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Tournament PUPL VIII: Discussion (Memes + Bullshit) Thread
- Thread starter Theia
- Start date
whoever made the pupl spreadsheet, bw doesnt appear in the tiers tab or the individual team tabs
Five thoughts on PUPL week 3.
Going to try and make this into a weekly segment where I go over five interesting things I saw during that week of PUPL. These can be meta trends, funny matches or gimmicky sets that did well. Will mostly be SS focused as that’s the meta which sees the most development but I'll try to branch out here and there.
1. New toys in SS.
This week gave us two new drops to use in Guzzlord and Doublade. Both made a huge splash straight away with Doublade seeing 50% usage and Guzzlord seeing 37.5% good for the 3rd and 4th most used pokemon. Whether this is new toy syndrome or an actual trend that’s here to stay we’re yet to see, but for now it seems like the drops will make a huge change on the metagame.
2. Sandslash and the new balance build.
In what seems like a direct result of the new drops, Sandslash, normally considered a niche pick in SS, had a huge usage spike this week. After being on only one team in week 1, Sandslash was used 11 times this week, good for 5th most used at 34.38%. Sandslash finds its place in the tier as a spinner that can comfortably spin against Doublade, which as mentioned was a common pick for this week. Additionally, Slash provides valuable spikes support which proved deadly this week.
Despite being the first week with new drops, several people recognised the potency of a particular build which showed up in a total of 8 games. The build is centred around using Guzzlord to knock off items, primarily heavy-duty boots, and then wearing teams down by hazard stacking with Sandslash and Gigalith, with Doublade providing spinblock support and set-up sweeping potential. Ribombee usually slotted in as the 5th slot and then there was some variation on the 6th.
Notably, this build won an incredible 6 out of its 8 games. Hazard stacking has always been strong in SS PU and it seems to have only gotten stronger now that we’ve improved both our knock off and spin-blocking options.
3. Scary ice types
An interesting trend we saw this week was some niche ice types making their appearance. On top of the usual, and terrifying, Vanilluxe and Sneasel picks, we got to see an Abomasnow, Froslass and Frosmoth all pick-up wins this week. As teams are finding more and more ways to abuse defensive Togedemaru I only expect this trend to continue. Abomasnow seems a particularly interesting pick here as a boots 4 attack set with blizzard, giga drain and earth power does very well into the balance build posted above.
4. Spl4sh vs Zs
Taking a step back from SS, I want to take a look at a particular ORAS game that occurred as the last game in Spl4sh and Zs’ bo3 set. I’ve said for a while that Spl4sh is the unluckiest player on this site, and that certainly seemed to be the case here. Well worth a look if you haven’t seen it already.
5. HO in SS
Finishing off in SS, I want to talk about HO in the metagame. After no HO teams in the first week, we got to see it featured in two matches this week, both resulting in wins for the HO side. I think the main reason for this is that Doublade enables a lot of builds, providing both spin blocking and a defensive backbone in the one slot. Interestingly, the two builds differed a lot as the only common pokemon was Archeops, which is one of the few offensive answers to Charizard.
Going to try and make this into a weekly segment where I go over five interesting things I saw during that week of PUPL. These can be meta trends, funny matches or gimmicky sets that did well. Will mostly be SS focused as that’s the meta which sees the most development but I'll try to branch out here and there.
1. New toys in SS.
This week gave us two new drops to use in Guzzlord and Doublade. Both made a huge splash straight away with Doublade seeing 50% usage and Guzzlord seeing 37.5% good for the 3rd and 4th most used pokemon. Whether this is new toy syndrome or an actual trend that’s here to stay we’re yet to see, but for now it seems like the drops will make a huge change on the metagame.
2. Sandslash and the new balance build.
In what seems like a direct result of the new drops, Sandslash, normally considered a niche pick in SS, had a huge usage spike this week. After being on only one team in week 1, Sandslash was used 11 times this week, good for 5th most used at 34.38%. Sandslash finds its place in the tier as a spinner that can comfortably spin against Doublade, which as mentioned was a common pick for this week. Additionally, Slash provides valuable spikes support which proved deadly this week.
Despite being the first week with new drops, several people recognised the potency of a particular build which showed up in a total of 8 games. The build is centred around using Guzzlord to knock off items, primarily heavy-duty boots, and then wearing teams down by hazard stacking with Sandslash and Gigalith, with Doublade providing spinblock support and set-up sweeping potential. Ribombee usually slotted in as the 5th slot and then there was some variation on the 6th.
Notably, this build won an incredible 6 out of its 8 games. Hazard stacking has always been strong in SS PU and it seems to have only gotten stronger now that we’ve improved both our knock off and spin-blocking options.
3. Scary ice types
An interesting trend we saw this week was some niche ice types making their appearance. On top of the usual, and terrifying, Vanilluxe and Sneasel picks, we got to see an Abomasnow, Froslass and Frosmoth all pick-up wins this week. As teams are finding more and more ways to abuse defensive Togedemaru I only expect this trend to continue. Abomasnow seems a particularly interesting pick here as a boots 4 attack set with blizzard, giga drain and earth power does very well into the balance build posted above.
4. Spl4sh vs Zs
Taking a step back from SS, I want to take a look at a particular ORAS game that occurred as the last game in Spl4sh and Zs’ bo3 set. I’ve said for a while that Spl4sh is the unluckiest player on this site, and that certainly seemed to be the case here. Well worth a look if you haven’t seen it already.
5. HO in SS
Finishing off in SS, I want to talk about HO in the metagame. After no HO teams in the first week, we got to see it featured in two matches this week, both resulting in wins for the HO side. I think the main reason for this is that Doublade enables a lot of builds, providing both spin blocking and a defensive backbone in the one slot. Interestingly, the two builds differed a lot as the only common pokemon was Archeops, which is one of the few offensive answers to Charizard.
Five thoughts on PUPL weeks 3 and 4
Missed a week so I’m doing them together. Please forgive me D:
1. The Scientist Rises
What you should imagine is a scenario like:
“2071. A scientist has created a magical panacea turning humans into poweful superhumans who are immortal and gifted with psychic powers making them unstoppable. He is the only one in the world who knows how to make this panacea. The World Government is going to jail the scientist on Saturn and is thinking of executing him. The jailing decision has already caused worlwide outrage, and the outcome of this decision will decide on the future of humankind.”
This is only a snippet from Ktutverde’s powerful prose which so eloquently describes the dilemma of our beloved scientist.
The scientist, of course, is Gigalith.
Freed from his jail of years past, the scientist has risen back to prominence and is now terrorizing special attackers everywhere, taking first and second place in usage across weeks 3 and 4 respectively. But now, with the help of a certain bee, he keeps the power of immortality for himself. Using rest he heals any wound he may pick up and uses the help of his buzzing friend to awaken unscathed.
