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Rampardos
- Thread starter Emperor
- Start date
hoodlum lizards aren't dragons either and it got dragon dance (scrafty) are crayfish dragons? (crawdaunt) tyranitar gets dragon dance to (its a tyrannosaurus) why not rampardos!!! by the way nice fact didn't know that about whiscash
Edit: why does LAPRAS get dragon dance its based on the loch ness monster is that a dragon? is it even REAL?!!!! we may never know
I have to agree with alphatron that Rampardos is an amazing TR sweeper. If the opponent is down to 3 monsters, set up TRoom and let Rampardos rip. Ice Beam is surprisingly effective - thanks to LO, it has no problems scoring an OHKO on Gliscor, and it should also be able to 2HKO Hippowdon. Of course you have to invest a lot of EVs in special attack, but you can afford to do this since it is a TR sweeper that doesn't require Speed.
Since Rampardos only has 3 turns to utilize Trick Room, I usually go full-out attack rather than Swords Dance. I would advise Stone Edge > Head Smash, since LO & 50% recoil really drains Rampardos. Although, if you're treating Rampardos as a suicide bomber who is clearing way for another physical TR Sweeper, then Head Smash may be effective. As my final move, I chose Hammer Arm, because it lets Rampardos finish off Tyranitars and Blisseys, among others. Zen Headbutt would hit Conkeldurr the hardest but that's about it.
Until Rampardos receives Sheer Force, it is somewhat competing with Rhyperior for this spot. Although, Rhyperior hits approximately 15% less harder than Rampardos, it is much more sturdier, giving it more utility.
Since Rampardos only has 3 turns to utilize Trick Room, I usually go full-out attack rather than Swords Dance. I would advise Stone Edge > Head Smash, since LO & 50% recoil really drains Rampardos. Although, if you're treating Rampardos as a suicide bomber who is clearing way for another physical TR Sweeper, then Head Smash may be effective. As my final move, I chose Hammer Arm, because it lets Rampardos finish off Tyranitars and Blisseys, among others. Zen Headbutt would hit Conkeldurr the hardest but that's about it.
Until Rampardos receives Sheer Force, it is somewhat competing with Rhyperior for this spot. Although, Rhyperior hits approximately 15% less harder than Rampardos, it is much more sturdier, giving it more utility.
you dont actually need any spatck evs to OHKO gliscor but ice beam is definitly an option
not when sheer force gets released but very true hippowdon is a beast
i think he means a conkeldurr switch in but good point
alphatron
Volt turn in every tier! I'm in despair!
If you're okay with running moves that will only be hitting pokemon on the switch in, you could do for Avalanche if you have the move slot space. I'm on the wii though, so I say this without being able to do the calcs. Zen headbutt does hit conkeldurr, as well as machamp though and you'll probably be seeing the former more often.
Yeah, head smash aside, rhyperior does give rampardos some heavy competition. Head smash itself is a monster of an attack and as Pocket said, you can simply have rampardos spam it until he dies in order to soften up your opponent's team for your other physical sweepers.
Yeah, head smash aside, rhyperior does give rampardos some heavy competition. Head smash itself is a monster of an attack and as Pocket said, you can simply have rampardos spam it until he dies in order to soften up your opponent's team for your other physical sweepers.
I think Conkeldurr is on a decline, so I would go with Hammer Arm to hit a lot of things that EdgeQuake doesn't hit hard enough. I would definitely go with Hammer Arm if I go with Head Smash, since Head Smashing Blissey is suicude.
Avalanche has 66% chance of taking out Gliscor on the switch with SR. Ice Beam is preferable here, because you don't have to predict Gliscor coming in, and it only takes a few Special Attack EVs (< 40 EVs) for the OHKO.
Ice Beam, with 252 EVs in Special Attack, can 2HKO physically defensive Hippowdon after SR, but if it invests more than 100 EVs in Special Defense, then the chance becomes slimmer. If Hippowdon's specially defensive then forget it.
