Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v4 [Volcarona Banned]

[StompyStomps]

the team I personally use, any suggestions?

Athos (Cobalion) @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 104 HP / 252 SpA / 152 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Flash Cannon
- Aura Sphere
- Tera Blast
the anti-meta threat

Requiem (Skeledirge) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Unaware
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 248 HP / 248 SpA / 12 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Slack Off
- Torch Song
- Scorching Sands
- Alluring Voice
The f_ck you

Heart-to-Heart (Alomomola) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Flip Turn
- Scald
- Wish
- Protect
The Team keeper aliver

KING GHIDORAH! (Hydrapple) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Regenerator
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Yawn
- Recover
- Grass Knot
can spread sleep while not caring about Spore or Sandstorm once Tera'd

Protoplasmesis (Reuniclus) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Acid Armor
- Tera Blast
- Stored Power
Stored Power cannon

Hard Wall (Deoxys-Defense) @ Light Clay
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Teleport
- Knock Off
Dual Screens Deox-D is a favorite of mine

 

[hoyesdomingo]

Hatterene is VERY good in this meta. Obviously it's always been excellent on HO as a hazard deterrent, but it also manages to be an incredibly adept sweeper. Mimikyu Stardust's HO team is an exemplary model of this; the entire team is peak offensive threats + glim, but I've found that hat can more often than not win the game on its own.


:Hatterene (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Bounce
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 200 Def / 56 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Draining Kiss
- Psyshock
- Mystical Fire

Hat also is v v good into rain; one of HO's biggest problems is getting outrun before it has an actual chance to setup. Tera water hat not only has the bulk to buy you a turn against banded and specs monsters, but it also lets you KO them in return, especially if you've managed to grab a calm mind up.

252+ Atk Choice Band Floatzel Wave Crash vs. 252 HP / 200+ Def Tera Water Hatterene in Rain: 162-191 (50.9 - 60%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Another great attribute of hat is how well it synergizes with glim; against common hazard mons like Ace or Gliscor, Hatterene basically gets free cm boosts. It often does have to tera against Ace, but it can often set up completely freely against Glis. In both cases, draining kiss gives it incredible recovery.

252 Atk Tera Fire Cinderace Pyro Ball vs. 252 HP / 200+ Def Tera Water Hatterene: 95-112 (29.8 - 35.2%) -- 18.9% chance to 3HKO
0 Atk Gliscor Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 200+ Def Hatterene: 81-96 (25.4 - 30.1%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 Atk Gliscor Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 200+ Def Hatterene: 103-123 (32.3 - 38.6%) -- 98.3% chance to 3HKO

 

[NotDaProGamer]

Speaking of
Talonflame @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Steel/Fairy/Water
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Temper Flare
- Will-O-Wisp
- Defog
- Roost
Here is an update defensive utility set for Talonflame
It has enough speed to outspeed Adamant Roaring Moon without boosts and can burn it with Will-o-wisp. It also can use Defog and threaten Gholdengo with Temper Flare in return, which doubles in power when Defog fails. This can OHKO Gholdengo 30% of the time from full health, which just means it’s an OHKO majority of the time thanks to Hazards.
0 Atk Talonflame Temper Flare vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gholdengo: 284-336 (90.1 - 106.6%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO
0 Atk Talonflame Temper Flare vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gholdengo: 284-336 (90.1 - 106.6%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
This is also a pretty decent answer to Kingambit as well so long as it isn’t Tera Fire.

This is a really cool set... until you go against and literally become SD fodder.

GamerWhosBad's ability Pedantic allowed it to move first to give its 'helpful knowledge'.
GamerWhosBad used EV Tweak!
92 Atk Talonflame Temper Flare vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gholdengo: 318-374 (100.9 - 118.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO (when power doubled).

the team I personally use, any suggestions?

Athos (Cobalion) @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 104 HP / 252 SpA / 152 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Flash Cannon
- Aura Sphere
- Tera Blast
the anti-meta threat

Requiem (Skeledirge) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Unaware
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 248 HP / 248 SpA / 12 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Slack Off
- Torch Song
- Scorching Sands
- Alluring Voice
The f_ck you

Heart-to-Heart (Alomomola) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Flip Turn
- Scald
- Wish
- Protect
The Team keeper aliver

KING GHIDORAH! (Hydrapple) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Regenerator
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Yawn
- Recover
- Grass Knot
can spread sleep while not caring about Spore or Sandstorm once Tera'd

Protoplasmesis (Reuniclus) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Acid Armor
- Tera Blast
- Stored Power
Stored Power cannon

Hard Wall (Deoxys-Defense) @ Light Clay
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Teleport
- Knock Off
Dual Screens Deox-D is a favorite of mine

Only suggestion is to change deoxys's name to GR1MMSNARL, and also that goggles probably isn't needed. You can just not tera to be immune to spore, and Sandstorm kinda gets walled by

 

[Heatranator]

For me, Deoxys-Speed and Kyurem are two pressure points in the tier that I have been eyeing. I do not find the standard lead Deoxys sets to be problematic as much as attacking ones and maybe even some word for screens. Kyurem has a more interesting set mix discussion, but I find its strain on the builder more worrisome than most other presences.

