Monotype UU Mega-Thread

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scpinion

Life > Monotype... unfortunately :)
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus

art by Disbelief

Welcome to the Under Used Monotype Mega-thread!

This thread hosts the discussion, viability rankings, and sample teams for the metagame.

What is Monotype UU?
Like other Smogon Metagames, Monotype supports its own version of "Under Used" (UU). Pokemon that are used heavily on the Monotype ladder are banned in this metagame. Mono UU also weights stats from the three previous months, has a major tier update every three months, and utilizes "quick drops/rises".

How are usage stats calculated?
We count dual-type Pokemon as separate species based on what type of team their own. For example, Zapdos on a Flying team is counted separately from Zapdos on an Electric team. This means many Pokemon from the common types are banned, while the less common types retain most of their Pokemon.

What is the cutoff for UU?
Any Pokemon you're more than 50% likely to encounter on the Monotype Ladder in a given day of playing, assuming you play 25 battles a day, is banned from Monotype UU. This corresponds to a usage stat of ~2.73%.
Note: The standard Smogon tiers use a "once in 20 games" cutoff, opposed to "once in 25".

Monotype UU Banlist
In addition to the usage-based bans, Pokemon that are deemed too strong for the metagame are manually banned. i.e. the Border Line Pokemon from standard tiers. These bans are overseen by the Mono UU council.

Council
no one at the moment :(

scpinion manages the stats, pm him if you're interested in helping out!


This sounds cool! Where can I play it?
Mono UU is only playable through room tours in the Monotype Room on PS! (just pm a staff member about hosting one) or if someone else is willing to play with these restrictions in a standard Monotype battle (just ask for a Mono UU battle in chat). There is not a challenge option for Mono UU on PS!.
 
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scpinion

Life > Monotype... unfortunately :)
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
UU Monotype Viability Rankings


Pokemon are placed in either S, A, B and C with S only having Pokemon that can easily influence the game against a majority of type matchups and C pokemon that have a a little niche in the metagame.​
Rules
- You can suggest changes to the ranking of a Pokemon, but make sure to include a couple of sentences justifying your changes.
- If you disagree with someone's suggested changes, politely refute their argument and explain where you'd place the Pokemon in question.
- Suggested changes get at least a day for people to respond to before they'll be implemented.
- The Mono UU council has the final say in where a Pokemon is placed.

If the OP falls behind the thread, please shoot me a quick message!
S-rank
Armaldo
Yanmega
A-rank
Shuckle
Vivillon
Durant
Scolipede
Beedrill-Mega
B-rank
Accelgor
Crustle
Venomoth
C-rank
Escavalier
Ninjask
Shedinja
Volbeat
Illumise
S-rank
Hydreigon
A-rank
Krookodile
Houndoom-Mega
Sableye
Umbreon
B-rank
Honchkrow
Zoroark
Malamar
Absol-Mega
Scrafty
Skuntank
C-rank
Spiritomb
Cacturne
Liepard
S-rank
Kyurem
Tyrantrum
Latias
A-rank
Dragalge
Zygarde
Goodra
Druddigon
B-rank
Flygon
Noivern
Kingdra
Haxorus
C-rank
Altaria
S-rank
Thundurus-I
Magnezone
Zapdos

A-rank

Ampharos-Mega
Manectric-Mega
Raikou

B-rank
Electivire
Luxray
Stunfisk
Eelektross
Rotom-Mow
C-rank
Jolteon
Rotom-Heat
Galvantula
Minun
Plusle
S-rank
Gardevoir-Mega
A-rank
Diancie
Gardevoir
Slurpuff
Sylveon
Whimsicott
B-rank
Florges
Granbull
Togetic
Aromatisse
Carbink
C-rank
Mawile
Mr. Mime
S-rank
Lucario
Scrafty
A-rank
Mienshao
Toxicroak
B-rank
Chesnaught
Gallade
Hitmonlee
Machamp
Virizion
Sawk
Poliwrath
C-rank
Hitmontop
Pangoro
Medicham
Throh
S-rank
Volcarona
Rotom-Heat
A-rank
Chandelure
Darmanitan
Entei
Torkoal
B-rank
Houndoom-Mega
Delphox
Fletchinder
Arcanine
C-rank
Moltres
Camerupt-Mega
Emboar
S-rank
Mandibuzz
Tornadus-Therian
Gyarados
A-rank
Salamance
Aerodactyl-Mega
Pidgeot-Mega
Articuno
Staraptor
Gligar
B-rank
Hawlucha
Crobat
Aerodactyl
Honchkrow
Xatu
Tornadus
C-rank
Archeops
Braviary
Sigilyph
Moltres
S-rank
Sableye
A-rank
Jellicent
Trevenant
Hoopa
B-rank
Froslass
Cofagrigus
Banette-Mega
Doublade
Dusclops
Gorgeist-Super
Mismagius
C-rank
Spiritomb
Shedinja
S-rank
Ferrothorn
Breloom
A-rank
Serperior
Cradily
Sceptile-Mega
Amoonguss
Rotom-Mow
Whimsicott
B-rank
Shiftry
Roserade
Ludicolo
Celebi
Venusaur
Gorgeist-Super
Abomasnow-Mega

C-rank
Chesnaught
Lilligant
Leavanny
S-rank
Diggersby
Nidoking
A-rank
Gastrodon
Gliscor
Krookodile
Landorus
Zygarde
Seismitoad
B-rank
Camerupt-Mega
Steelix-Mega
Rhyperior
Swampert
Swampert-Mega
Torterra
Piloswine
C-rank
Donphan
Nidoqueen
Golem
S-rank
Avalugg
Mamoswine
A-rank
Weavile
Piloswine
Cloyster
Abomasnow-Mega
B-rank
Rotom-Frost
Glalie-Mega
Articuno
Froslass
Lapras
Walrein
C-rank
Jynx
Cryogonal
S-rank
Pidgeot-Mega
Meloetta
A-rank
Blissey
Staravia
Audino-Mega
Miltank
Porygon-Z
Ditto
Snorlax
Smeargle
B-rank
Exploud
Cincinno
Ambipom
C-rank
Kecleon
Slaking
Pyroar
Furfrou
S-rank
Scolipede
A-rank
Crobat
Weezing
Beedrill-Mega
Drapion
Skuntank
Nidoqueen
B-rank
Toxicroak
Dragalge
Golbat
Amoonguss
C-rank
Roserade
Quilfish
Ariados
S-rank
Gardevoir
Latias
A-rank
Gallade
Metagross
Alakazam
Cresselia
B-rank
Celebi
Medicham
Espeon
Starmie
Azelf
Delphox
C-rank
Malamar
Wobbufett
S-rank
Aggron-Mega
Tyranitar
A-rank
Cradily
Diancie
Aerodactyl-Mega
Omastar
Shuckle
Tyranitar-Mega
B-rank
Archeops
Rhyperior
Tyrantrum
C-rank
Aurorus
Armaldo
Barbaracle
S-rank
Empoleon
Lucario
Scizor

A-rank
Klefki
Metagross
Aggron
Durant
Magneton
Ferrothorn
Aggron-Mega
B-rank
Registeel
Steelix-Mega
Cobalion
C-rank
Forretress
Mawile
S-rank
Starmie
Empoleon
Suicune
A-rank
Gyarados
Swampert
Slowbro
Crawdaunt
Tentaruel
Lanturn
B-rank
Quagsire
Gastrodon
Feraligatr
Rotom-Wash
Slowbro
Kingdra
Alomomola
C-rank
Ludicolo
Kabutops
Blastoise-Mega
Jellicent
Vaporeon
Sharpedo
D-rank
Milotic
Quilfish
 
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scpinion

Life > Monotype... unfortunately :)
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Sample Teams
Some of these teams may be out of date relative to the current UU metagame. If you find one that contains a banned Pokemon, please post to this thread so it can be moved to the archive.

Special shoutout to Tylacto for organizing this. Thanks!

By Tylacto

Yanmega @ Choice Specs
Ability: Tinted Lens
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Air Slash
- Bug Buzz
- Giga Drain
- U-turn

Armaldo @ Assault Vest
Ability: Battle Armor
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Rock Blast
- Knock Off
- Aqua Jet
- Rapid Spin

Shuckle @ Mental Herb
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Toxic
- Stealth Rock
- Sticky Web
- Encore

Durant @ Choice Band
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- X-Scissor
- Superpower
- Rock Slide

Volbeat @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Substitute
- Baton Pass
- Tailwind
- Thunder Wave

Vivillon @ Focus Sash
Ability: Compound Eyes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Bug Buzz
- Hurricane
- Quiver Dance
- Sleep Powder

by Tylacto

Leavanny @ Focus Sash
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Magic Coat
- Swords Dance
- Sticky Web

Venomoth @ Focus Sash
Ability: Tinted Lens
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Bug Buzz
- Sludge Bomb
- Sleep Powder
- Quiver Dance

Armaldo @ Custap Berry
Ability: Battle Armor
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Rock Blast
- Knock Off
- Rapid Spin
- Stealth Rock

Crustle @ Lum Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stone Edge
- X-Scissor
- Earthquake
- Shell Smash

Scyther @ Eviolite
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Wing Attack
- Bug Bite
- Swords Dance
- Roost

Durant @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 28 Def / 228 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- X-Scissor
- Crunch
- Superpower
By Tylacto

Kingdra @ Razor Claw
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 88 HP / 252 SpA / 168 Spe
Modest Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Surf
- Agility
- Focus Energy

Druddigon @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Dragon Tail
- Sucker Punch
- Glare
- Stealth Rock

Dragalge @ Assault Vest
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Sludge Bomb
- Thunderbolt
- Scald

Kyurem @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Focus Blast

Flygon @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 100 Atk / 156 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Defog
- Roost

Tyrantrum @ Lum Berry
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Head Smash
- Earthquake
- Crunch
- Dragon Dance

by Tylacto

Zygarde @ Leftovers
Ability: Aura Break
EVs: 252 HP / 232 SpD / 24 Spe
Careful Nature
- Dragon Tail
- Earthquake
- Coil
- Substitute

Goodra @ Assault Vest
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 248 HP / 148 Atk / 112 SpA
Mild Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Earthquake
- Power Whip
- Ice Beam

Salamence @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Crunch
- Fire Blast

Druddigon @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Tail
- Glare
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt

Kyurem @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 56 HP / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Modest Nature
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Roost
- Substitute

Haxorus @ Lum Berry
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Poison Jab
By Fírnen

Gardevoir @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Thunderbolt
- Shadow Ball

Diancie @ Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Sleep Talk
- Moonblast
- Calm Mind
- Rest

Florges @ Leftovers
Ability: Flower Veil
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Wish
- Moonblast
- Aromatherapy
- Protect

Togetic @ Eviolite
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Calm Nature
- Defog
- Thunder Wave
- Roost
- Flamethrower

Granbull @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Play Rough
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat

Sylveon @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
Happiness: 0
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Adamant Nature
- Quick Attack
- Frustration
- Curse
- Wish

by Tylacto

Gardevoir-Mega @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Focus Blast
- Trick Room

Carbink @ Normal Gem
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Explosion
- Reflect
- Stealth Rock
- Trick Room

Granbull @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Play Rough
- Close Combat
- Earthquake
- Crunch

Sylveon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA / 0 Spe
- Hyper Voice
- Shadow Ball
- Psyshock
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Aromatisse @ Leftovers
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 252 HP / 144 Def / 112 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Moonblast
- Protect
- Wish
- Trick Room

Whimsicott @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- U-turn
- Leech Seed
- Encore
- Stun Spore
Mienshao @ Choice Band
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Knock Off
- Stone Edge
- U-turn

Conkeldurr @ Assault Vest
Ability: Guts
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Mach Punch
- Knock Off
- Ice Punch

Virizion @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Giga Drain
- Taunt
- Synthesis
- Calm Mind

Medicham @ Focus Sash
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Zen Headbutt
- Fake Out
- Bullet Punch

Lucario @ Life Orb
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Flash Cannon
- Aura Sphere
- Agility
- Dark Pulse

Scrafty @ Leftovers
Ability: Shed Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- Bulk Up
- Rest

By Tylacto

Conkeldurr @ Assault Vest
Ability: Guts
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Mach Punch
- Knock Off
- Ice Punch

Poliwrath @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 96 Def / 164 SpD
Careful Nature
- Bulk Up
- Waterfall
- Substitute
- Encore

Scrafty @ Leftovers
Ability: Shed Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 SpD
Careful Nature
- Crunch
- Bulk Up
- Amnesia
- Rest

Chesnaught @ Salac Berry
Ability: Bulletproof
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Seed Bomb
- Drain Punch
- Belly Drum
- Substitute

Mienshao @ Life Orb
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- U-turn
- High Jump Kick
- Stone Edge

Gallade (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 248 HP / 200 Atk / 60 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Zen Headbutt
- Shadow Sneak
- Swords Dance
by scpinion
I've already seen someone else using this team in a room tour, so I figure I'll share it. Just a solid balanced Flying team. I've won a bunch of room tours w/ it and brought it to MPL vs. Tylacto.

Crocune (if it has some speed ev's), Sableye, and Taunt Aero are major threats. You can play around an Ice team w/ proper play. Otherwise it has a pretty good matchup vs. the meta. Lots of fun to use!