He now stands alone as the premier rocker of the PU world, leaving Regirock, Aggron and Sandaconda to grovel at his feet as he shrugs off fire blasts and blizzards alike, knowing that if the going gets tough, Ribombee will have his back.
2. Rocks Archeops (And Friends)
In an attempt to undermine the scientist, a number of new, ambitious rockers have burst onto the scene. These youngins disagree with the balanced ways of the scientist and strive to bring forth a more offensive world, where the pressure is too strong for the scientist to survive.
The most prominent of these is Archeops which has seen use a number of times as the only rocker on both HO and regular offensive builds. This makes sense as Archeops is always a helpful add on offensive builds since it provides a nice speed tier and Charizard resist, and edge and roost are the only two mandatory moves so it’s not hard to fit rocks onto it. Some other examples were Lambovino’s offensive rocks Lycanroc, a plethora of Rhydons and some Druddigon.
I do feel like this is a direct response to the scientist as I feel that most balance builds without him are suboptimal, so either you use the scientist or you run a more offensive build that maybe takes advantage of one of the rockers mentioned above.
3. Sharp and Pointy Problems
i am a doublade. i haev pointy swords and i liek to dance. if you dont repost this comment on 10 other pages i will get a 4x atk boost and sweep ur team
I have been quite vocal about my thoughts on Doublade and since these are my thoughts I get to ramble on about it as much as I like! Doublade saw a bit of a drop in usage in week 3 before rocketing up to the top of week 4 usage with a whole 18 uses! For reference, the scientist, the second most used pokemon, only saw a meagre 12 uses.
This became a bit of a staple of this week, with Doublade cleaning up a number of lategame scenarios. Or, if it wasn’t cleaning late game, it was using its tremendous bulk to trade hits with some of the strongest attackers in the tier and coming out victorious. For now, SD 3 attacks are all we’re seeing but I expect to see some experimentation with resttalk sets coming soon as well which might be even more threatening.
4. Icky Sticky Sun and Moon
For a while now I’ve been watching the SM metagame with curiosity as I have very little experience with it and am mostly learning it through PUPL replays. One thing that stood out to me is the power of HO teams in general, but specifically webs playstyles.
From my count, we’ve seen webs show up five different times, with the webs side winning four of these. That’s a fantastic success rate and not something I see too often for these super fishy builds. I’ll be curious to see if this success continues and if it does, what adjustment SM teams will make to help with their webs matchup.
5. A Fun Replay to End On
And finally, so that I don’t have to write anymore, I’ll show my favourite replay from last week. This is the SS PU match between Scottie and Lambovino, both highly respected and skilled players who tend to use very interesting builds. The set that caught my eye the most was Lambo’s lure Altaria set, which seems like a very cool way to beat down the standard balance builds that have been showing up recently.
Missed a week so I’m doing them together. Please forgive me D:
1. The Scientist Rises
What you should imagine is a scenario like:
“2071. A scientist has created a magical panacea turning humans into poweful superhumans who are immortal and gifted with psychic powers making them unstoppable. He is the only one in the world who knows how to make this panacea. The World Government is going to jail the scientist on Saturn and is thinking of executing him. The jailing decision has already caused worlwide outrage, and the outcome of this decision will decide on the future of humankind.”
This is only a snippet from Ktutverde’s powerful prose which so eloquently describes the dilemma of our beloved scientist.
The scientist, of course, is Gigalith.
Freed from his jail of years past, the scientist has risen back to prominence and is now terrorizing special attackers everywhere, taking first and second place in usage across weeks 3 and 4 respectively. But now, with the help of a certain bee, he keeps the power of immortality for himself. Using rest he heals any wound he may pick up and uses the help of his buzzing friend to awaken unscathed.
He now stands alone as the premier rocker of the PU world, leaving Regirock, Aggron and Sandaconda to grovel at his feet as he shrugs off fire blasts and blizzards alike, knowing that if the going gets tough, Ribombee will have his back.
2. Rocks Archeops (And Friends)
In an attempt to undermine the scientist, a number of new, ambitious rockers have burst onto the scene. These youngins disagree with the balanced ways of the scientist and strive to bring forth a more offensive world, where the pressure is too strong for the scientist to survive.
The most prominent of these is Archeops which has seen use a number of times as the only rocker on both HO and regular offensive builds. This makes sense as Archeops is always a helpful add on offensive builds since it provides a nice speed tier and Charizard resist, and edge and roost are the only two mandatory moves so it’s not hard to fit rocks onto it. Some other examples were Lambovino’s offensive rocks Lycanroc, a plethora of Rhydons and some Druddigon.
I do feel like this is a direct response to the scientist as I feel that most balance builds without him are suboptimal, so either you use the scientist or you run a more offensive build that maybe takes advantage of one of the rockers mentioned above.
3. Sharp and Pointy Problems
i am a doublade. i haev pointy swords and i liek to dance. if you dont repost this comment on 10 other pages i will get a 4x atk boost and sweep ur team
I have been quite vocal about my thoughts on Doublade and since these are my thoughts I get to ramble on about it as much as I like! Doublade saw a bit of a drop in usage in week 3 before rocketing up to the top of week 4 usage with a whole 18 uses! For reference, the scientist, the second most used pokemon, only saw a meagre 12 uses.
This became a bit of a staple of this week, with Doublade cleaning up a number of lategame scenarios. Or, if it wasn’t cleaning late game, it was using its tremendous bulk to trade hits with some of the strongest attackers in the tier and coming out victorious. For now, SD 3 attacks are all we’re seeing but I expect to see some experimentation with resttalk sets coming soon as well which might be even more threatening.
4. Icky Sticky Sun and Moon
For a while now I’ve been watching the SM metagame with curiosity as I have very little experience with it and am mostly learning it through PUPL replays. One thing that stood out to me is the power of HO teams in general, but specifically webs playstyles.
From my count, we’ve seen webs show up five different times, with the webs side winning four of these. That’s a fantastic success rate and not something I see too often for these super fishy builds. I’ll be curious to see if this success continues and if it does, what adjustment SM teams will make to help with their webs matchup.
5. A Fun Replay to End On
And finally, so that I don’t have to write anymore, I’ll show my favourite replay from last week. This is the SS PU match between Scottie and Lambovino, both highly respected and skilled players who tend to use very interesting builds. The set that caught my eye the most was Lambo’s lure Altaria set, which seems like a very cool way to beat down the standard balance builds that have been showing up recently.
Five Thoughts On PUPL Week 5
Ban Vanilluxe.
1.The Rise and Fall GigaSlash Balance.
It’s been quite fun talking about GigaSlash every week because it feels like I’ve gotten to truly experience the rise and fall of the archetype. After bursting onto the scene in W2 with a 72% win rate, Sandslash builds only won once last week despite being featured on 10 teams. This is good for only a 10% win rate. Additionally, in the win both teams had a Sandslash so it was guaranteed to get a win.
