Feature of Jan 15th

[chaos]

I have decided the first feature of the week (if you don't remember, it's a weekly thing we will do to focus contributors and actually get alot of these guides on the site) is going to be Vineon's RBY Differences guide.

http://www.smogon.com/community/showthread.php?t=6077

Any contributors who want to help or people who want to eventually get contributor status should try to fix this guide up to be absolutely perfect so we can post it sometime this week.

Anyone with SCMS access should format the guide in HTML and post the result here so we can make it release quality.

 

[chaos]

If any of the contributors want to format this to HTML, please post here :-/

 

[skarm]

Yeah yeah I'll format it.

 

[Roy]

I would like to format this

 

[FM]

I'll look over the guide for grammatical errors and do whatever else I can.

 

[Pidgeot500]

So, we respond here? The guide is already essentially correct, but if the Feature of the Week wants to make guides absolutely perfect... Well, looking very closely, I can see a few things that could use slight adjustment.

- Under "High Critical Hit Moves", possibly change the wording "and the formula used for those mean they nearly always Critical Hit" to "and the formula used for those means that they usually nearly always Critical Hit" (adding the word usually) since Pokemon like Parasect and Machop only CH around ~50% of the time.
- Under "Freezes", possibly change the wording "There is only two ways to thaw" to "There are only two ways to become unfrozen" because the "defrost" message doesn't appear when you get Hazed, Haze just resets everything with a blanket message that all status changes have been eliminated.
- Under "Trapping Moves", I know I said this probably wasn't necessary earlier, but I rethought it and decided it really should be included: poison/burn/seed turn-by-turn effects take place mid-partial trapping move (in the carts, not yet in NB/RBYbot since it's glitched) as the "attack continues". This means that poison/burning the Wrap user inhibits it, while poison/burning the Pokemon that's being Wrap'ed makes it take a whole ton of extra damage (so it works both ways).
- Under "99.6% Accuracy" mention also Bide (and Bide can hit ghosts too <3 )
- Under "Substitute": "Substitute will also NOT block attacks's secondary effects (ex: Body Slam can paralyse if it hits a Substitute), exept when the secondary effect is poison, which it will STILL block.." This is incorrect, I think Vineon just forgot to edit it since he and Kikuichimonji and Kamex discuss it later on. Sub will in fact block all secondary effects (even on the turn it breaks, as I asked Kamex about; that is, there doesn't still need to be a substitute at the end of the turn).
- Under the general "Other Move Differences" section, add Bide, mentioning that it responds to any kind of damage and that it can also hit anything, even ghost-types, like Counter, and that it never misses, even with accuracy modifiers, just like Swift. And that it can also do double back the amount of damage that would have been done if the user hadn't had a sub up, like Counter. Oh, and neat, apparently it counts turns following a damage-dealing move that don't cause damage but which don't miss as doing that same amount of damage as previous... Via Kamex: "If an opponent damages the user during the idling period, it must then use an attack that actually misses (as opposed to one that fails, or making a move, or using an item) in order to reset the last amount of damage counted towards Bide." Awesome.

That's all I can think of now besides grammar errors which I'm guessing isn't what we're looking for. Edit: Wait, FM says it is... well, in any case, not going to do that right now.

 

[chaos]

No, we are. Grammar and spelling is also apart of this.

 

[skarm]

Well I've already started formatting and made the required pages via SCMS. As I was formatting it I was also changing wording and spelling, grammar, etc. Vineon is french so there's just some basic grammar issues to go over which I was just going to do. Basically what I'd need you guys to do is tell me what to do add or remove specifically.

 

[Kamex]

Multi-hit (of the Double Kick/Twineedle as well as Doubleslap, etc) and partial trapping moves will do the same amount of damage during each hit in their duration.

The PP rollover with partial trapping moves.

For multi-turn moves (Dig, Skull Bash), PP is deducted on the second turn of use and the last move used is changed on the second turn of use. There is literally nothing done at all on the first turn. So something like this can happen:
Gengar switches in, Pidgeot switches in.
Gengar uses Metronome, "lowers its head."
Pidgeot uses Mirror Move => Metronome/not Skull Bash => Psychic or something like that.

A lot of times, the game will display the wrong type effectiveness messages. Most of the time it seems that if up against a dual-type the effectiveness message only consider's the pokemon's second type. This was fixed in Stadium.

Bide works much like Counter in accumulating damage and how it not always being reset can make it do a lot more harm than it should.

Conversion is completely different from Conversion and Conversion2 -- in RBY it changes the user's current type(s) to the opponent's current type(s).