Articuno @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 240 HP / 252 SpD / 16 Spe
Calm Nature
- Roost
- Freeze-Dry
- Heal Bell
- Toxic

Gligar @ Eviolite
Ability: Immunity
EVs: 240 HP / 252 Def / 16 Spe
Impish Nature
- Roost
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt
- Toxic

Mandibuzz @ Leftovers
Ability: Overcoat
EVs: 248 HP / 136 Def / 68 SpD / 56 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Roost
- Foul Play
- Taunt
- Defog

Aerodactyl-Mega @ Aerodactylite
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stone Edge
- Pursuit
- Earthquake
- Thunder Fang

Tornadus-Therian @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 168 HP / 88 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- U-turn
- Hurricane
- Knock Off
- Heat Wave

Salamence @ Expert Belt
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Lonely Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Fire Blast
- Earthquake

By Tylacto

Hawlucha @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 20 HP / 252 Atk / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Acrobatics
- High Jump Kick
- Swords Dance
- Substitute

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Waterfall
- Sleep Talk
- Rest
- Thunder Wave

Yanmega @ Life Orb
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Bug Buzz
- Air Slash
- Giga Drain
- Protect

Thundurus-Therian @ Assault Vest
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 240 SpA / 16 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Discharge
- Grass Knot
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Psychic

Mandibuzz @ Leftovers
Ability: Overcoat
EVs: 252 HP / 72 Def / 184 SpD
Careful Nature
- Foul Play
- Roost
- Toxic
- Defog

Aerodactyl @ Aerodactylite
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 252 Atk / 40 Def / 216 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
By Tylacto

Trevenant @ Lum Berry
Ability: Harvest
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 144 SpD
Impish Nature
- Horn Leech
- Will-O-Wisp
- Leech Seed
- Rest

Jellicent @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Magic Coat
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover

Sableye @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 72 SpD / 12 Spe
Impish Nature
- Foul Play
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Taunt

Doublade @ Eviolite
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gyro Ball
- Shadow Sneak
- Sacred Sword
- Swords Dance

Mismagius @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt
- Dazzling Gleam
- Nasty Plot

Golurk @ Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dynamic Punch
- Earthquake
- Curse
- Stealth Rock

by Tylacto

Trevenant @ Lum Berry
Ability: Harvest
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Horn Leech
- Will-O-Wisp
- Trick Room
- Rest

Jellicent @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Scald
- Trick Room
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover

Hoopa @ Life Orb
Ability: Magician
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Psyshock
- Trick Room

Doublade @ Eviolite
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Iron Head
- Shadow Sneak
- Sacred Sword
- Swords Dance

Banette @ Banettite
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Shadow Sneak
- Gunk Shot
- Shadow Claw
- Taunt

Golurk @ Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dynamic Punch
- Earthquake
- Curse
- Stealth Rock
by Tylacto

Abomasnow @ Abomasite
Ability: Soundproof
EVs: 248 HP / 64 Atk / 196 SpA
Lonely Nature
- Blizzard
- Ice Shard
- Earthquake
- Giga Drain

Serperior @ Life Orb
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Dragon Pulse
- Taunt

Breloom @ Focus Sash
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Mach Punch
- Rock Tomb
- Spore
- Swords Dance

Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 188 Def / 68 SpA
Bold Nature
- Sludge Bomb
- Foul Play
- Synthesis
- Spore

Cradily @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Recover
- Toxic
- Rock Slide

Whimsicott @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 180 Def / 76 SpD
Bold Nature
- Leech Seed
- Moonblast
- Encore
- Stun Spore

by Tylacto

Sceptile @ Sceptilite
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Giga Drain
- Dragon Pulse
- Focus Blast
- Substitute

Celebi @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 HP / 172 Def / 52 SpD / 36 Spe
Bold Nature
- Recover
- Substitute
- Nasty Plot
- Baton Pass

Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 188 Def / 68 SpA
Bold Nature
- Sludge Bomb
- Foul Play
- Synthesis
- Spore

Cradily @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Recover
- Toxic
- Rock Slide

Whimsicott @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Taunt
- Moonblast
- Encore
- Stun Spore

Breloom @ Focus Sash
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Mach Punch
- Rock Tomb
- Spore
- Swords Dance
by Fírnen

Piloswine @ Eviolite
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Adamant Nature
- Icicle Spear
- Ice Shard
- Stone Edge
- Stealth Rock

Nidoking @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Earth Power
- Sludge Wave
- Flamethrower

Gliscor @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Hyper Cutter
EVs: 76 HP / 252 Atk / 180 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Agility
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake

Gastrodon @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 248 HP / 112 Def / 148 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Toxic
- Recover
- Infestation

Zygarde @ Lum Berry
Ability: Aura Break
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Serious Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Extreme Speed

Diggersby @ Choice Band
Ability: Huge Power
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Serious Nature
- Earthquake
- Frustration
- Quick Attack
- Wild Charge

by Tylacto

Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 120 Def / 76 SpD / 60 Spe
Careful Nature
- Swords Dance
- Agility
- Substitute
- Baton Pass

Piloswine @ Eviolite
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Adamant Nature
- Icicle Spear
- Ice Shard
- Roar
- Stealth Rock

Krookodile @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Moxie
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Pursuit

Nidoking @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flamethrower
- Earth Power
- Sludge Wave
- Thunderbolt

Gastrodon @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 248 HP / 112 Def / 148 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Toxic
- Recover
- Infestation

Landorus-Therian @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 68 HP / 252 Atk / 188 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Swords Dance
- Rock Polish
by WishingJirachi7
Even with Kyurem-B banned, Ice still remains one of the better offensive monotypes with less threats to worry about that murdered it in standard (aside from the overpowered Fire especially as this team lacks Scarf Kyurem tho Cloyster can sweep when Heatran is weakened and Entei is removed.)

1ce Qu33n (Weavile) (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Icicle Crash
- Ice Shard
- Low Kick

Transport (Lapras) (F) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 208 HP / 252 SpA / 48 Spe
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Freeze-Dry
- Frost Breath
- Hidden Power [Fire]

IT'S X-MAS (Abomasnow-Mega) (M) @ Abomasite
Ability: Soundproof
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard

Pork Chops (Piloswine) (M) @ Eviolite
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 176 HP / 92 Atk / 240 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard
- Stone Edge

#1 C0ff33 Tabl3 (Avalugg) (M) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Avalanche
- Rapid Spin
- Earthquake / Toxic
- Recover

Nerf Fire!!! (Cloyster) (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Shell Smash
- Icicle Spear
- Ice Shard
- Rock Blast

by Tylacto

Avalugg (M) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Avalanche
- Rapid Spin
- Toxic
- Recover

Weavile (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Icicle Crash
- Ice Shard
- Low Kick

Walrein @ Choice Specs
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Frost Breath
- Signal Beam
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Rotom-Frost @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 248 SpD / 8 Spe
Calm Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split

Mamoswine @ Focus Sash
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Icicle Crash
- Ice Shard
- Stealth Rock

Cloyster (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 168 Atk / 88 SpA / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
- Shell Smash
- Icicle Spear
- Hydro Pump
- Rock Blast
by scpinion
Just a quick HO that I threw together—not sure if it is any good. Idea is to set webs and spam super strong Normal attacks so Pidgeot or Braviary can clean. Braviary is mainly there to punish someone that choses to Defog away the webs. The melo set was meant to check m-shark, so feel free to change it now that the shark is banned.

Smeargle @ Focus Sash
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Spore
- Stealth Rock
- Sticky Web
- Taunt

Pidgeot-Mega @ Pidgeotite
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Hurricane
- Heat Wave
- Roost
- Quick Attack

Porygon-Z @ Silk Scarf
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Tri Attack
- Thunderbolt
- Agility

Exploud @ Choice Specs
Ability: Scrappy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Boomburst
- Fire Blast
- Focus Blast
- Surf

Meloetta @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 8 HP / 76 Def / 232 SpA / 192 Spe
Modest Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Energy Ball

Braviary @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Tailwind
- Superpower
- Return
By Tylacto

Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Giga Drain
- Clear Smog
- Foul Play
- Spore

Toxicroak @ Life Orb
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Gunk Shot
- Drain Punch
- Sucker Punch
- Swords Dance

Scolipede @ Choice Band
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Megahorn
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Poison Jab

Nidoking @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Sludge Wave
- Earth Power
- Flamethrower
- Ice Beam

Drapion @ Air Balloon
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Cross Poison
- Pursuit
- Knock Off
- Taunt

Tentacruel @ Assault Vest
Ability: Liquid Ooze
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Acid Spray
- Rapid Spin
- Mirror Coat

by Tylacto

Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 60 Def / 196 SpD
Calm Nature
- Giga Drain
- Clear Smog
- Foul Play
- Spore

Weezing @ Black Sludge
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Flamethrower
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split
- Haze

Beedrill-Mega @ Beedrillite
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- U-turn
- Poison Jab
- Knock Off
- Protect

Nidoking @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Sludge Wave
- Earth Power
- Flamethrower
- Ice Beam

Drapion @ Air Balloon
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Cross Poison
- Pursuit
- Knock Off
- Taunt

Tentacruel @ Black Sludge
Ability: Liquid Ooze
EVs: 252 HP / 60 Def / 196 SpD
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Acid Spray
- Rapid Spin
- Toxic Spikes
by Tylacto

Azelf @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
- Explosion
- U-turn

Reuniclus @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Psyshock
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Trick Room

Gardevoir @ Life Orb
Ability: Trace
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Moonblast
- Psychic
- Thunderbolt
- Trick Room

Slowking @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Scald
- Fire Blast
- Toxic
- Trick Room

Malamar @ Leftovers
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Superpower
- Sleep Talk
- Rest
- Trick Room

Metagross @ Choice Band
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Meteor Mash
- Bullet Punch
- Ice Punch
- Zen Headbutt
by Tylacto

Tyranitar @ Assault Vest
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpA
Naughty Nature
- Stone Edge
- Fire Blast
- Pursuit
- Crunch

Cradily @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Giga Drain
- Toxic
- Recover
- Stealth Rock

Tyrantrum @ Lum Berry
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Head Smash
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Dragon Dance

Omastar @ Focus Sash
Ability: Weak Armor
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power [Grass]
- Shell Smash

Aerodactyl @ Aerodactylite
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Aerial Ace
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Taunt

Aurorus @ Choice Specs
Ability: Refrigerate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Freeze-Dry
- Earth Power
- Ancient Power

by Tylacto

Tyranitar-Mega @ Tyranitarite
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 8 Atk / 248 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stone Edge
- Crunch
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance

Cradily @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Giga Drain
- Toxic
- Recover
- Mirror Coat

Shuckle @ Mental Herb
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Sticky Web
- Toxic
- Encore

Omastar @ Focus Sash
Ability: Weak Armor
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Shell Smash

Aerodactyl @ Aerodactylite
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Aerial Ace
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Taunt

Diancie @ Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Calm Mind
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
by Tylacto

Scizor @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 232 HP / 252 Atk / 24 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Knock Off
- Superpower

Empoleon @ Air Balloon
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 252 HP / 228 SpD / 28 Spe
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Roar
- Defog
- Stealth Rock

Aggron @ Aggronite
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Heavy Slam
- Curse
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 92 Def / 164 SpD
Careful Nature
- Power Whip
- Leech Seed
- Thunder Wave
- Protect

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Zen Headbutt
- Iron Head
- Ice Punch
- U-Turn

Lucario @ Life Orb
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Aura Sphere
- Flash Cannon
- Vacuum Wave
- Nasty Plot

by Tylacto

Klefki @ Light Clay
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Spikes
- Thunder Wave

Lucario @ Life Orb
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Aura Sphere
- Flash Cannon
- Vacuum Wave
- Nasty Plot

Cobalion @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Volt Switch
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt

Aggron @ Air Balloon
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Head Smash
- Earthquake
- Ice Punch
- Autotomize

Magneton @ Choice Specs
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Grass]

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Zen Headbutt
- Iron Head
- Ice Punch
- U-turn

By Fírnen

Jellicent @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 48 Def / 212 Spe
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Will-O-Wisp
- Taunt

Sableye @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 240 Def / 20 Spe
Impish Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Taunt
- Foul Play

Chandelure @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Fire Blast
- Energy Ball
- Trick

Gourgeist-Super @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Insomnia
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Leech Seed
- Will-O-Wisp
- Synthesis
- Seed Bomb

Doublade @ Eviolite
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Sacred Sword
- Shadow Sneak
- Swords Dance
- Gyro Ball

Gengar @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dazzling Gleam
- Sludge Wave
- Thunderbolt
- Shadow Ball
By AV8

Reject (Shuckle) (M) @ Red Card
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Encore
- Knock Off
- Stealth Rock
- Sticky Web

The Mirror (Terrakion) @ Choice Band
Ability: Justified
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge

Grande (Tyranitar) (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sand Stream
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Ice Beam
- Stone Edge
- Fire Blast
- Crunch

Creation (Cradily) @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Toxic
- Stockpile
- Giga Drain
- Recover

Mars (Aggron) @ Aggronite
Ability: Sturdy
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 170 HP / 86 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Heavy Slam
- Curse
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Koby Not Kobe (Aurorus) (M) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Refrigerate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Freeze-Dry
- Nature Power
- Ancient Power
- Earth Power

By Tylacto
Cacturne @ Life Orb
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Seed Bomb
- Sucker Punch
- Drain Punch
- Swords Dance

Sableye @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 168 Def / 76 SpD / 12 Spe
Bold Nature
- Foul Play
- Will-O-Wisp
- Taunt
- Recover

Krookodile @ Focus Sash
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off

Skuntank @ Black Sludge
Ability: Aftermath
EVs: 252 HP / 40 Atk / 216 SpD
Careful Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Poison Jab
- Haze
- Defog

Zoroark @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Focus Blast
- Flamethrower
- Trick

Weavile @ Lum Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Ice Shard
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance

By Tylacto

Drapion @ Air Balloon
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Pursuit
- Cross Poison
- Toxic Spikes
- Taunt

Krookodile @ Focus Sash
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Knock Off
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock

Hydreigon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dark Pulse
- Fire Blast
- U-turn

Weavile @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Knock Off
- Ice Shard
- Low Kick

Honchkrow @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Sucker Punch
- Night Slash
- Tailwind

Sharpedo @ Life Orb
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Destiny Bond
- Protect

By Tylacto

Zapdos @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 236 HP / 252 SpD / 20 Spe
Calm Nature
- Discharge
- Toxic
- Roost
- Defog

Magnezone @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sturdy
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Volt Switch
- Mirror Coat

Ampharos-Mega @ Ampharosite
Ability: Mold Breaker
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Volt Switch
- Dragon Pulse
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Rotom-Heat @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 204 Def / 52 Spe
Bold Nature
- Volt Switch
- Overheat
- Will-O-Wisp
- Trick

Luxray @ Choice Band
Ability: Guts
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Wild Charge
- Crunch
- Superpower
- Volt Switch

Thundurus @ Life Orb
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Grass Knot
- Thunderbolt

Galvantula @ Focus Sash
Ability: Compound Eyes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunder
- Bug Buzz
- Energy Ball
- Sticky Web

Electivire @ Life Orb
Ability: Vital Spirit
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Wild Charge
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake
- Taunt

Thundurus (M) @ Choice Band
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Wild Charge
- Knock Off
- Superpower
- U-turn

Magnezone @ Choice Specs
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Flash Cannon
- Hidden Power [Grass]

Zapdos @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 244 SpD / 16 Spe
Calm Nature
- Volt Switch
- Tailwind
- Roost
- Defog

Manectric @ Manectite
Ability: Lightning Rod
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Flamethrower
- Hidden Power [Ice]

by Rimz
Rotom-Heat @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Trick
- Volt Switch
- Overheat
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Victini @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Victory Star
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- V-create
- Zen Headbutt
- Bolt Strike
- U-turn

Ninetales @ Heat Rock
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast
- Nasty Plot
- Solar Beam
- Toxic

Heatran @ Air Balloon
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 184 SpA / 72 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power
- Flash Cannon
- Roar

Entei @ Choice Band
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Extreme Speed
- Sacred Fire
- Stone Edge
- Bulldoze