With investment in Special Attack EVs, Ice Beam comes in handy against other situations, too, though. It can be used to finish off Thundurus / Tornadus / Haxorus / Dragonite / Celebi / Landorus without worrying the Stone Edge / Head Smash would miss or not.
Avalanche has 66% chance of taking out Gliscor on the switch with SR. Ice Beam is preferable here, because you don't have to predict Gliscor coming in, and it only takes a few Special Attack EVs (< 40 EVs) for the OHKO.
Ice Beam, with 252 EVs in Special Attack, can 2HKO physically defensive Hippowdon after SR, but if it invests more than 100 EVs in Special Defense, then the chance becomes slimmer. If Hippowdon's specially defensive then forget it.
With investment in Special Attack EVs, Ice Beam comes in handy against other situations, too, though. It can be used to finish off Thundurus / Tornadus / Haxorus / Dragonite / Celebi / Landorus without worrying the Stone Edge / Head Smash would miss or not.
alphatron
Volt turn in every tier! I'm in despair!
^Calcs were posted on the previous page showing that Ice beam ohkos without investment, let alone sheer force. Well, gliscor is taking 90% minimum, so that's a guarenteed ohko with SR. Sheer force would just remove the need for SR at all.
At this point, it's like the physical attackers who want to beat gliscor don't even have to try.
At this point, it's like the physical attackers who want to beat gliscor don't even have to try.
alphatron
Volt turn in every tier! I'm in despair!
Double post but I have something to offer.
Unfortunately, MoltenKyurem I did not have great results with Double Dance Rampardos at all. Mainly because he just couldn't force anything out against any type of team. You'd think Ninetales would at least go for the will-o-wisp or something, but no!
I did have good success with CB Rampardos under trick room though. When head smash actually hits, it's a friggin monster. Here are some calcs. All of the following were done with max Evs and a boosting nature.
CB Head smash vs. 252/252 Celebi: 86.1% - 101.2%
Vs. Skarmory: 81.4% - 96.4%
Vs. Gliscor: 83.6% - 98.9%
Vs. Slowbro: 82.5% - 97.5%
Vs. Tangrowth: 73.5% - 86.9%
Vs. Bronzong: 46.2% - 54.4%
I'll stop here but this should give you guys an idea of how powerful it is. 2hkos...EVERYTHING. Seriously. Lucario is 2hkod despite the 4x resistance. SpD Jirachi is 2hko'd, taking nearly 70% from the first head smash. Dragonite is ohko'd regardless of multiscale (assuming mold breaker isn't present anyway. 97% minimum to max/max bold dragonite). Standard Gastrodon? Same thing.
Whatever isn't 2hko'd either dies from rocks+head smash, is flat out ohko'd by head smash, or head smash missed because it has worse accuracy than stone edge and hydro pump. Ignore what the game tells you. It's not actually 80% accurate.
The best use I got out of him was on a sand team with trick room slapped onto a jellicient and SpD jirachi. He forces sacrifices or priority that isn't named gyro ball. Standard relaxed ferrothorn is 2hko'd by head smash(but you can easily go for the fire punch or the hammer arm on the predicted switch anyway). When my opponent switched in their wall and head smash actually hit, it gave me free room for a ferrothorn sweep. Balloon terrakion switching in on head smash? 2hkod. Conkeldurr? 2hko'd.
Unfortunately, MoltenKyurem I did not have great results with Double Dance Rampardos at all. Mainly because he just couldn't force anything out against any type of team. You'd think Ninetales would at least go for the will-o-wisp or something, but no!
I did have good success with CB Rampardos under trick room though. When head smash actually hits, it's a friggin monster. Here are some calcs. All of the following were done with max Evs and a boosting nature.