Counter can critical hit (though the damage in such a case is unaltered).

Disable gives a duration length of 1-7 which results in a move being disabled for 0-6 turns.

Haze will remove Focus Energy, Leech Seed, Light Screen, Mist, Reflect, confusion, and the cumulative nature of Toxic from both active pokémon and major status ailments from the opponent. And major status ailments from the user if used in Stadium.

Hyper Beam's recharge turn is negated if the opponent uses a partial trapping move.

Leech seed draining can exceed the pokemon's current HP.

Light Screen, Reflect double the user's defense rather than (I believe what I've heard is it halves the user's defense and quarters the opponent's attack? at any rate it's different in RBY)

The only restrictions on Metronone are itself and Struggle.

The base PP of Struggle is 10.

Substitute will take the hit if you hit yourself in confusion and will have no effect on the execution of Bide, Counter, or partial trapping moves.

 

[Aeolus]

Great guide: an excellent read for people who are rather new to RBY like me. Upon reading through it, I found some very minor spelling errors.

Under the Substitute section, "except" is spelled "exept" in lines 1 and 3

Under the Dig and Fly section, "paralyzed" is spelled "paralysed" in in lines 3 and 4. That may just be an alternate spelling, but I thought I'd point it out anyway. The same error appears under The Glare section. Also, "underground" is misspelled in the first line

Under Trapping Moves, "immobilized" is spelled "immobilised" in the 4th line from the bottom and the last line of the paragraph. Also, the last two sentences need to be combined into one. The penultimate one is a fragment.

Under Trapping Moves, "interesting" is spelled "interresting" in the first line of the second paragraph.

Under Type Effectiveness Differences, the first word "theres" should be There are.

The contractions in the introductory paragraph need apostrophes, and "it's" in the third line of paragraph three and the 3rd line under "Stat Changing Moves" doesn't get an apostrophe.

Under 99.6% Accuracy, "mentioned" is spelled "mentionned"

Sorry if that was nit-picky. I'm sure skarm would have caught most, if not all of it anyway, but I was bored. lol


Great Guide Vineon.

 

[Bugsy23]

Nice guide Vineon since I have never bothered to learn rby by reading stuff. Anyway, to finish what Aeolus started:

Under Special Stat, the word "werent" in line 9 is missing an apostrophe.

Under Critical Hit, in line 10, the first "your" should be "and"

Under Freezes, the sentence, "There is only two ways to thaw, and that is by getting hit by a Fire type attack or if your opponent uses Haze while your frozen Pokemon is into play" should be "There are only only two ways to thaw, and those are getting hit by a fire type attack or if your opponent uses Haze while your frozen Pokemon is in play."

Under Trapping Moves, in line 6, the word "isnt" is missing an apostrophe

Under Stat Changing Moves, in line 3, the word "it's" should not have an apostrophe

Under Substitute, in line 12, the word "wear" should be "where"

There were various commas missing as well, so maybe go through that again since this guide is supposed to be perfect.

 

[Kikuichimonji]

About Substitute:
Substitute blocks primary status moves, like Thunder Wave and Sleep Powder. It does not block direct confusion moves, like Confuse Ray. It does not block secondary status, like paralysis from Body Slam or Thunderbolt. It does block secondary confusion effects, like Confusion or Psybeam. However, on Netbattle this is glitched and Body Slam can still paralyze through Substitute, and visa-versa for Psybeam. Since I'm not entirely sure on whether this is supposed to be intended for Netbattle or cart mechanics, I'm not entirely sure how to word it.

Whirlwind has 85% accuracy.

There are many places where an ampersand (&) is used in place of the word "and." I don't know if this is something that's edit worthy or not. Also, there are many places where two periods are used, and I'm not entirely sure on whether Vineon meant for these to be a single period (.), three periods(...), or ellipsis (…)

The word “paralyses” is used under Thunder, and although the British spelling is correct, in the purely technical sense it is not consistent with what is included in the game text, and the rest of the document. Actually, there are several occurrences of “paralyse,” which as far as I know isn’t an acceptable spelling, even outside of the context of the game itself.

In the first sentence of the second paragraph describing Substitute mechanics, “Secondly, and this is where it gets interesting – if you…,” the use of dashes or commas should be consistent. Actually, a hyphen is used, rather than a dash, which is wrong either way. It should be changed to either “Secondly—and this is where it gets interesting—if…” or “Secondly, and this is where it gets interesting, if…”

Everything listed as a .4 chance is actually a .390625 chance, or you could just list it as being one chance in 256.

For individual moves, there’s a lot of inconsistency. Some of them are brief phrases “Does not confuse” but others include the subject “it,” “it” referring to the move in question.