Torkoal @ Custap Berry
Ability: White Smoke
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Lava Plume
- Rapid Spin
- Yawn
- Stealth Rock

By Tylacto

Ninetales @ Heat Rock
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
- Nasty Plot
- Toxic

Houndoom @ Houndoominite
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Flamethrower
- Dark Pulse
- Nasty Plot
- Destiny Bond

Emboar @ Choice Band
Ability: Reckless
EVs: 172 HP / 252 Atk / 84 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Superpower
- Wild Charge
- Earthquake

Heatran @ Air Balloon
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 112 SpA / 112 SpD / 32 Spe
Calm Nature
- Lava Plume
- Flash Cannon
- Solar Beam
- Earth Power

Torkoal @ Air Balloon
Ability: White Smoke
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Lava Plume
- Stealth Rock
- Rapid Spin
- Yawn

Victini @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Victory Star
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- V-create
- Bolt Strike
- U-turn
- Zen Headbutt

By Tylacto

Torkoal @ Air Balloon
Ability: White Smoke
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Lava Plume
- Rapid Spin
- Stealth Rock
- Yawn

Entei @ Choice Band
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Sacred Fire
- Iron Head
- Stone Edge
- Bulldoze

Volcarona @ Focus Sash
Ability: Flame Body
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Fiery Dance
- Bug Buzz
- Giga Drain
- Quiver Dance

Ninetales @ Heat Rock
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
- Nasty Plot
- Toxic

Camerupt @ Cameruptite
Ability: Solid Rock
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Ancient Power
- Solar Beam

Rotom-Heat @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Overheat
- Trick

By Tylacto

Audino @ Audinite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Dazzling Gleam
- Sleep Talk
- Rest
- Calm Mind

Blissey @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Soft-Boiled
- Seismic Toss
- Thunder Wave
- Stealth Rock

Staravia @ Eviolite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Brave Bird
- Feather Dance
- Roost
- Defog

Diggersby @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Huge Power
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Frustration
- Earthquake
- Wild Charge
- U-turn

Meloetta @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 200 Def / 60 SpD
Bold Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Calm Mind
- Substitute

Exploud @ Choice Specs
Ability: Scrappy
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
- Boomburst
- Fire Blast
- Focus Blast
- Ice Beam

by Tylacto

Alakazam @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Psyshock
- Focus Blast
- Energy Ball
- Calm Mind

Deoxys-Speed @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
- Spikes
- Recover

Meloetta @ Assault Vest
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Shadow Ball
- Dazzling Gleam
- Thunderbolt

Slowking @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Fire Blast
- Slack Off
- Thunder Wave

Delphox @ Choice Specs
Ability: Magician
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast
- Psychic
- Grass Knot
- Trick

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- Heart Stamp
- Ice Punch
- U-turn

by Tylacto

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Crabhammer
- Knock Off
- Aqua Jet
- Swords Dance

Suicune @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Rest
- Substitute
- Calm Mind

Cloyster @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 252 Atk / 20 Def / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Spear
- Ice Shard
- Razor Shell
- Rock Blast

Empoleon @ Leftovers
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 252 HP / 228 SpD / 28 Spe
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Roar
- Stealth Rock
- Defog

Gastrodon @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Recover

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Psyshock
- Ice Beam
- Rapid Spin

by Tylacto

Rotom-Wash @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 244 SpD / 8 Spe
Calm Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Volt Switch
- Will-O-Wisp
- Rest

Seismitoad @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 236 Def / 20 Spe
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Scald
- Toxic
- Stealth Rock

Cloyster @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 252 Atk / 20 Def / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Spear
- Ice Shard
- Razor Shell
- Rock Blast

Gyarados @ Lum Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Bounce
- Dragon Dance

Ludicolo @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Giga Drain
- Scald
- Focus Blast
- Rain Dance

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Psyshock
- Ice Beam
- Rapid Spin
If you find a team in the archive that is actually legal, let us know!
 
Last edited:

scpinion

Life > Monotype... unfortunately :)
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
The initial Monotype UU Viability Rankings have been published in the 2nd post of this thread.

I want to emphasize these are the initial rankings. We want you guys feedback!

Feel free to suggest changes based on your experiences in room tours. When doing so, make sure to include a couple sentences to justify the change.
 
Last edited:

Vid

Our life is what our thoughts make it
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
UU Monotype Seismitoad (Water) Unranked--->B or A

Seismitoad is the best stealth rocker on water in UU Monotype. Also with Swampert not being in the tier and it having respectable bulk and the same exact typing. This should be at least B rank because of lack of viable water type stealth rockers in Mono UU. Also a bonus it can abuse rain from rain dance support and can also be ran offensively with a decent movepull as well. This the "substitute" to Swampert in UU Monotype so it should be ranked.
 
MONO UU ROCK



Reject (Shuckle) (M) @ Red Card
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Encore
- Knock Off
- Stealth Rock
- Sticky Web


The Mirror (Terrakion) @ Choice Band
Ability: Justified
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge


Grande (Tyranitar) (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sand Stream
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Ice Beam
- Stone Edge
- Fire Blast
- Crunch



Creation (Cradily) @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Toxic
- Stockpile
- Giga Drain
- Recover



Mars (Aggron) @ Aggronite
Ability: Sturdy
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 170 HP / 86 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Heavy Slam
- Curse
- Rest
- Sleep Talk



Koby Not Kobe (Aurorus) (M) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Refrigerate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Freeze-Dry
- Nature Power/Hidden Power Fire
- Ancient Power
- Earth Power

Reject (Shuckle) (M) @ Red Card
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Encore
- Knock Off
- Stealth Rock
- Sticky Web

The Mirror (Terrakion) @ Choice Band
Ability: Justified
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge

Grande (Tyranitar) (M) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sand Stream
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Ice Beam
- Stone Edge
- Fire Blast
- Crunch

Creation (Cradily) @ Leftovers
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Toxic
- Stockpile
- Giga Drain
- Recover

Mars (Aggron) @ Aggronite
Ability: Sturdy
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 170 HP / 86 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Heavy Slam
- Curse
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Koby Not Kobe (Aurorus) (M) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Refrigerate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Freeze-Dry
- Nature Power
- Ancient Power
- Earth Power

tagging Dream Eater Gengar to add to sample teams
 
Last edited:
UU Monotype Seismitoad (Water) Unranked--->B or A

Seismitoad is the best stealth rocker on water in UU Monotype. Also with Swampert not being in the tier and it having respectable bulk and the same exact typing. This should be at least B rank because of lack of viable water type stealth rockers in Mono UU. Also a bonus it can abuse rain from rain dance support and can also be ran offensively with a decent movepull as well. This the "substitute" to Swampert in UU Monotype so it should be ranked.
I'm not agree at 100% with that, for me, Empoleon is the best Stealth Rocker, Hazard Control on Water UU Monotype.
He's already very used in Standard Monotype.

And for Bulk, Quaggsire is better. Seismitoad is better, like u said, on Rain Team and he's the most offensive Ground/Water type in UU Water.
But I don't think for the moment than Rain Water teams are the best choice for Water type.
Cancer Water and Regular Water is more efficient in my opinion.
That's why he's at the moment B Rank.

Ps: Electric immunity is already given by Lanturn and this one doesn't really hurted by Grass Knot (Thundurus, Heliolisk) like Seismitoad is.



Some UU Mono sample teams:

• Fighting
http://pastebin.com/vvcVtiT9

• Fairy
http://pastebin.com/QFcWLaiX

• Ghost
http://pastebin.com/FnRXqvQT
 
Last edited:

scpinion

Life > Monotype... unfortunately :)
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
New Mono UU banlist: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1EeOb3dxhG1Cqtd5UuGK3HcobQbb8phr45sVXKOGfUMY/pubhtml#

Note this banlist will be used for W1 of MonoPL. If something needs to be banned, then it will happen for week 2.
There's been quite a bit of backlash from this, so we're gonna hold off on the new banlist until week 2 of MPL. This gives the council, and the room, a chance to play test some of the new 'mons and figure out if they're broken. Sorry about the change...

The January 2016 banlist for Mono UU will be used for W1 of Mono PL.
 
(Please note this post is a discussion about UU Mono, not normal Monotype.)

There's been quite a bit of backlash from this, so we're gonna hold off on the new banlist until week 2 of MPL. This gives the council, and the room, a chance to play test some of the new 'mons and figure out if they're broken. Sorry about the change...

The January 2016 banlist for Mono UU will be used for W1 of Mono PL.
Yeah I agree that's probably the right call considering the short notice for players although I wouldn't worry about it too much.

I know I'm not the only person who feels this way so I just wanted to raise a point about the Mono UU system as a whole. I understand the tier is based off of the usage stats which I think is the right base idea because well... it is meant to be UnderUsed after all, I just feel there's a point where the council have to step in and balance the tier.

After looking over the new changes the tier looked as if it's going to be pretty unstable to say the least, but then it was just a matter of principles that came to mind. By allowing the main Monotype Tier to completely control the banlist of UU Mono, Sample teams and Viability Rankings will need to be updated on a monthly basis, which whether it's for the better or not I think most users would agree can be extremely inconveniant, forcing another round of team building but also making it more difficult for newer players to get a grip of the tier. I understand the sub-tier is probably not aimed at newer players, but it's not going to be enjoyable for any player if the second they feel like they're getting used to a tier it shifts completely.

I just wanted to put forward the suggestion that rather than having the Monotype Usage Stats have instant control over the UU Mono banlist, have each of the notable changes that should occur due to usage, go through the council to see whether they feel the change should actually happen. For example some of the changes between January and February I'm obviously not a huge fan of, but I'm happy to address them with some short reasoning to give the council some food for thought.

(See below)

Ok so these suggested changes are of course a matter of opinion and not fact so please don't get angry with me anything like that. I would supply replays to give more reasoning for each of these, but unfortunately not everybody plays the tier and I haven't been playing it long enough to stockpile any replays up.

(Ban Manaphy?) Ok this one really confused me when I realized it wasn't on the banned list. I mean water on the whole has had very little bans because of how the banning system works. Because water is so diverse, not many mons have overwhelming usage because of the variety there is, and therefore not many mons are banned, only being Politoad, Keldeo, Azumarill and the new addition of Cloyster.

But we've understood for a while in mono that just because a mon isn't used much, that doesn't mean that it's not broken, for example how Mega Altaria and Charizard X were banned on both types despite only being used considerably on one each. But here's Manaphy, being one of the only mons with access to Tail Glow, and in a tier where there are far less checks to it, and where Water is already one of the strongest types, it doesn't take a huge explanation to understand how effective this can be.

(Unban Skuntank/Drapion for Poison?) Ok it's been a long term feature of Poison teams that there will almost always need to be a Poison/Dark mon to provide a Psychic immunity. I understand there's still Scolipede allowed to threaten Psychic types, but what about Psychic moves in general? None of these mons are threatening on their own, and I just personally find it really harsh that not just one but both of them have been banned on top of 3 other mons in one month, leaving Poison with no psychic immunities.

(Unban Torkoal?) I think this is a fine example where a mon has been banned purely off how the system works with usage. I think it's fair to say Torkoal is far from threatening in any way, unless you want to run a Shell Smash set that badly.. But the point here is that Fire, a type that struggles with hazards enough in the Monotype meta itself, namely Stealth Rocks, is having it's only other viable form of hazard removal away from it. Charizard Y is banned an I agree with that, but that's a Defogger, and without Torkoal if I'm not mistaken that leaves Fire with just normal Charizard, and Moltres, both being 4x weak to rocks. It's not possible to argue that Torkoal makes any other types unusable, but in a meta where Rock is a really strong type and hazards are key, I think Fire at least deserves to keep it's only rapid spinner.

(Ban Garchomp for Ground?) I understand Mamoswine and Seismitoad were also unbanned with Garchomp in the recent changes, however I feel Seismitoad doesn't have a huge impact on the UU meta, and whilst Mamoswine is very threatening, Ground could certainly do with it due to the viability of Grass, and I also just don't feel it compares to the core breaking power of Garchomp, particularly it's mega. Now mega Garchomp is already hugely viable in the normal Monotype meta, in particular breaking Steel's core of Heatran and Skarmory. However take Garchomp down to UU Mono where it doesn't actually need to break teams because parts of their usual cores a banned, and this is where I feel it can simply do too much damage. This one I think is potentially worth more of a test before action than the others as I understand the support for Sand Force won't be there (barring Hippopotas), but you can see my reasoning.

(Unban Chandelure for Ghost?) Ok the first thing I think is relevant here is to have a look at the viability rankings for Ghost in UU and see the special attackers available. Then I considered that Gengar was also banned with Chandelure and Golurk in the recent changes, but it's Chandelure that I feel more strongly about due to how fundamental it is for Ghost teams. Without Aegislash and Sableye, Ghost has lost a considerable amount of reliability in its usual Defensive core, so here is where you'd think it could fall back on it's powerful offensive mons. However without Chandelure, as far as I know there is no mon that gets access to any Fire type move aside from HP Fire, and Fire being such an important attacking type for a team to have, severely hinders ghost effectively into the realm of unusable I feel. Maybe a bit extreme, but another reason why I feel Chandelure should stay is because of how for the most part it's predictable, its sub-par speed stat often forcing it to hold Choice Scarf, and this means that most types have a Special wall that can switch into it, and therefore I hardly think it's going to make Ghost dominate the tier.

(Unban Zapdos on Electric?) Surprise surprise this came up... I'd just like to point out that I think a Rotom-Wash ban is effectively perfect for Electric, I understand it was one of the best types in the Mono UU tier and could do with the small nerf, because it can still function decently well with a different Rotom form. However what I really don't think it can function almost at all without, is Zapdos. i understand if often causes large problems for Bug, but it's similar to Fire in terms of Hazard removal, except this really is the only form of Hazard removal for the entire type. Not only that but Zapdos is one of the only mons in the type with access to reliable recovery in Roost, making it one of the only mons suitable for being a Wall. Without it, Electric would be forced into the reals of HO, with Taunt Electivire/Thundurus/Emolga to prevent hazards, and would likely have to be a team dedicated to Sticky Webs.

(Ban Mega Venusaur for Grass?) Ok so Grass was already a fantastic type to use within the UU meta without it's main staple mon but then I see usage brings it back... Regardless of UU Monotype, in the normal tier alone, lots of types need to run specific sets just to be able to check Mega Venusaur, yet in UU Monotype when these potential checks are now banned, the sets become more desperate and the centralization begins. Mega Venu may be worth trying in the tier, but I really feel it would hugely influence the meta for a Type that doesn't actually need it.

There are other points about potentially nerfing hugely effective types in the tier such as thinking about Kyurem-B on Ice and Terrakion on Rock, simply because these mons will never come up for discussion simply because of how the usage system works, and how Ice and Rock are rarely used in the Monotype tier itself.


