Ladder STABmons [OMotM November]

Hey thanks The Ruins of Alpha for spotlighting Bad STABmons! I really enjoy this format and I'll share my feelings on viability below.

Overall, Bad STABmons is much kinder to other playstyles. Stall, semi-stall, and bulky offense are way better here, while hyper offense is nerfed to an extent because there are some really potent defensive cores that can be difficult to break if you don't prepare.

I'll just kinda list what I think are top offensive & defensive threats with some arbitrary pseudo rank attached to them.

In order of BST:

Offense


One of my favorite Pokemon in this format, Doublade sports a fantastic typing and a behemoth Defense with Eviolite and as such it's one of the best FakeSpeed checks, but it's primarily used as an offensive threat. With the No Guard ability, Doublade has a perfectly accurate STAB Iron Tail with a cool 30% chance to drop the target's Defense, which puts pressure on walls. It also usually carries Sacred Sword and Shadow Sneak and the last slot can be Swords Dance, Pursuit, Gear Grind, Bullet Punch, King's Shield, or Shadow Claw.
==Probable Rank==> A


Kecleon sports a solid base 90 Attack and access to a lot of priority, which mitigates that awful Speed. Generally it's used as a FakeSpeeder but what sets it apart from things like Rufflet and Raticate is its access to STAB Knock Off to punish Doublade, STAB Fire Punch to hit Ferroseed, and STAB Ice Punch to savage Gligar. While it can't run them all with FakeSpeed, it can cater its set based on your team needs quite well, making it extremely versatile.
==Probable Rank==> A/A+


Rotom is one of the faster attackers in the metagame, tying with threats such as Murkrow and Chatot, the latter of which it checks well, or outspeeding everything with a Scarf attached, which allows it to revenge the plethora of birds in the tier. Most notably it provides a fast answer to Rufflet and unlike Doublade can keep up the momentum for your team quite well. Besides running Scarf it does double status + Hex well.
==Probable Rank==> B+/A-


Sneasel is basically doing what Weavile does in regular STABmons with a notable buff in Speed, as it's the third fastest Pokemon after Swellow and Dugtrio (and ties with Persian but no one besides wishes uses that). Any combination of Knock Off, Icicle Crash, Ice Shard, Pursuit, Parting Shot, Swords Dance, and Low Kick work. Use it to revenge birds and Rotom and to scare off Doublade and Gligar.
==Probable Rank==> A-


One of the best wallbreakers in the format, Hustle Zweilous hits really, really hard. Usually carrying a Choice Band or running Eviolite to ease setup with Dragon Dance, it's truly a threat to watch out for, as not much in the metagame can stomach its Dark / Dragon STAB and Superpower. It doesn't even need a move for Fairies because most of the time the raw power of its attacks allows it to muscle past them regardless. It's held back by a bad base 58 Speed, but with +1 under its belt, it can actually outspeed a fair amount of Pokemon.
==Probable Rank==> B+


Bad STABmon's "Ursaring", if only because of Guts. The nice thing about this FakeSpeeder is its access to U-turn to pivot out of Gligar, Doublade, and Ferroseed. It hits a tad bit weaker than Guts Swellow but it isn't held back by a crippling Stealth Rock weakness, which for FakeSpeeders, is a real pain.
==Probable Rank==> B+


Servine is identical to its evolved counterpart in every way with the exception of a worse Speed tier. Still, 83 is usable. Like Serperior, Servine spams Contrary Leaf Storm and uses Spore to disable its checks and counters. It doesn't have Dragon Pulse, but it doesn't really need it. The choice between Hidden Power usually falls down to Fire for Ferrothorn or Rock for Togetic and Fletchinder. It's fairly one-dimensional but don't underestimate it in the slightest.
==Probable Rank==> A


Chatot is one of the few viable Boomburst spammers in the format, which is a nice change of pace for players annoyed by the prevalence of Sylveon in regular STABmons. In Bad STABmons, Chatot acts like a pseudo Thundurus with a set of Taunt, Nasty Plot, Boomburst, and Oblivion Wing. There's also Heat Wave for coverage but that's really only needed for Doublade and a +2 Oblivion Wing is still going to do a large chunk. Substitute sets can work without Boomburst or a Choiced set with Hurricane in there somewhere. Remember: Chatter is banned, even on Chatot.
==Probable Rank==> A-