CB Head smash vs. 252/252 Celebi: 86.1% - 101.2%
Vs. Skarmory: 81.4% - 96.4%
Vs. Gliscor: 83.6% - 98.9%
Vs. Slowbro: 82.5% - 97.5%
Vs. Tangrowth: 73.5% - 86.9%
Vs. Bronzong: 46.2% - 54.4%
I'll stop here but this should give you guys an idea of how powerful it is. 2hkos...EVERYTHING. Seriously. Lucario is 2hkod despite the 4x resistance. SpD Jirachi is 2hko'd, taking nearly 70% from the first head smash. Dragonite is ohko'd regardless of multiscale (assuming mold breaker isn't present anyway. 97% minimum to max/max bold dragonite). Standard Gastrodon? Same thing.
Whatever isn't 2hko'd either dies from rocks+head smash, is flat out ohko'd by head smash, or head smash missed because it has worse accuracy than stone edge and hydro pump. Ignore what the game tells you. It's not actually 80% accurate.
The best use I got out of him was on a sand team with trick room slapped onto a jellicient and SpD jirachi. He forces sacrifices or priority that isn't named gyro ball. Standard relaxed ferrothorn is 2hko'd by head smash(but you can easily go for the fire punch or the hammer arm on the predicted switch anyway). When my opponent switched in their wall and head smash actually hit, it gave me free room for a ferrothorn sweep. Balloon terrakion switching in on head smash? 2hkod. Conkeldurr? 2hko'd.
Scarf Ramparados is actually a half-decent threat in OU; it's capable of clean up sweeping quite easily with its monstrous attack once threats to it (priority, faster pokes) are gone.
Recoil or not, Head Smash packs a punch and can put a ver large (and important) dent in your opponent's team
Recoil or not, Head Smash packs a punch and can put a ver large (and important) dent in your opponent's team
I'm still thinking Choice Band Trick room is far superior.
Anyway, after reading this I'm very intrigued by Rampardos' potential, especially once the Sheer Force version gets released (allowing it to go mixed with Life Orb quite easily. If Tauros can do it, Rampardos sure as fuck can too).
In the meantime though, I'm tempted to build a Trick Room team with CB Rampardos as wall breaker. Given alphatron's calculations it would be extremely powerful in that role, allowing a more durable Trick Room abuser to sweep (I see Conkledurr greatly appreciating having physical walls removed, for example).
Oh and I just realized that Hammer Arm is a spectacular move for TR Rampardos, since it actually makes him faster. Bonus!
Though on second thought, how the hell is it hammering anything with those tiny little arms it has?
Choice scarf Rampardos is much easier to slap on any team than the Choice Band variant though. Thanks to Mold Breaker and his massive attack, he can easily spam Earthquake and sweep late game, even without STAB. The TR variant is better on a team dedicated to it, but CS requires much less team support.
The problem with this is that he's outclassed by so many other choice scarf users though. Haxorus immediately jumps to mind, serving a similar purpose (deal insane damage through a ridiculously powerful unboosted move) and he can outrun a lot more stuff and take hits better than Choice Scarf Rampardos. Then there's the issue that even with Rampardos' ridiculous attack stat, without any boosts it's going to get walled pretty easily by the likes of Skarmory and Ferrothorn.
While you're right about it being easier to throw on a team, that doesn't matter when Rampardos pretty much needs a massive amount of team support to succeed. If you're going to use a scarfer as slow as Rampardos, use Tyranitar instead.
Skarm is actually 2HKOed by Head Smash, lol, and Ferrothorn wouldn't enjoy Fire Punch / Superpower. Rampardos is in a whole new level of destruction compared to Haxorus, with its 165 Atk.
However, the lack of speed is a valid point, Jimera0. It does outrun up to Tornadus with Jolly, so if you don't mind lacking a revenge killer for Starmie, Alakazam, and anything faster, then Rampardos may not be a bad choice, lol.
Trick Room is where Rampardos truly shines, though, being able to use items that further boosts its offense without worrying about being outsped. It can still pull off a Mixed LO set effectively without Sheer Force, but its DW ability would make it soo much better.
