BL isn't based on usage; it's Pokémon who dropped from OU to UU and then were determined to be too powerful for UU (most recent examples: Cresselia and Porygon-Z).
Smogon Shoddy Server Statistics - February & March 2010
- Thread starter DougJustDoug
- Start date
BL isn't based on usage; it's Pokémon who dropped from OU to UU and then were determined to be too powerful for UU (most recent examples: Cresselia and Porygon-Z).
Very interesting, thanks for these Doug.
Life Orb Hitmonlee is pretty damn good. Should really be used more. And I agree with you, expect a huge rise and Torterra soon. So much variety in UU, it's such a an interesting tier.
There actually used to be almost 50 BLs a few years ago.
BL isn't a tier like standard and UU. It's a ban list, like Ubers, so it's not meant to be playable. Umbreon would only get put into BL if it were deemed broken in UU, So far, only 9 Pokemon have been considered ban-worthy in UU, using the current testing process. In theory, and ideally, BL could contain 0 Pokemon. Even when it contained 40+ Pokemon, it wasn't played by many people.
I'm so glad there aren't that many BLs anymore. The idea of having almost 50 interesting Pokemon that barely get used in standard, and are banned from UU is quite depressing. It seemed like such a waste. Not to mention, the methodology for determining those BLs was also quite poor.
Basically, to sum up, BL isn't intended to be a playable tier. Even when it had loads of Pokemon in, it wasn't, so the fact that there's only 9 of them is irrelevant.
But Umbreon isn't even close to broken in UU. If more people used it in OU, wouldn't it get moved from UU to OU? Or is that a one-way street?
I think he's saying don't use it in OU because he wants to be able to keep using it in UU. Or maybe he doesn't think it's a good Pokémon in OU.
Still kinda disappointed by the lack of Ludicolo in the tiers. It's an absolute game changer and surprise sweeper with its excellent bulk and decent offense.
Here's the one I'm using in my Pseudo-Rain Dance team. It's a rehash of an older version, but it's still working wonders for me:
Ludicolo (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 204 HP/104 Spd/76 SAtk/124 SDef
Calm nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Grass Knot
- Hydro Pump
- Leech Seed
- Ice Beam
I'm contemplating running Rain Dish over Swift Swim for more survivability. This underrated 'mon needs some help! :x
Here's the one I'm using in my Pseudo-Rain Dance team. It's a rehash of an older version, but it's still working wonders for me:
Ludicolo (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 204 HP/104 Spd/76 SAtk/124 SDef
Calm nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Grass Knot
- Hydro Pump
- Leech Seed
- Ice Beam
I'm contemplating running Rain Dish over Swift Swim for more survivability. This underrated 'mon needs some help! :x
I absolutely love these statistics!
| Starmie | Ability | Illuminate | 6.5 |
Apparently 6.5% of Starmie users have no idea what they are doing.
On a more serious note, is there any way to narrow these statistics down by CRE? Because different 'rungs' of the ladder have noticeably different usage patterns. Or maybe the usage for match winners? I have no idea how these stats are compiled so this very well may be impossible or way too complicated to be worth it. And, this could potentially lead to different tier lists for different levels of play. However, it could be useful for everyone to know if, for example, all 40900 uses of Snorlax in OU were by users at 1000 CRE and below, or if all 1435 uses of Metagross in Ubers resulted in a win.
| Starmie | Ability | Illuminate | 6.5 |
Apparently 6.5% of Starmie users have no idea what they are doing.
On a more serious note, is there any way to narrow these statistics down by CRE? Because different 'rungs' of the ladder have noticeably different usage patterns. Or maybe the usage for match winners? I have no idea how these stats are compiled so this very well may be impossible or way too complicated to be worth it. And, this could potentially lead to different tier lists for different levels of play. However, it could be useful for everyone to know if, for example, all 40900 uses of Snorlax in OU were by users at 1000 CRE and below, or if all 1435 uses of Metagross in Ubers resulted in a win.