All in all, I want UU Monotype to be a unique tier that is enjoyable to play, not where it's only a reflection of the Monotype tier itself just with different types being used far more than others, and where you don't need to change your teams on a monthly basis. Hopefully discussing the points made above will help achieve that :) Thanks for reading, I'll tag scpinion just in case you want this moved to another thread, and that'll be all.
 

scpinion

Life > Monotype... unfortunately :)
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Ok, the Mono UU banlist is finally updated for Feb. Apologies for the delay, we had quite a bit to iron through this month.

Moving forward, we'll be doing the UU tiering using the same policy Smogon does, but with a "once in 25 games" opposed to a "once in 20 games" cutoff. This corresponds to a usage stat of ~2.73%, opposed to ~3.41%.

The 3 month cycle will begin next month, so "quick drops/rises" (with higher cutoffs) wouldn't start until April.

To go along with this, the council are wanting to "suspect" Meloetta (psychic) , Scizor (steel), and Excadrill (steel). If you have good replays, or strong opinions, on those pokemon then please send the council (scpinion, Fírnen, Tylacto, & Articuno I) a message here on Smogon!

You can view the upadted UU banlist here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1EeOb3dxhG1Cqtd5UuGK3HcobQbb8phr45sVXKOGfUMY/edit?usp=sharing

Code:
 + ---- + -------------------------- + ------- +
 | Rank | Pokemon                    | Usage % |
 + ---- + ------------------------ - + ------- +
 | 1    | Skarmory (flying)          |  7.972% | 
 | 2    | Keldeo (fighting)          |  7.326% | 
 | 3    | Victini (psychic)          |  7.061% | 
 | 4    | Heatran (steel)            |  6.701% | 
 | 5    | Terrakion (fighting)       |  6.170% | 
 | 6    | Dragonite (flying)         |  6.164% | 
 | 7    | Dragonite (dragon)         |  5.964% | 
 | 8    | Volcarona (bug)            |  5.957% | 
 | 9    | Kyurem-Black (dragon)      |  5.942% | 
 | 10   | Skarmory (steel)           |  5.778% | 
 | 11   | Hoopa-Unbound (psychic)    |  5.490% | 
 | 12   | Slowbro (psychic)          |  5.419% | 
 | 13   | Garchomp (dragon)          |  5.416% | 
 | 14   | Scizor-Mega (steel)        |  5.320% | 
 | 15   | Breloom (fighting)         |  5.013% | 
 | 16   | Togekiss (flying)          |  4.996% | 
 | 17   | Bisharp (dark)             |  4.964% | 
 | 18   | Galvantula (bug)           |  4.908% | 
 | 19   | Mandibuzz (dark)           |  4.856% | 
 | 20   | Gengar (poison)            |  4.840% | 
 | 21   | Zapdos (flying)            |  4.739% | 
 | 22   | Azumarill (water)          |  4.708% | 
 | 23   | Keldeo (water)             |  4.675% | 
 | 24   | Landorus-Therian (flying)  |  4.642% | 
 | 25   | Infernape (fighting)       |  4.584% | 
 | 26   | Charizard-Mega-Y (flying)  |  4.560% | 
 | 27   | Charizard-Mega-Y (fire)    |  4.553% | 
 | 28   | Venusaur-Mega (poison)     |  4.472% | 
 | 29   | Hoopa-Unbound (dark)       |  4.468% | 
 | 30   | Gardevoir-Mega (psychic)   |  4.390% | 
 | 31   | Gallade-Mega (fighting)    |  4.302% | 
 | 32   | Latios (dragon)            |  4.293% | 
 | 33   | Hippowdon (ground)         |  4.164% | 
 | 34   | Excadrill (ground)         |  4.151% | 
 | 35   | Sableye-Mega (dark)        |  4.131% | 
 | 36   | Tyranitar (dark)           |  4.129% | 
 | 37   | Mew (psychic)              |  4.061% | 
 | 38   | Infernape (fire)           |  4.009% | 
 | 39   | Scizor (bug)               |  3.946% | 
 | 40   | Hydreigon (dragon)         |  3.942% | 
 | 41   | Bisharp (steel)            |  3.926% | 
 | 42   | Magnezone (steel)          |  3.776% | 
 | 43   | Aegislash (ghost)          |  3.720% | 
 | 44   | Gengar (ghost)             |  3.718% | 
 | 45   | Hawlucha (fighting)        |  3.708% | 
 | 46   | Pinsir-Mega (bug)          |  3.699% | 
 | 47   | Gyarados-Mega (flying)     |  3.582% | 
 | 48   | Nidoking (poison)          |  3.507% | 
 | 49   | Staraptor (normal)         |  3.502% | 
 | 50   | Latios (psychic)           |  3.490% | 
 | 51   | Heracross (bug)            |  3.456% | 
 | 52   | Latias-Mega (dragon)       |  3.437% | 
 | 53   | Doublade (steel)           |  3.437% | 
 | 54   | Tentacruel (poison)        |  3.412% | 
 | 55   | Sableye-Mega (ghost)       |  3.404% | 
 | 56   | Forretress (bug)           |  3.322% | 
 | 57   | Azumarill (fairy)          |  3.285% | 
 | 58   | Chandelure (ghost)         |  3.259% | 
 | 59   | Victini (fire)             |  3.243% | 
 | 60   | Klefki (fairy)             |  3.233% | 
 | 61   | Heatran (fire)             |  3.194% | 
 | 62   | Landorus (ground)          |  3.161% | 
 | 63   | Cobalion (fighting)        |  3.114% | 
 | 64   | Politoed (water)           |  3.084% | 
 | 65   | Golurk (ghost)             |  3.015% | 
 | 66   | Togekiss (fairy)           |  2.968% | 
 | 67   | Chansey (normal)           |  2.962% | 
 | 68   | Porygon2 (normal)          |  2.948% | 
 | 69   | Conkeldurr (fighting)      |  2.883% | 
 | 70   | Medicham-Mega (fighting)   |  2.867% | 
 | 71   | Gliscor (flying)           |  2.861% | 
 | 72   | Thundurus (flying)         |  2.848% | 
 | 73   | Crawdaunt (dark)           |  2.846% | 
 | 74   | Heracross (fighting)       |  2.825% | 
 | 75   | Gyarados-Mega (water)      |  2.813% | 
 | 76   | Jirachi (psychic)          |  2.785% | 
 | 77   | Thundurus-Therian (flying) |  2.770% | 
 | 78   | Lopunny-Mega (normal)      |  2.763% | 
 | 79   | Mamoswine (ground)         |  2.741% |
 