Don't laugh but Pupitar is a potent threat if you underestimate its potential. While its defensive merits look appealing, what makes it scary is access to Dragon Dance, Rest, Diamond Storm, and Precipice Blades and the ability Shed Skin while holding an Eviolite. Rock typing ensures it can't be revenged by FakeSpeed easily if at all. It also makes a nice offensive hazard stacker. With Rest it's probably the best Fletchinder counter out there.
==Probable Rank==> B/B+


RoA already mentioned how dangerous Bibarel is but it bears repeating. If the opponent doesn't have a Ferroseed, Quagsire, Shedinja, or Doublade or their own faster FakeSpeeder, it might as well be GG. Bibarel can run a 4th move to beat all those checks, however: Superpower, Grass Judgment, Pluck, Ghost/Ground Judgment, and Protect. Besides Swords Dance it also can run Curse, Growth, and Acupressure, making it hard to prepare for.
==Probable Rank==> A/A+


Combusken may be short on variety but what it does it does superbly well. A set of Protect / Swords Dance / V-create / High Jump Kick or Drain Punch threatens nearly every wall, leaving only Quagsire, Gligar, and Thick Fat Azumarill able to switch in safely. There's some wiggle room with things like Substitute, Baton Pass, and a less detrimental Fire STAB if necessary.
==Probable Rank==> A+/S


Dugtrio is the second fastest Pokemon and it's able to trap and eliminate a ton of threats for your team. It's very frail and prone to being revenged, but if it's able to remove an Audino or a weakened Quagsire, it's done its job. It can also throw out Spikes in between kills or from behind a sub, making it a good stacker too.
==Probable Rank==> A-/A


Don't let its low BST fool you: Frogadier is a top-metagame threat. It boasts a nice 97 Speed, allowing it to revenge kill a lot of the metagame quite comfortably. Access to moves such as Steam Eruption, Ice Beam, Dark Pulse, Hidden Power Fire, and Grass Knot puts a ton of pressure on opposing teams. Plus it has utility moves such as Toxic Spikes and U-turn to abuse switches. It's really good but it can be held back by a lack of power, as 83 Special Attack isn't always enough to muscle past fatmons like Audino and Togetic.
==Probable Rank==> A+


Bad STABmons' other Thundurus, Murkrow can use its Taunt + Nasty Plot set to shut down stall teams with ease and plow through them with Oblivion Wing and Dark Pulse or Night Daze. And in true Thundurus fashion, Murkrow also has the potential to be wholly physical too with Dragon Ascent and Knock Off. Prankster is typically preferred so it can Parting Shot and Taunt with priority, but Insomnia is a viable option to check Servine.
==Probable Rank==> B+/A-


While Togetic excels at playing support roles, it's also a huge offensive threat you have to watch out for. It has two very good abilities in Serene Grace and Super Luck and access to Nasty Plot, Oblivion Wing / Air Slash, and Moonblast plus Fire Blast for coverage. Thanks to the Eviolite item, it's absurdly bulky and can use that bulk to set up on most of the metagame with ease. It can even tank most FakeSpeed attempts and retaliate with a powerful move of its own.
==Probable Rank==> S


The format's best Belly Drummer, Munchlax is very similar to Snorlax but here it's even bulkier and harder to crack. Besides the common BellySpeed combo, Munchlax can also set up with Curse + Normal recovery move of choice or just use Swords Dance. Fire Punch is helpful to eliminate Ferroseed and Earthquake hits Doublade hard. As a standard FakeSpeeder it can run Pursuit to catch fleeing foes.
==Probable Rank==> A-


Another low BST, high viability Pokemon, Fletchinder is a standard on most teams and for good reason! STAB Dragon Ascent allows it to revenge kill a lot of the frail offensive threats in the metagame and unlike some other birds it has a SE STAB to punish Doublade with. Sacred Fire makes for a solid secondary attack, but some even go full-blown V-create for wallbreaking. Swords Dance turns it into a formidable sweeper and Taunt with or without Will-O-Wisp helps it break down walls such as Quagsire and Gligar that try to check it.
==Probable Rank==> A+


