ORAS OU Heroes

[michaeloche]

hopefully I got that right on the first try

Hello everyone, michaeloche here. Monday marks 3 years since I joined Smogon, and I'm nowhere near a postcount milestone, so here I am. The team I am presenting to you today originated in XY. An older stall team by Zekrenzo (can't find that thread for the life of me) was bouncing around the RMT forums, and during the first OLT, the user who was then known as AnybodyAgrees suggested I use that team. I made some tweaks myself, notably changing what was originally Mew to Mega Sableye when ORAS came out, eventually evolving into the team below.

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 144 SpD
Careful Nature
- Foul Play
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Knock Off

This is basically the cornerstone of most ORAS stall teams. I really don't think I need to explain what Mega Sableye does. I personally prefer the utility set, as it can handle a wide variety of attackers. This spread is used to stomach Heatran, which is kind of a pain for this team.

Skarmory @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Careful Nature
- Iron Head
- Stealth Rock
- Defog
- Roost

Chansey (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Seismic Toss
- Toxic
- Aromatherapy
- Soft-Boiled

I'm going to explain the next two mons together. This is the well-known SkarmChans (a current variant of the old SkarmBliss) core, but the nature of the metagame has forced them to be able to take hits from both sides of the spectrum, as opposed to being pure physical or pure special walls, respectively. Skarmory runs Iron Head to handle fairies, with a tad bit of speed creep, mainly for other uninvested base 70s as well as the mons that creep them. Rocks are rocks, and Defog is used to get rid of any hazards that manage to sneak past Sableye, mainly Spikes. Chansey is your standard pink blob, and primarily is used to SToss+Toxic her way through stuff. Aromatherapy is pretty much a must for dealing with residual status.

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast
- Moonlight
- Hidden Power [Ground]

Originally, Gliscor was in this slot, but I inserted Clefable into the team during the Hoopa-U meta, as my team was bothered by it at the time. At the same time, I wanted something to tackle setup mons efficiently, and I had no win condition. So I opted for the Unaware CM set, with HP Ground to lure in Heatran, patching up a hole with the departure of Gliscor. As with Skarmory, Clefable runs a bit of speed creep, in this case to beat min speed Tyranitar as well as mons that creep it. Due to not being immune to residual damage and Moonlight having half the PP of Soft-Boiled, this set should be used carefully, but it has its merits.

Alomomola @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 36 HP / 220 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Protect
- Wish
- Toxic

Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 168 Def / 92 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Spore
- Giga Drain
- Clear Smog
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Finally, I have this two-mon Regenerator core of Alomomola and Amoonguss. They complement each other well, as well as other benefits for the team. Alomomola can pass some hefty Wishes to anything that needs it in a pinch, as well as burn stuff, which is always nice to keep physically offensive opponents in check. Amoonguss has Spore, which can take something out of the game for a while, and can put the brakes on setup mons with Clear Smog. It can't handle everything by itself, however, which is why the Clefable above is Unaware. Lastly, HP Fire lets it not be dead weight against stuff like Ferrothorn and other Amoonguss.

threatlist

Heatran: The stallbreaker set in particular is a little bitch, but all the sets can give me trouble. This is the reason Clefable runs HP Ground.

Other Stallbreakers: Some offensive mons run stuff like Taunt, Encore, and Disable to finish out their moveslots, and Sableye can't switch in on all of them. These moves aren't always obvious, which makes them even more difficult to face.

Wallbreakers: Kyurem-B is the elephant in the room in this category, but it mainly depends on what set it is. Chansey walls the Specs set, for example, but the Band set or certain LO sets can do hefty damage with Outrage.

No replays because I'm lame, sorry. I will say, though, that this team, or at least a variant of it, has seen use in both the ladder and competitive scenes, and I have had fun with it, though I've certainly pissed a few people off. Because, you know, it's stall.

So that's this team. Feel free to drop a rate, use it yourself, tweak it to your liking, whatever.

shoutouts

First and foremost to formerly AnybodyAgrees, now HeadsILoseTailsYouWin , for giving me the idea for the team in the first place, as well as to Zekrenzo for making the original version (sorry I can't find yours, otherwise I would link it here).

