Whats with mowtom? Everyone I talk to has it at the top of their viability rankings, but I have yet to find a SINGLE mowtom user in ladder. But wait, theres more. when I went into tournament replays and discussion posts to see what mons and sets were viable, I still didnt see EVEN ONE MOWTOM TEAM!?!?!? whats up with everyone saying its good but it seems to just not exist? also what sets are good on it and why? what are its checks so i can cover them if im thinking of using it?
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Resource Simple Questions, Simple Answers
- Thread starter Ren-chon
- Start date
I can't speak to who you've talked to, but the viability list we have on forums is currently outdated. In general the list gets more accurate the higher your ELO is. If you are not consistently playing ladder matches in the 1300-1500+ rating range you are way more likely to encounter "off-meta" pokemon and movesets. This could be part of your problem. Once you get out of ELO hell the resources become a lot more valid and helpful.
To speak more on rotom and its movesets: simply put nu players value rotom-mow for its ability to compress multiple roles in one slot. it's a pivot with volt switch that can punish ground types in a way other electrics (bar h-trode) cannot. it is relatively fast and can boost its spatk with np, can also fit terablast without dropping a "necessary" move. choice scarf lets it outpace the majority of unboosted threats in the meta and a number of boosted ones as well. i haven't seen specs this gen, but you could theoretically run it i guess. its immune to sandaconda's glare and STAB eq - Sandaconda was on 75% of teams in NUWC - these two things alone make it deserving of a spot on several teams.
For the current meta its primary checks are shaymin, goodra, brute bonnet, decidueye, arboliva, other rotom-mow, appletun, cacturne. these will do better and worse depending on the rotom-set you face but are generally reliable unless you get hit with supereffective terablast. offensively you have a bunch of options vs scarf sets locked into electric or grass moves with the plethora of pokemon we have that resist those types (i.e. jolteon, tauros-paldea-fire, scyther, salazzle, toxicroak, oricorio, vivillon, slowbro-g, eelektross, etc.) as well as using naturally fast and strong pokemon like bruxish.
Here's two teams I built for NU World Cup, I didn't really build with the intention of using Rotom-mow but it naturally found its way on to both teams in two different roles.
https://pokepast.es/38d1cdd25dead657
On this team I needed something fast enough to outrun unboosted attackers and threaten them with leaf storm or volt to preserve momentum. It also provides some nice resistances and lets me pivot into glare sandaconda when it would otherwise kinda eat this team alive. Having the one-time check to fat walls and boosters is nice with trick, for example you can theoretically ward off an oricorio sweep with proper play by aggressively double switching to rotom mow or lock a jolteon/salazzle into tbolt/terablast or sludge/fire move to make it easier to manage.
https://pokepast.es/9e3beb1c60f63115
this team needs the speed from rotom-mow a little less with scarf tauros fire, but at preview it looks ambiguous and could be interpreted as scarf rotom with bulk up tauros so theres some added benefit there. here the role im asking rotom to fill is chipping tox+tect goodra into ohko range +2 mismagius shadow ball/dkiss (somewhere around 75%). rotom uniquely invites in goodra with its stab combination and gives me a pretty reliable will o wisp to cancel lefties recovery, volt switch on the following turn nets another 8% or so, which could be 16 in situations where u np first to get a little more damage. again rotom is also providing nice resistances and the pivot into conda that is the backbone of offense comps.
Thank you so much man!I can't speak to who you've talked to, but the viability list we have on forums is currently outdated. In general the list gets more accurate the higher your ELO is. If you are not consistently playing ladder matches in the 1300-1500+ rating range you are way more likely to encounter "off-meta" pokemon and movesets. This could be part of your problem. Once you get out of ELO hell the resources become a lot more valid and helpful.
To speak more on rotom and its movesets: simply put nu players value rotom-mow for its ability to compress multiple roles in one slot. it's a pivot with volt switch that can punish ground types in a way other electrics (bar h-trode) cannot. it is relatively fast and can boost its spatk with np, can also fit terablast without dropping a "necessary" move. choice scarf lets it outpace the majority of unboosted threats in the meta and a number of boosted ones as well. i haven't seen specs this gen, but you could theoretically run it i guess. its immune to sandaconda's glare and STAB eq - Sandaconda was on 75% of teams in NUWC - these two things alone make it deserving of a spot on several teams.