Change in use from February to March:
(Only Pokemon in the top 100 for both months were included, Rotom formes are counted only as Rotom-A)
Change in use from January to March:
(Only Pokemon in the top 100 for both months were included, Rotom formes are counted only as Rotom-A)
(Only Pokemon in the top 100 for both months were included, Rotom formes are counted only as Rotom-A)
Code:
Scizor 27.23% [COLOR=Red]-1.50%[/COLOR]
Tyranitar 22.40% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.89%[/COLOR]
Salamence 20.92% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.18%[/COLOR]
Heatran 19.03% [COLOR=Red]-2.31%[/COLOR]
Rotom-A 18.72% [COLOR=Red]-0.86%[/COLOR]
Latias 18.71% [COLOR=Red]-0.96%[/COLOR]
Gyarados 17.35% [COLOR=Red]-1.60%[/COLOR]
Jirachi 17.08% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.75%[/COLOR]
Metagross 15.64% [COLOR=Red]-0.52%[/COLOR]
Swampert 15.52% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.63%[/COLOR]
Gengar 15.14% [COLOR=Red]-0.16%[/COLOR]
Infernape 14.72% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.09%[/COLOR]
Lucario 13.93% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.49%[/COLOR]
Starmie 11.87% [COLOR=Red]-0.59%[/COLOR]
Blissey 11.48% [COLOR=Red]-0.09%[/COLOR]
Skarmory 10.24% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.74%[/COLOR]
Gliscor 9.99% [COLOR=Red]-0.79%[/COLOR]
Breloom 9.76% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.29%[/COLOR]
Vaporeon 9.52% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.88%[/COLOR]
Machamp 9.33% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.19%[/COLOR]
Azelf 9.18% [COLOR=Red]-0.22%[/COLOR]
Suicune 8.63% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.20%[/COLOR]
Magnezone 8.04% [COLOR=Red]-1.47%[/COLOR]
Flygon 7.71% [COLOR=Red]-0.17%[/COLOR]
Jolteon 7.47% [COLOR=SeaGreen]1.05%[/COLOR]
Dragonite 7.32% [COLOR=Red]-0.02%[/COLOR]
Celebi 7.24% [COLOR=Red]-0.50%[/COLOR]
Forretress 6.81% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.24%[/COLOR]
Empoleon 6.29% [COLOR=Red]-0.41%[/COLOR]
Kingdra 6.26% [COLOR=Red]-0.15%[/COLOR]
Togekiss 6.14% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.24%[/COLOR]
Bronzong 6.13% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.16%[/COLOR]
Zapdos 6.10% [COLOR=Red]-0.72%[/COLOR]
Aerodactyl 5.97% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.29%[/COLOR]
Snorlax 5.45% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.09%[/COLOR]
Electivire 5.36% [COLOR=Red]-0.33%[/COLOR]
Weavile 5.09% [COLOR=Red]-0.45%[/COLOR]
Mamoswine 4.87% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.03%[/COLOR]
Ninjask 4.64% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.24%[/COLOR]
Roserade 4.63% [COLOR=Red]-0.05%[/COLOR]
Dusknoir 4.40% [COLOR=Red]-0.24%[/COLOR]
Hippowdon 4.11% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.03%[/COLOR]
Smeargle 4.08% [COLOR=Red]-0.13%[/COLOR]
Tentacruel 3.96% [COLOR=Red]-0.02%[/COLOR]
Heracross 3.95% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.27%[/COLOR]
Umbreon 3.54% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.88%[/COLOR]
Porygonz 3.10% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.40%[/COLOR]
Alakazam 2.83% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.11%[/COLOR]
Cresselia 2.69% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.10%[/COLOR]
Abomasnow 2.68% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.04%[/COLOR]
Crobat 2.64% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.10%[/COLOR]
Rhyperior 2.62% [COLOR=Red]-0.10%[/COLOR]
Arcanine 2.54% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.05%[/COLOR]
Milotic 2.48% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.21%[/COLOR]
Dugtrio 2.42% [COLOR=Red]-0.01%[/COLOR]
Ludicolo 2.39% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.33%[/COLOR]
Yanmega 2.30% [COLOR=Red]-0.04%[/COLOR]
Froslass 2.27% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.35%[/COLOR]
Ambipom 2.10% [COLOR=Red]-0.19%[/COLOR]
Porygon2 1.98% [COLOR=Red]-0.17%[/COLOR]
Donphan 1.96% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.39%[/COLOR]
Uxie 1.94% [COLOR=Red]-0.41%[/COLOR]
Charizard 1.93% [COLOR=Red]-0.17%[/COLOR]
Clefable 1.92% [COLOR=Red]-0.04%[/COLOR]
Gallade 1.85% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.02%[/COLOR]
Blastoise 1.79% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.20%[/COLOR]
Spiritomb 1.69% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.00%[/COLOR]
Venusaur 1.69% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.09%[/COLOR]
Walrein 1.62% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.06%[/COLOR]
Feraligatr 1.60% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.20%[/COLOR]
Weezing 1.59% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.37%[/COLOR]
Kabutops 1.58% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.40%[/COLOR]
Sceptile 1.56% [COLOR=Red]-0.05%[/COLOR]
