CAP 4 CAP 4 - Part 6 (Base Stat Rating Poll 2)

[Sunday]

This is not Base Stat Total.

In this poll we vote for the Pokemon's Base Stat Rating. This is a far more accurate way of determining the effectiveness of a Pokemon's stat spread than Base Stat Total (and thus a much better way of determining it's power). Please take a gander at these links so you fully understand what you are voting for. I left out the extreemly overpowered and extreemly underpowered Base Stat Ratings. The main indication of this was "did anyone submit a spread with this BSR in the Base Stat Submission Thread?" Where the answer was "No" I didn't bother going that high/low in this poll.

Information about the formula is located here.
A utility for calculating the ODB is located here.


Pure Utility Pokemon

Description: There is a serious lack of Gravity, Rapid Spin, Wish, non Dark weak Trick Room, OU viable Heal Bell / Aromatherapy, Encore, Memento, Non Dark weak Perish Song, Psycho Shift, Safeguard, Magic Coat, Me First, Snatch, Spikes, Toxic Spikes, Tailwind and Haze Pokemon in our lovely Metagame. I don't know what type, what stat distribution or even what kind of Pokemon would effectively use all those, but I want to build a utility Pokemon for the useful yet less used utility moves. If I had to narrow the field a bit, I would emphasize Tailwind, Gravity, non Dark weak Trick Room, Rapid Spin, Wish and Encore. The normal utility moves like Reflect and Light Screen go without saying.

Primary Typing: Poison
Secondary Typing: Ground
Style Bias: Mixed, Between -5 and -10 -- Slightly towards defence
Build Bias: Between 5 and 10 -- Slightly towards physical

Rating is       Pokemon's Stats are  Pokemon with this rating
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
More than 1400  Exaggerated          Arceus, Deoxys-A, Giratina, Mewtwo, Rayquaza, Slaking, Regigigas, Palkia, Dialga, Ho-oh, Lugia, Deoxys, Groudon, Kyogre
900 to 1399     Too Good             None
580 to 899      Fantastic            Cresselia, Azelf, Salamence, Garchomp, Darkrai, Latios, Mew, Celebi, Jirachi, Manaphy, Shaymin, Latias, Syclant, Heatran, Zapdos
420 to 579      Excellent            Dragonite, Entei, Blissey, Tyranitar, Raikou, Regirock, Regice, Registeel, Moltres, Suicune, Metagross, Articuno, Snorlax, Uxie, Mesprit, Arcanine, Espeon
300 to 419      Very Good            Infernape, Electivire, Porygon-Z, Gyarados, Deoxys-D, Togekiss, Milotic, Gengar, Umbreon, Magmortar, Lapras, Alakazam, Lucario, Charizard, Typhlosion, Deoxys-S, Weavile, Rhyperior, Mamoswine, Sceptile, Blaziken, Vaporeon, Hippowdon, Walrein, Yanmega, Steelix, Leafeon, Kingdra, Jolteon, Feraligatr, Swampert, Revenankh, Flygon
250 to 299      Quite Good           Lickilicky, Torterra, Aggron, Heracross, Scyther, Tangrowth, Gallade, Gardevoir, Blastoise, Aerodactyl, Starmie, Roserade, Magnezone, Crobat, Floatzel, Honchkrow, Pinsir, Venusaur, Probopass, Glaceon, Houndoom, Luxray, Meganium, Empoleon, Staraptor, Gliscor, Rapidash, Tentacruel, Relicanth, Flareon, Magmar, Mismagius, Porygon2, Rampardos, Tauros, Muk 
210 to 249      Good                 Exeggutor, Kangaskhan, Scizor, Bastiodon, Poliwrath, Manectric, Electabuzz, Machamp, Politoed, Donphan, Ninetales, Golduck, Toxicroak, Drapion, Cradily, Nidoqueen, Ambipom, Kabutops, Miltank, Sharpedo, Nidoking, Ampharos, Ursaring, Slowbro, Slowking, Hypno, Rhydon, Dodrio, Bronzong, Omastar, Cloyster, Claydol, Drifblim, Zangoose, Absol, Abomasnow, Altaria, Golem, Dusknoir, Raichu, Kingler, Skuntank, Shiftry
175 to 209      Average              Froslass, Dewgong, Victreebel, Exploud, Ludicolo, Xatu, Armaldo, Hitmonlee, Glalie, Phione, Weezing, Clefable, Wailord, Primeape, Swalot, Tropius, Gastrodon, Breloom, Pidgeot, Grumpig, Hariyama, Whiscash, Stantler, Bellossom, Lanturn, Torkoal, Lopunny, Jynx, Forretress, Vileplume, Gorebyss, Magneton, Huntail, Vespiquen, Skarmory, Mantine, Cacturne, Lumineon, Octillery, Girafarig, Hitmonchan, Golbat, Venomoth, Banette, Seaking, Seviper
143 to 174      Below Average        Purugly, Spiritomb, Cherrim, Crawdaunt, Fearow, Sandslash, Electrode, Rotom, Mr. Mime, Piloswine, Noctowl, Chansey, Carnivine, Granbull, Hitmontop, Solrock, Lunatone, Vigoroth, Camerupt, Kadabra, Sneasel, Arbok, Jumpluff, Qwilfish, Haunter, Quagsire, Misdreavus, Seadra, Persian, Kecleon, Dusclops, Chimecho, Mothim, Pelipper, Mightyena, Castform, Munchlax
127 to 142      Poor                 Gligar, Swellow, Wormadam-G, Dragonair, Wormadam-S, Chatot, Wormadam, Ninjask, Bibarel, Dunsparce, Azumarill, Wobbuffet, Gabite, Marowak, Wigglytuff, Linoone, Furret, Pupitar, Tangela, Raticate, Metang, Sealeo, Masquerain, Lairon, Sunflora, Murkrow, Ponyta, Grotle, Monferno, Sudowoodo, Shelgon, Croconaw, Medicham, Marshtomp, Machoke, Wartortle, Bayleef, Prinplup, Charmeleon, Quilava, Ivysaur
100 to 126      Bad                  Combusken, Grovyle, Parasect, Plusle, Magcargo, Volbeat, Illumise, Togetic, Lickitung, Porygon, Minun, Gloom, Roselia, Ariados, Wailmer, Pachirisu, Shuckle, Yanma, Kricketune, Dugtrio, Delcatty, Weepinbell, Beautifly, Poliwhirl, Dustox, Butterfree, Corsola, Beedrill, Sableye, Mawile, Nidorina, Graveler, Flaaffy, Nidorino, Lileep
99 or less      Horrible             Everything else

