Construction Process Guide Writer(s)

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DougJustDoug

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We need to document the process we will follow when building pokemon. It doesn't need to be a rigid set of laws, but more of a guide for us to use for reference.

I'd like nominations/volunteers for a person or persons who are willing to build the guide for the project. I'd like people with good writing skills, familiarity with CAP history, and a willingness to work with the community through peer review. Feel free to nominate yourself or others and present qualifications.

Here's a sample high-level outline of the content required in the guide:

Construction Process Guide

Mini-Mod
Selection
Role​

Polling
Order
Step Descriptions
Voting Methods​

Playtesting

Revision


This is not comprehensive. But hopefully gives you an idea of what we need.

If multiple people are interested and qualified, I may appoint a "Construction Committee" to own this part of the project. After we determine the writers, we will open a special Construction Process Workshop thread to solicit input, peer review, and track progress. (These will work like Sunday's analysis workshop threads)

Whoever is appointed to this task is going to be instrumental in determining the future direction of this project. We need solid people on this one.

Who's interested?
 
I am. Do you need like a "resume" of sorts?

EDIT: Shit, didn't see that line at the top. Hold up, i'll have something for ya in a minute.

EDIT2: Ok.
Well, As many people on the CAP server know, My name Is Aki. I go by the Aliases "Aki", "Aki_BFG9000" and Associated names.
I Was interested in the CAP project because of the balancing of the metagame issues, because we have way more physical attackers than Special attackers.
If you vote for me *Flashes Vote for Aki picket sign* You will have:
-Someone dedicated to the CAP project (as many people as there are out there, but so what, it's a credential)
-Someone willing to part with their spare time to further the good of CAPkind.
-Someone who will critique, and is willing to be critiqued.

Plus a vote for me means that you may actually get me to shut up on the server.
 

tennisace

not quite too old for this, apparently
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well, im gonna just say that i've been here from the beginning and as many who have been on the server know, i am THE coolest mod. with that being said, i would like to be a mini-mod, but i believe that Sunday, Time Mage, and Eric the Espeon should be mini-mods first.

Edit: i guess this isnt for next mini-mod...i'd like to help make the guide if someone would spell-check it first =P
 

DougJustDoug

Knows the great enthusiasms
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Is this for the shot at being Mini-Mod for the next CAP? I kinda thought the current Mini-mod of the current CAP nominate a future one.
No, this is not for picking mini-mods for future pokemon projects.

This is for firming up the entire construction process. Part of which includes the way we assign mini-modship. Cooper passed the torch to Hyra. If, as a community, we like the idea of having a "line of succession" style of assigning mini-mods, then that's fine with me. But that is not written in stone. In fact, nothing is written anywhere on the construction process.

This is to appoint the writers that are going to document the process we will follow. Look at the outline above for an idea of what I mean when I refer to "the process". Whoever writes this is going to have quite a bit of say in the process being documented. It's still a community thing, but we have to assign ownership of certain tasks. This is an important one.
 
Hey Doug, I can do up a Draft if you'd like. If you would, I'd probably PM it, rather than post it.
 
No, this is not for picking mini-mods for future pokemon projects.

This is for firming up the entire construction process. Part of which includes the way we assign mini-modship. Cooper passed the torch to Hyra. If, as a community, we like the idea of having a "line of succession" style of assigning mini-mods, then that's fine with me.
Okay...my mistake then. The first part of the process made me thought it was the voting thread for next mini-mod though the "passing of the torch" thing was kinda my belief on how it was done.
 

DougJustDoug

Knows the great enthusiasms
is a Site Content Manageris a Top Artistis a Programmeris a Forum Moderatoris a Top CAP Contributoris a Battle Simulator Admin Alumnusis a Smogon Discord Contributor Alumnusis a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus
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Hey Doug, I can do up a Draft if you'd like. If you would, I'd probably PM it, rather than post it.
Right now, I want to see who are all the qualified candidates to take this on. Since this is an important task, I'm not going to rush it.

Aki, if you want to put together a sample, as support for your writing skills -- Go right ahead. But don't draft the entire guide. Just a sample of perhaps some key points and descriptions. You can post it in this thread as part of your "resume". Please wrap it in CODE tags to prevent this thread from getting too lengthy. If you would like a little peer review before posting, then reach out to some other members of the project via PM.

If project members want to suggest people other than themselves, that's fine. Also, everyone should feel free to comment on all candidates presented.
 
well, im gonna just say that i've been here from the beginning and as many who have been on the server know, i am THE coolest mod. with that being said, i would like to be a mini-mod, but i believe that Sunday, Time Mage, and Eric the Espeon should be mini-mods first.

Edit: i guess this isnt for next mini-mod...i'd like to help make the guide if someone would spell-check it first =P
You are just behind Mag in terms of Mod coolness. However, being the Quick Draw mod helps.