-----Cutoff, 1 in 25 ladder games, ~2.735%-----

 | 80   | Zapdos (electric)          |  2.724% | 
 | 81   | Excadrill (steel)          |  2.712% | 
 | 82   | Rotom-Wash (electric)      |  2.707% | 
 | 83   | Cloyster (water)           |  2.665% | 
 | 84   | Landorus (flying)          |  2.640% | 
 | 85   | Garchomp-Mega (ground)     |  2.571% | 
 | 86   | Clefable (fairy)           |  2.527% | 
 | 87   | Torkoal (fire)             |  2.527% | 
 | 88   | Ferrothorn (grass)         |  2.520% | 
 | 89   | Swampert-Mega (water)      |  2.515% | 
 | 90   | Rotom-Heat (fire)          |  2.509% | 
 | 91   | Skuntank (poison)          |  2.508% | 
 | 92   | Venusaur-Mega (grass)      |  2.444% | 
 | 93   | Drapion (poison)           |  2.433% | 
 | 94   | Magnezone (electric)       |  2.428% | 
 | 95   | Diancie-Mega (fairy)       |  2.421% | 
 | 96   | Nidoqueen (poison)         |  2.398% | 
 | 97   | Starmie (water)            |  2.390% | 
 | 98   | Thundurus (electric)       |  2.353% | 
 | 99   | Meloetta (psychic)         |  2.340% | 
 | 100  | Diggersby (normal)         |  2.339% | 
 | 101  | Terrakion (rock)           |  2.314% | 
 | 102  | Breloom (grass)            |  2.283% | 
 | 103  | Gastrodon (ground)         |  2.278% | 
 | 104  | Entei (fire)               |  2.228% | 
 | 105  | Ferrothorn (steel)         |  2.198% | 
 | 106  | Hydreigon (dark)           |  2.196% | 
 | 107  | Swampert (water)           |  2.161% | 
 | 108  | Tentacruel (water)         |  2.145% | 
 | 109  | Jellicent (ghost)          |  2.117% | 
 | 110  | Kyurem-Black (ice)         |  2.098% | 
 | 111  | Tyranitar (rock)           |  2.061% | 
 | 112  | Weavile (dark)             |  2.027% | 
 | 113  | Meloetta (normal)          |  2.012% | 
 | 114  | Ditto (normal)             |  2.003% | 
 | 115  | Dragalge (dragon)          |  1.976% | 
 | 116  | Jirachi (steel)            |  1.970% | 
 | 117  | Armaldo (bug)              |  1.968% | 
 | 118  | Seismitoad (ground)        |  1.921% | 
 | 119  | Avalugg (ice)              |  1.920% | 
 | 120  | Goodra (dragon)            |  1.907% | 
 | 121  | Medicham-Mega (psychic)    |  1.885% | 
 | 122  | Sylveon (fairy)            |  1.866% | 
 | 123  | Kingdra (water)            |  1.825% | 
 | 124  | Empoleon (water)           |  1.821% | 
 | 125  | Toxicroak (poison)         |  1.820% | 
 | 126  | Rotom-Wash (water)         |  1.806% | 
 | 127  | Lanturn (water)            |  1.706% | 
 | 128  | Shuckle (rock)             |  1.679% | 
 | 129  | Omastar (rock)             |  1.672% | 
 | 130  | Weavile (ice)              |  1.639% | 
 | 131  | Mamoswine (ice)            |  1.612% | 
 | 132  | Crobat (poison)            |  1.606% | 
 | 133  | Metagross (psychic)        |  1.600% | 
 | 134  | Salamence (dragon)         |  1.590% | 
 | 135  | Diancie-Mega (rock)        |  1.590% | 
 | 136  | Scolipede (bug)            |  1.577% | 
 | 137  | Arcanine (fire)            |  1.523% | 
 | 138  | Yanmega (bug)              |  1.515% | 
 | 139  | Whimsicott (grass)         |  1.511% | 
 | 140  | Gyarados (water)           |  1.508% | 
 | 141  | Umbreon (dark)             |  1.507% | 
 | 142  | Gallade-Mega (psychic)     |  1.470% | 
 | 143  | Ampharos-Mega (electric)   |  1.469% | 
 | 144  | Cradily (grass)            |  1.464% | 
 | 145  | Manectric-Mega (electric)  |  1.457% | 
 | 146  | Tornadus-Therian (flying)  |  1.440% | 
 | 147  | Pidgeot-Mega (normal)      |  1.417% | 
 | 148  | Cradily (rock)             |  1.416% | 
 | 149  | Manaphy (water)            |  1.413% | 
 | 150  | Raikou (electric)          |  1.376% | 
 | 151  | Serperior (grass)          |  1.375% | 
 | 152  | Scolipede (poison)         |  1.362% | 
 | 153  | Sableye (dark)             |  1.252% | 
 | 154  | Froslass (ice)             |  1.251% | 
 | 155  | Gyarados (flying)          |  1.239% | 
 | 156  | Volcarona (fire)           |  1.228% | 
 | 157  | Latias (psychic)           |  1.199% | 
 | 158  | Empoleon (steel)           |  1.196% | 
 | 159  | Suicune (water)            |  1.190% | 
 | 160  | Aerodactyl (flying)        |  1.183% | 
 | 161  | Garchomp (ground)          |  1.175% | 
 | 162  | Gardevoir (psychic)        |  1.173% | 
 | 163  | Lucario (fighting)         |  1.167% | 
 | 164  | Darmanitan (fire)          |  1.144% | 
 | 165  | Alakazam (psychic)         |  1.126% | 
 | 166  | Scrafty (fighting)         |  1.125% | 
 | 167  | Mandibuzz (flying)         |  1.101% | 
 | 168  | Gliscor (ground)           |  1.096% | 
 | 169  | Shuckle (bug)              |  1.094% | 
 | 170  | Ninetales (fire)           |  1.092% | 
 | 171  | Cloyster (ice)             |  1.089% | 
 | 172  | Staraptor (flying)         |  1.064% | 
 | 173  | Scizor-Mega (bug)          |  1.056% | 
 | 174  | Ludicolo (water)           |  1.048% | 
 | 175  | Latias (dragon)            |  1.046% | 
 | 176  | Nidoking (ground)          |  1.029% | 
 | 177  | Garchomp-Mega (dragon)     |  1.014% | 
 | 178  | Weezing (poison)           |  1.007% | 
 | 179  | Hawlucha (flying)          |  0.994% | 
 | 180  | Heracross-Mega (bug)       |  0.988% | 
 | 181  | Lapras (ice)               |  0.978% | 
 | 182  | Rhyperior (rock)           |  0.977% | 
 | 183  | Haxorus (dragon)           |  0.975% | 
 | 184  | Azelf (psychic)            |  0.967% | 
 | 185  | Klefki (steel)             |  0.962% | 
 | 186  | Cofagrigus (ghost)         |  0.956% | 
 | 187  | Gardevoir-Mega (fairy)     |  0.946% | 
 | 188  | Starmie (psychic)          |  0.913% | 
 | 189  | Porygon-Z (normal)         |  0.891% | 
 | 190  | Latios-Mega (dragon)       |  0.890% | 
 | 191  | Heracross-Mega (fighting)  |  0.887% | 
 | 192  | Deoxys-Speed (psychic)     |  0.873% | 
 | 193  | Gardevoir (fairy)          |  0.869% | 
 | 194  | Sharpedo-Mega (water)      |  0.858% | 
 | 195  | Rotom-Mow (grass)          |  0.853% | 
 | 196  | Celebi (grass)             |  0.839% | 
 | 197  | Abomasnow-Mega (ice)       |  0.824% | 
 | 198  | Chandelure (fire)          |  0.822% | 
 | 199  | Heliolisk (normal)         |  0.807% | 
 | 200  | Luxray (electric)          |  0.804% | 
 | 201  | Slurpuff (fairy)           |  0.803% | 
 | 202  | Eelektross (electric)      |  0.798% | 
 | 203  | Slowbro (water)            |  0.797% | 
 | 204  | Blastoise-Mega (water)     |  0.797% | 
 | 205  | Celebi (psychic)           |  0.796% | 
 | 206  | Galvantula (electric)      |  0.771% | 
 | 207  | Pidgeot-Mega (flying)      |  0.751% | 
 | 208  | Machamp (fighting)         |  0.749% | 
 | 209  | Aggron-Mega (rock)         |  0.745% | 
 | 210  | Crustle (bug)              |  0.742% | 
 | 211  | Fletchinder (fire)         |  0.736% | 
 | 212  | Glalie-Mega (ice)          |  0.732% | 
 | 213  | Hoopa (ghost)              |  0.723% | 
 | 214  | Electivire (electric)      |  0.719% | 
 | 215  | Beedrill-Mega (poison)     |  0.710% | 
 | 216  | Espeon (psychic)           |  0.688% | 
 | 217  | Lucario (steel)            |  0.683% | 
 | 218  | Whimsicott (fairy)         |  0.677% | 
 | 219  | Honchkrow (flying)         |  0.677% | 
 | 220  | Trevenant (ghost)          |  0.666% | 
 | 221  | Landorus-Therian (ground)  |  0.662% | 
 | 222  | Vivillon (bug)             |  0.659% | 
 | 223  | Krookodile (dark)          |  0.658% | 
 | 224  | Chesnaught (fighting)      |  0.655% | 
 | 225  | Froslass (ghost)           |  0.655% | 
 | 226  | Durant (bug)               |  0.651% | 
 | 227  | Tyranitar-Mega (dark)      |  0.643% | 
 | 228  | Salamence (flying)         |  0.642% | 
 | 229  | Sharpedo-Mega (dark)       |  0.627% | 
 | 230  | Honchkrow (dark)           |  0.618% | 
 | 231  | Bronzong (steel)           |  0.618% | 
 | 232  | Shiftry (grass)            |  0.601% | 
 | 233  | Piloswine (ice)            |  0.592% | 
 | 234  | Quagsire (water)           |  0.589% | 
 | 235  | Crawdaunt (water)          |  0.588% | 
 | 236  | Smeargle (normal)          |  0.582% | 
 | 237  | Kingdra (dragon)           |  0.581% | 
 | 238  | Snorlax (normal)           |  0.576% | 
 | 239  | Houndoom-Mega (dark)       |  0.573% | 
 | 240  | Aerodactyl-Mega (flying)   |  0.563% | 
 | 241  | Walrein (ice)              |  0.555% | 
 | 242  | Dragalge (poison)          |  0.532% | 
 | 243  | Camerupt-Mega (ground)     |  0.531% | 
 | 244  | Metagross (steel)          |  0.530% | 
 | 245  | Cresselia (psychic)        |  0.526% | 
 | 246  | Krookodile (ground)        |  0.525% | 
 | 247  | Tyrantrum (rock)           |  0.517% | 
 | 248  | Ludicolo (grass)           |  0.512% | 
 | 249  | Zoroark (dark)             |  0.502% | 
 | 250  | Seismitoad (water)         |  0.500% | 
 | 251  | Toxicroak (fighting)       |  0.499% | 
 | 252  | Gallade (psychic)          |  0.492% | 
 | 253  | Aurorus (ice)              |  0.472% | 
 | 254  | Golbat (poison)            |  0.469% | 
 | 255  | Tyrantrum (dragon)         |  0.467% | 
 | 256  | Druddigon (dragon)         |  0.466% | 
 | 257  | Deoxys-Defense (psychic)   |  0.461% | 
 | 258  | Beedrill-Mega (bug)        |  0.459% | 
 | 259  | Hitmonlee (fighting)       |  0.449% | 
 | 260  | Drapion (dark)             |  0.449% | 
 | 261  | Aerodactyl (rock)          |  0.446% | 
 | 262  | Golem (rock)               |  0.446% | 
 | 263  | Noivern (dragon)           |  0.440% | 
 | 264  | Aurorus (rock)             |  0.434% | 
 | 265  | Alakazam-Mega (psychic)    |  0.434% | 
 | 266  | Shedinja (ghost)           |  0.412% | 
 | 267  | Exploud (normal)           |  0.412% | 
 | 268  | Absol-Mega (dark)          |  0.409% | 
 | 269  | Diggersby (ground)         |  0.407% | 
 | 270  | Alomomola (water)          |  0.406% | 
 | 271  | Rotom-Frost (ice)          |  0.397% | 
 | 272  | Miltank (normal)           |  0.395% | 
 | 273  | Sableye (ghost)            |  0.393% | 
 | 274  | Slowking (water)           |  0.393% | 
 | 275  | Banette-Mega (ghost)       |  0.388% | 
 | 276  | Medicham (fighting)        |  0.384% | 
 | 277  | Roserade (grass)           |  0.384% | 
 | 278  | Scizor (steel)             |  0.373% | 
 | 279  | Malamar (psychic)          |  0.370% | 
 | 280  | Articuno (flying)          |  0.366% | 
 | 281  | Blissey (normal)           |  0.365% | 
 | 282  | Scrafty (dark)             |  0.362% | 
 | 283  | Ambipom (normal)           |  0.352% | 
 | 284  | Aggron-Mega (steel)        |  0.351% | 
 | 285  | Cinccino (normal)          |  0.349% | 
 | 286  | Pyroar (normal)            |  0.345% | 
 | 287  | Latias-Mega (psychic)      |  0.344% | 
 | 288  | Trevenant (grass)          |  0.335% | 
 | 289  | Granbull (fairy)           |  0.330% | 
 | 290  | Houndoom-Mega (fire)       |  0.328% | 
 | 291  | Reuniclus (psychic)        |  0.325% | 
 | 292  | Crobat (flying)            |  0.317% | 
 | 293  | Sharpedo (dark)            |  0.307% | 
 | 294  | Diancie (rock)             |  0.301% | 
 | 295  | Kecleon (normal)           |  0.297% | 
 | 296  | Diancie (fairy)            |  0.296% | 
 | 297  | Mienshao (fighting)        |  0.290% | 
 | 298  | Aerodactyl-Mega (rock)     |  0.280% | 
 | 299  | Steelix-Mega (ground)      |  0.262% | 
 | 300  | Gourgeist-Super (ghost)    |  0.260% | 
 | 301  | Doublade (ghost)           |  0.260% | 
 | 302  | Sceptile-Mega (grass)      |  0.259% | 
 | 303  | Registeel (steel)          |  0.258% | 
 | 304  | Audino-Mega (normal)       |  0.252% | 
 | 305  | Jellicent (water)          |  0.250% | 
 | 306  | Articuno (ice)             |  0.249% | 
 | 307  | Magneton (steel)           |  0.248% | 
 | 308  | Milotic (water)            |  0.240% | 
 | 309  | Quagsire (ground)          |  0.240% | 
 | 310  | Zygarde (ground)           |  0.236% | 
 | 311  | Venomoth (bug)             |  0.236% | 
 | 312  | Feraligatr (water)         |  0.235% | 
 | 313  | Dusclops (ghost)           |  0.235% | 
 | 314  | Jolteon (electric)         |  0.230% | 
 | 315  | Durant (steel)             |  0.229% | 
 | 316  | Zygarde (dragon)           |  0.229% | 
 | 317  | Swampert-Mega (ground)     |  0.226% | 
 | 318  | Gothitelle (psychic)       |  0.223% | 
 | 319  | Emboar (fighting)          |  0.219% | 
 | 320  | Hitmontop (fighting)       |  0.219% | 
 | 321  | Tauros (normal)            |  0.218% | 
 | 322  | Stunfisk (electric)        |  0.216% | 
 | 323  | Accelgor (bug)             |  0.213% | 
 | 324  | Jynx (ice)                 |  0.213% | 
 | 325  | Delphox (psychic)          |  0.207% | 
 | 326  | Thundurus-Therian (electric)|  0.204% | 
 | 327  | Cobalion (steel)           |  0.204% | 
 | 328  | Torterra (grass)           |  0.203% | 
 | 329  | Archeops (rock)            |  0.199% | 
 | 330  | Wobbuffet (psychic)        |  0.198% | 
 | 331  | Bronzong (psychic)         |  0.198% | 
 | 332  | Pangoro (fighting)         |  0.196% | 
 | 333  | Shedinja (bug)             |  0.194% | 
 | 334  | Sigilyph (psychic)         |  0.194% | 
 | 335  | Drifblim (ghost)           |  0.192% | 
 | 336  | Vaporeon (water)           |  0.192% | 
 | 337  | Slowking (psychic)         |  0.191% | 
 | 338  | Amoonguss (poison)         |  0.191% | 
 | 339  | Tornadus (flying)          |  0.189% | 
 | 340  | Meowstic (psychic)         |  0.182% | 
 | 341  | Yanmega (flying)           |  0.180% | 
 | 342  | Aggron (steel)             |  0.176% | 
 | 343  | Heliolisk (electric)       |  0.174% | 
 | 344  | Sharpedo (water)           |  0.172% | 
 | 345  | Kabutops (water)           |  0.170% | 
 | 346  | Sigilyph (flying)          |  0.166% | 
 | 347  | Malamar (dark)             |  0.166% | 
 | 348  | Florges (fairy)            |  0.165% | 
 | 349  | Slaking (normal)           |  0.164% | 
 | 350  | Escavalier (bug)           |  0.162% | 
 | 351  | Tangrowth (grass)          |  0.162% | 
 | 352  | Rotom-Mow (electric)       |  0.156% | 
 | 353  | Spiritomb (ghost)          |  0.155% | 
 | 354  | Linoone (normal)           |  0.155% | 
 | 355  | Tyranitar-Mega (rock)      |  0.153% | 
 | 356  | Spiritomb (dark)           |  0.153% | 
 | 357  | Latios-Mega (psychic)      |  0.151% | 
 | 358  | Noivern (flying)           |  0.149% | 
 | 359  | Forretress (steel)         |  0.148% | 
 | 360  | Gastrodon (water)          |  0.148% | 
 | 361  | Zangoose (normal)          |  0.148% | 
 | 362  | Liepard (dark)             |  0.148% | 
 | 363  | Delphox (fire)             |  0.146% | 
 | 364  | Scyther (bug)              |  0.144% | 
 | 365  | Roserade (poison)          |  0.141% | 
 | 366  | Mismagius (ghost)          |  0.141% | 
 | 367  | Volbeat (bug)              |  0.136% | 
 | 368  | Swellow (normal)           |  0.133% | 
 | 369  | Chesnaught (grass)         |  0.128% | 
 | 370  | Chatot (flying)            |  0.128% | 
 | 371  | Typhlosion (fire)          |  0.127% | 
 | 372  | Combusken (fighting)       |  0.127% | 
 | 373  | Omastar (water)            |  0.127% | 
 | 374  | Medicham (psychic)         |  0.126% | 
 | 375  | Steelix-Mega (steel)       |  0.124% | 
 | 376  | Emboar (fire)              |  0.121% | 
 | 377  | Regice (ice)               |  0.120% | 
 | 378  | Gourgeist-Super (grass)    |  0.119% | 
 | 379  | Uxie (psychic)             |  0.118% | 
 | 380  | Staravia (normal)          |  0.117% | 
 | 381  | Murkrow (dark)             |  0.115% | 
 | 382  | Dusknoir (ghost)           |  0.114% | 
 | 383  | Chatot (normal)            |  0.114% | 
 | 384  | Vivillon (flying)          |  0.112% | 
 | 385  | Dugtrio (ground)           |  0.111% | 
 | 386  | Glaceon (ice)              |  0.110% | 
 | 387  | Flareon (fire)             |  0.109% | 
 | 388  | Houndoom (fire)            |  0.109% | 
 | 389  | Lunatone (rock)            |  0.109% | 
 | 390  | Poliwrath (fighting)       |  0.109% | 
 | 391  | Claydol (psychic)          |  0.109% | 
 | 392  | Torterra (ground)          |  0.107% | 
 | 393  | Flygon (dragon)            |  0.105% | 
 | 394  | Gallade (fighting)         |  0.104% | 
 | 395  | Carracosta (rock)          |  0.103% | 
 | 396  | Pikachu (electric)         |  0.102% | 
 | 397  | Shiftry (dark)             |  0.101% | 
 | 398  | Xatu (flying)              |  0.101% | 
 | 399  | Houndoom (dark)            |  0.101% | 
 + ---- + -------------------------- + --------- +
 
Right now, I do think that the meta is incredibly unbalanced right now (and yes, I know it was only created recently) with a notable three types notably being a lot better than the other types. The banlist based on usage is an okay guideline but where lower types (like Electric) or extremely diverse types (like Water) dominate over it's viability in normal Monotype. Before I say, remember that this is my opinion and from first eye of the meta, not having tested most of the types in the meta yet.
I CANT LIST EVERY SINGLE VIABLE AND NICHE POKEMON FOR EVERY TYPE.

Electric, with no bans, is going to be mostly filled with generic Electric. Not much to say here. Most Electrics gain incredible momentum and decent wallbreaking power. It's not full of glass cannons either with Pokemon like Rotom-Wash and Zapdos and still have momentum. Electric has the incredible comination of wallbreaking power, extremely good momentum and walls for a perfect bulky offense team. Thats why I say that Electric is one of the best types in Mono UU. However, Electric still has his flaws, mostly due that it is fairly predictable and it's lack of a good Stealth Rocks user. Though most Electric teams will be Volt Switching all day that you won't notice anything.

Electric Pokemon said:
Thundurus is by far the power of the pack on Electric in normal Monotype and in UU. With the best walls generally gone on most types, Thundurus proceeds to be an incredible powerhouse with Thunderbolt alone. 125 SpAtk is enough to break the best walls in UU and can pack coverage like Hidden Power Ice and Grass Knot for Ground types. Not to mention that is has Prankster Thunder Wave to cripple Pokemon that are faster than Thundurus and helps with team support. Thundurus takes momentum, wallbreaking power and utility all in one into a new level. I would say that Thundurus
must go next banlist due to this.

Rotom-Wash is generally the defensive wall of Electric. With access to Will-O-Wisp to cripple physical attackers to another level and semi-reliable recovery with either Pain Split or ChestoResto. It also has Levitate which walls a lot of Pokemon that otherwise would be threats without it like Mamoswine. Rotom-Wash is almost always used as a defensive pivot and occasionally a scarfer. Rotom-Wash's SpAtk of 105 is not that bad either and can deal some serious damage with Hydro Pump to Ground types. Even though this is good, I don't think this is ban worthy but if Electric does get too hectic, I would suggest banning this with Thundurus.

Zapdos is a necessity on Electric as it's only way of hazard removal. Zapdos is generally used as a special wall with reliable recovery. Zapdos is an incredible Pokemon on Electric that changes Electric from being hyper offensive to balanced. This is by far the best Pokemon on Electric in general with access to some coverage in Heat Wave and Toxic. This is the only Pokemon on Electric that can truly stall a game. However, I don't think this is banworthy simply because of what it does to Electric. Without Zapdos, Electric would have to resort to hyper offensive without great wallbreaking power other than Thundurus, Magnezone and maybe Mega Ampharos. However, this is still a banworthy contender because of it's incredible utility.

