Steelix


Steelix

Our favorite and only giant steel snake is back this gen with a few new toys at its disposal. This thread is dedicated to the discussion of its competitive merit.
Code:
[B]#208 Steelix[/B]
Typing: Steel / Ground
Ability 1:[INDENT]Rock Head
  Does not take recoil damage from moves that cause recoil. Does not apply to Life Orb.
[/INDENT][INDENT]Sturdy
  OHKO moves do not affect this pokemon. Additionally, this pokemon will always survive with at least 1HP when hit by any move at 100% health.
[/INDENT][INDENT]Encourage (Dream World)
  Moves that have secondary effects are increased in power but no longer cause their secondary effect.
[/INDENT]HP: 75
Atk: 85
Def: 200
SpA: 55
SDef: 65
Spd: 30

[B]Level-up Moves:[/B]
  Lv1: Thunder Fang
Lv1: Ice Fang
Lv1: Fire Fang
Lv1: Mud Sport
Lv1: Tackle
Lv1: Harden
Lv1: Bind
Lv6: Screech
Lv9: Rock Throw
Lv14: Rage
Lv17: Rock Tomb
Lv22: Strike Down
Lv25: Sandstorm
Lv30: Body Purge
Lv33: Slam
Lv38: Stealth Rock
Lv41: Dragonbreath
Lv46: Curse
Lv49: Iron Tail
Lv54: Crunch
Lv57: Double-Edge
Lv62: Stone Edge
   
Strike Down: Physical Rock PP:15 / Power: 50 / Acc: 100
Makes Flying types susceptible to Ground attacks.

Body Purge: Sharply raises speed.

[B]TM Moves: [/B]
  TM05 - Roar
TM06 - Toxic
TM10 - Hidden Power
TM11 - Sunny Day
TM12 - Taunt
TM15 - Hyper Beam
TM17 - Protect
TM21 - Frustration
TM23 - Strike Down
TM26 - Earthquake
TM27 - Return
TM28 - Dig
TM32 - Double Team
TM37 - Sandstorm
TM39 - Rock Tomb
TM41 - Torment
TM42 - Facade
TM44 - Rest
TM45 - Attract
TM48 - Troll
TM64 - Explosion
TM66 - Payback
TM68 - Giga Impact
TM69 - Rock Polish
TM71 - Stone Edge
TM74 - Gyro Ball
TM77 - Psych Up
TM78 - Smooth Over
TM80 - Rock Slide
TM82 - Dragon Tail
TM87 - Swagger
TM90 - Substitute
TM91 - Flash Cannon
TM94 - Rock Smash
HM01 - Cut
HM04 - Strength


   Dragon Tail: Physical Dragon PP: 10 / Power: 60 / Acc: 90
Forces the opponent to switch.

Smooth Over: Physical Ground PP: 20 / Power: 60 / Acc: 100
May decrease the opponent's speed by 1 level.

[B]Egg Moves:[/B]
Flail
Block
Defense Curl
Rollout
Rock Blast
Rock Climb
Heavy Bomber
Stealth Rock

Heavy Bomber: Physical Steel PP: 10 / Power: -- / Acc: 100
Power depends on user's weight.
Steelix has not changed significantly this generation, but it has, however, gotten a few toys to play with. Here's what's notable:
  • Sturdy Prevents Being OHKO'd by Any Attack
    This means that at 100%, it doesn't have to worry about investing in a great deal of special defense in order to survive a hit. It can if it wants to sponge special attacks, but it is essentially free to invest in other stats now. Furthermore, Steelix 4x resists SR, meaning that switching in will not break Sturdy's effects while running leftovers.
  • Encourage
    With this, Steelix's attacking power gains a much needed boost. Although the amount boosted is yet unknown, things like Elemental Fangs, Rock Slide, and Iron Tail gain a power boost.
  • New Attacks
    Heavy Bomber, Strike Down, and Dragon Tail fit wonderfully with Steelix's general role. Heavy Bomber looks set to make fantastic use of Steelix's massive weight, while Dragon Tail is especially handy for absorbing Outrages and Phazing dragons.
  • It's still slow as shit and dies to most special attacks and even some physical attacks now. Plus it's attacking capabilities are "lol Steelix."
    Not much needs to be explained here.
I do not envision Steelix's role changing much this generation. However, I do feel that he might have some viability in OU given some of the new options it has available.