It's not a common sight but Cranidos is a real terror that can take a lot of people off guard, especially when its equipped with a Choice Scarf. Diamond Storm gets the boost from Sheer Force, making it slightly weaker than Head Smash but without that nasty recoil and with better accuracy. Fire Punch, Earthquake, and Pursuit or even Ice Beam are options to round out its arsenal. But really, it just spams Diamond Storm.
==Probable Rank==> B+


Hustlet is the most unreliable revenge killer in Bad STABmons but it's also the strongest by far. When it does hit, things die. FakeSpeed is its bread and butter, plus it's got Dragon Ascent, Superpower, and Shadow Claw to round out coverage. If it's not running FakeSpeed, it probably has a Choice Band, which does the same as FakeSpeed but all in one turn instead of two, thus limiting Leftovers recovery and ignoring Protect's attempt to burn Fake Out.
==Probable Rank==> A


Defense


Liepard isn't a wall by any means, but it's a valuable utility Pokemon thanks to Prankster Parting Shot, Taunt, and Thunder Wave. And while Murkrow can do these things too and has solid recovery, Liepard doesn't take as much Stealth Rock damage, hits a bit harder, and doesn't rely on its item nearly as much. It has a good mixture of offense and utility, but it's the utility that most people use it for.
==Probable Rank==> A-


Bad STABmon's pink blob. Audino is really good here with its unrivaled natural bulk on both defenses and the ability Regenerator, which allows it to pass Wishes or utilize Baton Pass extremely well. (Think of Stockpile or Swords Dance stuff.) It can't do much back but at least Boomburst has a high base power. Other utility options include Glare, Heal Bell, Toxic, Rapid Spin, and Knock Off.
==Probable Rank==> A/A+


Quagsire alone invalidates so many physical threats that it should always be considered when building a well-rounded Bad STABmons team. You'll often see it with a status move like Toxic or Scald (or both), Recover, Ground coverage, and then maybe Spikes, Protect, or even Curse. It's boring. It's predictable. But you have to plan for it somehow or you won't get anywhere in this format.
==Probable Rank==> A+/S


Gligar is a lot like Landorus-T here and often runs hazard support sets with either Defog or Stealth Rock / Spikes. Roost ensures it can stick around to wall physical attackers throughout the match and U-turn helps it keep up the momentum. Flying STAB is rare but Earthquake or even Precipice Blades give it an offensive bite when needed. Immunity keeps it free of Poison, but Toxic isn't too common except on other walls, which it can't really beat.
==Probable Rank==> A-/A


As Huge Power is banned, Azumarill must run either Sap Sipper or Thick Fat, and both abilities are good for this format. Sap Sipper lets it wall all variants of Servine and Ferroseed while spinning any hazards. With Thick Fat it can stomach Combusken's onslaught and tank all of Sneasel's attacks with ease. Water / Fairy / Normal moves grants it access to a list of goodies such as the aforementioned Rapid Spin plus Recover, Heal Bell, Glare, Baton Pass, Scald, and other standbys like Knock Off.
==Probable Rank==> B/B+


Sure, it can be a special sweeper, but it's unmatched when it comes to defensive support due to its amazing defensive typing and huge bulk with Eviolite. Defog, Roost, Moonblast, and a filler move such as Oblivion Wing or Thunder Wave is a pretty standard set. It pairs excellently with Quagsire, taking any Grass moves directed toward Quagsire and sending Rock, Electric, Poison, and Steel back. TogeSire can be quite hard to crack and forms probably the best defensive core in all of Bad STABmons.
==Probable Rank==> S


Porygon is another pre-evo that functions quite similarly to its evolved form. Like Porygon2, Porygon can abuse Download + Baton Pass well and even take advantage of the boosts for itself with Boomburst and Extreme Speed. It will have Recover to stay around longer and sometimes Glare to slow things down to a more manageable speed.
==Probable Rank==> B+/A-