While Deo-S attacking sets are amazing and also broken, I think that it also warps the lead metagame around it. If you want to set up hazards early game, you have it, Hamurott (which is mainly because it counter most Deo-S sets) and very rarely Ting-lu or Skarmory. Kyurem I believe is broken not because of it's offense's, but because of its speed. It's 95 base speed outspeeds tusk, which is huge for an offensive threat with that much power and versatility. It would be much better to handle if it was slower or the same speed as tusk. I don't think Kyurem is banworthy right now, I think that Moon is more problematic because it will always make progress and destroy a defensive hole in a team even if it has a "bad" matchup.

 

[Cuddly]

the team I personally use, any suggestions?

Athos (Cobalion) @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 104 HP / 252 SpA / 152 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Flash Cannon
- Aura Sphere
- Tera Blast
the anti-meta threat

Requiem (Skeledirge) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Unaware
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 248 HP / 248 SpA / 12 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Slack Off
- Torch Song
- Scorching Sands
- Alluring Voice
The f_ck you

Heart-to-Heart (Alomomola) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Flip Turn
- Scald
- Wish
- Protect
The Team keeper aliver

KING GHIDORAH! (Hydrapple) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Regenerator
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Yawn
- Recover
- Grass Knot
can spread sleep while not caring about Spore or Sandstorm once Tera'd

Protoplasmesis (Reuniclus) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Acid Armor
- Tera Blast
- Stored Power
Stored Power cannon

Hard Wall (Deoxys-Defense) @ Light Clay
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Teleport
- Knock Off
Dual Screens Deox-D is a favorite of mine

A general recommendation would be to use Pokepaste when sharing teams. It’s that button you see at the bottom of a team.
But for the team itself I think Hydrapple could use Dragon STAB like Draco Meteor. There are tons of Dragon types in the meta currently, which is why Ogerpon-Water fell off. It’s also way stronger and more reliable too than unSTAB Hydro Pump.

This is a really cool set... until you go against and literally become SD fodder.
GamerWhosBad used EV Tweak!
92 Atk Talonflame Temper Flare vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gholdengo: 318-374 (100.9 - 118.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO (when power doubled).

That seems like too much investment into Atk just so you can do 10% more to Gholdengo. Especially when Gholdengo rarely is at full health.

 

[Darlington]

Well I can finally say this, Ou is the best meta right now along with the lower tiers as well. Dlc 1 and home I felt like Ou was not the best tier or meta. I even said that Ubers Uu was the best tier and UU. But now by watching a lot of replays and can say Ou is the best because of dlc 2. Does that mean it's perfect. Well somewhat in my own opinion. For now I don't feel like nothing is broken except for Roaring Moon but that's just me. I did said Ghold before too but for now not anymore, maybe in the future. I know I'm not the council at all but I think February will be perfect to do the survey since Pecharunt will be released on January 11 and I know it won't be Ou usage but you never know. I think giving the Meta another month with no suspect or bans can be really good because we can have everyone input if they find the meta to be healthy, it's good or we need to suspect this Mon and that. I am quite curious to see the Usage though, who will fall down and who will rise. This should be very interesting

 

[Ibaragi]

Dengo being broken doesn't make sense.

Dengo by itself isn't really broken but it's Ability and the stranglehold effect is has on the hazard removal meta does.

I've come around to Good as Gold being less the problem, and more our lack of removal.

All of these statements are correct right now, which makes the situation more complicated than it was before.
Consistently through the first year of the meta, there was a very strong case to ban Gholdengo, or at least suspect it, based on its traits alone. Where as today, we kinda have to focus mostly on the effect Good for Gold has on hazard removal to justify testing it, and that itself is contentious.