Teams are doing a better job prepping for the build, with Quagsire, Wishiwashi and especially Whimsicott all seeing good usage. Additionally, specs Whimsicott has made a bit of a resurgence to punish these dual grass weak teams that use Doublade as their only fairy resist.
Sandslash’s win rate may go back to what it was as 10% is definitely an extreme outlier, but still, it’s funny to see such a drastic shift in success over the span of only a few weeks.
2. Offense Getting Hyper
In my first edition of five thoughts, I teased the idea of HO in SS PU following the drop of Doublade. Up until that point, it wasn’t a heavily explored archetype but over the past few weeks, it has boomed in popularity, especially in the BO3 slots.
Last week we had 3 different HO builds featured in 3 different games, and that’s more or less been the trend since W1. The archetype has a 67% win rate, winning 6/9 games which shows why people are using it. It especially makes sense in the BO3 slot where you might try to fish for a matchup game one, knowing that if it doesn’t work you still have two games left to secure your win.
The build that’s seeing the most usage is pdt from theCinccino’s Magmortars' lead Druddigon build shown below, so if you’re playing the Cinccino’s Magmortars look out ;)
Edit: As a number kindly pointed out to me, the team above is definitely not belonging to the Cincinnos and is actually the Magmortars' build. Whoops, thanks for the spot all!
3.
ZU Raid! 
This week we got to see some ZU friends take the spotlight in some of the SS games. Tlenit vs Wingless had Dugtrio-Alola pick up its first win in the same amount of appearances, and Cramorant get its first win in two appearances. Dug is a meta pick designed to benefit off of the sand that Gigaliths set thanks to powerful attacks with sand force, and Cramorant is a defogger that can abuse Sandslashes.
And then, following on from the previous section, ZUTL S1nn0hC0nfirm3d brought a HO team consisting of 4 ZU pokemon in Kabutops, Qwilfish, Silvally-Grass and Turtonator. This team also nabbed a win, using Silvally-Grass to abuse a Quagsire-Gigalith core, though an important speed tie had to be won to make it happen.
This speaks to the broader trend broached in section 1, which is the increased creativity in builds recently. I feel the meta is ripe for exploration at the minute and it seems to be the players that are exploring are the ones finding the most success. Hopefully this trend continues and we get to see some exciting builds this coming week!
Edit: (Also s/o Silvally-Fighting who I forgot about despite him winning two games :( )
4.
Charizard Stonks On The Decline
Just a week after being granted sole ownership of S on the viability rankings, Charizard usage has hit its lowest point with an abysmal 4 uses (12.5% usage rate). This is part of a larger trend, as Charizard’s usage has decreased every week since week 2.
I reckon Gigalith is largely to blame for this, as well as Charizard being a fire type that can’t switch into the broken Vanilluxe. Additionally, Eldegoss usage has been gradually decreasing as well which gives Zard fewer grass types to abuse. It’s also probably people trying new things and I’m sure we’ll see Zard climb back up again. I wouldn’t be surprised to see it in the low teens again by W7. However, I think the meta has shifted such that we won’t be seeing 17 Zard uses again this PUPL, which is what it was at W1.
5. Playoff Situation
As we’re getting closer to playoffs, it’s time to start looking at playoff chances and what certain teams need to do to stay in contention.
In terms of points, this is the current breakdown:
Happy Huntails: 6 points, +8 differential
Cheeky Cinccinos: 6 points, +2 differential
Moo Moo Milkers: 6 points, +1 differential
Detonating Ribombees: 6 points, +1 differential
The Vicious Rends: 6 points, +0 differential
M.A.A.D. City Magmortars: 5 points, +5 differential
Destructive Dedennes: 3 points, -6 differential
Unscrupulous Scraggies: 2 points, -11 differential
Four teams go through and there are currently 5 on 6 points. Within those, the Cinccinos and Ribombees play each other this week and the Cinccinos and the Huntails play each other next week. Any of the 6 point teams can guarantee their spot by winning out as it’s only possible for 4 teams to end on 10 points. A win and a tie is also likely to get them there, and just a win or two ties will likely have them competing in point differential.
The Mags can guarantee their spot by winning out as they play the Huntails and then the Rends. They also have a good shot with just a win or two ties due to their high point differential.
The Dedennes would need to win out AND have less than 4 teams go above 7. This would more or less require the Scraggies to win out, Cinccinos to win out and the Magmortars to win out. This would actually put the Dedennes third but as far as I can tell it’s their best shot at qualifying. There may be some scenarios where they come 4th but due to their low point differential, I’m not actually sure. Either way it’s a tough road for the Dennes .
The Scraggies are mathematically eliminated.
Ban Vanilluxe.
1.
The Rise and Fall GigaSlash Balance.It’s been quite fun talking about GigaSlash every week because it feels like I’ve gotten to truly experience the rise and fall of the archetype. After bursting onto the scene in W2 with a 72% win rate, Sandslash builds only won once last week despite being featured on 10 teams. This is good for only a 10% win rate. Additionally, in the win both teams had a Sandslash so it was guaranteed to get a win.
Teams are doing a better job prepping for the build, with Quagsire, Wishiwashi and especially Whimsicott all seeing good usage. Additionally, specs Whimsicott has made a bit of a resurgence to punish these dual grass weak teams that use Doublade as their only fairy resist.
Sandslash’s win rate may go back to what it was as 10% is definitely an extreme outlier, but still, it’s funny to see such a drastic shift in success over the span of only a few weeks.
2.
Offense Getting Hyper In my first edition of five thoughts, I teased the idea of HO in SS PU following the drop of Doublade. Up until that point, it wasn’t a heavily explored archetype but over the past few weeks, it has boomed in popularity, especially in the BO3 slots.
Last week we had 3 different HO builds featured in 3 different games, and that’s more or less been the trend since W1. The archetype has a 67% win rate, winning 6/9 games which shows why people are using it. It especially makes sense in the BO3 slot where you might try to fish for a matchup game one, knowing that if it doesn’t work you still have two games left to secure your win.
The build that’s seeing the most usage is pdt from the
Edit: As a number kindly pointed out to me, the team above is definitely not belonging to the Cincinnos and is actually the Magmortars' build. Whoops, thanks for the spot all!
3.
ZU Raid! This week we got to see some ZU friends take the spotlight in some of the SS games. Tlenit vs Wingless had Dugtrio-Alola pick up its first win in the same amount of appearances, and Cramorant get its first win in two appearances. Dug is a meta pick designed to benefit off of the sand that Gigaliths set thanks to powerful attacks with sand force, and Cramorant is a defogger that can abuse Sandslashes.
And then, following on from the previous section, ZUTL S1nn0hC0nfirm3d brought a HO team consisting of 4 ZU pokemon in Kabutops, Qwilfish, Silvally-Grass and Turtonator. This team also nabbed a win, using Silvally-Grass to abuse a Quagsire-Gigalith core, though an important speed tie had to be won to make it happen.
