I put this team together a while ago and it has gotten much success on wifi, but not so much on shoddy. Part of that is me just being lazy and rage quitting over hax, which I really think should be reduced in the game. Anyway this is a really fun team, but im running into trouble with it. I need help on predicting and possibly some replacements.
TEAM BUILDING PROCESS
Infernape is definitely my favorite starter ever. I used him on my first ever DS team, and he actually swept entire teams (prolly noobs tho, but it was still great) I like it bc he can very easily set up rocks and still deliver powerful hits. SR is almost a requirement for Standard teams now so i decided i really do need it in lieu of another attack. Infernape is also amazing unpredictable as a starter, it could carry fake out or vacuum wave, grass knot or U-turn, or it could be a nasty plot variant. Its so powerful that it can pretty much blast most leads' HP down to very little then SR so they cant switch back in, or vice versa on that order.
I really really didnt want to do this, but I had to. I dont like using scizor, but its just way too tempting. I thought of things that Infernape would have trouble with and most of my thoughts were solved by a bulky swords dancer (vaporeon, gyarados, latias, rotom). Scizor not only brings amazing power and surprising bulk, but it also provides two very important factors that i personally admire: stab priority moves and a very powerufl U-turn.
Another one of my favorite set up monsters is the Dragon Fish that can fly using its little face fins. As long as this doesnt have to face starmie, jirachi, zapdos, jolteon, or gengar (bc of thunderbolt) on its first turn, we are go. Gyara also provides another personally important trait in Taunt. This is my blissey/vaporeon/skarmory/fortress killer (provided support from another team member). Taunt destroys Baton pass teams- of which ive seen about 5, more than expected. This can take an explosion from a metagross (that could be a lie, maybe im thinking azelf or heatran). It also provides good synergy with the monkey and the Overly Over Used. Stab DD waterfall is quite deadly as it takes out rotoms, swamperts, other gyarados, and anything thats not a wall really.
Yes, the monster of Stark Mountain found its way into my arsenal of pokes. Contrary to the norm, i will not be running explosion. I know heatran shares the EQ weakness with infernape, as well as the fighting weakness but Gyara is the answer to both of these. Heatran's ability to absorb fire attacks aimed at scizor is invaluable. It also has above average speed and can also survive explosions. Like infernape, it is quite unpredictable which allows for a switch into a dragon type usually or gliscor, which i have answers to.
I know its uncanny that i just have all these monsters stalked up, but what can i say. Latias brings great synergy to this team as she can absorb any special attack thats not dragon and has to ability to cripple walls. She outspeeds everything not a boosted yanmega or ninjask (providing only one boost is allowed) and has such a diverse, and now unpredictable movepool that she can easily gun down anything that manages to best gyara or tran. Her speed is really the reason why I chose her bc up until now my overall speed was like, eh :/
Ok here is where any possible lose ends get tied up. I know celebi and latias will bring a bunch of pursuiters out but this celebi wont be going away from just one, and its strategry hopefully wont let it go down from two. Celebi provides amazing team support and will win nearly every stall war, barring stallrein and a strange latias stall i saw once. Again heatran takes in fire attacks and scizor can deal with ice attacks. i was weary about including the psychic forest fairy but its multitude of weaknesses is well covered by the rest of my team, and they usually dont incredibly dent celebi, except when i mispredict a scizor's u-turn.
IN THE EYEPIECE...
