Smogon Premier League XIV - Commencement Thread

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Crunchman

Banned deucer.
As an objective spectator (even though I signed up for SPL I don’t play any of the meta games so I promise I’m not coping) I have to say that this SPL draft looked pretty bad. Not like bad bad but for Smogon’s “most prestigious tournament” I expect more. Everyone has been talking about whether or not newcomers are having chances or not and honestly I don’t think that matters. SPL is meant to be an elite tour and should feature the best players on the site - whether that be veterans who have proven themselves in past editions or new players with spectacular results. I don’t have any beef with anyone who got drafted or was a manager aside from this observation. This SPL draft looked more like OUPL or any other sub forum tour - everyone is a good player, but it lacks the eliteness you expect out of an official team tournament. I honestly can’t say why, maybe having 12 slots over 10 slots contributed to a decline in the average quality of players but lots of big names new and old were shafted in this edition; I won’t bother naming them because most have already been mentioned in this thread. I understand that there is an increased builder pressure as well and lots of builders have been picked up. It’s important to remember that builders can be picked up for free and players can’t; the most exceptional builders warrant a pickup but most are strong players in their own right already. If a promising new builder is not ready to compete in SPL they can make the exact same impact as an out of team support and managers with connections (ie all SPL managers) should be able to procure the help of competent builders with ease. On the other hand a high level player without building experience or skill can develop so much more getting drafted and can contribute practically nothing undrafted. The bias towards builders is unnecessary, takes away chances to see raw players in action, and hinders the development of players for whom their game is their primary focus.

Finally, yes, SPL is a team tour, yes it’s enjoyed with friends. But for the spectator who wants to see the greatest players on the site and for the competitor who wants to play the best Smogon has to offer, SPL has a responsibility to stay elite and the managers part in upholding this responsibility is to ensure elite players at SPL level are drafted. Just as important as team chemistry is building as strong of a roster as possible and if strong players more than capable of holding their own are left undrafted that indicates at least a partial failure in the system or the culture and suboptimal drafts somewhere on the board.
 
As an objective spectator (even though I signed up for SPL I don’t play any of the meta games so I promise I’m not coping) I have to say that this SPL draft looked pretty bad. Not like bad bad but for Smogon’s “most prestigious tournament” I expect more. Everyone has been talking about whether or not newcomers are having chances or not and honestly I don’t think that matters. SPL is meant to be an elite tour and should feature the best players on the site - whether that be veterans who have proven themselves in past editions or new players with spectacular results. I don’t have any beef with anyone who got drafted or was a manager aside from this observation. This SPL draft looked more like OUPL or any other sub forum tour - everyone is a good player, but it lacks the eliteness you expect out of an official team tournament. I honestly can’t say why, maybe having 12 slots over 10 slots contributed to a decline in the average quality of players but lots of big names new and old were shafted in this edition
I think your problem is that you are placing this tour on too high of a pedestal. Spoiler alert: there are not anywhere near 120 good / competent players on the website, especially in a format that lacks lower tiers. Obviously, when the number of slots increases, the overall quality of the tournament will go down. Also, I promise you, there were no "big names" that were actually undrafted...because if you were a "big name" who wasn't just completely washed, you certainly would have been picked. There are, of course, a solid amount of players that could have been drafted that were not over individuals like myself, but to act like these omissions are dragging down the quality of the tour a crazy amount is simply an egregious notion. As someone who has kept up with this tournament for the past decade, I would say this tour has about as much quality as I was expecting for a tour with 120 starters. The only real way for a Smogon team tournament to really reach the elite level you are talking about is probably to cut the amount of teams in half.
 
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yone

The One.
is a Tiering Contributoris a Past WCoP Champion
I think your problem is that you are placing this tour on too high of a pedestal.
I think the way SPL is sold is made for us to see it that way, a player who sees SPL as the top of the top is not to blame because that's what it's there for, that's also why there are hundreds of signups, it's a shame that your opinions are always subjective because it just makes it seem like you don't understand anything..
Spoiler alert: there are not anywhere near 120 good / competent players on the website, especially in a format that lacks lower tiers.
Old man, you've done your time, it's obvious that you don't know many people now, stop judging the level of people on google sheets and watch them play a little..
 