With its Steel typing, Mawile makes an excellent Bird check, and now has Moonlight to regain health throughout the match. Stealth Rock is pretty common on any Mawile set to keep those pesky birds at bay even more and if needed it can attack with moves such as Play Rough and Gear Grind.
==Probable Rank==> B+


There are other good Grass Pokemon capable of playing supportive roles such as Tangela, Amoonguss, and Pumpkaboo, but with Ferroseed around, there's really no point in using them because Ferroseed offers so much utility in one Pokemon. It has access to two hazards plus Leech Seed to dissuade switch-ins. King's Shield or Spiky Shield help it water down foes or ramp up the chip damage, respectively. When it comes to attacking Ferroseed is weak, but Gyro Ball can be used to punish faster foes such as Servine, which otherwise has little to fear from Ferroseed.
==Probable Rank==> A


Shedinja can be dead weight if not played correctly, but with the right support it can shut down a ton of threats all by itself. Unfortunately most of the offensive threats listed above have moves that hit through Wonder Guard so in some matches it's relegated to just checking FakeSpeed. It makes a nice hazard stacker with Sticky Web and Spikes and can spread burns and pivot out of trouble with Baton Pass.
==Probable Rank==> B-/B


There are lots of other viable threats, both offensive and defensive, that aren't covered above. Some include Tinted Lens Noctowl, Swellow, Simple Swoobat, Magcargo, Sheer Force Croconaw, Mantyke, Corsola, Clamperl, Yanma, Lickitung, Krokorok, and Pawniard (and more!). This format is still really unexplored, so if you ever want to try it out, join the Neon Town room on Pokemon Showdown!
Have to agree, bad stabmons is a lot of fun. I'm fond of Lampent, Simple Swoobat, and Corsola, but that's more due to my weird team building.
Side note- wouldn't mawile want meteor mash, or is that's an intimidate set? I've had a lot of fun with the former.
 

EV

Banned deucer.
Let's talk about Acupressure.

If you're unfamiliar with the move, Acupressure, a Normal move, gives a random stat (including accuracy and evasion) a +2 modifier. It's commonly used on bulky Pokemon such as Chansey, Porygon2, or Sylveon before being Baton Passed away to a teammate. Recipients can be a Pokemon with Stored Power, something immune to phazing, or just about anything that can hit hard. Espeon and Mega Slowbro are a few examples.

But what about Baton Pass clause? Technically you can bypass the clause because Acupressure is random and thus not affected by the team builder checkpoint.

One might say, "Just ban the move in conjunction with Baton Pass," but that doesn't stop Pokemon like P2 and Sylveon from benefitting from the boosts themselves, and there's always Simple Bibarel, Sing Mega Pidgeot, and Stored Power Espeon or Meloetta that don't need to receive anything via Baton Pass and can boost for themselves.

The move is luck based and there are strategies that beat it (Taunt, WW, Roar, Topsy, Haze, Perish Song, Destiny Bond, Heart Swap, an early Toxic, Mirror Coat, Metal Burst, etc). Are these counter strategies common and viable enough to balance out a fairly rare, high risk, high reward strategy like Acupressure? You tell me.

Here's a replay of Chansey boosting and passing. The opponent was ill prepared, but it gives you a general idea on how it works http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/stabmons-442391774

The Ruins of Alpha is a frequent user of this strategy as well and might be able to lend some insight into how it's beaten.
 

Josh

=P
is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
He literally just stayed in and let it freely boost, not to mention his team had no chansey checks in the first place. If you're going to showcase a strategy make it against people who are at least half competent please.

As for my views on the "strategy"? Gimmicky at best, if you're suggesting it's even close to ban worthy I find that laughable.
 

EV

Banned deucer.
He literally just stayed in and let it freely boost, not to mention his team had no chansey checks in the first place. If you're going to showcase a strategy make it against people who are at least half competent please.

As for my views on the "strategy"? Gimmicky at best, if you're suggesting it's even close to ban worthy I find that laughable.
"The opponent was ill prepared, but it gives you a general idea on how it works."

