Quality Control Talonflame [QC 1/2]

Lucario

A side must always be chosen
is a Top Social Media Contributoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
[OVERVIEW]

In a tier with a bunch of powerful hazard setters Talonflame soars to the top as a premier pivot with U-turn, spreading Burn everywhere it goes, while also being able to remove hazards with Defog. Talonflame is not only reserved as a utility option, it can act as a physical wall in a pinch thanks to its ability Flame Body and being able to invest in its bulk without losing out on Speed and without the need for power thanks to its high base power STAB attacks like Brave Bird and Flare Blitz. Talonflame can force out Stealth Rock and Spikes setters like Krookodile, Registeel, Brambleghast, and Klefki by threatening them with Will-O-Wisp and using Defog to remove their hazards. Thanks to its high speed, Talonflame can revenge kill fast threats like non-Choice Scarf variants of Mienshao, Krookodile, and Infernape. However, Talonflame's flight can be cut short due to the tier king Slowbro's positive matchup against it. Not only that, but Talonflame's low offenses really standout while trying to revenge bulkier breakers and resists like Mew, Chandelure, and Oricorio-E which can all shrug off its attacks and don't care about burn. Talonflame's reliance on Heavy-Duty Boots is made apparent when it commonly switches into Knock Off users like Krookodile, Mienshao, Copperajah, and Infernape, forcing it to take hazard damage every time it wants to switch-in again. Talonflame's poor typing allows most other hazard setters to set up for free, like Rhyperior, Diancie, and Lycanroc-D.

[SET]
name: Utility
move 1: Brave Bird / Flare Blitz
move 2: Defog / U-turn
move 3: Roost
move 4: Will-O-Wisp / U-turn
item: Heavy-Duty Boots
ability: Flame Body
nature: Jolly
evs: 248 HP / 28 Def / 232 Spe
tera type: Steel

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Details
====

Brave Bird and Flare Blitz have the same base power, accuracy, recoil, and hit Grass-types like Tsareena, Venusaur, and Brambleghast for super effective damage, so the option for which one you choose is mostly personal preference. Brave Bird additionally hits Fighting-types and Fire-type resists like Mienshao, Chandelure, and Noivern; Flare Blitz is better into hazard setters and enables Talonflame to hit Steel-types and Flying-type resists like Copperajah, Klefki, and Thundurus for more damage and has a small chance to burn. Will-O-Wisp is a more reliable way of burning your opponents than Flame Body, letting Talonflame burn common switch-ins like Rhyperior, Vaporeon, and Raikou as well as threatening hazard setters that commonly switch-in like Rhyperior, Diancie, and Dragalge. 232 Speed EVs allow Talonflame to outspeed Noivern while maximizing its bulk as much as possible. Tera Steel gives Talonflame a much needed resistance to Lycanroc-D's Accelerock and Lucario's Extreme Speed, letting it check them more safely while also gaining a resistance to Stealth Rock if it ever lost its item; Talonflame can also become a pseudo-check for some special breakers like Mew, Noivern, and Dragalge with Tera Steel.

Talonflame's main role is to pivot, and thanks to it drawing in Electric- and Rock-type Pokemon, it pairs well with Ground- and Grass-types like Krookodile, Flygon, Vileplume, and Brute Bonnet, which can all exploit its switch-ins. Pokemon that appreciate hazard removal like Alolan Muk, Mew, and Gallade also pair well with Talonflame. Talonflame also enjoys tanking Fighting-type moves from Mienshao, Infernape, and Lucario, so teammates like Lycanroc-D, Krookodile, and Registeel all appreciate Talonflame's presence in battle. Bulky offense teams appreciate Talonflame's ability to lure in Electric- and Rock-types due to their passivity in certain matchups, so pivoting into Torterra, Flygon, and Swampert can help create momentum. On balanced structures Talonflame enjoys having switch-ins for Pokemon like Noivern and Dragalge, so Steel- and Fairy-types like Registeel, Copperajah, Klefki, and Sylveon all synergize well with it. Diancie, Rhyperior, and Gastrodon can all set up hazards in front of Talonflame without trouble, so Water- and Grass-types like Feraligatr, Basculegion, Brute Bonnet, and Vileplume can all safely switch-in and threaten a KO.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
====

Talonflame can instead opt for Taunt over Will-O-Wisp, crippling any setup attempts from the likes of Bulky Mew, Registeel, and Reuniclus, but it makes Talonflame a little more passive, especially since it isn't dealing much damage to those Pokemon regardless. Overheat and Flamethrower can be used instead of the two STAB attacks to hit Vileplume without worrying about Rocky Helmet and Effect Spore, but its poor accuracy paired with Talonflame's really low Special Attack stat makes it undesirable against most of the tier. Talonflame can boost its attack with Swords Dance and Bulk Up, which frees room for Gale Wings priority, however even after a boost it is still weak and relies on less than ideal moves to sweep with.