This speaks to the broader trend broached in section 1, which is the increased creativity in builds recently. I feel the meta is ripe for exploration at the minute and it seems to be the players that are exploring are the ones finding the most success. Hopefully this trend continues and we get to see some exciting builds this coming week!
4.
Charizard Stonks On The Decline Just a week after being granted sole ownership of S on the viability rankings, Charizard usage has hit its lowest point with an abysmal 4 uses (12.5% usage rate). This is part of a larger trend, as Charizard’s usage has decreased every week since week 2.
I reckon Gigalith is largely to blame for this, as well as Charizard being a fire type that can’t switch into the broken Vanilluxe. Additionally, Eldegoss usage has been gradually decreasing as well which gives Zard fewer grass types to abuse. It’s also probably people trying new things and I’m sure we’ll see Zard climb back up again. I wouldn’t be surprised to see it in the low teens again by W7. However, I think the meta has shifted such that we won’t be seeing 17 Zard uses again this PUPL, which is what it was at W1.
5. Playoff Situation
As we’re getting closer to playoffs, it’s time to start looking at playoff chances and what certain teams need to do to stay in contention.
In terms of points, this is the current breakdown:
Happy Huntails: 6 points, +8 differential
Cheeky Cinccinos: 6 points, +2 differential
Moo Moo Milkers: 6 points, +1 differential
Detonating Ribombees: 6 points, +1 differential
The Vicious Rends: 6 points, +0 differential
M.A.A.D. City Magmortars: 5 points, +5 differential
Destructive Dedennes: 3 points, -6 differential
Unscrupulous Scraggies: 2 points, -11 differential
Four teams go through and there are currently 5 on 6 points. Within those, the Cinccinos and Ribombees play each other this week and the Cinccinos and the Huntails play each other next week. Any of the 6 point teams can guarantee their spot by winning out as it’s only possible for 4 teams to end on 10 points. A win and a tie is also likely to get them there, and just a win or two ties will likely have them competing in point differential.
The Mags can guarantee their spot by winning out as they play the Huntails and then the Rends. They also have a good shot with just a win or two ties due to their high point differential.
The Dedennes would need to win out AND have less than 4 teams go above 7. This would more or less require the Scraggies to win out, Cinccinos to win out and the Magmortars to win out. This would actually put the Dedennes third but as far as I can tell it’s their best shot at qualifying. There may be some scenarios where they come 4th but due to their low point differential, I’m not actually sure. Either way it’s a tough road for the Dennes .
The Scraggies are mathematically eliminated.
Last edited:
Lily welcome to the cinccinos!The build that’s seeing the most usage is the Cinccino’s lead Druddigon build shown below, so if you’re playing the Cinccino’s look out ;)
Scrafty in SSPU
(whatever Creative Commons license this image is under I'm pretty sure I'm not violating it by using it in a Smogon PU Metagame Post so I won't make the effort to find the author and check the license yeah I'm a badass)
I'm not sure if this is the best place to make this post, but since the regular metagame thread is busy with vanilluksss talk and that my post will talk about PUPL, I guess this will do.
Ktut stop crying
Alright as my closest friends know I've been ranting about scrafty for... well for like a year and a half. I had been hoping it would get suspected before eggy alola, more recently I hoped it would get tried before guzzlord, and even more recently right after guzzlord's ban. Since vanilluxe is being tested and there seems to be talk about suspecting scyther or one of vanilluxe's icy friends or something, here's my opinion in the hope that scrafty gets tried in a foreseeable future.
Impact on teambuilding
Scrafty's impact on the metagame seems way too high to me, in particular building-wise. We might not see it in top usage, that's true. Maybe it's unoriginal, or there are too many scythers and bees as of late, or maybe that if you need to use scrafty AND scrafty counterplay you end up using the same teams, I dont know. But its impact on the meta is nasty, simply being able to switch on a ton of things, starting with gigalith, shrug off statuses, and then spamming knock off in a tier with no viable switchins is bad enough. It can also run a plethora of set and spreads, BU+rest, DD+pjab, sub, CB, LO, roseli (dd mostly). My focus will be spdef Bulkup, DD+jab no matter the item, and sub+3 atks to a lesser extent since they are the most common sets.
Counterplay, sorry I mispelled Ribombee
Counterplay to scrafty. Let's see. Ribombee, ribombee and ribombee ? That's close to the truth. The bee is a fine mon, it can aroma a sleeping gigalith, Revengekill a turtonator, play some mind games vs gallade... I don't believe it's a particulary good mon in such a fat meta infested with gigalith/steels/poison/zard/bulky stuff. Yet we have been seeing it over and over, why ? Because if you don't have it you're giving the win to scrafty kinda. It can outspeed DD sets, wall BU sets (but you need to be roosting a lot), so it makes sense to use it.
Bee usage (current PUPL)
https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/pupl-viii-replays-and-usage-statistics.3703839/#post-9292905
Bee is always #1 or #2 in usage. If you think that the main reason to use it is... well, scrafty, while being able to use aromatherapy and add some speed to the team and being cute (but we are tryhard smogonites we don't like cuteness), I think one should frown at it (I've done it so much that my eyebrows are now stuck in a V-shape that's terrible). If I'm wrong correct me, but bee does nothing particulary useful aside from that right?
Say it
I'll just speak my mind : I believe that having to use bee (or whimsi but no recovery rip) systematically is centralization plain and simple. You can try to use coil sanda but it loses to BU scrafty by PPstall unless you crit it, quag loses to PPstall too without curse. Scyther and Hurri Zard can RK scrafty but can't switch in. I think that's all I have to say, can't think of other counterplay to scrafty, and strats like going into physdef wishy to uturn into ribombee and thus protecting it from knock off is shaky at best and shouldnt be a thing, yet it is (see a replay showing it below). The same goes for coiling with sanda and EQ and when scrafty has to rest you go ribombee unless shed skin or unless you get crit or w/e.
Sub scrafty, wut, not even subpunch, who, how ?
Also have you seen Sub Scrafties being used these past PUPL weeks ? Why would anyone use that ? It doesn't beat quag (it actually does with pjab poison but since I clicked it 4 times and didnt get one and lost on the ladder because of that I'll say quag beats sub scrafty ok???), scyther wingbeats through the sub, why ? Because people realize the only real thing standing in the way of scrafty is the bee, so you sub, no need to predict, then jab it, then wreck havoc as you please : you don't actually need a set up move !
How romantic
I believe teambuilding in SSPU would be incredibly more healthy by removing scrafty, atm I personally just feel suffocated and I no longer believe in NU giving us solid counterplay to it (doublade and guzz made it even better actually).
No Scrafty No Peace, ah no it's Scrafty no Peace but it's not funny then (what it wasn't funny in the first place ?)