Magnezone is an unusual Pokemon. It's needed mainly becaues of it's typing being able to tank the most powerful wallbreakers in normal Monotype, However, Magnezone will be used more as a pure wallbreaker in UU Mono with the lack of the best walls. It's Steel typing does help with Rock and Ice moves, something that Thundurus and Zapdos are weak to. I would say that Magnezone is most likely to be a Choice Specs Pokemon but is just as viable with Choice Scarf. This is in no way banworthy in my mind and I doubt it will be banned unless something unusual happens in UU.

Raikou is known as the premier Choice Specs and SubCM Pokemon. With it's superior speed to most of Electric and decent SpAtk, Raikou is an extremely good sweeper and wallbreaker, which ever one you decide to choose. Additionally, with the lack of Mega Venusaur, you no longer have the need to run Extrasensory and have better coverage with Hidden Power Ice. I doubt this will be banned unless in extremely circumstances.

Luxray is a physical wallbreaker for Electric. It's decent movepool and priority helps a lot in normal Monotype. However, it's power doesn't really compensate in Mono UU with Pokemon like Chansey and Mega Sableye banned. I personally don't see that great of a use with Luxray in Mono UU with the exception of Rock and Ice (with Superpower), which is likely to decrease in usage due to the Kyurem-B and Terrakion ban. Poor Luxray.

At the other side of the spectrum, there is Electivire. In Mono UU, Electivire should be much better with a bit more unpredictability, a wider movepool and access to Earthquake, good for Lanturn. It's speed is also much better that makes Electivire viable with a Choice Scarf, Choice Band or even Life Orb with Volt Switch. Electivire is the premier physical Pokemon in Mono UU, good after its decrease in normal Mono.

Mega Ampharos is the taker of the mega evolution slot with it's brilliant Dragon typing being able to take incredible Fire and Grass attacks. It also creates good type synergy with Magnezone. Mega Ampharos is mostly used as a slow pivoter and with RestTalk but with less walls, can be more viable with Agility Ampharos. Even though this is generally an extremely good Pokemon, I doubt it is banworthy because of it's appalling speed, even after one Agility. Can't beat L'oreal in beauty though.

The minor mega, Mega Manectric is no slouch either. It's advantage over Ampharos is that it's speed, base 135 which is faster than almost all Electric types. However, it doesn't have the power, the synergy or the bulk that Mega Ampharos has. It's simply just another great pivoter with Intimidate as it's ability. If you want something like Manectric, you might as well use Raikou or Jolteon with Mega Ampharos.

Even with the recent Manaphy ban, Water still has a massive influence on UU Mono. With cores that create momentum, incredible wallbreaking power and extremely reliable walls that even top tier normal Mono would use. Water has no notable flaws in UU Mono and there is no surprise that Water is a deadly threat in this meta.

There are so many viable Pokemon that I just can't list them all
Water Pokes said:
Starmie is the Pokemon that is most likely to get banned I would say. With incredible wallbreaking power with Analytic and speed makes it one of the best wallbreakers in Mono UU. However, Starmie can also be used defensively with reliable recovery as a hazard remover and a status absorber with Natural Cure. Starmie can fill an infinite amount of roles in UU Mono effectively and that's why I say that Starmie is the one to be banned first.

Set-up sweeper #1. Cloyster is an incredible Shell Smash sweeper with the lack of walls like Skarmory which let it sweep a lot more easily in Mono UU. Cloyster can also be used as a last resort for priority with Ice Shard. A Pokemon that can set up and sweep so easily in a meta is almost always a banworthy Pokemon, though that could be slightly different depending on the changing meta in usage.

Set-up sweeper #2. Gyarados is an incredible sweeper with Dragon Dance, Intimidate (or Moxie) which can force opponents out for a free Dragon Dance. Gyarados is not as easy to sweep as with Cloyster, but it's still fairly easy to set-up and can tear teams out easily. Not to mention that Gyarados doesn't need hazard removal to set-up while Cloyster almost always does. Gyarados isn't really a banworthy Pokemon but again, depends in the changing meta in usage.

Set-up sweeper #3. The generic CroCrune set is extremely good in Mono UU as a defensive wall, sweeper and status absorber. Suicune is an easily set-up sweeper in a lot of conditions unlike the other sweepers. There is not much to say about the set other than it's plain brilliant in the meta. However, I wouldn't say it is "broken" just set, though it can easily be a seriously broken Pokemon in this meta.

Crawdaunt is just the best wallbreaker for Water in UU Mono with deadly moves like Knock Off, priority with Aqua Jet and Swords Dance. Adaptability is a deadly threat in Mono, UU Mono especially. Crawdaunt is NOT a safe switch in for any type at all and I wouldn't be surprised if it got banned. However, it's speed and frailty backs it away from being a top Pokemon and outclassed by Azumarill in normal Mono, but it has it's place in UU Mono.

Swampert is one of the Stealth Rock users on Water with good mixed defenses and an immunity to Electric, it's no surprise. Generally, it's just a phazer with Stealth Rocks and good offensive power as well. Not much to say here. I doubt this is ban worthy and likely won't be banned in the future.

Empoleon is the second of the Stealth Rock users on Water with generally being a special wall. It's Water/Steel typing is excellent for tanking Dragon and Grass moves. It's the Water/Steel version of Swampert with the exception that it learns Defog, which I think gives Empoleon the edge as the better Stealth Rock user. Still not banworthy though.

Tentacruel is a special wall and hazard remover in one. It's Poison typing also helps with Grass and Fighting types, not as useful in UU mono but still has its uses. It's generally paired with Swampert for a good core. Not much else to say here. Tentacruel is no where near banworthy in UU Mono.
Lanturn is the premier Electric absorber in almost all balanced and stall Water teams. As long as having Volt Absorb, it also gives momentum with Volt Switch and easy team support with Heal Bell. Lanturn will never be ban worthy but it's still extremely good, even better in this meta since Electric is expected to skyrocket in usage in the next 3 months. That's expected, however. Lanturn still has mediocre stats in general which is slightly disappointing due to how much Lanturn does for Water.

Mega Sharpedo will almost always be the mega of choice over Mega Blastoise. Mega Sharpedo after a speed boost can break core and sweep teams like Ghost and Psychic easily. It's mixed ability also help a lot in removing Pokemon like Avalugg and other physical walls. I doubt this will be banned but I wouldn't be totally be surprised if it does. Even though Mega Blastoise is viable, I doubt it would be used unless Mega Sharpedo gets the boot.


Unlike the other two types, Fire lacks any defensive cores and relies a lot on offense, though it's extremely deadly at doing that. With Drought still legal on Fire, it can easily dominate the meta as the best HO type in UU Mono. Fire does have it's weaknesses though. The most major weakness is that you have no hazard removal other than Torkoal (which removes tempo) or Moltres (which is 4x weak to Stealth Rocks anyway). Though I say that, Fire is still going to be a deadly force to face with.
Fire Pokes said:
Ninetales covers everything you need for UU Mono. Heat Rock Drought with Nasty Plot or Assault Vest Ninetales with Torkoal? I'm not sure what set Ninetales actually uses but it's main use is for Drought after all, having incredible team support for Fire teams. It's stats aren't too bad either. Having 81 SpAtk under sun is decent and with good SpDef and Speed, it can use many different movesets, like I said before. I think this COULD be banworthy but I doubt it would be banned. I haven't heard anyone say Fire is broken yet.

Entei is one of the best wallbreakers for Fire. With additional access to the most powerful priority in Extreme Speed. Entei is a top threat in Mono UU with little switchins and absolutely none for most types. I would say that if anything on Fire had to be banned at all, Entei would by far be the first choice with incredible wallbreaking abilities and priority. Entei may be just too good for this meta.

Chandelure is a unique one for Fire. It's a good wallbreaker and scarfer for Fire which deals with a generally good amount of Pokemon. However, I think the Life Orb set is best to maximize the damage to break almost all the walls on any type. The Life Orb set has little to no switchins like Entei. Only that Chandelure loses priority with the trade of Ghost STAB and a spinblocker. I think this is the second Pokemon to be banned after Entei.

Darmanitan is almost a free replacement to Victini. With insane attack and Sheer Force to boost Flare Blitz, it's no surprise that this is an incredible wallbreaker. Additionally, it gains access to U-Turn like Victini for good momentum. Darmanitan packs a mixture of Earthquake, Rock Slide and Superpower with U-Turn and Flare Blitz. Darmanitan has little to no switchins in UU Mono and could end up with the exact result as Entei.

Rotom-Heat is an extremely good pivoter for Fire. With being able to be a SpDef wall with screens and Volt Switch, it gives Fire incredible team support with Ninetales. Paired with Torkoal, it gives a decent defensive core that helps with the rest of the team. It's Electric typing also helps with removing Water types if it's choice scarf. This is just one of the best Pokemon on Fire because of it's access to pivot.

Volcarona is capable of destroying teams after a boost, it needs only the slightest invitation to start setting up and ending the game there and then. It also has a potent Bug STAB attack and access to coverage moves to beat foes that could otherwise take it on, making it difficult to reliably handle. Access to one of the best boosting moves in the game in Quiver Dance only makes it more threatening to be up against. Volcarona is one of the deadliest set-up sweepers in Fire and should be moderately easy to set-up with Volcarona in Mono UU.

Torkoal is the best utility Pokemon on Fire with access to Stealth Rock, Rapid Spin and extremely good defensive traits for Fire and generally the only viable hazard remover with the loss of Charizard-Y. Torkoal is nothing to really worry about, but it's the only way to get Stealth Rock up and remove Stealth Rock for Fire, making it a Mono UU essential.

With Mega Charizard-Y gones, Mega Houndoom takes the cake for the best mega on Fire. Houndoom is capable of functioning well against both defensive and offensive teams in UU Mono. As a Nasty Plot sweeper, Houndoom is second to none and is capable of making use of its obscene power and excellent STAB combo to rip apart defensive cores easily. Compared to it's other mega, Mega Camerupt, it has slightly less power but makes it up with an extremely good base speed and a boosting move.
Other top tier types in UU Mono:

Ground - It's loss of Excadrill and Landorus does hurt but still doesn't subtract from the fact that Ground is astonishing in UU Mono. With access to few of the best wallbreakers like Camerupt-M and Diggersby to sweepers like Krookodile to extremely good walls and pivots like Landorus-Therian. I would say that Ground is an extremely threatening type.

Grass - Even with the ban of Mega Venusaur, it can still be used as a more offensive Grass in UU mono with hazard stacking with Ferrothorn and Cradily, priority with Breloom and Shiftry and sweepers like Celebi. With no more Mega Venusaur, Mega Sceptile is likely to step in as the next best (and only) Grass mega and is still no slouch. With base 145 speed, it can outspeed a lot of the meta including base 80's like Chandelure, a huge threat to Grass with no Mega Venusaur. Grass may not have the wallbreaking power Fire or Ground has, but it still has potential to be good.

Remember that this is just a prediction on how the meta is going to go for the next 3 months and is entirely my opinion. The meta can go any path and we'll just have to see where it goes.
 
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Heyo, first post on the forums!
I have a few recomendations, which so far i lack the replays because the meta isn't played very often
I've been giving some thought on a few types
Electric
Well, this has no bans, so i'd recommend a few to balance the meta, because it's arguably one of the best types around
Rotom-w
This mon is just a incredible and versatile washing machine, banworthy imo
Why?
- Can be easily replaced by another form, so the type doesnt really get hindered (like it would be with a zapdos ban)
- Can run a variety of sets (phys wall, special wall, scarf, screens)
- With access to levitate, this just has a weakness to grass, and since common grass mons like mega venu and breloom are banned on their secondary types, it's tough to take down

Thundurus-I
This guy is banworthy imo
- Amazing physical, special and support movepool with prankster
- The type would hardly feel a big drawback, since the mons it usually kills like chansey and mega venu are also banned, so it could be replaced as a physical/mixed or just physical attacker by electivire or luxray


Psychic
Psychic is an overpowered type in almost every metagame, and this is no exception

Latias
Latias is just plain too good for this meta, even without its mega stone, banworthy imo
- Can run a variety of sets, with the most threatening one in this meta undoubtedely being the sub/cm set
- Has very high stats and reliable recovery on roost
- The type wouldn't feel the drawback of losing latias that much, having other many option, to an extent for almost every set, like sigilyph, gardevoir, mesprit, starmie, claydol and xatu

Starmie
Suspect test imo
- Large special movepool, natural cure, reliable recovery and rapid spin
- With reduced checks, starmie can prove a deadly special attacker

Cresselia
I'm actually surprised this isn't banned yet, this is just plain banworthy
- Amazing bulk, with reduced checks can run a deadly sub/cm set
- Incredibly hard wall to take down, with toxic and reliable recovery


Steel
Heatran
Well, i was giving some thought on the unban of heatran, at least as a suspect
- Steel is almost unusable without it
- Can't function that properly without skarmory and doublade support, so it wouldn't be that broken imo

Scizor
Extremely deadly sweeper that can sweep the majority of the metagame with it's checks being banned. banworthy
- Can run 2 deadly sets, that hit the majority of the tier hard (band and sd)
- A large number of common checks and counters are banned in at least one type(heatran, skarmory, slowbro, victini, infernape, volcarona, chandelure, aegislash, keldeo...)


Well, let's make this tier work
(And please change the name, because like, half of the people in the tours think it's regular mono lol)
Cheers
 
Heyo, first post on the forums!
I have a few recomendations, which so far i lack the replays because the meta isn't played very often
I've been giving some thought on a few types
Electric
Well, this has no bans, so i'd recommend a few to balance the meta, because it's arguably one of the best types around
Rotom-w
This mon is just a incredible and versatile washing machine, banworthy imo
Why?
- Can be easily replaced by another form, so the type doesnt really get hindered (like it would be with a zapdos ban)
- Can run a variety of sets (phys wall, special wall, scarf, screens)
- With access to levitate, this just has a weakness to grass, and since common grass mons like mega venu and breloom are banned on their secondary types, it's tough to take down

Thundurus-I
This guy is banworthy imo
- Amazing physical, special and support movepool with prankster
- The type would hardly feel a big drawback, since the mons it usually kills like chansey and mega venu are also banned, so it could be replaced as a physical/mixed or just physical attacker by electivire or luxray


Psychic
Psychic is an overpowered type in almost every metagame, and this is no exception

Latias
Latias is just plain too good for this meta, even without its mega stone, banworthy imo
- Can run a variety of sets, with the most threatening one in this meta undoubtedely being the sub/cm set
- Has very high stats and reliable recovery on roost
- The type wouldn't feel the drawback of losing latias that much, having other many option, to an extent for almost every set, like sigilyph, gardevoir, mesprit, starmie, claydol and xatu

Starmie
Suspect test imo
- Large special movepool, natural cure, reliable recovery and rapid spin
- With reduced checks, starmie can prove a deadly special attacker

Cresselia
I'm actually surprised this isn't banned yet, this is just plain banworthy
- Amazing bulk, with reduced checks can run a deadly sub/cm set
- Incredibly hard wall to take down, with toxic and reliable recovery


Steel
Heatran
Well, i was giving some thought on the unban of heatran, at least as a suspect
- Steel is almost unusable without it
- Can't function that properly without skarmory and doublade support, so it wouldn't be that broken imo

Scizor
Extremely deadly sweeper that can sweep the majority of the metagame with it's checks being banned. banworthy
- Can run 2 deadly sets, that hit the majority of the tier hard (band and sd)
- A large number of common checks and counters are banned in at least one type(heatran, skarmory, slowbro, victini, infernape, volcarona, chandelure, aegislash, keldeo...)