Steelix @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SDef
Nature: Sassy (+SDef, -Spd)
~ Earthquake
~ Stealth Rock
~ Strike Down / Stone Edge
~ Explosion / Roar / Dragon Tail

All-purpose wall, SR user, and Phazer. I do not see this role changing much this gen.

Steelix @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
Nature: Brave (+Atk, -Spd)
~ Curse
~ Earthquake
~ Stone Edge
~ Explosion / Fire Fang / Gyro Ball / Heavy Bomber (depending on which is more powerful)

Curse Steelix makes a return, but with a couple of new toys to play with. Because he now has the cushion of Sturdy, he can forgo the SDef and instead max out on Atk. Max Atk with a boosting nature allows Steelix to OHKO LO Starmie after SR after a Curse. Stone Edge is for general coverage, whereas the last move depends on what you want to hit.

What do you think? Do the changes this gen allow Steelix to become viable in the main stage or will he remain UU?
 
I'm liking study - exploding on bulky waters if you have a good spinner. just like passho berry baitlix, except now you get an item. But encourage stone edge is awesome as well.
I'd rather use gyro ball rather than heavy bomber - even thought steelix is one of the heaviest pokemon, he's also one of the slowest, and most fully evolved mons are pretty heavy anyway while being fast.
 
Well, hi guys. Name is Syrachime, I'm a bit new to the forums, but not really so for Pokemon as I've been in it since Generation 1. I've been into competitive battling for almost two years now, so I'm pretty familiar with this stuff too.

But as for me, I'm really glad to see Steelix getting encourage/Sturdy being improved. With Encourage, the curse set gains some extra moves to use alongside earthquake and gyro ball (Providing heavy bomber doesn't replace it as the premier steel move.) Having an elemental fang though hitting almost as hard now as a flamethrower or ice beam? That's really good. Thanks to this ability, all of the secondary effect moves that Steelix gains are either up to or surpass a base power of 90... That's amazing...

I'm also seeing a unique Stealth Rock setter upper here with sturdy. Being unable to be OHKO by anything means that Steelix is guaranteed to set up stealth rock for your team. Adding to this the ability to have explosion makes him a good suicide lead. And along with either encourage or sturdy, Steelix can now run a pretty destructive Choice Band set (Better with encourage though.)

Unfortunately with these new toys, I don't think Steelix will make it to OU... As someone who really likes using Steelix often, I can safely say his weaknesses to may common moves, terrible speed, and weak special defense leaves a lot to be desired. But then again, he has gotten quite a boost since the last generation. And being the best counter to any outrage is a plus under his belt. Time will tell just where he ends up being.
 
I think Encourage -might- see some use on some Curselix. Keep in mind though, I have a good guess that Sturdy will remain the gold standard. It's that good now.

What I -really- like for Steelix is Dragon Tail though. This means it can still phaze without being taunted (I think.). Strike Down is also a godsend for the big lug, as it allows Steelix to use the much-better Ground STAB against Flying Pokemon. I'm not sure if it would work on Levitate or not, but if so, I don't see many sets that would choose Stone Edge over Strike Down.
 
Dragon tail makes steelix's day. Steelix is one of only 3 steels that learn dragon tail (the others being aggron and dialga), and supports the greatest defense of the 3. This makes him one of the best, if not the best, check to outrage abusers.

Although... its still a tough metagame for steelix to get into. Now that shadow tag shanderaa is possibly running around, he'll almost be forced to run shed shell to escape (though sturdy can help against the thing). Also, with the plethora of fighting types, and the almighty doryuuzu running around, his role as physical wall is questionable, as even these mighty defenses are starting to crumble in comparison to the sheer power thats now avaliable.
 

alphatron

Volt turn in every tier! I'm in despair!
If you're running Curselix, then most likely you're only running Encourage for crunch or the elemental fangs. Crunch getting the encourage boost is helpful for dealing with starmie and the water/ghost jellyfish specifically.

I honestly believe sturdy Steelix only works as a lead thanks to entry hazards. You also shouldn't try to phaaze with steelix since not many things are scared of him.
 
If you're running Curselix, then most likely you're only running Encourage for crunch or the elemental fangs. Crunch getting the encourage boost is helpful for dealing with starmie and the water/ghost jellyfish specifically.

I honestly believe sturdy Steelix only works as a lead thanks to entry hazards. You also shouldn't try to phaaze with steelix since not many things are scared of him.
I think you should phaze with Steelix because, even though it doesn't scare a lot of pokemons, there are stil a lot of them that can't scratch steelix either.
 