But I still think it may be a necessary step, not so much because Gholdengo deserves it anymore, not even because I think it will fix Hazards (it won't), but because we don't have good alternatives. What other tiering action can work to lower the strain that Hazards has on our meta? Ban Gliscor, Sammurott-H, Ting Lu, Deoxys-S, even Ribombee, until we "power down" hazard setting? Ban Ceaseless Edge, maybe even Stone Axe, to validate Magic Bounce and Taunt at least as prevention methods? (btw, I go straight to the moves because Smeargle gets access to them and while he'd suck in comparison, I believe it would be close to playable enough where we'd see it a lot more; the Shed Tail conundrum all over again, basically). Make some complex ban where Spikes cannot be set by anything, or together with other forms of hazard or something awkward like that?

Precendent and tiering policies keep giving priority to simple, single-mon bans. And no single hazard setter is broken to the point of being the source of the problem; we'd need to ban around 5 mons that are otherwise fine to "maybe" weaken hazards this gen. And if we're gonna ban something dubious that is mostly not broken for the sole sake of artificially powering down Hazards, then banning Gholdengo alone to make removal more viable, is just the first option, even if it's not enough.

Ultimately, the point is that, even if lack of removal is the actual issue, we have no tiering tools to fix or manipulate that fact in any way. So we either do nothing and give in to Hazards forever, venture into complex bannings while having close to no precedent of that ever being a good idea, or we have to ban individual mons to change this, Gholdengo being the first on the list.

 

[StompyStomps]

A general recommendation would be to use Pokepaste when sharing teams. It’s that button you see at the bottom of a team.
But for the team itself I think Hydrapple could use Dragon STAB like Draco Meteor. There are tons of Dragon types in the meta currently, which is why Ogerpon-Water fell off. It’s also way stronger and more reliable too than unSTAB Hydro Pump.


That seems like too much investment into Atk just so you can do 10% more to Gholdengo. Especially when Gholdengo rarely is at full health.

Thank you, and I am suprised you didn't question Cobalions Tera Ice

 

[RyukTheDarkrai]

I might be alone in this, but I really do not like how much health Gliscor can get back in two turns from Poison Heal. An immunity to status (after the Toxic Orb activates) and being a great Knock Off switch-in after and 1/8th recovery of its HP every turn is utterly nuts. I'm really thankful for the new Special Attackers we got, especially Archaludon who can slowly withstand Gliscor's Earthquakes and fight back after, because taking essentially 43% from an Ice Spinner coming from a 252 Attack Great Tusk is absolutely not okay.

Pour one out for Lando-T. Survived just long enough for Gliscor to get banned all before it gets unbanned and its niche is stolen once again.

 

[RaikouLover]

I might be alone in this, but I really do not like how much health Gliscor can get back in two turns from Poison Heal. An immunity to status (after the Toxic Orb activates) and being a great Knock Off switch-in after and 1/8th recovery of its HP every turn is utterly nuts. I'm really thankful for the new Special Attackers we got, especially Archaludon who can slowly withstand Gliscor's Earthquakes and fight back after, because taking essentially 43% from an Ice Spinner coming from a 252 Attack Great Tusk is absolutely not okay.

Gliscor is cancer. After Tera, the primary offenders rn are Deoxys-S, Kyurem, Gliscor, and Kingcheap.

 

[RyukTheDarkrai]

Iron Boulder is very weak to priority, struggles to find a ton of free turns against offense, is easy to defensively Tera against, and does not break through balance well even after a boost while just using common Pokemon;

Also, genuine question: couldn't the same be applicable to Acrobatics Roaring Moon? What's the major difference breaker between the two Pokemon?

 

[Finchinator]

Also, genuine question: couldn't the same be applicable to Acrobatics Roaring Moon? What's the major difference breaker between the two Pokemon?

Moon is a lot stronger and has a better defensive profile. It also can displace items and play a longer game.

 

[ianlazerbeem]

Anyone else finding "matchup moth" nicknames for Volc very inaccurate right now, finding it a relatively consistent Mon & not having a huge amount of set variety? I sort of feel like Tera Ground Tera Blast is the only Volc set that's offensively good and can sweep without heavy team support (eg outside of a standard late game situation) it's a good Mon but it requires commiting your Tera for Heatran, Skeledirge, Packing Heat, and because of their defensive profiles (mainly the third's) there's really only one real option for that Tera, and even then Latios and Latias usually would require morning sun + further setup to bust through, this Mon is a lot more limited in its options than before yet still provides such important and incredible defensive and offensive value to the meta and utility in one slot, I have seen many harsh words about it being "restricting" in the NJNP thread and I think this is way off base, it's not restricting, it's restrictED! And sure it restricts things such as Kingambit late game sweep, and Ghold Nasty Plot sweep, oh no what a horrible thing! Tiering action needs to stay FAR AWAY from this Mon. Keep Volc Legal now and forever.