Infernape @ Focus Sash
Blaze | Hasty
60 ATK | 252 SPA | 220 SPE
~ Fire Blast
~ Grass Knot
~ Close Combat
~ Stealth Rocks
I really really like lead ape due to its wide range of attacks and above average speed. I chose to include Grass Knot over Fake Out just to deal with lead swamperts (out of 30 matches, i believe ive seen 8). U-turn was suggested a long time ago, and i tested it out but on this team I really need a grass move especially for leadperts. This could be thought of as a suicide lead, but its more of a single/ double kamikaze lead. EV's are just standard but I added more 1 more speed BLT to outspeed other standard speed leadapes. As i said, this can very reliably set up the quintessential rocks and deal some damage. I love when this thing doesnt die bc it can sweep in the late game. what ive also found myself doing is bringing it in (with 1HP from sash and opponents rocks up) as a scout to see what my foe will send out, like after a deathly explosion or when LO takes out both pokes. I fire blast as a huge stab attack, it could really put a damper on things when it misses the first turn but the return in power is great. This is very effective against azelf leads as well as metagross leads. I actually enjoy when a rachi or smeargle trick scarfs this thing. This is my strategy for lead swameprts: GK first, they will prolly go for rocks, that leaves them with anywhere from 13%-17% usually so they wont be staying in for another one, then i SR on the switch and take it from there.
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Against Top Leads
- SR first, if they SR then just go on the offensive. if they psychic first, then im left at 1 HP and i switch to heatran to take whatever.
- They usually SR, first so its the same thing as Azelf excpet meta's attack would be EQ. If they EQ, then i again just go to heatran to take BP, and counter with either earth power or overheat
- As stated, I grass knot first then SR if they SR first if they attack first, i just grass knot then close combat in fear of the switch and just deal with the lack of rocks.
- i always flamethrower first anticipating the trick scarf, but if not i still flamethrow and hope to not get paralyzed then SR
- I just assume the taunt and go for the close combat. Either way if they taunt or attack im gonna either get a KO by gyara switch or sucessfully get rocks up.
- Hopefullllly Ill be faster so i just go straight on the offensive and take out the possibility of a late game sweeper
- I'm faster so I throw flames, except when they have scarf and put me to sleep; i dont like that much. usually with these i just do a flamethrower and see what happens and usually end up just switching to celebi
- I'm faster so I SR first then combat
- I'm faster so I SR before the taunt, then combat till death or switch into gyara to take EQ and DD on the switch out.
- These things are always fun to deal with. I go for the combat bc I should be faster. But if its a trick scarf and they spore I know they cant spore again and are forced to switch out so i go to my poke with the second best coverage and fastest, latias and just blast away at any counter that comes by.
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Scizor @ Choice Band
Technician | Adamant
244 | 252 ATK |12 SPE
~ Bullet Punch
~ U-turn
~ Pursuit
~ Superpower
This used to be a SD variant, but we all know "that shows no skill" so i was called a noob and everything else imaginable for using it. However apparently this is acceptable so I am using this variant. Its great for trapping latias except when its surfing and it does more than you would think. Its great for a lot of things but many things can hurt it if i pick the wrong move or something which happens often. Superpower is purely for blissey while bullet punch i use just as a neutral hit when i know whatever i switch into is going to switch and pursuit wont really affect it. This is really powerful on paper (or computer screens), but it does take alot of skill to be used effectively. Im open to suggestions of a better EV spread to let it take more hits and still get off a massive U-turn. This is very helpful against gengars and really any ghost without WoW, which i switch to heatran or celebi to take. I dont like that its not too fast so any neutral special attack is gonna cause some damage. This thing is usually owned by jirachis and magnezones. I love blasting away with BP but there is always a counter. essentially i just need help predicting with this set, its great as it is i just have to learn how to use it. also if anyone has dreamed up a new spread/moves for a scizor, please suggest it; or if anyone feels a different variant could be more useful please let me know :).
Gyarados @ Leftovers
Intimidate | Adamant
128 ATK | 232 SPE | 148 HP
~ Dragon dance
~ Stone Edge
~ Taunt
~ Waterfall
Just monstrous, especially its great attack even before a DD. Its unique 81 base speed lets it outspeed anything 80 or less without a scarf. I like leftovers bc alotta times a move will hit and take about 40%-55% and if i bounce, leftovers ensures a not 2HKO. Taunt ruins walls, baton pass teams, entry hazards, and stat decreasers. Also, im not too too worried about SR here because usually it can leftys + bounce off the damage or I can DD then go and heal as i go just in case something scarfed or named jolteon comes out, which i outspeed and annihilate with waterfall -after one DD of course. The only thing that I dont like facing is whirlwinds and roars, it seems people just love getting you all boosted up then just whisking you away, that grinds my gears, which is why i taunt first whenever i see a potential for roar/whirlwind. Other uncommon but still noteworthy threats are thunderpunch breloom, jirachi, and snorlax. I had to take bounce off bc once i got tricked into a choice scarf while bouncing and i was dead. What do you think about bounce/stone edge/ something else? perhaps payback to take on rotom swich ins?