However, the lack of speed is a valid point, Jimera0. It does outrun up to Tornadus with Jolly, so if you don't mind lacking a revenge killer for Starmie, Alakazam, and anything faster, then Rampardos may not be a bad choice, lol.
Trick Room is where Rampardos truly shines, though, being able to use items that further boosts its offense without worrying about being outsped. It can still pull off a Mixed LO set effectively without Sheer Force, but its DW ability would make it soo much better.
Even with a scarf, I'm pretty sure you can 2HKO Standard Skarm with Head Smash. While I agree that TTar is an all around better scarfer, Rampardos can function as a Wallbreaker and revenge killer at the same time, which is a pretty rare trait. CS Haxorus fills a similar role but has more bulk like you said, but Rampardos' extra power still gives him an interesting niche.
I will agree that rampardos is an excellent wall breaker, but why cant we just use scarf aggron? or band aggron? other than a lot more attack and base 8 more speed it doesnt have much over a recoiless head smash.
Because Aggron is so slow, a Choice Scarf isn't even remotely viable. Anything even decently fast will still outspeed him. If you really want to sweep with him, you need Rock Polish or Baton Pass, and even at +2 many things can still pick him off. Also, Mold Breaker means Rampardos can easily spam EQ once opposing flying types are gone, and he destroys all of those with Head Smash. Aggron gets EdgeQuake too, but still has to predict well if the opponent has pokemon with Levitate.
Don't get me wrong, Aggron is a good and underrated pokemon, but you can't use him in the same way you would Rampardos (unless you're using Trick Room, and even then Mold Breaker differentiates them enough to warrant Rampardos' viability)
Really, it can still 2HKO Skarmory you think? Well I suppose that is a big difference... but still, you'd need to predict with Ferrothorn.
It does seem that you have a point with using it with scarf. The ability to both break down walls and revenge is potent indeed. The issue I have with it though is that it can't revenge a lot of things faster scarfers can. For instance, anything that nets a speed boost is going to outspeed and KO Rampardos (for instance, Dragon dancers, base 115+s) Or anything with a super effective prioirty (Lucario, Metagross, Scizor) is going to be impossible for it to revenge kill, where as something like Haxorus will be able to take those out. Still, it does have its merrits.
And Aggron isn't going to be able to do the same thing, simply because it has way, way less power and thanks to its typing is pretty much just as frail as Rampardos is (I've gone over Aggron's faults in detail in its thread already). Rampardos is a much better choice imo for scarfing.
As a plain TR CBer Zweilous is better imo.it may have like 15 less base attack but:
1.dragon is a better offensive type than rock
2.Zweilous doesn't die from BP Scizor which is everywhere
3.Zweilous doesn't have to kill itself to dent the opponent.
Also if we are talking about Head Smash on Rapmardos then there is no accuracy issue with Zweilous since his most spammable move has also 80% accuracy.
And anyway i don't think that Rampardos is good as a TR sweeper(in OU)
since Scizor and Conk are everywhere.
1.dragon is a better offensive type than rock
2.Zweilous doesn't die from BP Scizor which is everywhere
3.Zweilous doesn't have to kill itself to dent the opponent.
Also if we are talking about Head Smash on Rapmardos then there is no accuracy issue with Zweilous since his most spammable move has also 80% accuracy.
And anyway i don't think that Rampardos is good as a TR sweeper(in OU)
since Scizor and Conk are everywhere.
Zweilous doesn't really get much better coverage in OU. Either way it's the Steel types giving you trouble. Also, Rampardos has access to better coverage options. Finally, sure CB Scizor can obliterate it, but it isn't going to like taking a Head Smash on the switch very much. I haven't done the calcs, but I suspect it might even OHKO some variants. As for other priority, Zwelious is just as weak to it. Finally, Zwelious' Outrage is actually much weaker than Rampardos' Head Smash. What Rampardos looses in coverage with Head Smash, it gains in raw power.