 

[Pidgeot500]

There are many places where an ampersand (&) is used in place of the word "and." I don't know if this is something that's edit worthy or not. Also, there are many places where two periods are used, and I'm not entirely sure on whether Vineon meant for these to be a single period (.), three periods(...), or ellipsis (…)

Probably it would be insane to care about grammar to this extent, but there's actually a difference between three- and four-period ellipses... three-period is for when an idea/statement is just briefly trailed off, such as "Don't... do that. If you press that button... this building will explode." and four-periods is for when it doesn't finish, such as "And now she'll never know how the story ends...." I was reading a high school keyboarding textbook (by the way, business textbooks are packed with right-wing messages) and there was a little note about this in the margins. Not sure if this is relevant to what you're trying to figure out. Oh and wow, there's a separate character for an ellipsis... Edit: That's right, I did mess up the ellipsis... I always do that. I used to always love four-dot ellipses for everything, but now I instinctively only use three.... it's an irregular aesthetic reversal.

 

[chaos]

trailing....

 

[Vineon]

I didnt think stuff like whirlwind being 85% accurate matter... since in fact, it does not.

same thing for stuff like Counter scoring a "critical hit"

 

[Kikuichimonji]

I didnt think stuff like whirlwind being 85% accurate matter... since in fact, it does not.

same thing for stuff like Counter scoring a "critical hit"

You could just tag stuff like that as "useless," or just have a separate section for "Stuff that is different, but you'd never realize/care about."




Since I feel like picking on syntax:

Throughout the entire document, Pokémon is spelled without the accent mark over the e. Also, Pokémon is already plural, and thus use of "Pokemons" is not necessary. Anything relating to the spelling of "Pokémon" or any forms of it will be ignored from this point onward.

There are a lot of what I feel to be unnecessary capitalizations. In-game terms, like Attack, Speed and Special, as well as the names of Attacks and Pokémon should be left that way, but terms like "base stat" and "ratio" which are never used in game as caps shouldn't be. (Ratio is used, but the game never gives it the magical "all-caps status" that it gives to WEEDLE who learns STRING SHOT and POISON STING.)


I may repeat things that have already been mentioned.

I probably missed a few things.



Special Stat
An ampersand is used.
GSC is an acronym and should be capitalized.

Critical Hits
RBY is an acronym and every letter of it should be capitalized.
Ratio is given unnecessary capitalization.
Addition is capitalized.
Critical hits don't double the damage dealt, they double your level when calculating damage.

High Critical Hit Moves
High and Moves don't need capitalization, and when Critical is used without Hit, I'm not sure it needs it either.

Freezes
There are only two ways to thaw, since you're applying that verb to two ways, rather than one. Also, "those" should be used to refer to the two ways, rather than "that."

One-Hit-KO Attacks
OHKO is an acronym and should be capitalized.

Trapping Moves
An ampersand is used. In the first complete sentence, "prevent" should be changed to "prevents."
There is a space before a colon.
I'm pretty sure immobilized should be spelled with a "z," even if "immobilised" is technically correct, the game spells it with a "z."
The last two sentences of the first paragraph should be combined, and "however" should be used to start the sentence.
The second paragraph has some really awkward comma usage.

Type Effectiveness Differences
There's a space before the colon.

Type Effectiveness Differences
The game doesn't capitalize all the words in the phrases "not very effective" and "super effective," and they shouldn't be here.
In the last parenthetical sentence, the first letter of the first word should be capitalized, and it should be punctuated, probably with a period.

Stat Changing Moves
The second sentence is a fragment and should probably be combined with the first.
If the word "Now" is going to be used to start the third sentence (ugh), it really should be proceeded by a comma.
Paralyze should be spelled with a "z."
The last sentence is punctuated by two periods.

Sleeping
The word "however" should probably be removed from the third sentence.

Hyper Beam
Substitute is a move name and should be capitalized.

Substitute
As I said before:
Substitute blocks primary status moves, like Thunder Wave and Sleep Powder. It does not block direct confusion moves, like Confuse Ray. It does not block secondary status, like paralysis from Body Slam or Thunderbolt. It does block secondary confusion effects, like Confusion or Psybeam. However, on Netbattle this is glitched and Body Slam can still paralyze through Substitute, and visa-versa for Psybeam. Since I'm not entirely sure on whether this is supposed to be intended for Netbattle or cart mechanics, I'm not entirely sure how to word it.

Reflect & Light Screen
It should probably be noted that lowering the stat in question (Psychic special fall, Screech) negates the effect of Reflect/Light Screen.