bruno

is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Championis a Past WCoP Champion
World Defender
Its funny because I actually thought this was one of the most stacked signups "big name" wise and it was a big reason why i considered signing up myself(its also the SPL with most signups ever) despite feeling like skipping the last like 3 editions. Not sure how long it`s been since you see bkc, m dragon, ojama and mcmeghan playing in the same tour, and some more surprise-ish signups like CE, Empo and Mana to boot. You got almost all the hype staples in there too. Not sure what "big eliteness" is really missing here comparing it to last seasons, I mean there's some people missing here and there but what can you do..
 

teal6

is a Tournament Directoris a Forum Moderatoris a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Two-Time Past SCL Championis a Past WCoP Champion
Moderator
Its funny because I actually thought this was one of the most stacked signups "big name" wise and it was a big reason why i considered signing up myself(its also the SPL with most signups ever) despite feeling like skipping the last like 3 editions. Not sure how long it`s been since you see bkc, m dragon, ojama and mcmeghan playing in the same tour, and some more surprise-ish signups like CE, Empo and Mana to boot. You got almost all the hype staples in there too. Not sure what "big eliteness" is really missing here comparing it to last seasons, I mean there's some people missing here and there but what can you do..
yeah, ciele
 
It’s important to remember that builders can be picked up for free and players can’t; the most exceptional builders warrant a pickup but most are strong players in their own right already. If a promising new builder is not ready to compete in SPL they can make the exact same impact as an out of team support and managers with connections (ie all SPL managers) should be able to procure the help of competent builders with ease. On the other hand a high level player without building experience or skill can develop so much more getting drafted and can contribute practically nothing undrafted. The bias towards builders is unnecessary, takes away chances to see raw players in action, and hinders the development of players for whom their game is their primary focus.
i dislike this misconception so much and it makes it quite clear to me that you don't really have much experience in official team tournaments yet. you act as if it makes no difference for a supporting team builder to simply be in the chat or to actually be part of the roster and on the team in full. in reality that difference is huge and almost all great teams have supporting slots purchased for 3k, if not even more. hell, two years ago i bought TPP as a substitute for 6.5k and i seriously doubt we win that spl without him. would he have provided the same amount of effort in team building, test games, scouting support and being an active social presence if he were a mere unofficial chat addition? absolutely not. i sure as shit wouldn't have either. the support the wolfpack would have gotten from an undrafted off the roster replacement would have been significantly worse, both in terms of quality and in terms of motivation. will of fire is another great example of someone excelling in this role and there have been many others, too.

another thing is that building and contributing as a whole isn't easy, which makes good support hard to come by. if someone is motivated and actively tries to help with team building, yet their input is simply not good enough or perhaps even bad, then they're actually being a detriment to the team rather than a boost. if teams simply bought 14 players off of their ability to play tournament games regardless of their ability to contribute to the overall environment and prep work, then that team would lose. so, in my opinion, it's important to remember that winning team tournaments is much more than just the sum of the final player records. the bias towards supporting players is not unnecessary and in fact makes the 'raw players' you want to see in action show up to their games with better teams, better preparation and thus better games. if someone is a promising builder with a positive attitude and a willingness to help a team win, then i'd argue they are ready to compete in SPL.
 
i think that there are a lot of ppl that "deserve" to be in spl for various reasons whether it be their accomplishments, skill, team building support, etc

the unfortunate reality is that spl is limited slots and people who deserve to be in the tour go undrafted.

near the end of the auction, we were debating between someone who various accomplishments in their tier and definitely shouldve been drafted and wouldve been a starter and someone who was, in our opinion, "less skilled" but as a substitute brought more to the team since they played multiple tiers, are a positive chat presence, and so on. we saw that as having more value in a sub despite the other person being the more skilled player, because if we went with player 1 it wouldve meant we had a less flexible team. player 1 strictly mained 1 tier and is quite good at it. player 2 didnt main any but plays multiple and ultimately we saw that as more valuable in a substitute. if we still needed a starter at that point, we wouldve gone for player 1 without a second thought

its unfortunate and yes i cant deny that spl is about knowing and being friends with people but when it comes to the cheaper slots its not as straightforward as some the responses in the thread might seem to suggest.