Everybody in the "Silly Things You've Seen on [basically every meta that has had one]" threads over the years, especially the OMs version right now: jordanthejq12 LordBraixen dsm77773 SP458 thdhted heybbygal Stocke and anyone else I may have missed.

Everyone on the RU ladder who uses Ambipom, Typhlosion, and Cinccino: you guys suck.

And to you, fellow Smogonites, who have put up with my bullshit made it a fun experience for me. You guys rock.

import

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 144 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Foul Play
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Knock Off

Skarmory @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Careful Nature
- Iron Head
- Stealth Rock
- Defog
- Roost

Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Seismic Toss
- Toxic
- Aromatherapy
- Soft-Boiled

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast
- Moonlight
- Hidden Power [Ground]

Alomomola @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 36 HP / 220 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Protect
- Wish
- Toxic

Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 168 Def / 92 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Spore
- Giga Drain
- Clear Smog
- Hidden Power [Fire]

 

[Anna says hi]

I remembered when I used stall in XY, good times.

The first change I'd recommend is for Skarmory's item from Leftovers -> Shed Shell. This is completely self explanatory and lets you beat Magnet + Wallbreaker cores without having to play cautiously every single turn. You may also want to try Iron Head -> Counter or Brave Bird/Drill Peck. These let you handle Mega Pinsir better, which straight up 2HKOes all of your other mons bar Alomomola with ease. Iron Head is woefully inadequate on a set without Whirlwind, as it only 4HKOes Pinsir at best, giving it time to set up 3 Swords Dances and destroy the rest of your team. Drill Peck has no recoil, but has a chance to only 3HKO Pinsir. Brave Bird will always 2HKO Pinsir(and OHKO if the Pinsir lowered its own defense), but the recoil can pressure you, so pick your poison. Counter is a move I used that can surprise attackers that have already boosted like Mega Tyranitar for a KO. However, it requires good prediction to use on a set without Taunt, and Skarmory will lose to Taunt Mega Gyarados regardless.

Something I've found to help me with stuff like Charizard X is Rocky Helmet Alomomola. This is completely optional, but I've found it to be surprisingly good as a Rocky Helmet user, as you will want to switch Mola in to stuff like Landorus-T and Scizor if they have a Magnezone on their team. Being able to get chip damage on things U-turning out is invaluable for Stall, and Alomomola perfectly fits the bill as a Helmet user.

Other than those, I can't think of any other suggestions that directly improve the team. Stall in gen 6 has been about choosing what you beat and lose to, and those three are the only alterations I can think of that don't make you vulnerable to something else.

 

[Sun]

Hello, good stall team you has here, the stall builds in this metagame are finding more space than what was the Hoopa-u metagame, which was very difficult to use fat team, due to the excessive force of Hoopa, now we are experiencing a solid and balanced metagame where stall teams are finding creative (Weavile stall); Your stall build, after careful analysis of the details there are gaps as you mentioned yourself against Stallbreaker heatran, Heatran, learning Taunt + Magma Storm is able to make trouble for all team members, also having the ability to use Solar beam is able to deal with Alomomola, another threat that you mentioned is Kyurem-black, Kyurem is a really nice extra threat manageable Heatran, since you Chansey + Clefable but also you've done well does mention it, because now playing Band, which is definitely a very difficult set deal for your team, I would recommend to preserve Clefable, and try to scout his moveset using Protect, also to deal with it better to do you need to optimize the set and spreads of Clefable, because I think that set is not very usable and beneficial in a stall build; I noticed that your team has trouble with LO Tornadus-T, Tornadus Therian is really hard to deal with, because it manages to beat Chansey using Knock off + Superpower, also does massive damage with Turricane at the other remaining team members also can generate momentum useful to the team of 'opponent to move into advantage the situation; Finally, well known that your team has serious problems against SD Gliscor and BU+Taunt Talonflame, these two can easily stallbreak your team, resisting scald of alomomola, undergoing ridiculous damage, and in the case of Talonflame you can prevent Toxic using Taunt, then alomomola become a set-up bait for talonflame and Gliscor that increase the statistics without any problems, beating your team. My rate I will try to make these threats more manageable as possible, so by making your stall more compact build.