If you also dislike scrafty feel free to expand on the topic, I kept it to the minimum (aka need to use bee nonstop) my goal was just to voice my concern and frustration in this metagame because of scrafty. If you see me making fun of us gen8PUers by saying "ribombee the Wall" it's perfectly normal too, it's a great indirect jab at scrafty's impact on building that summarizes the situation as it has been for a year or so very well (jab or... poison jab? !!!!)
Replays
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8pu-641876 : here you can see a good example of the pressure scrafty puts on building and playing. Pdt needs to make a careful and somewhat systematic use of physdef wishy to switch into scrafty and uturn out into ribombee, protecting it from knock off : getting knocked sort of means insta death to sand/rocks/tspikes or at the very least being forced to spam roost. With this core comes scyther, which maintains pressure and momentum and doesnt let scrafty in, and gives the team a chance to win should ribombee be killed. Since I lose to aurorus I don't get to show a full scrafty battle but you get the idea, it's a pretty stupid game mostly around scrafty.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8pu-639024 : scyther+bee again, vs scrafty. When I watch this it pretty much feels like : will bee and scyther be able to keep scrafty at bay ? Ho3n's sub scrafty allows him to not need to predict and just sub and jab (roll to Kill after sandstorm unless defensive bee). Same thing than above, most of the game is about scrafty too.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8pu-568195 : old replay but that kinda summarizes the scrafty teambuilding situation : use a fairy (since there's like 2 viable and both are fast frail pixies your options are narrow) or lose. With TJ and the rest of the huntails last year I think we understood what scrafty really meant at that moment, until then it was "oh yeah annoying thing, but a fighting type (passimian) + hurri zard + pressure will be enough right ? Well no. Nowadays I guess it would be "oh no don't count on gallade as scrafty counterplay".
TLDR: suspect scrafty after vanilluxe and before moving to another potentially broken mon. Thanks
Attachments
I agree that Scrafty is centralizing, but I don't think this is necessarily a bad thing. In fact, Scrafty's #1 answer that you highlight happens to compress speed control, cleric, and wincon in 1, so is it really so bad that it finds its way onto teams so often? Moreover though, I do think Scrafty's lack of counters is somewhat overstated: 2 of Scyther, Hurri Zard, Charm Leech Eldegoss (yes it's viable), Coil Conda, NGas Taunt Weezing, or Colbur Taunt Jelli can be enough to keep it at bay depending on the rest of what your team looks like. Naturally, heavily Gigalith-reliant teams may want something like Ribombee because of its durability vs BU Scrafty which some other answers cannot claim as easily, but it would be wrong to treat these mons like they aren't checks. Coil Conda for example you say gets PP stalled, but this does not have to be the case when you can get a crit (which you have a very good shot at if you run Drill Run) and you can also get 3 decent rolls for the 3HKO if Scrafty has been knocked. Generally I think the counterplay to BU Scrafty is pretty straightforward and reliable enough as long as you don't make the mistake of using somewhat shakier checks on teams that gives Scrafty a lot of switchin opportunity. If there is any reason I would sympathize with a Scrafty suspect it would be the presence of offensive sets like Sub or DD, which can be more of a hassle to check if you can't keep Scrafty out. On the other hand, these sets lack recovery and may struggle to find opportunity to break or sweep against teams that can keep the pressure on them. In this way, they act somewhat similarly to a whole slew of niche breakers that have a small pool of checks and can catch some really strong matchups but can also fall flat on their face. I think any pro-ban argument against Scrafty would have to show how I am wrong in this regard and how Scrafty is in some way a lot more troublesome to deal with than things like Trevenant, Gallade, Vikavolt, or whatever. The idea that the BU set contributes to it being problematic I just cannot buy though.Impact on teambuilding
Scrafty's impact on the metagame seems way too high to me, in particular building-wise. We might not see it in top usage, that's true. Maybe it's unoriginal, or there are too many scythers and bees as of late, or maybe that if you need to use scrafty AND scrafty counterplay you end up using the same teams, I dont know. But its impact on the meta is nasty, simply being able to switch on a ton of things, starting with gigalith, shrug off statuses, and then spamming knock off in a tier with no viable switchins is bad enough. It can also run a plethora of set and spreads, BU+rest, DD+pjab, sub, CB, LO, roseli (dd mostly). My focus will be spdef Bulkup, DD+jab no matter the item, and sub+3 atks to a lesser extent since they are the most common sets.
Counterplay, sorry I mispelled Ribombee
Counterplay to scrafty. Let's see. Ribombee, ribombee and ribombee ? That's close to the truth. The bee is a fine mon, it can aroma a sleeping gigalith, Revengekill a turtonator, play some mind games vs gallade... I don't believe it's a particulary good mon in such a fat meta infested with gigalith/steels/poison/zard/bulky stuff. Yet we have been seeing it over and over, why ? Because if you don't have it you're giving the win to scrafty kinda. It can outspeed DD sets, wall BU sets (but you need to be roosting a lot), so it makes sense to use it.
Bee usage (current PUPL)
https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/pupl-viii-replays-and-usage-statistics.3703839/#post-9292905
Bee is always #1 or #2 in usage. If you think that the main reason to use it is... well, scrafty, while being able to use aromatherapy and add some speed to the team and being cute (but we are tryhard smogonites we don't like cuteness), I think one should frown at it (I've done it so much that my eyebrows are now stuck in a V-shape that's terrible). If I'm wrong correct me, but bee does nothing particulary useful aside from that right?
Say it
I'll just speak my mind : I believe that having to use bee (or whimsi but no recovery rip) systematically is centralization plain and simple. You can try to use coil sanda but it loses to BU scrafty by PPstall unless you crit it, quag loses to PPstall too without curse. Scyther and Hurri Zard can RK scrafty but can't switch in. I think that's all I have to say, can't think of other counterplay to scrafty, and strats like going into physdef wishy to uturn into ribombee and thus protecting it from knock off is shaky at best and shouldnt be a thing, yet it is (see a replay showing it below). The same goes for coiling with sanda and EQ and when scrafty has to rest you go ribombee unless shed skin or unless you get crit or w/e.
This doesn't seem like a great replay to showcase if you're trying to make the argument there's something wrong with Scrafty. I don't see a game that revolves around Scrafty at all; pdt is basically as prepped as you can be for the mon and is only really threatened by your Scyther, which is easily shown by the fact that after your Scyther goes down you can apply basically no pressure on his team anymore. Meanwhile, his own Scyther + Aurorus quickly forces you into a difficult position where you're forced to go Weezing on the former which then gives pdt a free U-Turn into Aurorus which in turn forces kills. If any mon is central in this game it is Scyther, not Scrafty whatsoever. For what it's worth, pdt would probably have been quite fine without Wishi to keep Bee's Boots too, Wishi just helps to ease the matchup even more.