 

[omgthatkid]

Voted for Very Good.
My spread falls under this category, plus I think the Pokemon would perform better with a higher rating...obviously.

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

Voted for Very Good because that's the rating I feel most comfortable with. It also stem from having my stat spread fall within the range.

 

[Aldaron]

Yea, I want a Very Good pokemon....so I voooooootttteeedddd fffooorrrr tthhhaaattttt.

 

[Tsukikage]

Voted for Quite Good

 

[Flounder]

Quite Good.

Probably going to lose, but... >_>

I have to try.

 

[billymills]

I chose quite good.
This is supposed to be a utility pokemon, therefore stats aren't the top priority, a good moveset is. It should be good without very high stats.

 

[Drab Emordnilap]

I voted for quite good, after I looked at the list of where current pokemon fall. Restriction breeds creativity, and there are plenty of examples of pokemon in the quite good tier that still perform very well, thanks to their moves and typing, which is something we want here.

Roserade, Starmie, and Heracross is good company.

 

[Chaoscrippler]

I went with Quite Good.

 

[Zerix]

Quite Good all the way.

 

[gengod]

Voted for Very Good because that's the rating I feel most comfortable with. It also stem from having my stat spread fall within the range.

Voted Very Good for this same reasoning. I want ask if this current poll is even necessary, Very Good did win the last poll by 22 votes.

 

[JimBob]

I chose quite good.
This is supposed to be a utility pokemon, therefore stats aren't the top priority, a good moveset is. It should be good without very high stats.

I 100% agree with this dude

We didn't set out to build a wall, or a power attacker, we set out to build a utility pokemon. This thing should be able to put pressure on things without threatening them, and be able to absorb attacks without being too difficult to take out. A Quite Good BSR will nest it right in there.

 

[tennisace]

And with my vote, its tied at 16. Go quite good!

 

[Fishin]

Why not? I'd like some input so I know how to fix it up.

The main reason is summed up in this previous post of mine:

On the subject of attack stats, I'm opposed to making one attack stat a whole lot weaker than the other, or having both stats extremely low. A Pokemon without any moderately strong attacking moves is just setup bait. Even if it's primary role is utility, if it has 60/60 attacking stats, it's an open invitation for dangerous sweepers to come in and set up. Even if you're planning to run a pure utility set without a single attacking move, having a decent attack stat will make opponents think twice before bringing a sweeper in. Having the option to run an offensive set also helps to make the metagame more diverse, which is never a bad thing. Variety is the spice of life - that goes for Pokemon too!