Read next time. The replay wasn't meant to showcase it beating a good team. It was meant to show how the strategy is applied.

We already take steps to curb stat passing that involves Speed. This move is also like having Moody but without the negative drops. Both things are banned. Think about it.
 
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Josh

=P
is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
I did read. That's not a good representation of how it works. In a battle, that is nothing like it will play out. After you reveal acupressure any half competent player will switch into something that deals with chansey and stops the boosts from getting out of hand. If you want to show me a general idea on how it works then show me an example of a battle where it defeats a decent opponent, or at least puts in work. Defeating low ladder kids with a gimmick doesn't convince anyone of that gimmicks viability. Also, this is majorly different from moody. Moody gives you passive boosts and you can keep up offensive pressure at the same time. You can stall moody boosts with protect. Moody is not stopped by taunt. Moody can not be encored. They're incomparable. Banning it in conjunction with Baton Pass has some merit I /guess/ but your original post suggested it's still too powerful on its own. And at that point you're getting too ban happy, it's no less competitive than sing, confuse ray, etc.
 

drampa's grandpa

cannonball
is a Community Contributoris a Community Leader Alumnus
I should have been saving more :( these aren't very good just one tour, but its a sample.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/stabmons-441660570 In which I lose
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/stabmons-441656688 In which I win without Acupressure (why did I even include this? for completeness's sake.)
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/stabmons-441644937 smh a Dewgong (without Encore)
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/stabmons-441638368 A good example of what Acupressure can do v an unprepared team (Pummygotato comes in, sees what I'm using, and still doesn't bring Encore Dewgong to the next match???)


I'm going to say this right now: Acupressure hasn't shown itself to be broken. The current meta seems to be kind to it, because rip based taunt user and set-up sweeper Thunderous.

There are definitely easy counters to Acupressure spam. Transform Chansey shut me down 100% yesterday, but running Sub stops this. Phazing and Topsy-Turvy are both nasty, although Baton Passing into a Magic Bouncer can mess this up (sableye is nice as a counter because they need to predict when you will switch to sab, not just bp when they see it). Unaware? Mold Breaker and Stored Power got yo back. Toxic has not been a huge problem for me, because nobody is running Toxic.
I feel like most of these counters dont show up too frequently, and I'm no expert so I won't comment on their viability otherwise. However I think that it's an important thing to consider.

I'm wavering on whether or not it's uncompetitive. I've gotten matches where a first turn evasion boost has won me everything, the opponent has literally not been able to hit. I've gotten first turns where the opponent has forfeited because of a certain boost I've gotten (usually, again evasion). I also really don't like that you can circumvent the baton pass clause so easily.

Don't forget that a team should be able to function with only the five other members for a good portion on the match. If your team only functions with Acupressure-pass your team is bad. So you can lure out and break their counter, which is usually obvious, then set up freely, pass to your sweeper / wallbreaker of choice, and win. The best users of this move usually function well otherwise, so it WONT BE OBVIOUS FROM TEAM PREVIEW WHAT YOU'RE DOING, unless everyone starts using this, which they shouldn't, its a luck based strategy.

The thing to remember is that isnt "use this and win". This is something that puts the game in the hands of the rng. Porygon-2, the only mon I've used with it so far, is bulky enough to take hits, and you're potentially boosting your survivability all the time through evasion, defense, and special defense boosts. Once you're boosted enough, what's killing you? Poison types toxic? Woops, I have a sub. Or I just pass what I have.

Also: Want to use this strategy in standard? Fear not! Based Dodrio and Medicham are here to save the day. Don't use Smeargle for this it's bad

Edit: Thought I might as well dump my team here is http://pastebin.com/PCSJPuAv
 
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AquaticPanic

Intentional Femboy Penguin
is a Community Leaderis a Community Contributor
Community Leader
Tbh Accupressure Stored Power Magic Bounce Espeon is the only thing I can see being good with accupressure (Although it's still gimmic). The rest... Maybe Bibarel but meh. Espeon at the least won't get taunted/forced to switch and will get STAB Stored Power (I don't even know what would be it's bp if somehow you get your stats maxed out, but it would pretty much OHKO any non-dark type. To finish the gimmic go Miracle Eye or whatever.)
 


dugtrio. god this thing is annoying. with the controversy surrounding its placement in ou, i decided to mess around in stabmons with it. here's the set i've been running:

Dugtrio @ Focus Sash
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Screech
- Reversal
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge

really helpful alongside sylveon, and i've been running baton pass on sylveon to help bring it in. it's a neat strategy and it's surprisingly better than i'd originally thought!
 