Registeel 1.48% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.02%[/COLOR]
Raikou 1.47% [COLOR=Red]-0.45%[/COLOR]
Honchkrow 1.46% [COLOR=Red]-0.08%[/COLOR]
Shuckle 1.45% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.53%[/COLOR]
Hitmontop 1.43% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.02%[/COLOR]
Mismagius 1.43% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.23%[/COLOR]
Espeon 1.40% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.40%[/COLOR]
Electrode 1.38% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.25%[/COLOR]
Slowbro 1.31% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.10%[/COLOR]
Houndoom 1.30% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.15%[/COLOR]
Lanturn 1.30% [COLOR=Red]-0.12%[/COLOR]
Shaymin 1.27% [COLOR=Red]-0.17%[/COLOR]
Typhlosion 1.24% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.03%[/COLOR]
Claydol 1.23% [COLOR=Red]-0.10%[/COLOR]
Miltank 1.17% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.25%[/COLOR]
Steelix 1.17% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.11%[/COLOR]
Marowak 1.14% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.22%[/COLOR]
Blaziken 1.12% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.11%[/COLOR]
Absol 1.09% [COLOR=Red]-0.12%[/COLOR]
Cradily 1.07% [COLOR=Red]-0.01%[/COLOR]
Staraptor 1.07% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.15%[/COLOR]
Lapras 1.02% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.16%[/COLOR]
Azumarill 1.01% [COLOR=Red]-0.06%[/COLOR]
Aggron 0.94% [COLOR=Red]-0.15%[/COLOR]Change in use from January to March:
(Only Pokemon in the top 100 for both months were included, Rotom formes are counted only as Rotom-A)
Code:
Scizor 27.23% [COLOR=Red]-1.67%[/COLOR]
Tyranitar 22.40% [COLOR=Red]-0.03%[/COLOR]
Salamence 20.92% [COLOR=Red]-1.41%[/COLOR]
Heatran 19.03% [COLOR=Red]-2.40%[/COLOR]
Rotom-A 18.72% [COLOR=Red]-1.63%[/COLOR]
Latias 18.71% [COLOR=Red]-2.67%[/COLOR]
Gyarados 17.35% [COLOR=Red]-1.40%[/COLOR]
Jirachi 17.08% [COLOR=Red]-0.98%[/COLOR]
Metagross 15.64% [COLOR=Red]-1.42%[/COLOR]
Swampert 15.52% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+1.07%[/COLOR]
Gengar 15.14% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.42%[/COLOR]
Infernape 14.72% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.41%[/COLOR]
Lucario 13.93% [COLOR=Red]-0.38%[/COLOR]
Starmie 11.87% [COLOR=Red]-0.31%[/COLOR]
Blissey 11.48% [COLOR=Red]-0.20%[/COLOR]
Skarmory 10.24% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.54%[/COLOR]
Gliscor 9.99% [COLOR=Red]-0.93%[/COLOR]
Breloom 9.76% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+1.19%[/COLOR]
Vaporeon 9.52% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.36%[/COLOR]
Machamp 9.33% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+1.03%[/COLOR]
Azelf 9.18% [COLOR=Red]-1.22%[/COLOR]
Suicune 8.63% [COLOR=Red]-0.48%[/COLOR]
Magnezone 8.04% [COLOR=Red]-1.90%[/COLOR]
Flygon 7.71% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.01%[/COLOR]
Jolteon 7.47% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.62%[/COLOR]
Dragonite 7.32% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.47%[/COLOR]
Celebi 7.24% [COLOR=Red]-0.31%[/COLOR]
Forretress 6.81% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.11%[/COLOR]
Empoleon 6.29% [COLOR=Red]-0.13%[/COLOR]
Kingdra 6.26% [COLOR=Red]-0.38%[/COLOR]
Togekiss 6.14% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.29%[/COLOR]
Bronzong 6.13% [COLOR=Red]-0.15%[/COLOR]
Zapdos 6.10% [COLOR=Red]-1.05%[/COLOR]
Aerodactyl 5.97% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.64%[/COLOR]
Snorlax 5.45% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.27%[/COLOR]
Electivire 5.36% [COLOR=Red]-0.22%[/COLOR]
Weavile 5.09% [COLOR=Red]-0.02%[/COLOR]
Mamoswine 4.87% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.38%[/COLOR]
Ninjask 4.64% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.79%[/COLOR]
Roserade 4.63% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.08%[/COLOR]
Dusknoir 4.40% [COLOR=Red]-0.04%[/COLOR]
Hippowdon 4.11% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.00%[/COLOR]
Smeargle 4.08% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.24%[/COLOR]
Tentacruel 3.96% [COLOR=Red]-0.27%[/COLOR]
Heracross 3.95% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.72%[/COLOR]
Umbreon 3.54% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.83%[/COLOR]
Porygonz 3.10% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.18%[/COLOR]
Alakazam 2.83% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.62%[/COLOR]
Cresselia 2.69% [COLOR=Red]-0.14%[/COLOR]
Abomasnow 2.68% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.33%[/COLOR]
Crobat 2.64% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.21%[/COLOR]
Rhyperior 2.62% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.34%[/COLOR]
Arcanine 2.54% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.46%[/COLOR]
