Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v3

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Finchinator said:
It’s sure as hell not Gambit

Imagine the riots if we quickbanned something that didn’t get banned after a suspect within the next two months AND didn’t survey it…
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Yeah, imagine all of the celebrations riots, everyone is gonna be wanting the heads of Big Stall™ and the council for sure…
 
Cuddly said:
Look at the current list of Defog and Rapid Spin users, what realistically happens if Gholdengo is banned?
Like currently the only Pokemon you'd want to bring with Defog/Rapid Spin that also uses said moves are Great Tusk, Corviknight, Mandibuzz, and Torkoal, all of which can threaten Gholdengo out anyways, and pretty much are the only hazard removers that are good/not outclassed. Only Pokemon I can see rising in usage as a Defogger is Scizor and Cinderace forgoing Court Change.
Ultimately there really isn't a change to hazard aspect of the Metagame if Gholdengo is banned. Good defoggers and rapid spins are simply just rare or outclassed.
The real issue is that the metagame is way too strong and distribution of Defog/Rapid Spin was gutted. Unless Indigo Disk provides Defog back to several Pokemon like Zapdos, Moltres, Landorus-T, Pelipper, and Rotom-W, hazards will just be a problem no matter what.
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mandibuzz cannot threaten ghold out idk what to tell you. I was a believer but then I saw the calcs and it's just free plots
 
Finchinator said:
It’s sure as hell not Gambit

Imagine the riots if we quickbanned something that didn’t get banned after a suspect within the next two months AND didn’t survey it…
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Obviously with what happened with Volcarona a Kingambit QB won't happen, but it wouldn't be nearly as bad as Volc. Volc had a significant number of people thinking it was fine, and it wasn't seen as the most obviously banworthy thing in the huge number of problematic HOME drops. I have not seen anyone in this forum defend Kingambit since it survived, and it stands out even among the chaotic clusterfest of the current meta. Not saying it should happen, but people would react more favorably than last time.

redninjapuffle said:
A free swords dance just for being the last mon standing is fair, sure
I'm surprised the dude lived suspect
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It's actually only equal to a +1 boost instead of a +2, but yeah.
 
DaddyBuzzwole said:
gambit wasn't even on the survey, inexplicably
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It's very explicable though. There was a suspect and the ban movement failed.

Also, I'm sympathetic to those that think Gambit is too powerful, but let's stop acting like it's an unambiguous bad in the tier and that a lot of people wouldn't be upset if it was suddenly removed after failing to get banned in a suspect. Removing this thing from the tier would have massive implications, especially in a community that is already whining incessently about Gholdengo.
 
pokeclysm said:
I have not seen anyone in this forum defend Kingambit since it survived
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We exist, we just know that we'll get yelled it by everyone for saying he isn't broken.

I get why people hate it, but to me it's believe it or not, one of the few things making Ogerpon and a lot of other new threats manageable for me. Being able to sucker punch and kill it from a high percent is a godsend when it thinks it can sweep.

Also, there's just so much counterplay to it now. Everyone is running encore now. You have to burn a tera not to get potentially one shot buy Bloodmoon Vacuumn Wave. Everyone is running fast will-o-wisp. There's no way to beat Dondozo ever except with Tera Dark Fallen 5. Iron Valiant is more prominent than ever. It's got 4MSS, and I actually ran into a Gambit that ran Sucker Punch/Iron Head/Low Kick instead of Kowtow, but because it didn't have it, Toxapex walled it completely.
 
Goodstyle said:
We exist, we just know that we'll get yelled it by everyone for saying he isn't broken.

I get why people hate it, but to me it's believe it or not, one of the few things making Ogerpon and a lot of other new threats manageable for me. Being able to sucker punch and kill it from a high percent is a godsend when it thinks it can sweep.

Also, there's just so much counterplay to it now. Everyone is running encore now. You have to burn a tera not to get potentially one shot buy Bloodmoon Vacuumn Wave. Everyone is running fast will-o-wisp. There's no way to beat Dondozo ever except with Tera Dark Fallen 5. Iron Valiant is more prominent than ever. It's got 4MSS, and I actually ran into a Gambit that ran Sucker Punch/Iron Head/Low Kick instead of Kowtow, but because it didn't have it, Toxapex walled it completely.
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I mean look, all that would be a great argument if Kingambit could only Tera into Dark. Considering it can Tera into any other type and get extra coverage makes almost all of those issues complete non-issues. Also, saying Kingambit has 4MSS when literally all it needs to do the things it’s the best at is Kowtow/Sucker/Swords Dance and whatever coverage you want is dumb.

“Well, it’s Tera that’s the problem then”, I completely agree, but if Tera doesn’t end up going (even though it should imo) then Kingambit with Tera still here is not healthy in the slightest. And giving the Gen 2 Snorlax reason for it being “healthy” by checking the other questionable shit in the meta doesn’t really make its case any better.
 
Finchinator said:
It’s sure as hell not Gambit

Imagine the riots if we quickbanned something that didn’t get banned after a suspect within the next two months AND didn’t survey it…
Click to expand...
imo the key difference is that Volc was banned for WCOP while Kingambit would be (at this stage) for meta development
 
Goodstyle said:
It's very explicable though. There was a suspect and the ban movement failed.

Also, I'm sympathetic to those that think Gambit is too powerful, but let's stop acting like it's an unambiguous bad in the tier and that a lot of people wouldn't be upset if it was suddenly removed after failing to get banned in a suspect. Removing this thing from the tier would have massive implications, especially in a community that is already whining incessently about Gholdengo.
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maybe if the tier falls apart if gambit is banned, we should ban gambit and then put the parts back together
 
Finchinator said:
The SV OU tiering council is currently conducting a vote on one Pokemon that received high enough support in the tiering survey. Please note that we are not voting on any Pokemon with low survey scores or that did not get included as we continue to value your feedback within our process.

In addition, there is a likelihood that, regardless of the vote’s outcome, we enter a suspect in the aftermath of this vote and in the coming days. Stay tuned for more information as it becomes readily available.
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Ogerpon Hearthflame go bye bye

Have fun in Ubers firepon, I am sure it will find a niche on teams running Groudon or Koraidon, as it hits obnoxiously hard in Sun if it can get a trailblaze off
 
DynamaxBestMeta said:
Besides Turtonator (god only knows if that fat bastard is in), what even resists fire/grass and can strike back that isnt already ubers? You arent gonna swing in a dragonite and prematurely pop multiscale, right?
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Ability Shield Heatran, Ability Shield Ceruledge/Armarouge and Tera Grass Ability Shield Daschbun.

That’s the list. All invalidated by Knock Off.
 
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