Hello all, so I'd like to discuss a topic which I can't actually find a lot of information on, but is very relevant at the start of each new generation. Obviously this topic is quickbanning, and at what point a pokemon can be said to deserve a quickban as opposed to a suspect.
Quickbanning by the nature of it is something which is done without a direct vote from the community, but it is something which will have a dramatic effect on the tier. Yet, despite this, there is very little information on exactly why a quickban is used, and under what conditions a pokemon deserves a quickban. Here is the main piece of information from this thread: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/meet-the-overused-tiering-council.3492786/#post-6225947
You can clearly see how over half the team is dictated by Mega Mence, in either eliminating its counters, giving it another chance to sweep, or responding to it with ice shard. Just from looking at this team, you can see just how unhealthy Mega Mence is. Joey even says that the team isn't perfect, but if you're quick enough to set up with Mega Mence you can just plow through everything anyway.
To be clear, I'm not saying every pokemon that is quickbanned has to be as good as Mega Mence. I'll build up to the point I'm making, which is that recently we've seen somewhat of a change in what makes a pokemon quickban worthy. Whether it be MKang, MMence, or MGengar, all the quickbans in recent memory all followed the trend of handing out wins like candy while being hell to respond to for all playstyles. Neither Aegislash nor Landorus, while they were very effective and big threats in the metagame, handed out wins for no effort in the way described above, because they weren't at the same level of power. In the case of Aegislash, there was big community backing specifically for a quickban in the thread here: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/on-the-radar.3587559/
It was clear that the meta wasn't going to progress unless Aegi left it. However, there was not the same level of support for a Landorus quickban. There isn't a need to appease everyone, but I think the community should have some input in what is quickbanned and suspected, and the difference in the decision between the two.
The new direction of quickbanning might not be a bad thing, but I would like to use this thread to actually get something in writing, as to why the tool of quickbanning is used.
This is not a thread about overturning the decision concerning Landorus. I just think we should have a clearer view about quickbanning in regards to 3 major factors:
1) How easy the pokemon is to win with, and how much easier it has to be in order to be quickbanned rather than suspected.
2) How great the effect of pokemon has to be on the metagame, for the pokemon to be quickbanned rather than suspected.
3) To what extent the community should, if at all, have an input in quickbanning, specifically as opposed to suspecting. Provided they should, what degree of backing is needed for a quickban to happen?
Obviously, a council response would be much appreciated as to what they think the policy on quickbanning should be, and how dire the state of the meta has to be in order to warrant it.
Quickbanning by the nature of it is something which is done without a direct vote from the community, but it is something which will have a dramatic effect on the tier. Yet, despite this, there is very little information on exactly why a quickban is used, and under what conditions a pokemon deserves a quickban. Here is the main piece of information from this thread: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/meet-the-overused-tiering-council.3492786/#post-6225947
However, this only describes quickbans as a time saver. It doesn't address what impact a pokemon has to have in order to qualify. Previously, the general view of a what a quickban was here for in terms of the power required, was that if a pokemon was so easy to win with and so centralising, that games would devolve into who set up their wincon first, then it would be banned. There would be very little counterplay, if any at all to the quickbanned pokemon, and the skill required to win with it vs playing against would be so tilted that you would feel at a major disadvantage by not including the pokemon on your team. Some examples of this would be Mega Kangaskhan in XY, Mega Salamence in ORAS, and Zygarde 100% in SM. A sample team built around a quickbanned pokemon can be found here: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/has-he-done-enter-mega-mence-yet.3524277/I) Quick bans will be made when a certain aspect (be it a Pokémon, an ability, a move, an item or a combination of the aforementioned) of the metagame becomes so blatantly broken that passing it through a formal suspect test would be a waste of time and effort for everyone. From now on, quick bans will be made according to the following circumstances:
Before the council makes the final decision, a thread will be posted in Policy Review, so that everyone who has posting privileges in that forum will get the chance to weigh in and potentially influence the decision. The thread will stay open for approximately one week;
When the decision is made, the council will post a thread in the OU Forum. The post will provide the reasons behind the ban.
You can clearly see how over half the team is dictated by Mega Mence, in either eliminating its counters, giving it another chance to sweep, or responding to it with ice shard. Just from looking at this team, you can see just how unhealthy Mega Mence is. Joey even says that the team isn't perfect, but if you're quick enough to set up with Mega Mence you can just plow through everything anyway.
To be clear, I'm not saying every pokemon that is quickbanned has to be as good as Mega Mence. I'll build up to the point I'm making, which is that recently we've seen somewhat of a change in what makes a pokemon quickban worthy. Whether it be MKang, MMence, or MGengar, all the quickbans in recent memory all followed the trend of handing out wins like candy while being hell to respond to for all playstyles. Neither Aegislash nor Landorus, while they were very effective and big threats in the metagame, handed out wins for no effort in the way described above, because they weren't at the same level of power. In the case of Aegislash, there was big community backing specifically for a quickban in the thread here: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/on-the-radar.3587559/
It was clear that the meta wasn't going to progress unless Aegi left it. However, there was not the same level of support for a Landorus quickban. There isn't a need to appease everyone, but I think the community should have some input in what is quickbanned and suspected, and the difference in the decision between the two.
The new direction of quickbanning might not be a bad thing, but I would like to use this thread to actually get something in writing, as to why the tool of quickbanning is used.
This is not a thread about overturning the decision concerning Landorus. I just think we should have a clearer view about quickbanning in regards to 3 major factors:
1) How easy the pokemon is to win with, and how much easier it has to be in order to be quickbanned rather than suspected.
2) How great the effect of pokemon has to be on the metagame, for the pokemon to be quickbanned rather than suspected.
3) To what extent the community should, if at all, have an input in quickbanning, specifically as opposed to suspecting. Provided they should, what degree of backing is needed for a quickban to happen?
Obviously, a council response would be much appreciated as to what they think the policy on quickbanning should be, and how dire the state of the meta has to be in order to warrant it.
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