Milotic 2.48% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.50%[/COLOR]
Dugtrio 2.42% [COLOR=Red]-0.01%[/COLOR]
Ludicolo 2.39% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.67%[/COLOR]
Yanmega 2.30% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.31%[/COLOR]
Froslass 2.27% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.27%[/COLOR]
Ambipom 2.10% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.06%[/COLOR]
Porygon2 1.98% [COLOR=Red]-0.53%[/COLOR]
Donphan 1.96% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.27%[/COLOR]
Uxie 1.94% [COLOR=Red]-0.78%[/COLOR]
Charizard 1.93% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.29%[/COLOR]
Clefable 1.92% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.20%[/COLOR]
Gallade 1.85% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.03%[/COLOR]
Blastoise 1.79% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.33%[/COLOR]
Spiritomb 1.69% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.06%[/COLOR]
Venusaur 1.69% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.35%[/COLOR]
Walrein 1.62% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.11%[/COLOR]
Feraligatr 1.60% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.37%[/COLOR]
Weezing 1.59% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.21%[/COLOR]
Kabutops 1.58% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.44%[/COLOR]
Sceptile 1.56% [COLOR=Red]-0.15%[/COLOR]
Registeel 1.48% [COLOR=Red]-0.05%[/COLOR]
Raikou 1.47% [COLOR=Red]-0.38%[/COLOR]
Honchkrow 1.46% [COLOR=Red]-0.05%[/COLOR]
Shuckle 1.45% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.37%[/COLOR]
Hitmontop 1.43% [COLOR=Red]-0.04%[/COLOR]
Mismagius 1.43% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.02%[/COLOR]
Espeon 1.40% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.57%[/COLOR]
Electrode 1.38% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.37%[/COLOR]
Slowbro 1.31% [COLOR=Red]-0.06%[/COLOR]
Houndoom 1.30% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.38%[/COLOR]
Lanturn 1.30% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.08%[/COLOR]
Shaymin 1.27% [COLOR=Red]-0.10%[/COLOR]
Typhlosion 1.24% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.22%[/COLOR]
Claydol 1.23% [COLOR=Red]-0.38%[/COLOR]
Steelix 1.17% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.19%[/COLOR]
Marowak 1.14% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.20%[/COLOR]
Blaziken 1.12% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.08%[/COLOR]
Absol 1.09% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.07%[/COLOR]
Cradily 1.07% [COLOR=Red]-0.11%[/COLOR]
Staraptor 1.07% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.18%[/COLOR]
Azumarill 1.01% [COLOR=Red]-0.08%[/COLOR]
Tangrowth 0.98% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.11%[/COLOR]
Aggron 0.94% [COLOR=Red]-0.13%[/COLOR]
Gardevoir 0.90% [COLOR=SeaGreen]+0.07%[/COLOR]
Scizor and Tyranitar would take a plunge.
Against the top ten, scizor is really only useful against latias, salamence and gengar (rotom-A walls it, heatran is like a perfect counter, gyarados sets up in its face etc...). Once latias goes, so does a huge chunk of scizor's utility. Using scizor to counter T-Tar would be risky as with latias gone, scarftar would inevitably decline probably allowing DDbabiriTar to shine once again.
I remembered the last time that happened, Umbreon dropped straight back to UU the next tiering shift. Fear not, my friend, it'll only be 4 months.
they're both excellent pokemon in their own right...neither would drop too much. nobody runs scizor purely to check latias, they run it cause it has a stupidly powerful priority move and a myriad of resistances. tyranitar is a monstrous sweeper, past and present, so it will continue to stay in high ou for sure. if anything, mence might take scizor's #1 spot. how many times have you had your mixmence sweep interrupted by a latias? with latias gone mence will be all over the place
And with Mixmence going high, so will do the amount of Scizors that try to BP a weakened one after getting in on Draco Meteor, so my bet is Scizor will still be #1.
By that I meant like maybe 3-5% of a drop. Of course they would stay in high OU.
EDIT: I guess you guys have a point about mixmence...
EDIT: I guess you guys have a point about mixmence...
And then Cresselia would be used again to deal with Salamence...
And then Scizor comes back to #1.
Things might change you know...next gen might not have Bullet Punch as part of the move tutor.
On the same vein next gen will probably have something like the Pal Park to tranfer mons through generations, making the need of a tutor irrelevant since Scizor will conserve BP, though both your point and mine is pure guessing.
Edit: @ Thorns:
Check out the stats eric posted, the only mon that dropped a lot was Heatran and that was 2.~%. 3-5% is indeed a very big drop if we are talking about the stats.