Checks and Counters
====

**Electric-types**: Thundurus, Oricorio-E, and Toxtricity all have a positive matchup against Talonflame, they can all take a hit from its STAB attacks whenever and threaten an OHKO or set up. Rotom-H is especially tricky for Talonflame, resisting both of its STAB attacks, being immune to burn, and can Trick a Choice Scarf onto it, acting as a hard wall against Talonflame.

**Item Removal**: Common Knock Off users like Krookodile, Alolan Muk, and Reuniclus and Trick users like Porygon-Z, Rotom-H, and Florges can all remove Talonflame's Heavy-Duty Boots, forcing it to take Stealth Rock damage every time it switches in.

**Rock-types**: Rhyperior and Diancie are both hazard setters that beat Talonflame thanks to their Rock-type STAB attacks achieving a KO, freely letting them switch-in and set up hazards any time Talonflame is on the field. Lycanroc-D is also noteworthy thanks to its strong priority move Accelerock, although it has to worry about being burned.

**Water-types**: Vaporeon and Milotic can all tank hits from Talonflame, heal the HP back with ease, and retaliate with Scald. Offensive Water-types like Feraligatr and Basculegion can also threaten Talonflame but neither like to be burned. Slowbro is a much bigger check to Talonflame is too passive versus Slowbro, letting it set up Calm Mind for free.

[CREDITS]
Written by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/lucario.189361/
Quality checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/rabia.336073/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user4.103/
Grammar checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user5.104/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user6.105/
 
Last edited:

Rabia

is a Site Content Manageris a Top Social Media Contributoris a Community Leaderis a Community Contributoris a Smogon Discord Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Battle Simulator Moderator
GP & NU Leader
add remove comments
[OVERVIEW]

In a tier with a bunch of powerful hazard setters Talonflame soars to the top as a premier user of Defog, spreading Burn everywhere it goes, it can also pivot out of a tricky situation with U-turn, furthering its team's momentum. Talonflame is not only reserved as a utility option, it can act as a physical wall in a pinch thanks to its ability Flame Body and being able to invest in its bulk without losing out on Speed and without the need for power thanks to its high base power STAB attacks like Brave Bird and Flare Blitz. Talonflame can force out Stealth Rock and Spikes setters like Krookodile, Registeel, Brambleghast, and Klefki by threatening them with Will-O-Wisp and using Defog to remove their hazards. Thanks to its high speed, Talonflame can revenge kill fast threats like non-Choice Scarf variants of Mienshao, Krookodile, and Infernape. (condense this first half more and emphasize its pivot role more. talonflame isn't that amazing of a fogger when you consider it's kind of ass into the rockers beyond burning them, so I don't think that needs to be your first point) However, Talonflame's flight can be cut short due to the tier king Slowbro's positive matchup against it. Not only that, but Talonflame's low offenses really standout while trying to revenge bulkier breakers and resists like Mew, Chandelure, and Oricorio-E which can all shrug off its attacks and don't care about burn. Talonflame's poor typing and reliance on Heavy-Duty Boots are made apparent when facing other Stealth Rock setters like Rhyperior, Diancie, and Lycanroc-D and Knock Off users like Alolan Muk, Reuniclus, and Thundurus which all threaten Talonflame with their STAB options or removing its item, forcing it to take Stealth Rock damage. (I'd actually make this Knock Off weakness the first point and just add Slowbro to your list of bulky threats it can't beat. Talk about how it's basically a magnet for Knock Off and is also commonly tasked with switching INTO the common Knock Off users like Krook, Shao, Nape, and Rajah)

[SET]
name: Utility
move 1: Brave Bird / Flare Blitz
move 2: Defog / U-turn
move 3: Roost
move 4: Will-O-Wisp / U-turn
item: Heavy-Duty Boots
ability: Flame Body
nature: Jolly
evs: 248 HP / 28 Def / 232 Spe
tera type: Steel / Ground