dave and tony provide good perspectives as both have a long history of managing
 
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Corazan

Crystal
is a Tiering Contributoris a Past SCL Championis a Past WCoP Champion
As an objective spectator (even though I signed up for SPL I don’t play any of the meta games so I promise I’m not coping) I have to say that this SPL draft looked pretty bad. Not like bad bad but for Smogon’s “most prestigious tournament” I expect more. Everyone has been talking about whether or not newcomers are having chances or not and honestly I don’t think that matters. SPL is meant to be an elite tour and should feature the best players on the site - whether that be veterans who have proven themselves in past editions or new players with spectacular results. I don’t have any beef with anyone who got drafted or was a manager aside from this observation. This SPL draft looked more like OUPL or any other sub forum tour - everyone is a good player, but it lacks the eliteness you expect out of an official team tournament. I honestly can’t say why, maybe having 12 slots over 10 slots contributed to a decline in the average quality of players but lots of big names new and old were shafted in this edition; I won’t bother naming them because most have already been mentioned in this thread. I understand that there is an increased builder pressure as well and lots of builders have been picked up. It’s important to remember that builders can be picked up for free and players can’t; the most exceptional builders warrant a pickup but most are strong players in their own right already. If a promising new builder is not ready to compete in SPL they can make the exact same impact as an out of team support and managers with connections (ie all SPL managers) should be able to procure the help of competent builders with ease. On the other hand a high level player without building experience or skill can develop so much more getting drafted and can contribute practically nothing undrafted. The bias towards builders is unnecessary, takes away chances to see raw players in action, and hinders the development of players for whom their game is their primary focus.

Finally, yes, SPL is a team tour, yes it’s enjoyed with friends. But for the spectator who wants to see the greatest players on the site and for the competitor who wants to play the best Smogon has to offer, SPL has a responsibility to stay elite and the managers part in upholding this responsibility is to ensure elite players at SPL level are drafted. Just as important as team chemistry is building as strong of a roster as possible and if strong players more than capable of holding their own are left undrafted that indicates at least a partial failure in the system or the culture and suboptimal drafts somewhere on the board.
I'm not so sure about the builder part of the post, but I gotta say I fully agree with the fact that this SPL draft seemed kinda weird. While I was only discussing it with friends bc I was too scared of making a post, props to you to have the guts to express your opinion publicly. I feel like the draft lacked something to the point that the SCL draft seemed way more spicier than this one. I think the biggest problem is the lack of mainers/top players in oldgens, while in SCL there was a polemic bc a ton of competents mainers didn't get a shot, here we have a shortage. When I read the smogtours discord and I see that we have to beg some players to signup in order to "save a pool" I just find it quite sad honestly, it shouldn't be the way smogon's biggest and most competitive tournament works. Couple this lack with the fact that the format is really hard to deal with (Having 4 SV slots and ALL oldgens combined in 12). I think if we had less slots like 3SV and cut 1 oldgen it would've been more fresh as the others pools would've been upgraded in that way too.

On paper this doesn't look like this will be the best SPL ever but on practice it could easily be with the good ingredients (tiebreak, dramas, plot twists...). I just really believe It's only a format issue and I'm hoping for a better one next year as we had hit the most signup ever which is awesome.

Looking for a good tournament, may the best win
 
I think the biggest problem is the lack of mainers/top players in oldgens, while in SCL there was a polemic bc a ton of competents mainers didn't get a shot, here we have a shortage. When I read the smogtours discord and I see that we have to beg some players to signup in order to "save a pool" I just find it quite sad honestly, it shouldn't be the way smogon's biggest and most competitive tournament works.

This lack of mainers/top players in oldgens is due to how tours currently work in Smogon imo. Maybe this doesn't affect SM/SS yet because they are fresh gens and players are still quite active but in the coming years it will affect them as well. 1-6 individuals are little more than nothing rn. WCOP abandoning all old gens also eliminated the possibility for many players who decide to play an old gen to show their skill and teamwork in a place with more easier access.

idk what is the solution but I think that RoA staff and TDs should analyze a possible revamp to motivate and attract people to play some Old Gen
 

Theia

You love me for everything you hate me for
is a Tournament Directoris a Site Content Manageris a Social Media Contributoris a Member of Senior Staffis a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Top Dedicated Tournament Hostis a Battle Simulator Admin Alumnus
User Safety Lead
This lack of mainers/top players in oldgens is due to how tours currently work in Smogon imo. Maybe this doesn't affect SM/SS yet because they are fresh gens and players are still quite active but in the coming years it will affect them as well. 1-6 individuals are little more than nothing rn. WCOP abandoning all old gens also eliminated the possibility for many players who decide to play an old gen to show their skill and teamwork in a place with more easier access.

idk what is the solution but I think that RoA staff and TDs should analyze a possible revamp to motivate and attract people to play some Old Gen
Hiya, speaking as the person in charge of roughly 85-90% of tournament organization for Ruins of Alph, I'm absolutely more than happy to listen to DMs with ideas on how things can improve! Unfortunately, simply saying that things are bad and need to improve doesn't give me much to work with.