For the current meta its primary checks are shaymin, goodra, brute bonnet, decidueye, arboliva, other rotom-mow, appletun, cacturne. these will do better and worse depending on the rotom-set you face but are generally reliable unless you get hit with supereffective terablast. offensively you have a bunch of options vs scarf sets locked into electric or grass moves with the plethora of pokemon we have that resist those types (i.e. jolteon, tauros-paldea-fire, scyther, salazzle, toxicroak, oricorio, vivillon, slowbro-g, eelektross, etc.) as well as using naturally fast and strong pokemon like bruxish.
Here's two teams I built for NU World Cup, I didn't really build with the intention of using Rotom-mow but it naturally found its way on to both teams in two different roles.
https://pokepast.es/38d1cdd25dead657
On this team I needed something fast enough to outrun unboosted attackers and threaten them with leaf storm or volt to preserve momentum. It also provides some nice resistances and lets me pivot into glare sandaconda when it would otherwise kinda eat this team alive. Having the one-time check to fat walls and boosters is nice with trick, for example you can theoretically ward off an oricorio sweep with proper play by aggressively double switching to rotom mow or lock a jolteon/salazzle into tbolt/terablast or sludge/fire move to make it easier to manage.
https://pokepast.es/9e3beb1c60f63115
this team needs the speed from rotom-mow a little less with scarf tauros fire, but at preview it looks ambiguous and could be interpreted as scarf rotom with bulk up tauros so theres some added benefit there. here the role im asking rotom to fill is chipping tox+tect goodra into ohko range +2 mismagius shadow ball/dkiss (somewhere around 75%). rotom uniquely invites in goodra with its stab combination and gives me a pretty reliable will o wisp to cancel lefties recovery, volt switch on the following turn nets another 8% or so, which could be 16 in situations where u np first to get a little more damage. again rotom is also providing nice resistances and the pivot into conda that is the backbone of offense comps.
What was the exact reason for testing the new suspect requirements?
Is Johto Sneasel better than Hisuian Sneasel? If so, why?
Disclaimer: all opinions are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of the nu council, nu tier leaders, yada-yada
It makes losses less punishing. With the earlier system players needed to achieve a certain, usually high, gxe and a loss to a player who had a low elo would heavily weigh against the player due to how new accounts function with confidence intervals for glicko. This would often lead to players “resetting” and creating a new account after they realized they had a lower than expected glicko/gxe after 10 or so games. This further exacerbated the problem of new accounts with low rating confidence contributing to games with two players with low confidence intervals duking it out on the low ladder as players who reset encountered others who were beginning their journey anew.
It also makes finishing a suspect run noticeably less stressful when you have a certain number of games to play and a max number of games to lose and it doesnt matter the quality of your opponent. Too often do you get to the 1400/1500s range, as you often do when suspect laddering, and receive a 200 point down pair to the 1200/1300s range. Losing downpairs has a significantly higher effect on gxe/glicko than a simple win/loss metric because downpairs are often players with lower gxe/glicko themselves and the hit to gxe can often be unrecoverable in a small amount of games, especially if the ladder is already dead enough that you’re getting down pairs at high ladder elos.
Yes. And it’s not close. Dark/Ice is much better offensively and Knock Off is one of the best moves in the game. Poison/Fighting resists are pretty easy to fit onto teams these days and most of the tiers ground types (which are almost mandatory in modern gens to block volt switch) do great into gunk/cc/trailblaze, for example Gligar, Sandaconda, Palossand. Sneasel-Hisui receives competition from Toxicroak for the same typing but notably does not have access to sucker punch or dry skin (which is huge for checking bruxish). It’s probably not terrible but theres just a lot of market pressure keeping heasel’s stock down rn.
FishSucksAtPKMN
Banned deucer.
Haven't played much NU, why is Volbeat up here in the VR?
Mainly because it's an excellent rain/sun setter due to Prankster, backed up with utility moves like Encore, U-turn and Thunder Wave to disrupt any non Dark-types. It's valued for these things. A lot of rain/sun teams are hard-pressed to match Volbeat's utility in those weathers. Because rain/sun aren't the best archetype (sand is actually more popular atm), volbeat is rather niche, though it still can be deadly with the right matchup and support from teammates.
Welcome to the community! Electrode-H is definitely more of a pivot with Heavy Duty-Boots and Volt Switch because of its blistering speed and STAB combination, but it finds itself just too weak to be a special nuke as you describe it.