I think this set is a lot better.
Code:
Dugtrio @ Focus Sash
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Naive Nature / Hasty Nature
IVs: 21 HP / 0 Def / 0 SpD
- Substitute
- Screech
- Earthquake
- Reversal
Sub makes the chansey matchup a LOT better, since you don't get glared, toxic'd, or xformed into. It's also useful against sucker punch TTar/Bisharp. I've tried Stone Edge, but it doesn't really help dug trap anything except Volcarona. I've also tried SR, spikes, memento, precipice, and sucker, but didn't find many of them to be that useful. Hazards are tough to stack when you have no bulk, sucker does no damage at all, precipice is better at killing TTar, but can lose you the game if it misses, while EQ is guaranteed to chunk TTar for like 75, and memento isn't as useful with most of the big boosting moves nerfed. Obviously it's still a good option if you're trying to sweep with whatever setup sweeper, but whimsicott seems like a better user to me. The IVs give you 201 HP, which leaves you at 1 after 4 subs or 2 STosses, and the min defenses ensures you get down to 1 for reversal. Hasty and Naive are pretty comparable with 35/50/70 defenses. Naive gives you less bulk overall, but Hasty gives you an easier time if you accidentally get xformed into.

Good partners that I've used it with are M-Pidgeot, Scizor, Latios, Sylveon, M-Diancie, and volturners in general.
 
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Pokémon Analysis #1: Excadrill

Excadrill, the Subterrene Pokemon, resides in the lowly ranking of B+ currently. With an unimpressive stat spread bar its HP and Attack, the prominence of both Keldeo and Landorus-T, and the decline of Sand usage as opposed to OU, everyone's favorite mole isn't seen too often. Furthermore, Excadrill faces competition in a lot of aspects from specific Pokemon. Entry hazard removal from Landorus-T, offensive Steel-type from Mega Scizor and so on and so forth. However, Excadrill is an incredibly potent Pokemon which I've found myself using a ton recently. Here's what it's got to offer.
Aspects of Excadrill
Excadrill gains access to a plethora of viable moves by virtue of its solid typing. From this, Excadrill can draw into its arsenal moves such as Gear Grind, Precipice Blades, King's Shield, and even Bullet Punch. This can turn Excadrill into either an offensive powerhouse, or a niche defensive Pokemon that loves the omnipresence of Sylveon.

Excadrill's Sets

From what I've explored, Choice Band, Life Orb, and Leftovers are the three items Excadrill should run. Each one with a blend of its wide movepool. Choice Band sets should run Bullet Punch / Iron Head / Precipice Blades / [Rapid Spin / Return / Rock Slide]; Life Orb sets should run Rapid Spin / Iron Head / Precipice Blades / [Swords Dance / Bullet Punch / Stealth Rock]; and Leftovers sets should run Stealth Rock / Rapid Spin / [Iron Head / Earthquake] / [Toxic / King's Shield / whichever move not chosen from the former bracket]. My personal favorite is the Defensive Leftovers set. Countering Aerodactyl and Sylveon in one set is heat, and it isn't something you see very often. Furthermore, it acts as an excellent check to Mega Lopunny and other Extreme Speed abusers.

Excadrill's Impact on the Metagame

Excadrill does not have a significant impact, truthfully. With Landorus-T keeping every single set in check, teams don't have to overly prepare for Excadrill. However, it's still a very promising threat that has just yet to gain traction.

Despite not having much traction, Excadrill is an excellent Pokemon that I encourage you all to try out!
 
Fun with graphs!