This is a better replay to make your case and also showcases a more problematic set than the BU set, which is just not a problem whatsoever. I don't think omi's team is great though, it makes sense that Scrafty + VoltTurn would exploit a team so heavily reliant on Gigalith. It is also worth noting btw that Ribombee doesn't need all that much investment to dodge the OHKO after sand from Scrafty's Poison Jab and frankly you should always be running some bulk on it anyway, if people are too lazy to consider anything other than max/max on their fast offensive mons that's on them for not adapting. The bulk isn't for Scrafty alone btw, also helps with stuff like Lycanroc Accelerock, Defeatist Archeops etc.
This really is quite an old replay and I would figure if Scrafty is as broken as you suggest you'd be able to find another replay that works just as well from more recent times. I think at the time you could sorta get away with Hurri Zard + Scarf Pass to keep it in check though, just not in tandem with something as easily exploited as Palossand. The meta slowing down and fat Gigalith balance becoming as common as it has definitely shifted the meta towards more Ribombee so that you can keep checking Scrafty reliably in the long run, which of course inspires stuff like Sub Scrafty to take advantage of that.
I admit the replays I found are not the best, I just didn't make the effort to go over every PUPL replay : I sort of just wanted to say "hey someone is actually worried about scrafty here" and hoped someone else sharing my view would make a detailed post.
Now I just found a new PUPL replay and I hope it supports my claims : https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8pu-642034
Sensei has SD vally and CB sneasel and Magneton and Sandslash and whimsi so basically 4/5 things that easily pressure scrafty and yet he gets swept. One could maybe say he could have tried going whimsi on the DD, but if gorex clicked pjab he lost too.
Now about stallbreakers
I also do not consider vanilluxe/gallade/trev/vika that you mentioned as problematic, they are trouble vs fat teams like any breaker, when I use such teams I do struggle a lot vs those but to me it's just my problem for using eldegoss/weezing/sanda/gigalith/etc, stallbreakers beat stall and if balance teams atm are closer to stall with rest/aroma/regen/etc it's not the breakers' fault if they have free reign (I lost with a "meta" team vs glaceon yesterday, it destroys gigalith/doublade/eldegoss, it's not even really worse than the icecream, is it a problem too?).
I believe that if we are stuck in a meta where most people use awfully passive stuff like bee/gigalith/eldegoss etc it's due to the impact scrafty/zard have on it (remember zard alone forces to use rest on rock-types and as a consequence forces to use an aromatherapist = need to use bee/eldegoss = balance teams are more like stall atm = of course anything with 100+ atk/spatk can look scary). I do not consider scyther broken in the slightest either, as far as I'm concerned you can ban as much breakers as you want nothing will be solved until scrafty/zard are tackled (yeah I view zard as an issue).
Again that's just my opinion, but I'm kinda afraid of seeing soon posts like "magneton is broken" or "ban aurorus" or "abomasnow is an issue" or "suspect gallade" or "ban [insert whatever breaker]". On a first impression yeah, but imo the problem lies deeper, it's very unlikely a metagame needs getting rid of so many mons when a ton have already been banned.
Sorry if this sounded provocative
I'm very much aware this answer I'm writing is most likely polemic and can seem provocative, I just think we're headed in the wrong direction since guzzlord got banned and vanilluxe tested because a lot of random mons can work similarly, which imo shows the problem lies elsewhere and that it is our fundamentally flawed way of building with horribly passive mons such as the bee that puts us in this much trouble vs anything qualifying as a breaker.
Again I'm not trying to be provocative I'm just speaking my mind and saying what a gen8PU meta I'd enjoy is.
Peace and let me know if this isn't the place to discuss this topic.
THE ROAD TO THE PLAYOFFS
*format was stolen from this post by BigFatMantis
Was going to do this with five thoughts but since usage is delayed I'd like to get it up now so people know where they stand
Moo Moo Milkers
Record: 3-1-2
Points: 8
Differential: +4
The Milkers are sitting in a very nice spot being the only team to reach 8 points. This makes it very likely for them to make playoffs, with only the following scenario being grounds for an elimination:
1. Lose to the Dedennes 6-2 or worse this week
2. The Huntails and Cinccinos tie
3. The Ribombies beat or tie with the Scraggies
4. The Magmortars beat the Rends by any margin
OR
4. The Rends beat the Magmortars by 6-2 or more (the Rends are -7 behind the Milkers right now so they would have to make up that difference via a combination of a big win for them and a big loss for the Milkers).
It's extremely unlikely for all this to happen and even just a 5-3 loss would guarantee them playoffs as it would mean the Cinccinos can't overtake them with a tie due to differential.
Happy Huntails
Record: 2-1-3
Points: 7
Differential: +6
With 3 teams on 7 points, this is where things get interesting. The Huntails stand at the top of that bunch with their +6 point differential, which gives them a leg up on the other two who are at +2 and +1. But still, their future isn't certain and they need to perform this week to see their dream come true.
Here's how they get in:
Method #1: Win or Tie against the Cinccinos this week. Even though this may result in 5 teams at 8 or more points, a tie will guarantee they have a better differential than the Cinccinos and guarantee them in.
Method #2: Lose to the Cinccinos, and have only 1 of the Ribombies, Rends, Mags and Dedennes leapfrog them:
In a loss scenario, the Milkers who are at 8 points and the Cinccinos who would be at 9 points from a win would have to be guaranteed, and of course, we're assuming the Huntails make it. This would mean there can be only one other team that has more than 7 points or has 7 points and a great differential than the Huntails.
The Ribombies, Rends, Mags and Dedennes could all end up being one of those teams which makes it tricky for the Huntails. The Ribombies would need to win or tie, the Rends would need to win by any amount, the Mags would need to win or tie, and the Dedennes would need to win by a lot + have the Huntails lose by a lot (-3 vs +6 differential).
Since the Rends and Mags play each other, one of them is guaranteed to leapfrog the Huntails. This means the Ribombies, who play the last place Scraggies, would have to lose, and the Dedennes, who play the first place Miltanks, would have to avoid grabbing a huge win.
The Huntails are in a good place to secure playoffs, but there's a very real possibility of them not making it this week with a loss so they need to lock in to make sure that doesn't happen.
Cheeky Cinccinos
Record: 1-0-5
Points: 7
Differential: +2
The Cinccinos have continued to grind out ties all season and this puts them in a comfortable enough spot heading into the final week. Similar to the Huntails, all they need to do is perform and we'll be seeing them in the playoffs.
Method #1: Win against the Huntails. While it may be more in their nature to tie, the Cinccinos would love a win this week as it guarantees them in.
Method #2: Tie against the Huntails, and have either of the following two happen:
Ribombies lose or tie with the Scraggies
OR
Rends lose, tie, or win beat the Magmortars by 6-2 or less.
So I'd say the Cinccinos are pretty safe with a tie.
Method #3: Lose to the Huntails, and have only 1 of the Ribombies, Rends, Mags and Dedennes leapfrog them:
This is very similar to the Huntails situation, except the Cinccinos are in a much worse position in terms of point differential.