I disagree. I think that Steelix got horribly nerfed this generation. Explosion halved in power, everything got more powerful, heavy bomber is practically useless... only his abilities got any better. Sturdy doesn't seem that useful to me? How are you playing Steelix so that it's at full health? It doesn't have reliable recovery, and it's a tank, so it should be switching into moves... Encourage is the only real buff it got, so I guess it's rock slide is 1.3 times more powerful now, whoopeee. Sorry Steelix :(
 
It should be noted it was recently discovered Encourage pokemon can cancel out the recoil on Life Orb. So for a offensive Steelix its possible now to get a 1.6x boost to the elemental fangs + Crunch + Rock Slide from Encourage + LO. The catch is the recoil still takes effect if you use a non-Encourage boosted move like Earthquake. Its not implemented on PO but was confirmed to work this way in game.

But its hard not to see how Steelix won't be swept to the side thanks to the drill mole running around and everyone packing moves to work on it.
 

Deck Knight

Blast Off At The Speed Of Light! That's Right!
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Yeah, about Doryuuzu: It can't OHKO Steelix with Earthquake. People still seriously underestimate jut how massive Steelix's Defense is.

You need 252 HP / 16 Def to survive Adamant Choice Band Doryuuzu Earthquake 100% of the time with a Sassy Steelix.

Life Orb Jolly Doryuuzu does 67-78.5% damage to the same Steelix.

Baloon Jolly Doryuzu does 51-61% to the same Steelix.

A Steelix with 252 HP / 76 Defense and Impish avoids a 2HKO from Jolly Baloon Doryuuzu. By the same token, Jolly Choice Band Doryuuzu will fail to 2HKO such a Steelix with one Curse under its belt.

Unfortunately Steelix has trouble KOing back, so the standard Steelix will probably be Curselix. With no Investment a +1 Steelix Earthquake always OHKOs. A Fire Fang from no investment Sturdy Steelix does 34-40%, no investment Encourage Steelix does 43-52%.

No investment Life Orb Steelix OHKO's with Earthquake and 2HKO's with Encourage Fire Fang.
 
Well, with Block and Steelix's gargantuan defense, Steelix can make a good Torment Toxic staller

Name: Cock Blocked by Gary Oak
Steelix @ Leftovers
Nature: Sassy/ Careful
EVS: 252 HP/ 120 Att/ 4 Def/ 132 SpDef
~ Block
~ Torment/ Taunt
~ Toxic/ Substitute
~ Gyro Ball/ Earthquake/ Toxic/ Protect

Kind of a gimmick. Really no point in a phazing move considering you want your opponent to stay in anyway. It's pretty useful on pokemon with a recovery move or Regeneration, considering they can't simultaneously recover or switch out, or just stop all set up/ recovery moves with taunt, leaving you to slowly wear them down With a Protect + Toxic combo or with Earthquake/ Gyro Ball.
 
It should be noted it was recently discovered Encourage pokemon can cancel out the recoil on Life Orb. So for a offensive Steelix its possible now to get a 1.6x boost to the elemental fangs + Crunch + Rock Slide from Encourage + LO. The catch is the recoil still takes effect if you use a non-Encourage boosted move like Earthquake. Its not implemented on PO but was confirmed to work this way in game.

But its hard not to see how Steelix won't be swept to the side thanks to the drill mole running around and everyone packing moves to work on it.
Don´t forget Iron Tail:

100 BP * 1.3 LO * 1.3 Encourage * 1.5 STAB = 253.5 BP

That´s like firing (the now nerfed) Explosion without dying. Iron Tail accuracy sucks, though.
 
Assuming that Life Orb recoil is cancelled out by Encourage, the elemental fangs now have a base power of 104, Iron Tail 253.5 and Rock Slide 120.

The elemental fangs will give him a lot of coverage, and Iron Tail is gonna hit like a truck, even with that mediocre attack.
 
^Awesome!

Another possible strategy is using wrap to trap something in. (Hooray for gimmicks!)

On another note, Body Purge can raise its speed to outspeed, and potentially kill, counters, not to mention solving the Low Kick problem. And it gets screech, which could help it with killing things, especially when combo'd with Wrap to trap them in!

Also, sweeping steelix is almost as bad as breakable armor Onix.
 