Really shows how odd things are. Heatran dropping constantly then rising; Sylveon steadily rising then falling, Mega Lopunny slowly falling, Lando-T jumping everywhere, and Keldeo taking a bouncy ride to the top. How do you guys think this ties in with metagame trends?
 

thesecondbest

Just Kidding I'm First
Another mon on the way to the top is MPidge, going from 2.4 to 2.8 to now 5.45 percent. When September's usage stats come out, expect to see it even higher.
 

Funbot28

Banned deucer.
Ya I really been enjoying Mega Pidgeot as of late due to sleep being so useful when breaking down walls that like to switch into Pidg such as Sylveon, Rotom-W, Tyranitar, anmd Porygon 2. Normal/Flying with Fire coverage is simply amazing offensively as it mostly covers all types besides Rock-types. I think this explains the decline of Mega Lopunny usage as I feel players are realising that Lopunny is not the only good fakespeeder to use and often switch to other Normals such as Stoutland and Urasaring for that role to conserve their mega slot in order to use other great megas such as Scizor, Blastoise, and Sceptile (honestly Sceptile is extremely underrated as well). The spike in Sylveon also does not really surprise me as well since the cleric set with Rapid Spin is just too splashable and effective not to use really, while offensive Sylv still is and will always remain to be extremely threatening. Im also surprised that Keldeo is not being used more often as well since Specs Water Spout has practically no switchins and is so good at breaking down those balance teams with ease. I suspect Aerodactyl will be joining the top tier threats in usage as well due to the CB set probs being the best wallbreaker atm and teams often relying solely on Lando-T and Ferrothorn as switchins (which they are not btw). Mega Venasaur is also a great anti-meta threat atm since it counters two of the biggest threats atm in Sylveon and Keldeo so easily and can also apply pressure to the opposing team with strong Seed Flare's and Spore support.

Excadrill is a cool mon that I should try to start using as well too. I remember using Mold Breaker Choice Band back in the Thundurus-I meta and it wrecked stuff so easily with Gear Grind and Precipice Blades dear lord. It is also is a hazard remover that is not weak to Pursuit which is alwaus nice. Dugtrio is also amazing when paired with Mega Pidgeot and Sylveon in order to remove Rock and Steel types respectively, which really helps tremendously at times.

Acupressure Bibarel is stupid too ;)
 

thesecondbest

Just Kidding I'm First
Yeah, completely agree. The latest team I was using for stabmons was sing/sub/owing/boomburst mpidge with arena trap duggy to kill tran and Judgement fire sylv to lure ferro. Then I also had lord aerodactyl. Had a fiar bit of success with it, getting up to 1400+. Obviously it can use a few tweaks, but those three mons synergize very well.
 

EV

Banned deucer.
Another mon on the way to the top is MPidge, going from 2.4 to 2.8 to now 5.45 percent. When September's usage stats come out, expect to see it even higher.
About 10%. Not bad.

Also the threatlist in post 2 is updated! Sableye jumped up into the top 20 again. Not really sure why when it gets dicked around by Sylveon and Mega Lop and can't switch into most of the top threats. Any ideas?
 

Lcass4919

The Xatu Warrior
because its mega sableye. literally the god of stall, stallbreaking, and checking offensive threats with burns. mega lop and sylv DO beat it. but to say its "shit" is literally one of the most incorrect terms one could give it. not to mention, sylv itself isnt nearly as good, since people actually prepare for it now. and overpreparation really curbstomps its viability (which is probably the reason why sylv, heatran, and keld all alternate viability.) oh, sylv is more common...gotta use heatran more...oh, heatrans used more, gotta use keldeo. heatrans so common, gotta use sylv less. sylvs used less, gotta use heatran less, heatrans used less, gotta use keldeos less. and so on.

people just cry over losing dark void. and use that as an exuse to say sab is bad. when sableye was literally suspected to be banned in OU and lost via 53/47 ban no ban ratio(not meeting 60%, rightfully so) iirc. its def not banworthy. but other then sylveon and lop, who dislike switching into sab due to burns, and clefable, it really doesnt have ANY checks or counters. people just rely on nuking it until its dead or running clef/sylv. calling a mon with EVERY tool a bulky mon crys for "bad" is a crutial mistake, and vastly makes up for its less then stellar hp.

