almost anything not listed on the set is really pushing it.
* Overheat OHKOes Kartana and still does considerable damage to other Steel-types like Celesteela and Metagross without causing recoil damage to Talonflame, thus preserving Gale Wings.
* Flamethrower also OHKOes Kartana while preserving Gale Wings, but does pitiful damage to any other Steel-type.
* Quick Guard allows Talonflame to protect itself and its teammates from priority attacks, especially Fake Out.
* Roost gives Talonflame a recovery option that could potentially enable it to reactivate Gale Wings. However, it will generally be taking too much damage to be able to take advantage of this option.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Rock-type Pokemon**: Gigalith and Nihilego resist both of Talonflame's STAB moves, thus allowing them to take any attack and OHKO with Rock Slide and Power Gem, respectively.

**Water-type Pokemon**: Tapu Fini, Milotic, and Gastrodon all threaten to do substantial damage to or OHKO, (RC) if not outright OHKO, (RC) Talonflame with their Water-type STAB moves. However, as they do not resist Flying-type moves, they will still take substantial heavy (repetition) damage from Supersonic Skystrike.

**Tapu Koko**: Tapu Koko outspeeds and OHKOes Talonflame with Thunderbolt while not being OHKOed by anything in Talonflame's arsenal. However, it does risk taking huge damage from Flare Blitz on the switch-in.

**Tapu Lele**: Tapu Lele's Psychic Surge ability will set up Psychic Terrain, which will prevent Talonflame from using Supersonic Skystrike against any grounded Pokemon at full HP, although Talonflame will still be able to use priority Tailwind. However, Tapu Lele risks being 2HKOed by Flare Blitz as it switches in.

**Intimidate**: Intimidate users like Gyarados and Arcanine lower Talonflame's already meager Attack stat, reducing its damage output. Furthermore, these Pokemon threaten to OHKO Talonflame with Waterfall and Wild Charge, respectively, although Talonflame has a chance to OHKO both with Supersonic Skystrike, depending on their EV spreads, if it is unaffected by Intimidate.
GP 1/1
 

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