DougJustDoug said:
Right now, I want to see who are all the qualified candidates to take this on. Since this is an important task, I'm not going to rush it.

Aki, if you want to put together a sample, as support for your writing skills -- Go right ahead. But don't draft the entire guide. Just a sample of perhaps some key points and descriptions. You can post it in this thread as part of your "resume". Please wrap it in CODE tags to prevent this thread from getting too lengthy. If you would like a little peer review before posting, then reach out to some other members of the project via PM.

If project members want to suggest people other than themselves, that's fine. Also, everyone should feel free to comment on all candidates presented.
This implies that i'll doo a Little draft of a (some) polls.

Which is what i'll do. I've got heavy WiFI traffic ATM, so i'll post it when i'm ready.
 

Magmortified

<b>CAP 8 Playtesting Expert</b>
is a CAP Contributor Alumnus
If nobody minds, I can help write up the guide.

I might write up a sample as well, but I just wanted to throw my paper slip into the hat.
 
Get on the CAP server. There's no-one to talk to atm.

On a more related note, A sample would be good.
 
First off, hello DJD. I would love to document the Pokemon creating process. I haven't been with the "CAP" movement very long, matter of fact, this is roughly my first day. I haven't been a regular so to speak on Smogon, but this project really snatched my attention. So with that being said, even though i'm relatively new, i still think i can make numerous contributions to this movement, and why not let this be my start. So Doug all i am asking that you give me shot, nothing more, nothing less. I will prove myself to you eventually, in due time.
 

eric the espeon

maybe I just misunderstood
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I am not the best at writeing guides, but i have some ideas on how to improve the order and working of the polls (mostly the type ones) and would like to help.

also i think there should normaly be 2 mini-mods for each pokemon, it would speed up the process, and stop "gaps" from forming between polls.
 

Sunday

God Bless Nintys Incompetence :*)
is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnus
i believe that Sunday, Time Mage, and Eric the Espeon should be mini-mods first.
Well thanks for the vote of confidence ^__^
(Even if I don't really want to be a minimod, even if that's not what this thread is about)

I'm not volunteering to write the actual document, but you can be sure I'll rigorosly scrutinise the drafts and final.
 
I'm a little confused as to what this is about. I'm with you up to we need volunteers to help write, but you completely lost me on what needs to be written.

A guide of some sort?

I found the process pretty damn simple. But then again, I missed the first 3 or 4 polls on Revenankh, and I missed pretty much all of Syclant. So I think I'll go back and check all of the polls. After that, I could try to help write whatever it is we're supposed to be writing, but that needs further explanation to me.
 
I think I can help with this. Making solid guidelines for next projects will surely make the more efficient and organized, and I already have some ideas. I'm not the perfect candidate, since English is not my first language, so my writing will probably not be as good as others, but I'll try to do my best.
 
seen as there seems so many interested can't we find a way for us to work together to get projects done quicker because at the minute each pokemon is taking over a month to complete. Maybe run more then one or something
 
I say we give this job to Cooper if he feels up to it.

It was his thought process that gave birth to the entire idea. I copied much of the process from him, so I think it would be best that he writes it, since he knows how it came about.
 

tennisace

not quite too old for this, apparently
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Top CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus
You are just behind Mag in terms of Mod coolness. However, being the Quick Draw mod helps.
I AM the fastest kick this side of chuck norris... but i digress. I agree with Hyra that Cooper should do this because it was his idea.
 

DougJustDoug

Knows the great enthusiasms
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I guess the implications of this task are not obvious to everyone. For those of you that don't understand what needs to be done and what it means, I'll try to clarify it. This is gonna be a wall of text. Anyone that isn't interested in the inner workings of this project should just stop reading now. In fact, this entire thread is probably not your cup of tea.

When Cooper ran the Syclant project, he had no rules or predetermined structure for the process. All we knew was that he was running the show, it would be a step-by-step process, and there would be community polls involved. I don't know if Cooper had a master blueprint or not -- I doubt it. I think he had a good gut feel for how he wanted it to work, and he played by ear as he went along. And, all things considered, it worked great.

After Syclant was done, Cooper didn't want to run the next one, so he assigned the task to Hyra. Hyra obviously liked a lot of what Cooper did, because he ran the Revenankh process very much like Cooper ran Syclant. Hyra made some slight changes here and there, but it was pretty much the same general process.

Did Hyra have to follow the same process as Cooper? No. He could do just about anything he wanted. What if Hyra would have made a dictatorial decision? What if I bribed Hyra to throw out all the art submissions and select my djinni design by executive fiat? What could we do about it? Nothing really. Individuals could stop participating, but that's about it. Fortunately, we've had two excellent mini-mods that never intentionally abused their power over the process.

But, I don't think it's a good idea to expect perfect altruism from everyone in the future. In fact, many times, individuals can make very poor decisions, while THINKING they are acting in everyone's best interests. There have already been significant disagreements with the mini-mods in the past. At no time, do I think the mini-mods were ever trying to lord over the process.