Salazzle is one great answer to it (gotta be careful with Earth Power though). IronPress Bronzong walls Shaymin and wins the 1v1. Goodra matches up well against it, especially AV. Scyther eats it alive. One thing to note tho, Shaymin can and tends to run scarf so it can outspeed scarf Bruxish so be aware of that.
Good to know! Thank you :)
Is ambipom now good in this metagame or is it most likely going to drop further to pu and beyond?
Hey, so in the event Terrakion doesn't rise to RU or higher would it be feasible to give the former OU titan another chance once the tier inevitably gets swamped by power creep from tier shifts?
Just about everything that's banned will have the chance to be looked at again after things begin to settle down. Personally, as a council member who voted DNB just now on Terrak, I'd most likely support a retest in the future :)
Sun is certainly a viable playstyle right now. Generally the compositions look something like
and the last slot is pretty flexible. I've personally seen 
used effectively under the sun. But other options to give you more flexibility include 
The most difficult thing when building and playing with Sun teams right now is striking the right balance between speed control, momentum/pivoting capability, and wallbreaking. Charizard, Typhlosion, Ninetales, and Brute Bonnet are all great at what they do, but they're also all under base 100 speed, which makes revenge killing them laughably easy and you can easily find yourself in a position to sweep with a base 100+ scarfer or booster such as Trailblaze Pauros or DD Flygon. You can offset this to a certain degree by running one of the Chlorophyll mons noted above, but not all of 'em are that quick even under sun and they typically need a turn to growth before they really become threatening (although that turn is not difficult to come by - espeically given pivoting options like eject button Espeon).
If you want to use Sun, go for it. You'll learn a lot about the tier's responses to it and that should help guide any new styles of team you build to incorporate Pokemon that naturally give sun teams trouble such as
I don't think you should expect to win every game with this archtype but you should almost always have playable matchups with thoughtful teambuliding. There are also some recent tournament replays with Sun from NUCL and NU Seasonal, I'm too lazy to grab them, but I doubt they'll be difficult to find. Good luck out there!
Hey found myself there just out of curiosity and I was wondering, are there any sample teams up to date? I was curious about trying golurk since it's one of my favourite and I heard it's pretty good in NU but I'm not a good builder and I haven't really studied the tier much (as much as Rabia is an amazing content creator, he's too entertaining for me to actually learn more than the basics of the tier)
Sample teams are not up to date as the meta is everchanging making it hard to make samples that will not get outdated with a week or two. I do have a CB Golurk team if you want to try it out though. I peaked pretty high on the ladder with it and won with it in a tournament game, so I can assure you it is pretty good:
(Click on the sprites to show team)If you have any questions about the team or building teams in general, feel free to ask questions in the NU room on PS! or joining the NU discord (which can be found in the NU room). Have fun with NU :)
Thanks man I'm actually trying to learn proper team building since some time ago but as an AAA main the balance on balance meta really spoiled me (only other deviation I'm comfortable with are phat and ho since they're so simple) and I'm to the point where I fear an offence Vs offence matchup more than an ho Vs phat or stall Vs stall. Probably will learn actual team building skills other than sweeper stack with suicide leads go brr in the future or whenever school gets lighter (they say it doesn't get better in university unfortunately :< ) but I already saw that NU will be a good tier to play for run and possibly try horrible handmade teams in the low ladder (talking about my horrible handmaking skills, I never actually found complaints about any of yours magebuilder's teams)Sample teams are not up to date as the meta is everchanging making it hard to make samples that will not get outdated with a week or two. I do have a CB Golurk team if you want to try it out though. I peaked pretty high on the ladder with it and won with it in a tournament game, so I can assure you it is pretty good:
If you have any questions about the team or building teams in general, feel free to ask questions in the NU room on PS! or joining the NU discord (which can be found in the NU room). Have fun with NU :)
So to make it short (really bad at writing coeherent and cohesive posts) thanks for the team and the help, appreciate it! Will see you all in the ladder for fun and in the thread to steal other teams
Are sample teams are coming back anytime soon?
Meta has been very volatile these last few months with the DLC shifts and the bans and unbans, so we haven’t had time to constantly update them. They should be coming back sometime in March as it is the last major shift.
Feel free to check out the team bazaar, you can find tournament teams as well as fun off meta stuff!