>

First of all, given the lack of a strong water type that can counter Gliscor, Talonflame and Heatran, i'd suggest using Suicune over Alomomola,
Suicune is a great win-condition for stall builds, works really well, as it is able to absorb state conditions and heal using Rest, also it has pressure, which is a very good ability to deal with fatty teams as other stalls, or against pokemon blocked by choice item, that being forced to use a single move, they lose more quickly PP, Suicune provides a sort of countermeasure for Bisharp, which can be annoying if you play Lum + SD, finally after using one or two CMs is able to control the the dreaded Tornadus-T, causing significant damage to it even with Scald, Suicune can also help against Kyurem-black, that usually comes on Suicune, risking the burn if Kyurem is burned, suicune can safely use Cm and win the game stalling its Fusion bolt PP.

As I told you over the spread and set Clefable need to be optimized, I'll explain the reason .. Moonlight and HP Ground, I find it a redundant moves on Unaware Clefable because there are so many Sand teams around, and you has now a heatran check , then I'd suggest replacing them with Wish+ Protect, This combination allows you to better manage rain dance Manaphy, without loss of health recovery that has Moonlight, Protect allows you to scout opponents' moves, this is very useful against the choice item users, but also helps to stalling the weather turns , Wish is a useful support move for pokemon that they have little life, it can be exploited very well in your team; finally, I suggest using Thunder Wave over CM, Thunder wave helps manage Tornadus-Therian, Weavile, Mega Lopunny and Heatran; i'd suggest this spread: 216 HP / 172 Def / 120 SpD, with Calm nature, this spread allows Clefable to has a better recovery number with 216 evs on hp, also it has enought Def to counter mega Lopunny and Weavile better without rocks up, finally 120 SpD allows Clefable to take 3HKO by Ice beam from LO Kyurem-black without rocks up.

Another option would be to use this spread on Skarmory: 248 HP / 80 Def / 176 SpD, with a Careful nature , this spread allows Skarmory to take better physical hits as Weavile's Icicle crash, or LO Excadrill's Rock slide, 176 Spd are enought to deal with NP Togekiss.

Sets

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 216 HP / 172 Def / 120 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Wish
- Protect
- Moonblast
- Thunder Wave

Suicune @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

That's all, I hope I have helped you, and good luck with your team

 

[michaeloche]

Hello, good stall team you has here, the stall builds in this metagame are finding more space than what was the Hoopa-u metagame, which was very difficult to use fat team, due to the excessive force of Hoopa, now we are experiencing a solid and balanced metagame where stall teams are finding creative (Weavile stall); Your stall build, after careful analysis of the details there are gaps as you mentioned yourself against Stallbreaker heatran, Heatran, learning Taunt + Magma Storm is able to make trouble for all team members, also having the ability to use Solar beam is able to deal with Alomomola, another threat that you mentioned is Kyurem-black, Kyurem is a really nice extra threat manageable Heatran, since you Chansey + Clefable but also you've done well does mention it, because now playing Band, which is definitely a very difficult set deal for your team, I would recommend to preserve Clefable, and try to scout his moveset using Protect, also to deal with it better to do you need to optimize the set and spreads of Clefable, because I think that set is not very usable and beneficial in a stall build; I noticed that your team has trouble with LO Tornadus-T, Tornadus Therian is really hard to deal with, because it manages to beat Chansey using Knock off + Superpower, also does massive damage with Turricane at the other remaining team members also can generate momentum useful to the team of 'opponent to move into advantage the situation; Finally, well known that your team has serious problems against SD Gliscor and BU+Taunt Talonflame, these two can easily stallbreak your team, resisting scald of alomomola, undergoing ridiculous damage, and in the case of Talonflame you can prevent Toxic using Taunt, then alomomola become a set-up bait for talonflame and Gliscor that increase the statistics without any problems, beating your team. My rate I will try to make these threats more manageable as possible, so by making your stall more compact build.