 

[Elec-ant1234]

Anyone else finding "matchup moth" nicknames for Volc very inaccurate right now, finding it a relatively consistent Mon & not having a huge amount of set variety? I sort of feel like Tera Ground Tera Blast is the only Volc set that's offensively good and can sweep without heavy team support (eg outside of a standard late game situation) it's a good Mon but it requires commiting your Tera for Heatran, Skeledirge, Packing Heat, and because of their defensive profiles (mainly the third's) there's really only one real option for that Tera, and even then Latios and Latias usually would require morning sun + further setup to bust through, this Mon is a lot more limited in its options than before yet still provides such important and incredible defensive and offensive value to the meta and utility in one slot, I have seen many harsh words about it being "restricting" in the NJNP thread and I think this is way off base, it's not restricting, it's restrictED! And sure it restricts things such as Kingambit late game sweep, and Ghold Nasty Plot sweep, oh no what a horrible thing! Tiering action needs to stay FAR AWAY from this Mon. Keep Volc Legal now and forever.

Yeah I kinda see tera ground to be the most viable and most consistent, especially with Archaludon running around being neutral to one stab and resisting the other. And also just that it's less broken due to more mons being added that do well into it. We aren't limited to garganacl and blissey anymore (flame body is also just funny on it, so thats a point in it's favor)

 

[StompyStomps]

Also, genuine question: couldn't the same be applicable to Acrobatics Roaring Moon? What's the major difference breaker between the two Pokemon?

Roost+Knock Off+Higher Attack to paraphrase Finchinator

 

[Darlington]

So who is the Ferrothorn in this Gen?

 

[TheTraininator]

So who is the Ferrothorn in this Gen?

Gliscor, probably. Now that it has Spikes, it fulfills a very similar niche.

 

[Just A Shroom God]

So who is the Ferrothorn in this Gen?

Zapdos.
They don't DO the same thing, but are the same in that they are stupidly enraging to play against while also not qualifying as "broken", and that my teams are always somehow super weak to them.

 

[hoyesdomingo]

So who is the Ferrothorn in this Gen?

The answer is dengo and you cannot convince me otherwise. Stranglehold over hazard meta; somehow manages to eat hits and recover health back; impeccable typing.

 

[manyproblems]

Well I can finally say this, Ou is the best meta right now along with the lower tiers as well. Dlc 1 and home I felt like Ou was not the best tier or meta. I even said that Ubers Uu was the best tier and UU. But now by watching a lot of replays and can say Ou is the best because of dlc 2. Does that mean it's perfect. Well somewhat in my own opinion. For now I don't feel like nothing is broken except for Roaring Moon but that's just me. I did said Ghold before too but for now not anymore, maybe in the future. I know I'm not the council at all but I think February will be perfect to do the survey since Pecharunt will be released on January 11 and I know it won't be Ou usage but you never know. I think giving the Meta another month with no suspect or bans can be really good because we can have everyone input if they find the meta to be healthy, it's good or we need to suspect this Mon and that. I am quite curious to see the Usage though, who will fall down and who will rise. This should be very interesting

This meta only seems good because it's been so bad since day 1. Now its full of broken set up sweepers who already start with a stat boost, combined with even more hazards.

 

[StompyStomps]

This meta only seems good because it's been so bad since day 1. Now its full of broken set up sweepers who already start with a stat boost, combined with even more hazards.

Yeah, I believe that Gholdego is the problem, because the hazard stack is so prominent. At least this isn't VGC with Urshifu RS+ Prankster Tornadus with Rain Dance, Taunt, Tailwind, and Bleakwind Storm.

 

[hoyesdomingo]

This meta only seems good because it's been so bad since day 1. Now its full of broken set up sweepers who already start with a stat boost, combined with even more hazards.

I actually do this think is a fair point. Even after all of the most outrageously broken stuff was banned, Gambit, Ghold, and especialy Tera have been massive issues. Tera especially because it allows the two + threats in general to just completely change up what checks them (Gambit can tera fire for WOW; tera flying for Tusk, etc). This level of instability can result in situations where predicting right puts you at a massive advantage (e.g. ice spinning a Tera Flying Gambit), while predicting wrong can cost you the game.

EDIT: To make it clear, my biggest issue with the metagame is it feels like you are rewarded too much/punished too much for individual turns. If I get my skarm trapped and OHKOed by a mag in ADV, I'm not instantly at risk of being swept. But w/Tera and bulky offensive behemoths, that's often a possibility.

 

[RyukTheDarkrai]

This just in; local idiot learns Electro Shot grants you a SpA, even if it hits a Ground Type or hits Protect.