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Details
====

Brave Bird and Flare Blitz have the same base power, accuracy, recoil, and hit Grass-types like Tsareena, Venusaur, and Brambleghast for super effective damage, so the option for which one you choose is mostly personal preference. Brave Bird additionally hits Fighting-types and Fire-type resists like Mienshao, Chandelure, and Noivern while Flare Blitz enables Talonflame to hit Steel-types and Flying-type resists like Copperajah, Klefki, and Thundurus for more damage and has a small chance to burn. (I'd try and emphasize that Flare Blitz is generally better into hazard setters) Defog removes all hazards except for Leech Seed; this can enable your own breakers and walls more. U-turn allows Talonflame to pivot safer into an ally instead of hard switching. Roost lets Talonflame restore its HP, letting it switch-in more to tank hits and spread burn. (all fluff, unless you can find a more interesting way of putting it then leave it out) Will-O-Wisp is a more reliable way of burning your opponents than Flame Body, letting Talonflame burn common switch-ins like Rhyperior, Vaporeon, and Raikou. (talk about how Will-O-Wisp makes Talonflame actually capable of threatening the hazard setters it's tasked with negating imo) 232 Speed EVs allow Talonflame to outspeed Noivern while maximizing its bulk as much as possible. Tera Steel gives Talonflame a much needed resistance to Lycanroc-D's Accelerock and Lucario's Extreme Speed, letting it check them more safely while also gaining a resistance to Stealth Rock if it ever lost its item; Talonflame can also become a pseudo-check for some special breakers like Mew, Noivern, and Dragalge with Tera Steel. Tera Ground turns Talonflame's Electric-type weakness into an immunity, letting it safely switch-in on Electric-types like Rotom-H and Magnezone, it also gains a resistance to Lycanroc-D's Accelerock and Stealth Rock, but it now gains a weakness to Grass-type attacks, giving it a poor matchup against Vileplume and Venusaur. (unconvinced by ground being worthwhile. you still get super smoked by rotom-h and you can't even touch zone without blitz)

Talonflame's main role is to act as a Defog user and pivot, so Pokemon that appreciate hazard removal like Alolan Muk, Vileplume, and Brute Bonnet can pair well. (start this teammates section off by mentioning good partners for Talon's U-turn. what is talonflame drawing in? what can come in on those U-turns to exploit the opponent's switch-in?) Talonflame also enjoys tanking Fighting-type moves from Mienshao, Infernape, and Lucario, so teammates like Lycanroc-D, Krookodile, and Registeel all appreciate Talonflame's presence in battle. Bulky offense teams appreciate Talonflame's ability to lure in Electric- and Rock-types due to their passivity in certain matchups, so pivoting into Torterra, Flygon, and Swampert can help create momentum. On balanced structures Talonflame enjoys having switch-ins for Pokemon like Noivern and Dragalge, so Steel- and Fairy-types like Registeel, Copperajah, Klefki, and Sylveon all synergize well with it. Diancie, Rhyperior, and Gastrodon can all set up hazards in front of Talonflame without trouble, so Water- and Grass-types like Feraligatr, Basculegion, Brute Bonnet, and Vileplume can all safely switch-in and threaten a KO. Bulky set up sweepers like Mew, Slowbro, and Oricorio-E all appreciate Talonflame spreading burn on physical attackers like Lycanroc-D, Krookodile, and Tsareena, giving them more oppurtunities to set up. Talonflame wants to keep its item and avoid Knock Off from Krookodile, Alolan Muk, and Incineroar, so Knock Off absorbers like Colbur Berry Slowbro, Alolan Muk, Sylveon, and Vileplume all pair well wth it. (let the record show that you say earlier Talonflame LOVES to switch into Mienshao and Infernape, two common Knock Off users)

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
====

Talonflame can instead opt for Taunt over Will-O-Wisp, crippling any setup attempts from the likes of Cloyster bulky Mew, Registeel, and Reuniclus, but it makes Talonflame a little more passive, especially since it isn't dealing much damage to those Pokemon regardless. Overheat can be used instead of the two STAB attacks to hit Magnezone, Cloyster, and Vileplume with more damage, but its poor accuracy paired with Talonflame's really low Special Attack stat makes it undesirable. (tbh the reason you'd ever run Overheat or Flamethrower for that matter is for Vileplume and nothing else really) Talonflame can boost its attack with Swords Dance and Bulk Up, which frees room for Gale Wings priority, however even after a boost it is still weak and relies on less than ideal moves to sweep with.

Checks and Counters
====

**Electric-types**: Thundurus, Rotom-H, Oricorio-E, and Toxtricity all have a positive matchup against Talonflame, they can all take a hit from its STAB attacks whenever and threaten an OHKO or set up. (put more emphasis on rotom-H; it literally walls you lol)

**Item Removal**: Common Knock Off users like Krookodile, Alolan Muk, and Reuniclus and Trick users like Porygon-Z, Rotom-H, and Florges can all remove Talonflame's Heavy-Duty Boots, forcing it to take Stealth Rock damage every time it switches in.