A win for the Ribombies would see them leapfrog the Cinccinos. Similarly, a tie and a Cinccinos loss of 6-2 or more would do it. A 5-3 loss with a tie would mean a tiebreak scenario between the two.
A win OR a tie and a 7-1 Cinccino loss would have the Rends go ahead.
A Magmortars win or tie by any margin would have them go ahead.
A Dedennes win + a Cinccinos loss that would make up the point differential (-3 vs +2) would have the Dedennes go ahead.
Since the Magmortars and Rends play each other, it would be best if one of them were to win as a tie would make it possible for them both to jump ahead.
Ultimately a loss would put the Cinccinos in a bad situations, and while they can still make it through with one, they'd much rather avoid it.
Detonating Ribombies
Record: 3-2-1
Points: 7
Differential: +1
The last of the 7 points teams, the Ribombies come in with a relatively weak +1 differential. However, like the other two teams, they can control their destiny by simply performing in this final week against the last place Scraggies.
Method #1: Win against the Scraggies. This would get them up to 9 points, a score only 3 teams can reach simultaneously.
Method #2: Tie with the Scraggies and have any of the following three happen:
A win in the Huntails vs Cinccinos series (doesn't matter who)
OR
A tie in the Huntails vs Cinccinos series and the Rends tie or lose.
OR
A tie in the Huntails vs Cinccinos series and the Rends win 5-3.
Method #3: Lose against the Scraggies and get leapfrogged by none of the Rends, Mags and Dennes
Provided the Cinccinos don't lose worse than the Ribombies (+2 vs +1 currently), the Ribombies can't afford to get leapfrogged by any team below them. As mentioned before, if the Cinccinos and Ribombies end up with the same points and differential it will go to tiebreak due to the W6 tie they had.
While unlikely the Huntails could lose worse than the Ribombies and fall below them if they lose 0-8 and the Ribombies lose 3-5, which would give the Bombies a bit of breathing room.
The Rends can leapfrog with a win or a tie and by the Ribombies losing 6-2 or worse (since the Rends won the head-to-head matchup W2).
The Mags can leapfrog with a win by any amount or a tie.
The Dedennes can leapfrog by beating the Milkers by enough to make up the point differential (-3 vs +1).
M.A.A.D. City Magmortars
Record: 2-2-2
Points: 6
Differential: +7
Outside of the top 4, we get to the teams that absolutely need to perform to advance. Thanks to crushing 6-2 and 6-1 weeks though, the Magmortars are actually in a nice enough spot as in most cases they can get by with a tie.
Method #1: Win against the Rends. Due to their differential, and depending on the results of other matchups, they could come first by doing this. Either way though, it guarantees them playoffs.
Method #2: Tie against the Rends, and have one of the Huntails, Cinccinos or Ribombies lose.
Since the Cinccinos play the Huntails, this is a very possible outcome, however, a tie in this matchup and the Ribombies tying or winning would eliminate the Magmortars.
A loss would mean elimination.
Vicious Rends
Record: 2-2-2
Points: 6
Differential: -3
A landslide 1-7 loss to the Huntails W3 means the Rends basically need to win to go through, and even then it's not certain.
Method #1: Win against the Magmortars, and then make it through on point difference or by certain losses:
If the Rends win and the Huntails and Cinccinos series, ends in one of the teams winning, the Rends are guaranteed in.
If the Rends win and the Ribombies lose, the Rends are guaranteed in.
If the Rends win and the Ribombies tie or win, and the Huntails vs Cinccinos series is a tie, the Rends need to win 6-2 to get in, edging out either the Rimbombies or the Cinccinos (depending on whether or not the Bombies win).
Method #2: Tie and have both of the Cinccinos or Ribombies implode, and a Dedennes loss.
If the Rends tie, then the Magmortars will still be ahead of them so they need the Ribombies AND the Cinccinos to both have 6-2 and 7-1 losses respectively (since they have the tiebreaker against the Bombies). Additionally, the Dedennes can't win as this would put them ahead of the Rends.
A tough spot for the Rends but at least they know that a big win will guarantee them their playoff spot.
Destructive Dedennes
Record: 1-2-3
Points: 5
Differential: -3
At 5 points, only a big win will do it for the Dedennes. Even then, they need a lot to go right. Here's how it lines up!
Method #1: Win big against the Milkers and:
Right now there are three teams on 7 and one on 8. The Dedennes, who can max out at 7, need some low-point differential teams to finish on 7 so that they can leapfrog them.
Unfortunately for them, the two 6-point teams, the Rends and Mags, play against each other, and with the Mags at a +7 differential, one of these two teams is guaranteed to stay ahead of the Dennes. This means they need two of the top 4 teams to stay behind.
The above mandates that the Ribombies lose to the Scraggies and that the Huntails vs Cinccinos series finishes in a win, preferably for the Huntails. If things unfolded like this, a 6-2 win for the Dedennes would always get them through.
Alternatively, if the Ribombies still lose and the Huntails lose instead, the Dedennes would have to make up the 9-point differential between the two with their own win score and the Huntails' loss score, an unlikely outcome.
The road is very tough for the Dedennes and they need two losses from the top 4 to make it happen, but it's still technically possible.
Unscrupulous Scraggies
Record: 0-4-2
Points: 2
Differential: -14
*format was stolen from this post by BigFatMantis
Was going to do this with five thoughts but since usage is delayed I'd like to get it up now so people know where they stand
Moo Moo Milkers Record: 3-1-2
Points: 8
Differential: +4
The Milkers are sitting in a very nice spot being the only team to reach 8 points. This makes it very likely for them to make playoffs, with only the following scenario being grounds for an elimination:
1. Lose to the Dedennes 6-2 or worse this week
2. The Huntails and Cinccinos tie
3. The Ribombies beat or tie with the Scraggies
4. The Magmortars beat the Rends by any margin
OR
4. The Rends beat the Magmortars by 6-2 or more (the Rends are -7 behind the Milkers right now so they would have to make up that difference via a combination of a big win for them and a big loss for the Milkers).
It's extremely unlikely for all this to happen and even just a 5-3 loss would guarantee them playoffs as it would mean the Cinccinos can't overtake them with a tie due to differential.
Happy Huntails Record: 2-1-3
Points: 7
Differential: +6
With 3 teams on 7 points, this is where things get interesting. The Huntails stand at the top of that bunch with their +6 point differential, which gives them a leg up on the other two who are at +2 and +1. But still, their future isn't certain and they need to perform this week to see their dream come true.
Here's how they get in:
Method #1: Win or Tie against the Cinccinos this week. Even though this may result in 5 teams at 8 or more points, a tie will guarantee they have a better differential than the Cinccinos and guarantee them in.
Method #2: Lose to the Cinccinos, and have only 1 of the Ribombies, Rends, Mags and Dedennes leapfrog them:
In a loss scenario, the Milkers who are at 8 points and the Cinccinos who would be at 9 points from a win would have to be guaranteed, and of course, we're assuming the Huntails make it. This would mean there can be only one other team that has more than 7 points or has 7 points and a great differential than the Huntails.