Heatran @ Expert Belt
Flash Fire | Timid
252 SPA | 252 SPE | 4 HP
~ Fire Blast
~ Dragon Pulse
~ Earth Power
~ Hidden Power [Grass]
I originally had specs on this, but then I heard of the idea of faking a specs and luring in a latias or swampert then blasting away. I also really hated when I was locked into overheat and a latias or swampert came in. I was also worried about speed, but then on another team I used an mostly offensive celebi with only 245 speed and it won the lions share of speed battles surprisingly, so this with 253 speed is in the same ballpark. I wont lie, specstran was B-E-A-S-T taking out things things that it normally would have had to try to 3HKO, but the angst I felt with having to death fodder gyara or scizor to free up one of heatran's attacks did not account for being able to blow up a salamence switch in, which i could easily have handled with latias. So i suppose I need advice with the scarf over expert belt debate, but personally im leaning toward the expert belt. Heatran's ability to take explosions and take out lots of foes with neutral damage has earned it a slot on almost all of my teams. I really like this bc i usually blast with fire untill they bring in swampert or another heatran then i reveal my surprise
Latias @ Choice Scarf
Levitate | Timid
252 SPA | 252 SPE | 4 HP
~ Draco Meteor
~ Surf
~ Thunderbolt
~ Trick
Very threatening at any point in the game. Draco Meteor is boss over anything not tryanitar, metagross, or magnezone, or mrs. humpty dumpty. I took heatran's specs away bc of being locked into an attack, but I need my fast as lightening revenge latias. i like bringing her in late in the game when i know what pokes my foe could send out and either surfing or bolting my way out. Trick is usually for blissey crippling, but usually its a switch in and i cant use trick then anyway, also i have celebi, scizor, and gyarados to handle miss bliss with ease. Anyone have any suggestions for some attack or something over trick? i thought recover or CM, but then oh choice scarf, maybe ice beam to take out gliscor, zapdos? in any event, i feel that trick on this particular latias on this particular team is not pulling its wieght. Lately ive been considering dragon pulse over draco meteor bc this is really only good for one or two great hits then i have to switch out. It brings great power but with the spA drops, its versatility is virtually nonexistent.
Celebi @ Leftovers
Natural Cure | Bold
252 HP | 220 DEF | 36 SPE
~ Thunderwave
~ Grass Knot
~ Leech Seed
~ Recover
Stall master to the max right here. I have been backed into so many corners and threw out this little guy and came out on top. This is my definition of team support, it can absorb t-waves, toxics, WoW's, spores and switch out and be fine. Also, the thunderwave support is vital to heatran and scizor to some extent. I love the subseed strategy, i know shaymin does it "better" bc it has less weaknesses, but shaymin cant paralyze anyone. I dont value paralysis for the hax but for the speed reduction. my pokes are right on the threshold of average/above average speed, and cutting the foes speed in half is a great great aid. The only thing ive ever seen taking out this celebi is a X-scissor from a scizor and i believe it got a crit too, or a crunch from a scarftar. With this set, i always always twave first, then im faster so i seed. i really dont like luck, personally i think it plays way too much of a role in the game (much like the current US government plays too much of a role in the lives of US citizens), but that being said i must play the game as its made and try to use luck to my advantage with the para hax. i took out substitute for grass knot just to not get completely killed by taunt users.
LOOKING BACK...