mega sab doesnt switch into threats. thats just not what its for. its made to spread burns, block status, and annoy the opponent with its presence. lets look at a common list of pokemon in viability rankings (down to A rank) who fear mega sableye(or pre mega burns) who are common in stabmons:
landorus-t, aerodactyl, scizor,azu(yes, azu)garchomp, terrakion, tyranitar, braviary, gyarados,weavile fears pre-mega burns (basically meaning sab gets a free burn on these mons/scares them out so it can parting shot without mega evolving giving you initiative)
and these mons actually fear mega sableye: ferrothorn, klefki, slowbro(and mega), rotom-wash, porygon 2, gengar, chansey, latias-mega, slowking, mega venusaur.

just looking at s-a rankings, it matches up well vs over half the metagame in a lead scenario, and its general utility is just stupid good with bounce and wisp. its not as good as it is in OU due to sylvs overpopularity, among its usual problems, but for someone to say only low ladderers use it is just horribly wrong.
 

EV

Banned deucer.
Lcass4919 , megas are tracked separately. The stats are for regular Sableye specifically. Mega Sableye is...
| 52 | Sableye-Mega | 3.01219% | 191 | 2.536% | 161 | 2.882% |
 

lost heros

Meme Master
About 10%. Not bad.

Also the threatlist in post 2 is updated! Sableye jumped up into the top 20 again. Not really sure why when it gets dicked around by Sylveon and Mega Lop and can't switch into most of the top threats. Any ideas?
Priority parting shot and will-o-wisp. It can very easily steal momentum away from your opponent's sweep and help your team set up. Sylveon is probably its biggest threat that could stop it from doing its job of lowering the opposing foe's stats and potentially giving your Pokémon a free turn. Mega Lopunny can sorta do the same but it's weaker and despises switching in on Will-o-wisp.
 

Lcass4919

The Xatu Warrior
Lcass4919 , megas are tracked separately. The stats are for regular Sableye specifically. Mega Sableye is...
| 52 | Sableye-Mega | 3.01219% | 191 | 2.536% | 161 | 2.882% |
wait what. people seriously use regular sab MORE then mega? its literally tjhe same set but with benefits of changing to bounce midway through battle.
 

EV

Banned deucer.


I banned Acupressure. There was no reason to use this move other than to fish for evasion boosts, thus bypassing the Evasion Clause. Bibarel was the worst offender of this strategy, being able to rack up +4 boosts for itself or Passing them off to a sweeper like Espeon. Other users included Chansey, which also Passed, or any Normal type. The move was a scam. Truly, honestly.

Bibarel is banned completely in Bad STABmons because Simple is just too good there. Also, thanks to the new custom banlist feature, we're able to host Bad STABmons tours in Neon Town.
 
All Pokemon to have graced top 10 in usage:
  • Aeordactyl
  • Altaria-M
  • Azumarill
  • Chansey
  • Charizard
  • Clefable
  • Cloyster
  • Diggersby
  • Ferrothorn
  • Garchomp
  • Gyarados
  • Heatran
  • Hoopa-U
  • Keldeo
  • Kyurem-B
  • Landorus-T
  • Lopunny-M
  • Porygon-Z
  • Sableye
  • Scizor
  • Scizor-M
  • Stoutland
  • Sylveon
  • Talonflame
  • Thundurus
  • Thundurus
  • Togekiss
  • Tyranitar
  • Ursaring
  • Whimsicott
Here's a graph of their usage fluctuating up until now, from November 2014:



and the raw data:



You may have to zoom in. This took me about four hours to create, so I hope you find it as fascinating as I do! Blank spaces mean the Pokemon was unreleased or banned in that month. Let me know what you guys think! If you have any specific Pokemon you want to see, let me know. Here's Eevee:



Made it with just straight, not curved. Curved looks nicer to me imo, but for short ones it's nicer to have straight. Could've also put zero in March and August but didn't since it didn't need to have zeros.

Yeah! Discuss. :>
 

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