**Rock-types**: Lycanroc-D, Rhyperior, and Diancie all threaten Talonflame with an OHKO, often forcing it out and in the case of the latter two, getting Stealth Rock up. (talk too about how Rhyperior and Diancie are inconveniently hazard setters that Talonflame sorta just sucks against)

**Water-types**: Slowbro, Vaporeon, and Milotic can all tank hits from Talonflame, heal the HP back with ease, and retaliate with Scald. (Talonflame is simply setup fodder for Slowbro. Mention that.) Offensive Water-types like Feraligatr and Basculegion can also threaten Talonflame but neither like to be burned.

[CREDITS]
Written by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/lucario.189361/
Quality checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user3.102/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user4.103/
Grammar checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user5.104/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user6.105/

qc 1/2 when done
 

Lucario

A side must always be chosen
is a Top Social Media Contributoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
add remove comments
[OVERVIEW]

In a tier with a bunch of powerful hazard setters Talonflame soars to the top as a premier user of Defog, spreading Burn everywhere it goes, it can also pivot out of a tricky situation with U-turn, furthering its team's momentum. Talonflame is not only reserved as a utility option, it can act as a physical wall in a pinch thanks to its ability Flame Body and being able to invest in its bulk without losing out on Speed and without the need for power thanks to its high base power STAB attacks like Brave Bird and Flare Blitz. Talonflame can force out Stealth Rock and Spikes setters like Krookodile, Registeel, Brambleghast, and Klefki by threatening them with Will-O-Wisp and using Defog to remove their hazards. Thanks to its high speed, Talonflame can revenge kill fast threats like non-Choice Scarf variants of Mienshao, Krookodile, and Infernape. (condense this first half more and emphasize its pivot role more. talonflame isn't that amazing of a fogger when you consider it's kind of ass into the rockers beyond burning them, so I don't think that needs to be your first point) However, Talonflame's flight can be cut short due to the tier king Slowbro's positive matchup against it. Not only that, but Talonflame's low offenses really standout while trying to revenge bulkier breakers and resists like Mew, Chandelure, and Oricorio-E which can all shrug off its attacks and don't care about burn. Talonflame's poor typing and reliance on Heavy-Duty Boots are made apparent when facing other Stealth Rock setters like Rhyperior, Diancie, and Lycanroc-D and Knock Off users like Alolan Muk, Reuniclus, and Thundurus which all threaten Talonflame with their STAB options or removing its item, forcing it to take Stealth Rock damage. (I'd actually make this Knock Off weakness the first point and just add Slowbro to your list of bulky threats it can't beat. Talk about how it's basically a magnet for Knock Off and is also commonly tasked with switching INTO the common Knock Off users like Krook, Shao, Nape, and Rajah)

[SET]
name: Utility
move 1: Brave Bird / Flare Blitz
move 2: Defog / U-turn
move 3: Roost
move 4: Will-O-Wisp / U-turn
item: Heavy-Duty Boots
ability: Flame Body
nature: Jolly
evs: 248 HP / 28 Def / 232 Spe
tera type: Steel / Ground

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Details
====

Brave Bird and Flare Blitz have the same base power, accuracy, recoil, and hit Grass-types like Tsareena, Venusaur, and Brambleghast for super effective damage, so the option for which one you choose is mostly personal preference. Brave Bird additionally hits Fighting-types and Fire-type resists like Mienshao, Chandelure, and Noivern while Flare Blitz enables Talonflame to hit Steel-types and Flying-type resists like Copperajah, Klefki, and Thundurus for more damage and has a small chance to burn. (I'd try and emphasize that Flare Blitz is generally better into hazard setters) Defog removes all hazards except for Leech Seed; this can enable your own breakers and walls more. U-turn allows Talonflame to pivot safer into an ally instead of hard switching. Roost lets Talonflame restore its HP, letting it switch-in more to tank hits and spread burn. (all fluff, unless you can find a more interesting way of putting it then leave it out) Will-O-Wisp is a more reliable way of burning your opponents than Flame Body, letting Talonflame burn common switch-ins like Rhyperior, Vaporeon, and Raikou. (talk about how Will-O-Wisp makes Talonflame actually capable of threatening the hazard setters it's tasked with negating imo) 232 Speed EVs allow Talonflame to outspeed Noivern while maximizing its bulk as much as possible. Tera Steel gives Talonflame a much needed resistance to Lycanroc-D's Accelerock and Lucario's Extreme Speed, letting it check them more safely while also gaining a resistance to Stealth Rock if it ever lost its item; Talonflame can also become a pseudo-check for some special breakers like Mew, Noivern, and Dragalge with Tera Steel. Tera Ground turns Talonflame's Electric-type weakness into an immunity, letting it safely switch-in on Electric-types like Rotom-H and Magnezone, it also gains a resistance to Lycanroc-D's Accelerock and Stealth Rock, but it now gains a weakness to Grass-type attacks, giving it a poor matchup against Vileplume and Venusaur. (unconvinced by ground being worthwhile. you still get super smoked by rotom-h and you can't even touch zone without blitz)