This is a much more solid team than I anticipated. Celebi really ties the team together with the paraseeding and scizor picks off everything with BP and latias outspeeds the game. This team takes very good care of rain dance teams and baton pass teams which used to absolutely ruin me. Salamence really isnt a problem with heatran and latias, agiligross doesnt do much with my celebi strategy. DD tyranitar could be problematic but then i got my celebi and of course scizor. Lucarios usually arent a large issue thanks to celebi and gyarados, but i do have to watch out for the SD extreme speed. I know two fires on one team isnt recommended bc of the EQ weakness, but i figure two things that EQ cant touch justifies that somewhat. The other thing i could see being an issue is if i allow spikes set up and am forced to switch out, as i have no spinner. rocks arent too big of an issue for gyara, but multiple switches will take their toll. also itd be nice to get a spin blocker in here but ive learned that rocks help but are not absolutely pivotal for a win with this team, as celebi + time beats all. One type of team that this team fails against tho is U-turn teams, bc im not wonderful at predicting. Thanks for reading, please rate and add any and all suggestions!
TEAM BUILDING PROCESS
Infernape is definitely my favorite starter ever. I used him on my first ever DS team, and he actually swept entire teams (prolly noobs tho, but it was still great) I like it bc he can very easily set up rocks and still deliver powerful hits. SR is almost a requirement for Standard teams now so i decided i really do need it in lieu of another attack. Infernape is also amazing unpredictable as a starter, it could carry fake out or vacuum wave, grass knot or U-turn, or it could be a nasty plot variant. Its so powerful that it can pretty much blast most leads' HP down to very little then SR so they cant switch back in, or vice versa on that order.
I really really didnt want to do this, but I had to. I dont like using scizor, but its just way too tempting. I thought of things that Infernape would have trouble with and most of my thoughts were solved by a bulky swords dancer (vaporeon, gyarados, latias, rotom). Scizor not only brings amazing power and surprising bulk, but it also provides two very important factors that i personally admire: stab priority moves and a very powerufl U-turn.
Another one of my favorite set up monsters is the Dragon Fish that can fly using its little face fins. As long as this doesnt have to face starmie, jirachi, zapdos, jolteon, or gengar (bc of thunderbolt) on its first turn, we are go. Gyara also provides another personally important trait in Taunt. This is my blissey/vaporeon/skarmory/fortress killer (provided support from another team member). Taunt destroys Baton pass teams- of which ive seen about 5, more than expected. This can take an explosion from a metagross (that could be a lie, maybe im thinking azelf or heatran). It also provides good synergy with the monkey and the Overly Over Used. Stab DD waterfall is quite deadly as it takes out rotoms, swamperts, other gyarados, and anything thats not a wall really.
Yes, the monster of Stark Mountain found its way into my arsenal of pokes. Contrary to the norm, i will not be running explosion. I know heatran shares the EQ weakness with infernape, as well as the fighting weakness but Gyara is the answer to both of these. Heatran's ability to absorb fire attacks aimed at scizor is invaluable. It also has above average speed and can also survive explosions. Like infernape, it is quite unpredictable which allows for a switch into a dragon type usually or gliscor, which i have answers to.
I know its uncanny that i just have all these monsters stalked up, but what can i say. Latias brings great synergy to this team as she can absorb any special attack thats not dragon and has to ability to cripple walls. She outspeeds everything not a boosted yanmega or ninjask (providing only one boost is allowed) and has such a diverse, and now unpredictable movepool that she can easily gun down anything that manages to best gyara or tran. Her speed is really the reason why I chose her bc up until now my overall speed was like, eh :/
Ok here is where any possible lose ends get tied up. I know celebi and latias will bring a bunch of pursuiters out but this celebi wont be going away from just one, and its strategry hopefully wont let it go down from two. Celebi provides amazing team support and will win nearly every stall war, barring stallrein and a strange latias stall i saw once. Again heatran takes in fire attacks and scizor can deal with ice attacks. i was weary about including the psychic forest fairy but its multitude of weaknesses is well covered by the rest of my team, and they usually dont incredibly dent celebi, except when i mispredict a scizor's u-turn.
IN THE EYEPIECE...