Thanks so much in advance :psyglad:
 

Finchinator

-OUTL
is a Tournament Directoris a Top Social Media Contributoris a Community Leaderis a Community Contributoris a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Top Dedicated Tournament Hostis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnusis a Past WCoP Championis the defending OU Circuit Championis a Two-Time Former Old Generation Tournament Circuit Champion
OU Leader
The Power Rankings for SPL XIV are now up! I hope you enjoy the article and have a great experience overall this SPL.

Thank you so much to everyone who helped with this time sensitive article. A huge thank you to Lumari and Quite Quiet for working so thoroughly on making these possible over the years and 16bit, emma, Isaiah, Kalalokki, Sulo, UT, Zacpz, and Zracknel for their specific contributions that made this edition possible as well. I appreciate all of you.

This is the tenth edition of the SPL Power Rankings and the sixth I have done; it has been an honor to have this platform. Sharing the article with hundreds of active players on Smogon who follow tournaments closely and thousands of people overall is very humbling. With that said, the article is a substantial time sink to the point where I have to sacrifice IRL matters or sleep during some weeks leading up to tournaments, so I will either take a step back or look to restructure some things moving forward. Very excited for whatever developments may be coming on this front.
 

Conflict

is the 9th Smogon Classic Winneris a Three-Time Past SPL Championis the defending GSC Circuit Champion
World Defender
To reach a wider audience and to also boost interest in SPL in this and especially future seasons you should also link the PR's on showdown for a while. Maybe a couple writer's for future editions even feel compelled to help after they have read it.

In the meantime I thank you Finchinator for doing these year after year - greatly appreciate it. If you ever step down from Smogon it will be a huge loss for the community so I hope to see you around for years to come.
 

Amaranth

is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Dedicated Tournament Hostis a Tournament Director Alumnusis a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Past SPL Champion
UPL Champion
image_2023-01-16_024429240.png


These wonderful custom avatars are up on main and will soon be up on smogtours as well!

A huge shoutout goes out to the artists Altthiel Brumirage sharpclaw and especially Clementine who worked extra hard to handle requests from everyone and get everything ready with timeliness, make sure to thank them!
e: and kyledove for making a lot of the base trainer sprites in the first place of course :heart:
 
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Baloor

Tigers Management
is a Community Contributoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a defending SPL Champion
PUPL Champion
it's crazy to me how my boy Clementine still doesn't have the art badge despite carrying the official team tournament avatars for over a year. Not to mention how he does a lot of commissions for unofficial tour prizes/customs in general for free depending on the difficulty (he's done several for me this year alone). shoutout to the other artists, of course, they all do great work, but clem has been putting in overtime and deserves more recognition than he's been given. Without him, these likely wouldn't have been finished this fast with this outstanding level of quality.

i hope to see all the artists who work on the customs get the badge soon here eventually because they are painfully overworked, but, I needed to give my friend a special shout out. especially because I think he plans on calming down with the amount of work he's doing and it would suck if he stops before he is rewarded for it.

edit: i understand the parameters for customs and the art badge are a little scuffed, however, I feel this is a particularly special case due to the absolute insane work ethic clem has. while the customs are clems most notable contribution, he does a ton of banners for projects and tournaments which should also be in consideration as he puts those out just as much.
 
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sharpclaw

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Community Leader
Honored to be included in this year's team of SPL sprite-makers! But/And mostly wanna give a huge shoutout to Clementine for really going above and beyond this year. His work speaks for itself, of course, but the dude's output is just bonkers, and--more importantly--he cares deeply about the work and about getting teams exactly what they request. Committed almost to a fault. HUGE kudos to an extraordinary spriter, collaborator, and friend. badge this man tbh
 
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