I've been using a Steelix lead.
Sturdy
Impish
Leftovers
Evs Hp 136 Atk 120 Def 252
Earthquake
Taunt
Dragon Tail
Stealth Rock


Dragon Tail is so multiverse on a lead for steelix. People used Roar on him before so why not go with the one that can't be taunted. Speaking of taunt, when he is taunted to stop me from puttin up rocks, just dragon tail them out of there and then I can use my rocks. Also, a lot of stat abuser leads are showing up (Urgamoth) so the Butterfly dance I hit them with dragon tail and they wasted a turn.

Taunt just because it is taunt and the mischiveous fuzzball is everywhere. It is also to taunt a shedninja or blaziken so it can't batton pass and it is forced into struggle mode.

He has is issues. Water and fighting attacks but the water/ghost makes up for that with immunity to both. Most fire special attackers are 1hit ko from earthquake and sturdy makes sure it happens.

Espeon is a good check thanks to magic coat, especially coming off of a Uturn and Voltaros (eletric genie) is a pain. Hippowden has also been a problem lead for Steelix.

I want a rock recovery move if they come out with another generation and then Stellix will be amazing.
 
Is it really confirmed that encourage negates lo recoil? Because it sounds really cheesy to me.

How can sturdy be good? He's a tank, he's not supposed to get one-shotted, even by special attacks.

Encourage + rockslide gives you a stone edge with 10% more accuracy, which is very nice, since the low accuracy on stone edge is so annoying.
 
Is it really confirmed that encourage negates lo recoil? Because it sounds really cheesy to me.
Again...

Confirmed Encourage gives a 1.3x boost to moves that have a secondary effect on the opponent, but prevents that effect from occurring. Also stops Life Orb recoil from occurring for moves that gain the Encourage boost, but still gives the Life Orb boost. Does not apply to moves that have been given the flinch secondary effect by King's Rock. (Slipperjeans Afti, El Sargento)
 
^Awesome!

Another possible strategy is using wrap to trap something in. (Hooray for gimmicks!)

On another note, Body Purge can raise its speed to outspeed, and potentially kill, counters, not to mention solving the Low Kick problem. And it gets screech, which could help it with killing things, especially when combo'd with Wrap to trap them in!

Also, sweeping steelix is almost as bad as breakable armor Onix.
Wrapping the opponent is quite a good idea, considering all residual damage counts in the end. Dig is also very good with Steelix because, with the opponent unable to switch, and if you have wrap and toxic, you can Toxic and wrap stall one turn and hit them with the attack too.. it's can be a viable option for stalling, and screech does increase the damage of a rather inferior Dig.
 
Wrapping the opponent is quite a good idea, considering all residual damage counts in the end. Dig is also very good with Steelix because, with the opponent unable to switch, and if you have wrap and toxic, you can Toxic and wrap stall one turn and hit them with the attack too.. it's can be a viable option for stalling, and screech does increase the damage of a rather inferior Dig.
Personally, I would rather go with Zapdos or Skarmory using Freefall with that combo. At least the bird can roost for stalling purposes. A toxic, Roost, Freefall, thunderbolt set with Zapdos would be pretty fun.
 
I disagree. I think that Steelix got horribly nerfed this generation. Explosion halved in power, everything got more powerful, heavy bomber is practically useless... only his abilities got any better. Sturdy doesn't seem that useful to me? How are you playing Steelix so that it's at full health? It doesn't have reliable recovery, and it's a tank, so it should be switching into moves... Encourage is the only real buff it got, so I guess it's rock slide is 1.3 times more powerful now, whoopeee. Sorry Steelix :(
I think Sturdy is a great ability on Steelix. I just think people need to look at Steelix from a different perspective before dismissing that ability.

Steelix generally isn't going to survive more than 2 hits against respectable special attackers unless it switches in on a resistance and if it has significant investment. With Sturdy, you don't need to worry about investing in Special Defense, and instead you can focus more on what Steelix is actually good at, which is physical tanking and to a lesser extent physical attacking.
 
Personally, I would rather go with Zapdos or Skarmory using Freefall with that combo. At least the bird can roost for stalling purposes. A toxic, Roost, Freefall, thunderbolt set with Zapdos would be pretty fun.
It would be a good combo, but considering Steelix forces the opponent to stay in with Wrap/Block, you can stall until the opponent's pokemon gets Toxic/Dig KO'd, but the birds do get Roost, so I guess it's a matter of preferance.
 
It would be a good comb, but considering Steelix forces the opponent to stay in with Wrap/Block, you can stall until the opponent's pokemon gets Toxic/Dig KO'd, but the birds do get Roost, so I guess it's a matter of preferance.
Zapdos also has pressure, which is undoubtedly awesome for stall.
 

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