Infernape @ Focus Sash
Blaze | Hasty
60 ATK | 252 SPA | 220 SPE
~ Fire Blast
~ Grass Knot
~ Close Combat
~ Stealth Rocks
I really really like lead ape due to its wide range of attacks and above average speed. I chose to include Grass Knot over Fake Out just to deal with lead swamperts (out of 30 matches, i believe ive seen 8). U-turn was suggested a long time ago, and i tested it out but on this team I really need a grass move especially for leadperts. This could be thought of as a suicide lead, but its more of a single/ double kamikaze lead. EV's are just standard but I added more 1 more speed BLT to outspeed other standard speed leadapes. As i said, this can very reliably set up the quintessential rocks and deal some damage. I love when this thing doesnt die bc it can sweep in the late game. what ive also found myself doing is bringing it in (with 1HP from sash and opponents rocks up) as a scout to see what my foe will send out, like after a deathly explosion or when LO takes out both pokes. I fire blast as a huge stab attack, it could really put a damper on things when it misses the first turn but the return in power is great. This is very effective against azelf leads as well as metagross leads. I actually enjoy when a rachi or smeargle trick scarfs this thing. This is my strategy for lead swameprts: GK first, they will prolly go for rocks, that leaves them with anywhere from 13%-17% usually so they wont be staying in for another one, then i SR on the switch and take it from there.
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Against Top Leads
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Scizor @ Choice Band
Technician | Adamant
244 | 252 ATK |12 SPE
~ Bullet Punch
~ U-turn
~ Pursuit
~ Superpower
This used to be a SD variant, but we all know "that shows no skill" so i was called a noob and everything else imaginable for using it. However apparently this is acceptable so I am using this variant. Its great for trapping latias except when its surfing and it does more than you would think. Its great for a lot of things but many things can hurt it if i pick the wrong move or something which happens often. Superpower is purely for blissey while bullet punch i use just as a neutral hit when i know whatever i switch into is going to switch and pursuit wont really affect it. This is really powerful on paper (or computer screens), but it does take alot of skill to be used effectively. Im open to suggestions of a better EV spread to let it take more hits and still get off a massive U-turn. This is very helpful against gengars and really any ghost without WoW, which i switch to heatran or celebi to take. I dont like that its not too fast so any neutral special attack is gonna cause some damage. This thing is usually owned by jirachis and magnezones. I love blasting away with BP but there is always a counter. essentially i just need help predicting with this set, its great as it is i just have to learn how to use it. also if anyone has dreamed up a new spread/moves for a scizor, please suggest it; or if anyone feels a different variant could be more useful please let me know :).
Gyarados @ Leftovers
Intimidate | Adamant
128 ATK | 232 SPE | 148 HP
~ Dragon dance
~ Stone Edge
~ Taunt
~ Waterfall
Just monstrous, especially its great attack even before a DD. Its unique 81 base speed lets it outspeed anything 80 or less without a scarf. I like leftovers bc alotta times a move will hit and take about 40%-55% and if i bounce, leftovers ensures a not 2HKO. Taunt ruins walls, baton pass teams, entry hazards, and stat decreasers. Also, im not too too worried about SR here because usually it can leftys + bounce off the damage or I can DD then go and heal as i go just in case something scarfed or named jolteon comes out, which i outspeed and annihilate with waterfall -after one DD of course. The only thing that I dont like facing is whirlwinds and roars, it seems people just love getting you all boosted up then just whisking you away, that grinds my gears, which is why i taunt first whenever i see a potential for roar/whirlwind. Other uncommon but still noteworthy threats are thunderpunch breloom, jirachi, and snorlax. I had to take bounce off bc once i got tricked into a choice scarf while bouncing and i was dead. What do you think about bounce/stone edge/ something else? perhaps payback to take on rotom swich ins?