Well, let's make this tier work
(And please change the name, because like, half of the people in the tours think it's regular mono lol)
Cheers
I'm agree with mostly point you said. I mean, at least suspect. (concerning Thundurus, Rotom-W, Latias, Scizor).

Have Cresselia CM isn't a big issue, he needs at least 2-3 CM to be "good" offensively, so you can use moves like Haze (This exist for a good reason), there is Taunt/Toxic/... as another option.

Starmie is a good mon, but it doesn't deserve the ban, its movepool is great indeed but 100 Sp.Atk doesn't make it over powerful.

Next, all Pokemon who are banned because of its usage will keep banned. Here for your Heatran request, it won't happen. He's the 4th Pokemon the most used in regular monotype.
→ | 4 | Heatran (steel) | 6.701% |

For the name, I don't see any problems. Change the name to "Not Used Monotype" will be still the same issue because some people don't read rules tour before joining. (It happens to STABmon, AAA too).



Edit: Please guys if you've the opportunity to give us some replays to our suspects or any others Pokemon you think they should be suspects, it will give more weight that "It's broken".
 
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I would like to suggest a Zapdos ban (or suspect) on Mono UU Electric

Really, if you disagree with this then you either didn't read this or you are way too biased of having it banned (electric users) because how much advantage it gives vs lots of matchups now that most wallbreakers/threats are gone.

Also, I would like to let it very clear that ''Electric will no longer have a defogger, therefore it would be unusuable'' is an invalid argument. There are so many types who are able to work very well without even relying on hazard removal (Grass, Fighting, and so on), and Electric can do just fine just by relying on pivotting (Strong Volt Switch cores are now even stronger considering most types actually lost important mons).

If you take a look at the banlist, you will realize that nearly all Zapdos's counters are now gone, especially considering the recent Mega-Venusaur ban on Grass and Kyurem-Black ban on Ice (all of them made by the council, and not by usage, and please do note that I am not complaining about those bans). And just like those two types had their losses, I also would like to suggest a ban on Zapdos, since it is a nearly unbrekeable wall in the current metagame and teams often have to rely on Toxic (which it isn't even a thing considering there are great clerics on Electric to the likes of Mega-Ampharos or you could just switch to Magnezone). Of course there are exceptions and certain types could still do fine against it, but the fact remains that most Monotype teams still have a really hard time with it and I think its prevalence on the metagame is very unhealthy.

If the council is looking forward to a healthier metagame, then I hope people there think carefully about this decision. Remember Mono UU is meant to be different, fun and unique, and I believe Metagame Balance is one of the few required aspects on enforcing those attributes to it.
 
I would like to suggest a Zapdos ban (or suspect) on Mono UU Electric

Really, if you disagree with this then you either didn't read this or you are way too biased of having it banned (electric users) because how much advantage it gives vs lots of matchups now that most wallbreakers/threats are gone.

Also, I would like to let it very clear that ''Electric will no longer have a defogger, therefore it would be unusuable'' is an invalid argument. There are so many types who are able to work very well without even relying on hazard removal (Grass, Fighting, and so on), and Electric can do just fine just by relying on pivotting (Strong Volt Switch cores are now even stronger considering most types actually lost important mons).

If you take a look at the banlist, you will realize that nearly all Zapdos's counters are now gone, especially considering the recent Mega-Venusaur ban on Grass and Kyurem-Black ban on Ice (all of them made by the council, and not by usage, and please do note that I am not complaining about those bans). And just like those two types had their losses, I also would like to suggest a ban on Zapdos, since it is a nearly unbrekeable wall in the current metagame and teams often have to rely on Toxic (which it isn't even a thing considering there are great clerics on Electric to the likes of Mega-Ampharos or you could just switch to Magnezone). Of course there are exceptions and certain types could still do fine against it, but the fact remains that most Monotype teams still have a really hard time with it and I think its prevalence on the metagame is very unhealthy.

If the council is looking forward to a healthier metagame, then I hope people there think carefully about this decision. Remember Mono UU is meant to be different, fun and unique, and I believe Metagame Balance is one of the few required aspects on enforcing those attributes to it.
Well, I'm biased I think, I don't think Zapdos is a problem in Mono UU, I'm going to explain it.
Just before, Grass has defogger (Shiftry (for viable) and Tropius) and Fighting has Hitmontop (Spinner).

Well, now concerning Zapdos:
You point all of them counters are banned. Let me give some example to counter it:

• Steel type: M-Aggron and HO physical Pokemon are able to give trouble to Zapdos.

• Fighting Type: Scrafty sets up in front of it (Bulk up Rest), Toxicroak SD LO 0hko it like many others.

• Dragon: Tyrantrum, Kyurem are main names I've in my head.

• Water: Lanturn: Toxic/Volt Absorb, and M-Pedo gives some trouble in other way (252+ Atk Strong Jaw Mega Sharpedo Ice Fang vs. 248 HP / 64 Def Zapdos: 260-308 (67.8 - 80.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock).

• Electric: Raikou CM set up, band Luxray, Electivire).

• Fairy: Fairy mostly wins when Magnezone is dead, they stall easily Electric after the death Magnezone.

• Fire: Darm, Entei are nice wallbreakers to face Zapdos.

• Ice: Ice.

• Bug: Armaldo (EQ/Stone Edge), Crustle is able to Shell Smash in front of it.

• Normal: Best match up for normal. (If u want names: Blissey stalls with M-Audino).

• Grass: Cradily Toxic, Breloom (Spore/Rock Tomb)

• Poison: Nidoqueen I think, give troubles.

• Psychic: Latias sets up, Cresselia sets up, ...

• Rock: Rock.

• Ground: Diggersby, Piloswine, Nidoking, ...

• Ghost: maybe the most evident issue here but I think Treevenant Leech Seed Will-O-Wisp gives a lot of issue for it.

• Dark: Weavile, Taunt everywhere, ...

• Flying: I tested Emolga with 1 True Lycan and I think he can say it the set I used was ugly for Electric type, in other way, Salamence Lum Berry DD.


So, I think I may be biased but Zapdos isn't the main issue for Electric power.
I think people take habits to see Psychic, Flying, Steel and Dragon for top types and they are lost, confused with top types in UU like Electric.
If some Pokemon may be suspect in Electric, I think it will be (supposition, not an affirmation) Thundurus and Rotom-W.


 
Well, I'm biased I think, I don't think Zapdos is a problem in Mono UU, I'm going to explain it.
Just before, Grass has defogger (Shiftry (for viable) and Tropius) and Fighting has Hitmontop (Spinner).

Well, now concerning Zapdos:
You point all of them counters are banned. Let me give some example to counter it:

• Steel type: M-Aggron and HO physical Pokemon are able to give trouble to Zapdos.

• Fighting Type: Scrafty sets up in front of it (Bulk up Rest), Toxicroak SD LO 0hko it like many others.

• Dragon: Tyrantrum, Kyurem are main names I've in my head.

• Water: Lanturn: Toxic/Volt Absorb, and M-Pedo gives some trouble in other way (252+ Atk Strong Jaw Mega Sharpedo Ice Fang vs. 248 HP / 64 Def Zapdos: 260-308 (67.8 - 80.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock).

• Electric: Raikou CM set up, band Luxray, Electivire).

• Fairy: Fairy mostly wins when Magnezone is dead, they stall easily Electric after the death Magnezone.

• Fire: Darm, Entei are nice wallbreakers to face Zapdos.

• Ice: Ice.

• Bug: Armaldo (EQ/Stone Edge), Crustle is able to Shell Smash in front of it.

• Normal: Best match up for normal. (If u want names: Blissey stalls with M-Audino).

• Grass: Cradily Toxic, Breloom (Spore/Rock Tomb)

• Poison: Nidoqueen I think, give troubles.

• Psychic: Latias sets up, Cresselia sets up, ...

• Rock: Rock.

• Ground: Diggersby, Piloswine, Nidoking, ...

• Ghost: maybe the most evident issue here but I think Treevenant Leech Seed Will-O-Wisp gives a lot of issue for it.

• Dark: Weavile, Taunt everywhere, ...

• Flying: I tested Emolga with 1 True Lycan and I think he can say it the set I used was ugly for Electric type, in other way, Salamence Lum Berry DD.

So, I think I may be biased but Zapdos isn't the main issue for Electric power.
I think people take habits to see Psychic, Flying, Steel and Dragon for top types and they are lost, confused with top types in UU like Electric.
If some Pokemon may be suspect in Electric, I think it will be (supposition, not an affirmation) Thundurus and Rotom-W.
You're probably forgetting about the great amount of momentum Electric can have, and Trevenant/Piloswine/Nidoking aren't really much troubles for it (Rotom-Wash + Zapdos's good natural bulk). Keep in mind I am talking about teams as a whole, countering one pokemon by itself doesn't really decide whether it deserves or not the ban. Fairy doesn't even close (Look how many mons its gotten after Clefable, Azumarill, Togekiss and Klefki banned), and it can just go for Toxic, which is a great deal. Cradily is often troubled by Magnezone, and Armaldo doesn't seem to be reliable because of Rotom-Wash. Normal had some key bans as well, which means Zapdos will have a way easier time on Toxic spam, and it can still rely on the defensive coverage offered by his team if needed (as I have said, Magnezone can toxic absorb or you could go for Amphy as cleric).

Ice and Rock are both crippled by Magnezone. And I'm going to remember again that Ice has lost Kyurem-Black, and Rock has lost Terrakion/Mega-Diancie, meaning Electric is still going to have an easier time on these both matchups.

You might be right about some (For example, Fire Wallbreakers), and I really let it clear that certain types could just handle it fine, yet most answers mentioned by you are actually unreliable because of Electric's potential/coverage.

Another reason for the ban support comes about centralization. People are often forced to use sets to counter it that aren't really viable otherwise.

About some discussion on having Rotom-Wash banned, I don't even think it would be that effective, since there are replacements that can be just as useful (other rotom formes). Surely there will be some impacts in this change, yet I still think most teams will still have issues because of Zapdos. Thundurus ban might be worthy though, thanks to the great coverage and access to Nasty Plot + Prankster Twave.
 
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I'm only going to focus on the defog argument for Zapdos being unbanned because I find it to be a completely invalid argument. There is a small part of me that is actually insulted that someone thought this was a valid argument, which is no doubt prompting me to write way more than is necessary. For that, I apologize in advance.

tl;dr: electric's reliance on defog is hugely overstated because of these reasons:
1. Steel needs Heatran more than electric needs defog.
2. Ghost literally only has Drifblim for hazard control, because Mega Sableye is banned. But no, electric needs to have defog.
3. Fairy has access to Togekiss in OU, but doesn't use it because they just don't need it. As it turns out, sometimes you don't need hazard control.
4. Electric doesn't need defog as badly as fire needs hazard control. Seriously man?
5. Having access to hazard control doesn't make it viable. You have to consider the pokemon and set viability along with the opportunity costs.
end of tl;dr

---
Feel free to use my 1-5 numbering to counter my arguments.

I'm trying to figure out why electric so direly needs a defogger (in Zapdos) when steel apparently doesn't need Heatran. Sure, you can claim usage stats on Heatran, but we should probably face the fact that steel itself is harshly crippled. Steel lost the other parts of its immunity core, which I would claim are critical to the success of Heatran. Somehow, electric falls into complete and utter disaster without a defogger, but steel without Heatran is fine and dandy?


I have further questions on why electric is in such immense peril without a defogger. Let's look at ghost. Mega Sableye, the magic bouncer, is gone. Their only hazard control is now... Drifblim. Please. Drifblim doesn't get recovery or successful defensive stats or abilities to make it a viable defogger. I mean, it's literally not even ranked on the UU or OU monotype VR. So are you going to unban Mega Sableye to provide hazard control? Or do you think it's okay to force a type like ghost, which was already weak enough and weakened further by significant bans, to run a Pokemon like Drifblim? Don't kid yourself, you're not running Drifblim on ghost for specifically defog. (If you are using it, you're probably using some god forsaken set like flare boost or unburden. Just check usage stats) If ghost can survive without defog, why can't electric? (As a side remark, not part of the discussion, ghost has Shedinja for crying out loud. That Pokemon can't even function without hazard removal!)


Let's continue with fairy. Fairy's only defogger is Togekiss, unless you want to use Togetic. Further, Fairy has no rapid spinner, and lost its magic bouncer in Mega Diancie. Is this fair to fairy? I'm not sure if it's even fair to force fairy to use Togetic when Zapdos is allowed on electric, but that's beyond the point. The more important matter is to consider whether fairy even needs defogging. If you look at usage stats, Togekiss almost never even uses defog (12.3% usage). Fairy seems to be doing just fine without defog, so why can't electric?


And, when rereading Tylacto's argument, I had to reread multiple times the context of electric's immense reliance on defog out of sheer incredulity. In quotation: "However what I really don't think it can function almost at all without, is Zapdos. i understand if often causes large problems for Bug, but it's similar to Fire in terms of Hazard removal, except this really is the only form of Hazard removal for the entire type." Electric is as crippled by hazards as fire? This is fire, whose only rock resistant Pokemon are banned. And you want to claim electric, with no inherent weakness to rock at all beyond exactly this problematic Zapdos, similarly agreed to be problematic Thundurus-formes, and I suppose sturdy Magnezone, is similarly crippled? Electric is in such dire need of hazard removal, you're comparing it to fire?