Roar & Whirlwind
Whirlwind is 85% accurate.

Dig & Fly
Forms of "paralyse" are used, which should be changed to use the spelling used in game. Also, Fly should be capitalized, since it's a move name.

Glare
Paralyze.

Leech Seed
HP does not need to be pluralized.

Thunder
Paralyzes.

Recovering Moves Failing
Two ellipses are used after "fail," only one is necessary.

 

[Pidgeot500]

When skarm is through formatting and incorporating suggestions as appropriate, would the guide then be reposted here for further review? (I had assumed that it would be, since the week wasn't halfway through way back when this topic was active etc. so I thought there'd be time, but it's just one day left now.)

 

[skarm]

The feature for the week of January 15th has been completed and uploaded. Thanks to all those that helped out!

Also, this is the first article for the RBY section!

http://www.smogon.com/rby/articles/index.html

 

[Hipmonlee]

Reflect & Light Screen
It should probably be noted that lowering the stat in question (Psychic special fall, Screech) negates the effect of Reflect/Light Screen.

Uhh.. Are you sure this is correct? I had thought this was the case originally but was corrected by Kamex.. Actually come to think of it it might have been Jolt135 who corrected me. I am still not sure if these two are in fact the same person..
I do know that on NB this definitely doesnt happen.

Uhh, regarding wrap and such, what is supposed to happen when the wrapping pokemon fps and what was the crazy rubbish about pp that happened.. Actually come to think of it, we should make a wrap guide and sort all that stuff out there. I nominate Matt to write it, cause he seems to know how it is supposed to work, unlike me, who is only aware of how it works on NB.

There is a .4% chance that Recover will fail.

Where did this come from? Is this true? [Edit] - For the time being I am removing it, I am pretty sure this is an error, but please correct me if I am wrong..

Have a nice day.

 

[Kikuichimonji]

What happened to mention of the thing where recovery moves fail at 255 or 511 less than max HP?

 

[Pidgeot500]

(Edited out: fixed)

I can make these changes myself tomorrow, since I'm not very busy at all, or skarm or Hip or Vineon or someone can make them and edit my post.

I love the comment about the RBY charm :)

Edit: (Edited out: fixed) For fun, you could also add that almost every time a technique causes just the right amount of damage to do this, there was a 1/39 or 2.56% chance of it happening, which is around a quarter of the chance of freezing (so for every 4 freezes this should happen once, maybe! ;-) ).

Edit: Oh, OK, cool. Classes canceled today (which is unfortunate) so will get right to it. Edit: Okay, done. Also, I added Bide... IMO, if Bite is there too, it should be added. =)

Edit: Under Swift, it's stated: "Swift is the only move that can hit Pokemons underground/in the air, after they used Dig or Fly." Technically Bide can too, so maybe we should just take this out entirely and add a note to the Dig/Fly section? Edit: Oh, and Transform too...

 

[skarm]

Well you know what you guys can feel free to edit it if you like. It took me forever to format it and undoubtably I missed some errors.

 

[Kamex]

Uhh, regarding wrap and such, what is supposed to happen when the wrapping pokemon fps and what was the crazy rubbish about pp that happened..

The duration just ends. And

If the opponent switches out before the turn duration ends, Wrap will automatically be used against the incoming pokémon, deducting an additional PP from the move. If at such a time Wrap has 0 PP, Wrap will still be used against the incoming pokémon. After that use, the current PP of Wrap will roll over to 63, and full PP ups will be applied to it.

Even if Wrap misses, it will negate the recharge turn normally required for Hyper Beam. Additionally, if the user of Wrap attacks before the user of Hyper Beam during a recharge turn and the use of Wrap misses, the user of Hyper Beam will automatically use Hyper Beam during that turn. If at such a time Hyper Beam has 0 PP, Hyper Beam will still be used, and afterwards its current PP will roll over to 63, and full PP ups will be applied to it.

Well you know what you guys can feel free to edit it if you like. It took me forever to format it and undoubtably I missed some errors.

None of the things I mentioned earlier in the thread have been included.

 

[Chronicles]

Focus Energy Not only will it not make your Critical Hit Ratio higher it will quarter it instead. Do not use under any circumstance.
i thought they reduce your CH ratio to zero if your slower, or leave it the same as before if your faster
EDIT: ok my bad :(

 

[Kamex]

Focus Energy Not only will it not make your Critical Hit Ratio higher it will quarter it instead. Do not use under any circumstance.
i thought they reduce your CH ratio to zero if your slower, or leave it the same as before if your faster

That's the wrong info that's currently found on AH.