Heatran @ Expert Belt
Flash Fire | Timid
252 SPA | 252 SPE | 4 HP
~ Fire Blast
~ Dragon Pulse
~ Earth Power
~ Hidden Power [Grass]
I originally had specs on this, but then I heard of the idea of faking a specs and luring in a latias or swampert then blasting away. I also really hated when I was locked into overheat and a latias or swampert came in. I was also worried about speed, but then on another team I used an mostly offensive celebi with only 245 speed and it won the lions share of speed battles surprisingly, so this with 253 speed is in the same ballpark. I wont lie, specstran was B-E-A-S-T taking out things things that it normally would have had to try to 3HKO, but the angst I felt with having to death fodder gyara or scizor to free up one of heatran's attacks did not account for being able to blow up a salamence switch in, which i could easily have handled with latias. So i suppose I need advice with the scarf over expert belt debate, but personally im leaning toward the expert belt. Heatran's ability to take explosions and take out lots of foes with neutral damage has earned it a slot on almost all of my teams. I really like this bc i usually blast with fire untill they bring in swampert or another heatran then i reveal my surprise
Latias @ Choice Scarf
Levitate | Timid
252 SPA | 252 SPE | 4 HP
~ Draco Meteor
~ Surf
~ Thunderbolt
~ Trick
Very threatening at any point in the game. Draco Meteor is boss over anything not tryanitar, metagross, or magnezone, or mrs. humpty dumpty. I took heatran's specs away bc of being locked into an attack, but I need my fast as lightening revenge latias. i like bringing her in late in the game when i know what pokes my foe could send out and either surfing or bolting my way out. Trick is usually for blissey crippling, but usually its a switch in and i cant use trick then anyway, also i have celebi, scizor, and gyarados to handle miss bliss with ease. Anyone have any suggestions for some attack or something over trick? i thought recover or CM, but then oh choice scarf, maybe ice beam to take out gliscor, zapdos? in any event, i feel that trick on this particular latias on this particular team is not pulling its wieght. Lately ive been considering dragon pulse over draco meteor bc this is really only good for one or two great hits then i have to switch out. It brings great power but with the spA drops, its versatility is virtually nonexistent.
Celebi @ Leftovers
Natural Cure | Bold
252 HP | 220 DEF | 36 SPE
~ Thunderwave
~ Grass Knot
~ Leech Seed
~ Recover
Stall master to the max right here. I have been backed into so many corners and threw out this little guy and came out on top. This is my definition of team support, it can absorb t-waves, toxics, WoW's, spores and switch out and be fine. Also, the thunderwave support is vital to heatran and scizor to some extent. I love the subseed strategy, i know shaymin does it "better" bc it has less weaknesses, but shaymin cant paralyze anyone. I dont value paralysis for the hax but for the speed reduction. my pokes are right on the threshold of average/above average speed, and cutting the foes speed in half is a great great aid. The only thing ive ever seen taking out this celebi is a X-scissor from a scizor and i believe it got a crit too, or a crunch from a scarftar. With this set, i always always twave first, then im faster so i seed. i really dont like luck, personally i think it plays way too much of a role in the game (much like the current US government plays too much of a role in the lives of US citizens), but that being said i must play the game as its made and try to use luck to my advantage with the para hax. i took out substitute for grass knot just to not get completely killed by taunt users.
LOOKING BACK...
This is a much more solid team than I anticipated. Celebi really ties the team together with the paraseeding and scizor picks off everything with BP and latias outspeeds the game. This team takes very good care of rain dance teams and baton pass teams which used to absolutely ruin me. Salamence really isnt a problem with heatran and latias, agiligross doesnt do much with my celebi strategy. DD tyranitar could be problematic but then i got my celebi and of course scizor. Lucarios usually arent a large issue thanks to celebi and gyarados, but i do have to watch out for the SD extreme speed. I know two fires on one team isnt recommended bc of the EQ weakness, but i figure two things that EQ cant touch justifies that somewhat. The other thing i could see being an issue is if i allow spikes set up and am forced to switch out, as i have no spinner. rocks arent too big of an issue for gyara, but multiple switches will take their toll. also itd be nice to get a spin blocker in here but ive learned that rocks help but are not absolutely pivotal for a win with this team, as celebi + time beats all. One type of team that this team fails against tho is U-turn teams, bc im not wonderful at predicting. Thanks for reading, please rate and add any and all suggestions!