>

First of all, given the lack of a strong water type that can counter Gliscor, Talonflame and Heatran, i'd suggest using Suicune over Alomomola,
Suicune is a great win-condition for stall builds, works really well, as it is able to absorb state conditions and heal using Rest, also it has pressure, which is a very good ability to deal with fatty teams as other stalls, or against pokemon blocked by choice item, that being forced to use a single move, they lose more quickly PP, Suicune provides a sort of countermeasure for Bisharp, which can be annoying if you play Lum + SD, finally after using one or two CMs is able to control the the dreaded Tornadus-T, causing significant damage to it even with Scald, Suicune can also help against Kyurem-black, that usually comes on Suicune, risking the burn if Kyurem is burned, suicune can safely use Cm and win the game stalling its Fusion bolt PP.

As I told you over the spread and set Clefable need to be optimized, I'll explain the reason .. Moonlight and HP Ground, I find it a redundant moves on Unaware Clefable because there are so many Sand teams around, and you has now a heatran check , then I'd suggest replacing them with Wish+ Protect, This combination allows you to better manage rain dance Manaphy, without loss of health recovery that has Moonlight, Protect allows you to scout opponents' moves, this is very useful against the choice item users, but also helps to stalling the weather turns , Wish is a useful support move for pokemon that they have little life, it can be exploited very well in your team; finally, I suggest using Thunder Wave over CM, Thunder wave helps manage Tornadus-Therian, Weavile, Mega Lopunny and Heatran; i'd suggest this spread: 216 HP / 172 Def / 120 SpD, with Calm nature, this spread allows Clefable to has a better recovery number with 216 evs on hp, also it has enought Def to counter mega Lopunny and Weavile better without rocks up, finally 120 SpD allows Clefable to take 3HKO by Ice beam from LO Kyurem-black without rocks up.

Another option would be to use this spread on Skarmory: 248 HP / 80 Def / 176 SpD, with a Careful nature , this spread allows Skarmory to take better physical hits as Weavile's Icicle crash, or LO Excadrill's Rock slide, 176 Spd are enought to deal with NP Togekiss.

Sets

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 216 HP / 172 Def / 120 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Wish
- Protect
- Moonblast
- Thunder Wave

Suicune @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

That's all, I hope I have helped you, and good luck with your team

Thanks for the rate. I actually hadn't encountered Torn-T very much with this team for some reason. In practice, Alomomola did seem to be the weakest link a good portion of the time, so I can justify shifting things around a bit (Cune being the Heatran check and wincon, Clef being the Wish passer). By the way, the Skarmory spread you listed had 4 EVs left over, so I stuck them in Defense.

I remembered when I used stall in XY, good times.

The first change I'd recommend is for Skarmory's item from Leftovers -> Shed Shell. This is completely self explanatory and lets you beat Magnet + Wallbreaker cores without having to play cautiously every single turn. You may also want to try Iron Head -> Counter or Brave Bird/Drill Peck. These let you handle Mega Pinsir better, which straight up 2HKOes all of your other mons bar Alomomola with ease. Iron Head is woefully inadequate on a set without Whirlwind, as it only 4HKOes Pinsir at best, giving it time to set up 3 Swords Dances and destroy the rest of your team. Drill Peck has no recoil, but has a chance to only 3HKO Pinsir. Brave Bird will always 2HKO Pinsir(and OHKO if the Pinsir lowered its own defense), but the recoil can pressure you, so pick your poison. Counter is a move I used that can surprise attackers that have already boosted like Mega Tyranitar for a KO. However, it requires good prediction to use on a set without Taunt, and Skarmory will lose to Taunt Mega Gyarados regardless.

Something I've found to help me with stuff like Charizard X is Rocky Helmet Alomomola. This is completely optional, but I've found it to be surprisingly good as a Rocky Helmet user, as you will want to switch Mola in to stuff like Landorus-T and Scizor if they have a Magnezone on their team. Being able to get chip damage on things U-turning out is invaluable for Stall, and Alomomola perfectly fits the bill as a Helmet user.

Other than those, I can't think of any other suggestions that directly improve the team. Stall in gen 6 has been about choosing what you beat and lose to, and those three are the only alterations I can think of that don't make you vulnerable to something else.

I originally had BB on Skarm, but I switched it to IH because fairies were giving me trouble. Also, I think Counter is just way too passive, but that's just me.