Archaludon is such a rad edition. Glad Rain got something to play with. Patches up a lot of stuff for the archetype.

 

[Just A Shroom God]

ok, double post, but week 2 (??? lost track over christmas) thoughts:

threat creep is REAL. Trying to defensively deal with all of the crap is basically impossible: you bring dondozo to deal with Gouging Flame, but then you're weak to Bolt, so then you bring ting-lu, but then you're weak to Serperior, so you bring Volcarona, but then you're weak to Boulder, etc. etc. etc. The best way to win is to out-offense your opponent, and to this effect I'd like to shout out Blaziken for being an underrated threat; so many teams fall to the dual STAB after a SD boost, the only thing really safe is donbozo.

Darkrai SHOULD be a really good setup sweeper, because it outspeeds almost everything unboosted and there's no good defensive counterplay; however, there's the problem: Nothing is unboosted speed-wise and nobody's trying to defensively counter anything for reasons listed above. As of now darkrai dies way too easily to even be a threat without scarf, and scarf sets don't do NEARLY enough damage; anything remotely defensive, including pdef dondozo, completely counters it, and it doesn't do enough damage even to offensive pokemon to be considered as a good revenge-killing option. For instance, it only 3HKOs Garchomp + Gouging Flame and fails to KO pdef Ghold.

from my position at 1050 on the ladder I have seen almost no deo-s yet except as suicide leads, which feel annoying but no less than hamurott or grimmsnarl, so I can't comment on its brokenness

gholdengo feels a lot worse now; almost everything introduced either damages it to much to setup on, takes marginal damage from it, or both. GaG (me lmao what a stupid ability) for once doesn't feel so restricting. Unfortunately hazard control still sucks, but I think that's mainly because the only good one is Corv thanks to ghold usage dropping, which, while he is a good pivot, doesn't have the bulk to defog safely more than once and can't really punish setup sweepers running around everywhere. As a result, my marginally more successful teams have been either 3-4 boots mons with gliscor as a knock absorber, or used offensive pressure to prevent spikes from ever going up in the first place.

Kingambit is as stupid as always but imo not more stupid than how he was before.

Archaludon and Hydrapple feel like really nice glue and are the only slightly defensive pokemon I can usually get away with on teams. Archaludon practically counters rain teams without ting-lu, especially with Assault Vest and Electro Shot, while Hydrapple uses dragon tail and regenerator to semi-consistently waste booster energy and phase setup sweepers, as long as they don't oneshot you of course. Hydrapple is also hilarious design to me: I want to know what gamefreak employee looked at dipplin and said: "Yknow what this evoution line needs needs? MORE FUCKIN DIPPLIN HEADS!!!" Probably the same one that designed dudunsparce; give the man a medal already

webs is simultaneously really really good against any team that doesn't have serperior and really bad in the meta because it turns out giving serperior a +1 speed boost sometimes means you just kinda lose, isn't that quirky and fun?

speaking of serperior, he's definitely really underexplored. people seem to be gravitating towards the stellar tera blast sets which imo are bad because, while you gain excellent coverage, you don't hit anything super effectively, which means that oftentimes you can't eliminate threats at +2 faster than they can kill or heavily damage you. Best sets imo are the dragon pulse sets, which don't require you to tera and also work against a lot of the new dragon types that we got, but running tera blast fire/ground lets you circumvent usual defensive counterplay while also giving you a decent new defensive typing, but locks you into teraing which is obviously terrible. Oh and subglare is stupid as always, especially with fewer status absorbers.

Overall, I'd give this meta a 7/10 for competitiveness and a 4/10 for fun. Definitely feels like there's room to exercise and express player skill in making the most optimal team, but as I am not a good player, the matchup-fishy aspect kinda bothers me and lack of hazard removal is REALLY a thorn in my side.

 

[DaddyBuzzwole]

EDIT: To make it clear, my biggest issue with the metagame is it feels like you are rewarded too much/punished too much for individual turns. If I get my skarm trapped and OHKOed by a mag in ADV, I'm not instantly at risk of being swept. But w/Tera and bulky offensive behemoths, that's often a possibility.

i actually kind of like this more because it gives me a way clearer idea of where i fucked up when i watch my replays so i can get a better idea of what not to do next time. it's a lot easier when it's something like "oh, yep, there it is, i mispredicted the eq on turn 29" instead of "oh yeah, i clicked a second toxic spikes on turn 12 which allowed their breaker to come in on turn 78 and kill two mons instead of one because it was at 7% hp on switch-in and would have died to regular poison in one turn but lived because it was toxic"