Talonflame's main role is to act as a Defog user and pivot, so Pokemon that appreciate hazard removal like Alolan Muk, Vileplume, and Brute Bonnet can pair well. (start this teammates section off by mentioning good partners for Talon's U-turn. what is talonflame drawing in? what can come in on those U-turns to exploit the opponent's switch-in?) Talonflame also enjoys tanking Fighting-type moves from Mienshao, Infernape, and Lucario, so teammates like Lycanroc-D, Krookodile, and Registeel all appreciate Talonflame's presence in battle. Bulky offense teams appreciate Talonflame's ability to lure in Electric- and Rock-types due to their passivity in certain matchups, so pivoting into Torterra, Flygon, and Swampert can help create momentum. On balanced structures Talonflame enjoys having switch-ins for Pokemon like Noivern and Dragalge, so Steel- and Fairy-types like Registeel, Copperajah, Klefki, and Sylveon all synergize well with it. Diancie, Rhyperior, and Gastrodon can all set up hazards in front of Talonflame without trouble, so Water- and Grass-types like Feraligatr, Basculegion, Brute Bonnet, and Vileplume can all safely switch-in and threaten a KO. Bulky set up sweepers like Mew, Slowbro, and Oricorio-E all appreciate Talonflame spreading burn on physical attackers like Lycanroc-D, Krookodile, and Tsareena, giving them more oppurtunities to set up. Talonflame wants to keep its item and avoid Knock Off from Krookodile, Alolan Muk, and Incineroar, so Knock Off absorbers like Colbur Berry Slowbro, Alolan Muk, Sylveon, and Vileplume all pair well wth it. (let the record show that you say earlier Talonflame LOVES to switch into Mienshao and Infernape, two common Knock Off users)

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
====

Talonflame can instead opt for Taunt over Will-O-Wisp, crippling any setup attempts from the likes of Cloyster bulky Mew, Registeel, and Reuniclus, but it makes Talonflame a little more passive, especially since it isn't dealing much damage to those Pokemon regardless. Overheat can be used instead of the two STAB attacks to hit Magnezone, Cloyster, and Vileplume with more damage, but its poor accuracy paired with Talonflame's really low Special Attack stat makes it undesirable. (tbh the reason you'd ever run Overheat or Flamethrower for that matter is for Vileplume and nothing else really) Talonflame can boost its attack with Swords Dance and Bulk Up, which frees room for Gale Wings priority, however even after a boost it is still weak and relies on less than ideal moves to sweep with.

Checks and Counters
====

**Electric-types**: Thundurus, Rotom-H, Oricorio-E, and Toxtricity all have a positive matchup against Talonflame, they can all take a hit from its STAB attacks whenever and threaten an OHKO or set up. (put more emphasis on rotom-H; it literally walls you lol)

**Item Removal**: Common Knock Off users like Krookodile, Alolan Muk, and Reuniclus and Trick users like Porygon-Z, Rotom-H, and Florges can all remove Talonflame's Heavy-Duty Boots, forcing it to take Stealth Rock damage every time it switches in.

**Rock-types**: Lycanroc-D, Rhyperior, and Diancie all threaten Talonflame with an OHKO, often forcing it out and in the case of the latter two, getting Stealth Rock up. (talk too about how Rhyperior and Diancie are inconveniently hazard setters that Talonflame sorta just sucks against)

**Water-types**: Slowbro, Vaporeon, and Milotic can all tank hits from Talonflame, heal the HP back with ease, and retaliate with Scald. (Talonflame is simply setup fodder for Slowbro. Mention that.) Offensive Water-types like Feraligatr and Basculegion can also threaten Talonflame but neither like to be burned.

[CREDITS]
Written by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/lucario.189361/
Quality checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user3.102/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user4.103/
Grammar checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user5.104/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/user6.105/

qc 1/2 when done
implemented
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top