The Ribombies, Rends, Mags and Dedennes could all end up being one of those teams which makes it tricky for the Huntails. The Ribombies would need to win or tie, the Rends would need to win by any amount, the Mags would need to win or tie, and the Dedennes would need to win by a lot + have the Huntails lose by a lot (-3 vs +6 differential).
Since the Rends and Mags play each other, one of them is guaranteed to leapfrog the Huntails. This means the Ribombies, who play the last place Scraggies, would have to lose, and the Dedennes, who play the first place Miltanks, would have to avoid grabbing a huge win.
The Huntails are in a good place to secure playoffs, but there's a very real possibility of them not making it this week with a loss so they need to lock in to make sure that doesn't happen.
Cheeky Cinccinos Record: 1-0-5
Points: 7
Differential: +2
The Cinccinos have continued to grind out ties all season and this puts them in a comfortable enough spot heading into the final week. Similar to the Huntails, all they need to do is perform and we'll be seeing them in the playoffs.
Method #1: Win against the Huntails. While it may be more in their nature to tie, the Cinccinos would love a win this week as it guarantees them in.
Method #2: Tie against the Huntails, and have either of the following two happen:
Ribombies lose or tie with the Scraggies
OR
Rends lose, tie, or win beat the Magmortars by 6-2 or less.
So I'd say the Cinccinos are pretty safe with a tie.
Method #3: Lose to the Huntails, and have only 1 of the Ribombies, Rends, Mags and Dedennes leapfrog them:
This is very similar to the Huntails situation, except the Cinccinos are in a much worse position in terms of point differential.
A win for the Ribombies would see them leapfrog the Cinccinos. Similarly, a tie and a Cinccinos loss of 6-2 or more would do it. A 5-3 loss with a tie would mean a tiebreak scenario between the two.
A win OR a tie and a 7-1 Cinccino loss would have the Rends go ahead.
A Magmortars win or tie by any margin would have them go ahead.
A Dedennes win + a Cinccinos loss that would make up the point differential (-3 vs +2) would have the Dedennes go ahead.
Since the Magmortars and Rends play each other, it would be best if one of them were to win as a tie would make it possible for them both to jump ahead.
Ultimately a loss would put the Cinccinos in a bad situations, and while they can still make it through with one, they'd much rather avoid it.
Detonating Ribombies Record: 3-2-1
Points: 7
Differential: +1
The last of the 7 points teams, the Ribombies come in with a relatively weak +1 differential. However, like the other two teams, they can control their destiny by simply performing in this final week against the last place Scraggies.
Method #1: Win against the Scraggies. This would get them up to 9 points, a score only 3 teams can reach simultaneously.
Method #2: Tie with the Scraggies and have any of the following three happen:
A win in the Huntails vs Cinccinos series (doesn't matter who)
OR
A tie in the Huntails vs Cinccinos series and the Rends tie or lose.
OR
A tie in the Huntails vs Cinccinos series and the Rends win 5-3.
Method #3: Lose against the Scraggies and get leapfrogged by none of the Rends, Mags and Dennes
Provided the Cinccinos don't lose worse than the Ribombies (+2 vs +1 currently), the Ribombies can't afford to get leapfrogged by any team below them. As mentioned before, if the Cinccinos and Ribombies end up with the same points and differential it will go to tiebreak due to the W6 tie they had.
While unlikely the Huntails could lose worse than the Ribombies and fall below them if they lose 0-8 and the Ribombies lose 3-5, which would give the Bombies a bit of breathing room.
The Rends can leapfrog with a win or a tie and by the Ribombies losing 6-2 or worse (since the Rends won the head-to-head matchup W2).
The Mags can leapfrog with a win by any amount or a tie.
The Dedennes can leapfrog by beating the Milkers by enough to make up the point differential (-3 vs +1).
M.A.A.D. City Magmortars Record: 2-2-2
Points: 6
Differential: +7
Outside of the top 4, we get to the teams that absolutely need to perform to advance. Thanks to crushing 6-2 and 6-1 weeks though, the Magmortars are actually in a nice enough spot as in most cases they can get by with a tie.
Method #1: Win against the Rends. Due to their differential, and depending on the results of other matchups, they could come first by doing this. Either way though, it guarantees them playoffs.
Method #2: Tie against the Rends, and have one of the Huntails, Cinccinos or Ribombies lose.
Since the Cinccinos play the Huntails, this is a very possible outcome, however, a tie in this matchup and the Ribombies tying or winning would eliminate the Magmortars.
A loss would mean elimination.
Vicious Rends Record: 2-2-2
Points: 6
Differential: -3
A landslide 1-7 loss to the Huntails W3 means the Rends basically need to win to go through, and even then it's not certain.
Method #1: Win against the Magmortars, and then make it through on point difference or by certain losses:
If the Rends win and the Huntails and Cinccinos series, ends in one of the teams winning, the Rends are guaranteed in.
If the Rends win and the Ribombies lose, the Rends are guaranteed in.
If the Rends win and the Ribombies tie or win, and the Huntails vs Cinccinos series is a tie, the Rends need to win 6-2 to get in, edging out either the Rimbombies or the Cinccinos (depending on whether or not the Bombies win).
Method #2: Tie and have both of the Cinccinos or Ribombies implode, and a Dedennes loss.
If the Rends tie, then the Magmortars will still be ahead of them so they need the Ribombies AND the Cinccinos to both have 6-2 and 7-1 losses respectively (since they have the tiebreaker against the Bombies). Additionally, the Dedennes can't win as this would put them ahead of the Rends.
A tough spot for the Rends but at least they know that a big win will guarantee them their playoff spot.
Destructive DedennesRecord: 1-2-3
Points: 5
Differential: -3
At 5 points, only a big win will do it for the Dedennes. Even then, they need a lot to go right. Here's how it lines up!
Method #1: Win big against the Milkers and:
Right now there are three teams on 7 and one on 8. The Dedennes, who can max out at 7, need some low-point differential teams to finish on 7 so that they can leapfrog them.
Unfortunately for them, the two 6-point teams, the Rends and Mags, play against each other, and with the Mags at a +7 differential, one of these two teams is guaranteed to stay ahead of the Dennes. This means they need two of the top 4 teams to stay behind.
The above mandates that the Ribombies lose to the Scraggies and that the Huntails vs Cinccinos series finishes in a win, preferably for the Huntails. If things unfolded like this, a 6-2 win for the Dedennes would always get them through.
Alternatively, if the Ribombies still lose and the Huntails lose instead, the Dedennes would have to make up the 9-point differential between the two with their own win score and the Huntails' loss score, an unlikely outcome.
The road is very tough for the Dedennes and they need two losses from the top 4 to make it happen, but it's still technically possible.
Unscrupulous Scraggies Record: 0-4-2
Points: 2
Differential: -14