75/65 may not be 60/60, but it's still too low to threaten most sweepers unless we're going to give this thing one hell of an offensive movepool (which you actually say you don't want in your stat spread post). At the point you're at now, though, you'd have trouble boosting the attacking stats without boosting the stat total/stat rating higher, so that was actually part of what prompted my vote of Very Good.

Also, to me 109 speed looks somewhat contrived, and not just because it's designed to be one point above Infernape (though that's a big part of it). Taking a look at the Speed rankings of several Pokemon:

115: Azelf, Starmie, Ambipom, etc
112: Purguly
110: Gengar, Espeon, Jumpluff, etc
108: Infernape
105: Mismagius, Rapidash, Lopunny, etc
102: Garchomp
100: Salamence, Zapdos, Charizard, etc
97: Luvdisc, Raticate
95: Rayquaza, Drapion, Gliscor, etc

There's a clear pattern (though it stops at both ends of the list I posted) - there're a bunch of Pokemon at each number divisible by 5, then one or two at a number in between. 109 speed goes completely against this pattern, so it looks even more unnatural.

 

[tennisace]

The main reason is summed up in this previous post of mine:
75/65 may not be 60/60, but it's still too low to threaten most sweepers unless we're going to give this thing one hell of an offensive movepool (which you actually say you don't want in your stat spread post). At the point you're at now, though, you'd have trouble boosting the attacking stats without boosting the stat total/stat rating higher, so that was actually part of what prompted my vote of Very Good.

Also, to me 109 speed looks somewhat contrived, and not just because it's designed to be one point above Infernape (though that's a big part of it). Taking a look at the Speed rankings of several Pokemon:

115: Azelf, Starmie, Ambipom, etc
112: Purguly
110: Gengar, Espeon, Jumpluff, etc
108: Infernape
105: Mismagius, Rapidash, Lopunny, etc
102: Garchomp
100: Salamence, Zapdos, Charizard, etc
97: Luvdisc, Raticate
95: Rayquaza, Drapion, Gliscor, etc

There's a clear pattern (though it stops at both ends of the list I posted) - there're a bunch of Pokemon at each number divisible by 5, then one or two at a number in between. 109 speed goes completely against this pattern, so it looks even more unnatural.

Well, I see your point. The reason it looks contrived is that it IS contrived. It is designed specifically to take out frail Infernape, but still be beaten by Gengar. As for the attacks, I am going to boost them in my next update to around 80 in an effort to get a Very Good Rating. Thanks for the feedback!

 

[lucariodramon]

Went for Quite Good.

 

[Sunday]

Eww it's a close poll this sucks :(
I was hoping to be able to send out the PM's requesting final stat submissions today but it looks like I'm going to have to wait for the poll to end before I can do that, which will probably set the whole process back around 24 hours.

 

[T_T]

Voted for "Very Good" 0o

 

[Salt Wyrm]

After seeing other "quite good" Pokemon, I decided on voting quite good. It seems a little more appropriate for a purely utility Pokemon anyways.

 

[darkie]

I picked Quite Good, as with the insane movepool this is most likely going to get, it doesn't need tremendous stats to do well. Look at Starmie, Infernape, etc.

 

[omgthatkid]

Ah, one thing I realized is that the Quite Good category has a generally low BST.
Just passing over it, I think Gliscor has the highest BST at 505 or something like that.
When compared to previous CAP projects, thats incredibly low.
Not to mention the fact that this pokemon is weak to common attack types like Ground, Ice, and Water.
So I think it's justified to vote for Very Good.
Even with a good movepool, dying to one super-effective attack isn't exactly the best way to implement this Pokemon.

 

[JimBob]

Just passing over it I noticed that Aerodactyl and Starmie, both of whom are "Quite Good", have 520 BST.

And Heracross has a BST of 500, but that doesn't stop him from being a pretty scary Pokemon. As X-Act has said several times before, BSR is more indicative of a Pokemon's power than BST.

 

[omgthatkid]

Oh, yea I forgot about them. ><
But I was trying to say that having a higher BST, like on par with the other CAP pokemon, would greatly help its survivability.
It's not like anyone is talking (seriously) about making this Pokemon a 600 BST Pokemon

 

[JimBob]

I never said anyone was talking about making it base 600. I do think that this pokemon could probably function well with a BST of around 520, just like Aeroy and Starmie, and it doesn't need a 550 like a lot of people are giving it.

 

[Wilson]

i dont post here much but...

does a utility pokemon really need a very good rating?

the merits in the moves for this type of poke and since im assuming the only stat its really gonna need is speed why do we need to have such a high bsr im just kind of confused

i guess i must be confusing the meaning of base stat rating with base stat total forgive me if im being dumb

i voted for quite good obviously