The fact that the project has made it this far, is somewhat of a miracle. Just think about it for a second: Did anyone really have to "follow" Cooper or Hyra? Absolutely not. We call them mini-mods, but they can't infract people or control posts and threads.

At any time, some disgruntled faction of the project could have struck off on their own and made their own polls. Perhaps when there was disagreement over Cooper's decisions regarding Mountaineer -- remember that? What if JoeBlowUser would have said "Screw you Cooper, me and 30 other project members think we can do this a better way. We're making our own polls from here on out, and I'm gonna be the mini-mod." Realistically, there would be little that could have been done. Cooper and others could complain to Smogon site staff, but most of Smogon couldn't have cared less about the project at that point. Maybe Smogon would have stepped in and controlled it, maybe not. I'm glad it never came to that. In general, we all accepted Cooper and Hyra's leadership and let them run the show however they saw fit.

The current construction process guideline is easy to document. Here it is:

"There is a mini-mod. They can do whatever they want. Everyone must do what they say. When they are done, they can hand-pick their successor. Rinse, repeat.

PS. They don't even have to pick a successor, technically they can keep going for as long as they want."​

OK, I don't know about you -- but that is not a good way to run a community organization. The "benevolent dictator" is a wonderful form of government -- until somebody forgets the "benevolent" part. That is why democratic communities set up rules and guidelines. They then select leaders to enact and enforce those guidelines. If the guidelines are known to everyone, then everyone knows what is happening and what is about to happen. That eliminates surprises and tons of disagreements. To use a management cliche -- it is "expectation setting".

I have been involved in many communities, some good and some bad. Without structure, communities tend toward chaos and dissent. Factions form, wars begin, and the community crumbles. This happens easily in online communities. I don't want that to happen here. I have certain capabilities to prevent members from getting out of control. Smogon staff has certain capabilities to prevent me from getting out of control. If we lay out some guidelines for the construction process, then everyone will know what to expect when we build pokemon, and how to judge our progress. That should help curb dissension and chaos.

When we build a pokemon -- What is the community expectation? How should the process unfold? I want us to write it down and put it in a sticky for the world to see. Future mini-mods should use it as a point of reference. Newcomers can use it to get a "lay of the land" and understand how we do things here.

Using the outline from the OP, here's a partial list of questions that should be answered in various sections of the guidelines.

Construction Process Guide

Mini-Mod
Selection
How do mini-mods get selected?
What are the qualifications?​
Role
What are their responsibilties?
What "powers" do they have?​

Polling
Order
What steps do we vote on?
What is the general sequence of polls?​
Step Descriptions
What are the details of "complex" polls?
For example:
What types are included in the typing poll?
Are "previously used" types excluded? Why?
How are art and sprite submissions gathered?
How do you determine which art is included in the first art poll?
Why do certain people get to submit base stats?
What are the qualifications?
How are movelists determined?​

Voting Methods
Which polls should be single choice? Which should be multi-choice?
In multi-choice polls, what is the threshold for a "winning" choice?
What is bold text voting? How are they counted? Can bold votes be changed?
Can the mini-mod choose any voting method on any poll?​

Playtesting
How is playtesting organized?
How long do we playtest a pokemon?​

Revision
What conditions would cause a revision to a pokemon?
How are revisions proposed and voted on?​

I want to know who are going to be the movers and shakers on this project that are going to author the first "official" construction process. I'm not going to do it. I have enough responsibilities with the forum and the server. Also, there is already enough perception out there that this is somehow "my project". If someone else owns this very important task, it spreads the "balance of power" on the project to other people, and all the attention that goes with it.

This isn't an "honorary" task. There's a lot of work to be done. I'd prefer to have one lead writer and maybe one or two other writers to help. Hopefully, the community as a whole will be involved in the workshop thread to give feedback and editorial help.

Anyone out there who has aspirations to be a mini-mod in the future -- you should be very interested and involved in this process. That doesn't mean you need to be a named writer on this document. But, if you aren't prepared to do the work to help formalize the process -- don't expect to be given the responsibility to lead a pokemon project in the future.
 
voting methods as long as they work should be selected by whoever runs the topics. If you have modded them then you should trust them enough to give them the benfit of the doubt not to fuck it up.
 

Magmortified

<b>CAP 8 Playtesting Expert</b>
is a CAP Contributor Alumnus
voting methods as long as they work should be selected by whoever runs the topics. If you have modded them then you should trust them enough to give them the benfit of the doubt not to fuck it up.
Sometimes the benefit of the doubt just isn't enough. Despite how much we trust the people who have become mini-mods, in the long term, it really becomes much safer to install guidelines to keep them from screwing up for whatever reason.

I still wouldn't mind helping to write things up. *Calls other writer*
 
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