I most importantly want to ask whether your need for hazard control is SO important that you are willing to use crippling Pokemon on your team. Saying "Oh, X type has Y mon" is a fallacy if you're not considering viability. Having the option to defog is not the same as viably being able to defog. There is still the need to gauge opportunity costs and viability, when considering whether one should run hazard removal. Consider (for one brief moment) in OU monotype, where fighting essentially loses to sticky webs. Bug can all but sweep with Pinsir, rock sweeps with Diancie, and normal close to sweeps with Pidgeot. And yet, fighting refuses to run Hitmontop because it's simply not truly viable and the opportunity cost is too high. This is the case with ghost, who simply cannot afford to run Drifblim in its already crippled state. This is why fairy does not run defog, because Togekiss's sets do not have room for defog without severe opportunity costs. Juleocesar claims grass doesn't need hazard removal either. This, I would assume is due to opportunity costs, but I'm no expert on grass. Back in UU monotype, I could continue with types like ground, whose only viable removal is Donphan and Flygon neither of which are particularly appealing. Oh, sorry, ground can run hyper cutter Gliscor to defog, which I'm sure is a completely viable and popular set.


Whether Zapdos is unhealthy or not, I'm not fully sure. I believe personally that Zapdos will eventually cause a stale and overcentralized metagame. However, regardless of whether that is the case or not, this ridiculous defog argument needs to stop being used in defense for Zapdos when it's so clearly just a fallacious argument.
 
I'm only going to focus on the defog argument for Zapdos being unbanned because I find it to be a completely invalid argument. There is a small part of me that is actually insulted that someone thought this was a valid argument, which is no doubt prompting me to write way more than is necessary. For that, I apologize in advance.

tl;dr: electric's reliance on defog is hugely overstated because of these reasons:
1. Steel needs Heatran more than electric needs defog.
2. Ghost literally only has Drifblim for hazard control, because Mega Sableye is banned. But no, electric needs to have defog.
3. Fairy has access to Togekiss in OU, but doesn't use it because they just don't need it. As it turns out, sometimes you don't need hazard control.
4. Electric doesn't need defog as badly as fire needs hazard control. Seriously man?
5. Having access to hazard control doesn't make it viable. You have to consider the pokemon and set viability along with the opportunity costs.
end of tl;dr

---
Feel free to use my 1-5 numbering to counter my arguments.

I'm trying to figure out why electric so direly needs a defogger (in Zapdos) when steel apparently doesn't need Heatran. Sure, you can claim usage stats on Heatran, but we should probably face the fact that steel itself is harshly crippled. Steel lost the other parts of its immunity core, which I would claim are critical to the success of Heatran. Somehow, electric falls into complete and utter disaster without a defogger, but steel without Heatran is fine and dandy?


I have further questions on why electric is in such immense peril without a defogger. Let's look at ghost. Mega Sableye, the magic bouncer, is gone. Their only hazard control is now... Drifblim. Please. Drifblim doesn't get recovery or successful defensive stats or abilities to make it a viable defogger. I mean, it's literally not even ranked on the UU or OU monotype VR. So are you going to unban Mega Sableye to provide hazard control? Or do you think it's okay to force a type like ghost, which was already weak enough and weakened further by significant bans, to run a Pokemon like Drifblim? Don't kid yourself, you're not running Drifblim on ghost for specifically defog. (If you are using it, you're probably using some god forsaken set like flare boost or unburden. Just check usage stats) If ghost can survive without defog, why can't electric? (As a side remark, not part of the discussion, ghost has Shedinja for crying out loud. That Pokemon can't even function without hazard removal!)


Let's continue with fairy. Fairy's only defogger is Togekiss, unless you want to use Togetic. Further, Fairy has no rapid spinner, and lost its magic bouncer in Mega Diancie. Is this fair to fairy? I'm not sure if it's even fair to force fairy to use Togetic when Zapdos is allowed on electric, but that's beyond the point. The more important matter is to consider whether fairy even needs defogging. If you look at usage stats, Togekiss almost never even uses defog (12.3% usage). Fairy seems to be doing just fine without defog, so why can't electric?


And, when rereading Tylacto's argument, I had to reread multiple times the context of electric's immense reliance on defog out of sheer incredulity. In quotation: "However what I really don't think it can function almost at all without, is Zapdos. i understand if often causes large problems for Bug, but it's similar to Fire in terms of Hazard removal, except this really is the only form of Hazard removal for the entire type." Electric is as crippled by hazards as fire? This is fire, whose only rock resistant Pokemon are banned. And you want to claim electric, with no inherent weakness to rock at all beyond exactly this problematic Zapdos, similarly agreed to be problematic Thundurus-formes, and I suppose sturdy Magnezone, is similarly crippled? Electric is in such dire need of hazard removal, you're comparing it to fire?


I most importantly want to ask whether your need for hazard control is SO important that you are willing to use crippling Pokemon on your team. Saying "Oh, X type has Y mon" is a fallacy if you're not considering viability. Having the option to defog is not the same as viably being able to defog. There is still the need to gauge opportunity costs and viability, when considering whether one should run hazard removal. Consider (for one brief moment) in OU monotype, where fighting essentially loses to sticky webs. Bug can all but sweep with Pinsir, rock sweeps with Diancie, and normal close to sweeps with Pidgeot. And yet, fighting refuses to run Hitmontop because it's simply not truly viable and the opportunity cost is too high. This is the case with ghost, who simply cannot afford to run Drifblim in its already crippled state. This is why fairy does not run defog, because Togekiss's sets do not have room for defog without severe opportunity costs. Juleocesar claims grass doesn't need hazard removal either. This, I would assume is due to opportunity costs, but I'm no expert on grass. Back in UU monotype, I could continue with types like ground, whose only viable removal is Donphan and Flygon neither of which are particularly appealing. Oh, sorry, ground can run hyper cutter Gliscor to defog, which I'm sure is a completely viable and popular set.


Whether Zapdos is unhealthy or not, I'm not fully sure. I believe personally that Zapdos will eventually cause a stale and overcentralized metagame. However, regardless of whether that is the case or not, this ridiculous defog argument needs to stop being used in defense for Zapdos when it's so clearly just a fallacious argument.
Great write up, I completely agree with you. Just to add on to your points, before most of the revisions, I noticed Electric and Ice (not even rock) had no bans once so ever. If you were to compare the 2 in terms of viability in (OU) Monotype, its a lot easier (as proven by multiple people) to ladder with electric than it is to ladder with ice. Seriously, think about it, how many people have actually gotten at least above 1600s with ice? (In ORAS, I've counted 2). On the contrary, a pretty decent list of people have gone even beyond 1700 with electric.

Also, if you look at the matchup tables, Electric has a lot more fair matchups than ice does, yet, it got no bans, as opposed to ice getting probably the biggest asset taken away in Kyurem-B (now I'm not saying that was a bad decision, what I am saying is why does a much easier type like electric have no bans compared to that?). To be fair I think as people have mentioned, there is a tiny bit of bias to certain types. I agree with Seiryuu in that it should have some bans too, Zapdos probably being the 1st (and electric will not be unusable, I think quite the opposite). Do think as well Thundy-I should also be considered (Rotom-Wash is more debatable if anything).
 
Alright, I'm neutral about a Zapdos ban but I think there are some things that actually need to be noticed.

With the ban of Zapdos, Electric will be forced to generally tailor to being Hyper Offensive with Galvantula. Because of Electric's good momentum with Volt Switch means that Electric will be taking damage almost every time it uses Volt Switch or switches out in general. Of course, Electric can easily run Thunderbolt alone but that encourages people to have a wider amount of switchins because they can't switch from a sweeper to a wallbreaker, for example.

However, with lots of momentum with Electric, it's checks for a lot of types are simply invalid because Zapdos can easily pack Volt Switch to gain more momentum, not to mention that almost everything that stops Volt Switch is walled by Rotom-Wash anyway. As briefly said before, Defog helps so much with removing Stealth Rocks, having an easier time to gain even more momentum.

Yes, I say that Electric does need a nerf badly but is Zapdos really the Pokemon to ban? Does it really shit on you that bad that you want it banned? If it's incredible walling ability is why you think it should be banned, then look at Deoxys-Defense. It has Taunt, hazard stacking and Recover but that isn't banned. It does an incredible role in Electric, yes, but all it does is to Defog and maybe Toxic if it has it.

Without breaking Electric's defensive core, I do think the Pokemon that should be banned is Thundurus-I.



Thundurus is a massive threat in this meta. With little switchins, a wide movepool like Grass Knot, Thunderbolt, Knock Off or even U-Turn to gain momentum vs Ground Pokemon. it shouldn't be that big of a surprise that I support a suspect on this. It also has an incredible 125 SpAtk and 115 Atk to compliment this wide movepool. It has access to Prankster Thunder Wave to remove set-up threats like Volcarona and cripples easily if Thundurus somehow doesn't wallbreak your whole team. Not to mention that even without Zapdos or Rotom-W, it still can get free switchins with slow Volt Switches like Mega Ampharos or even Stunfisk.
 

scpinion

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Can anyone post a replay showing us how electric/Zapdos is broken in the meta? That'd be really helpful to go along with all the theorymoning. :)
 

(Far more than just Defog)
I'm only going to focus on the defog argument for Zapdos being unbanned because I find it to be a completely invalid argument. There is a small part of me that is actually insulted that someone thought this was a valid argument, which is no doubt prompting me to write way more than is necessary. For that, I apologize in advance.

tl;dr: electric's reliance on defog is hugely overstated because of these reasons:
1. Steel needs Heatran more than electric needs defog.
2. Ghost literally only has Drifblim for hazard control, because Mega Sableye is banned. But no, electric needs to have defog.
3. Fairy has access to Togekiss in OU, but doesn't use it because they just don't need it. As it turns out, sometimes you don't need hazard control.
4. Electric doesn't need defog as badly as fire needs hazard control. Seriously man?
5. Having access to hazard control doesn't make it viable. You have to consider the pokemon and set viability along with the opportunity costs.
end of tl;dr

---
Feel free to use my 1-5 numbering to counter my arguments.

I'm trying to figure out why electric so direly needs a defogger (in Zapdos) when steel apparently doesn't need Heatran. Sure, you can claim usage stats on Heatran, but we should probably face the fact that steel itself is harshly crippled. Steel lost the other parts of its immunity core, which I would claim are critical to the success of Heatran. Somehow, electric falls into complete and utter disaster without a defogger, but steel without Heatran is fine and dandy?


I have further questions on why electric is in such immense peril without a defogger. Let's look at ghost. Mega Sableye, the magic bouncer, is gone. Their only hazard control is now... Drifblim. Please. Drifblim doesn't get recovery or successful defensive stats or abilities to make it a viable defogger. I mean, it's literally not even ranked on the UU or OU monotype VR. So are you going to unban Mega Sableye to provide hazard control? Or do you think it's okay to force a type like ghost, which was already weak enough and weakened further by significant bans, to run a Pokemon like Drifblim? Don't kid yourself, you're not running Drifblim on ghost for specifically defog. (If you are using it, you're probably using some god forsaken set like flare boost or unburden. Just check usage stats) If ghost can survive without defog, why can't electric? (As a side remark, not part of the discussion, ghost has Shedinja for crying out loud. That Pokemon can't even function without hazard removal!)


Let's continue with fairy. Fairy's only defogger is Togekiss, unless you want to use Togetic. Further, Fairy has no rapid spinner, and lost its magic bouncer in Mega Diancie. Is this fair to fairy? I'm not sure if it's even fair to force fairy to use Togetic when Zapdos is allowed on electric, but that's beyond the point. The more important matter is to consider whether fairy even needs defogging. If you look at usage stats, Togekiss almost never even uses defog (12.3% usage). Fairy seems to be doing just fine without defog, so why can't electric?


And, when rereading Tylacto's argument, I had to reread multiple times the context of electric's immense reliance on defog out of sheer incredulity. In quotation: "However what I really don't think it can function almost at all without, is Zapdos. i understand if often causes large problems for Bug, but it's similar to Fire in terms of Hazard removal, except this really is the only form of Hazard removal for the entire type." Electric is as crippled by hazards as fire? This is fire, whose only rock resistant Pokemon are banned. And you want to claim electric, with no inherent weakness to rock at all beyond exactly this problematic Zapdos, similarly agreed to be problematic Thundurus-formes, and I suppose sturdy Magnezone, is similarly crippled? Electric is in such dire need of hazard removal, you're comparing it to fire?


I most importantly want to ask whether your need for hazard control is SO important that you are willing to use crippling Pokemon on your team. Saying "Oh, X type has Y mon" is a fallacy if you're not considering viability. Having the option to defog is not the same as viably being able to defog. There is still the need to gauge opportunity costs and viability, when considering whether one should run hazard removal. Consider (for one brief moment) in OU monotype, where fighting essentially loses to sticky webs. Bug can all but sweep with Pinsir, rock sweeps with Diancie, and normal close to sweeps with Pidgeot. And yet, fighting refuses to run Hitmontop because it's simply not truly viable and the opportunity cost is too high. This is the case with ghost, who simply cannot afford to run Drifblim in its already crippled state. This is why fairy does not run defog, because Togekiss's sets do not have room for defog without severe opportunity costs. Juleocesar claims grass doesn't need hazard removal either. This, I would assume is due to opportunity costs, but I'm no expert on grass. Back in UU monotype, I could continue with types like ground, whose only viable removal is Donphan and Flygon neither of which are particularly appealing. Oh, sorry, ground can run hyper cutter Gliscor to defog, which I'm sure is a completely viable and popular set.


Whether Zapdos is unhealthy or not, I'm not fully sure. I believe personally that Zapdos will eventually cause a stale and overcentralized metagame. However, regardless of whether that is the case or not, this ridiculous defog argument needs to stop being used in defense for Zapdos when it's so clearly just a fallacious argument.

Nice post btw, although I presume it was intended to have a reply so here this is better late than never.

Yes I understand that on the whole you mentioned that the point you were addressing was centered around the "Defog" argument. I think you're seeing it as overstated, simply because that is far from the only reason, but it's the one that tends to crop up the most.

This is because Zapdos is far more than just a Defogger. Zapdos is the only viable option for reliable recovery on Electric, having access to Roost where as barring the, at some times sketchy option of Pain Split on Rotom, every other mon is confined to Rest. This makes Zapdos almost the type's only defensive wall that can consistently last throughout a game. Effectively what I'm saying there, is that without Zapdos, Electric is forced into a team based around Sticky Webs and Hyper Offence, something Chleg has already raised, but the important point being that Electric doesn't have the offensive and sweeping potential other types such as Rock and Fire have in order to be able to effectively pull off Hyper Offence.

Looking over your post, there were alot of references to the standard OU Monotype tier, but considering this is about UU Monotype, I'll try to bear both in mind to address all the points.


"1. Steel needs Heatran more than electric needs defog."
I'm trying to figure out why electric so direly needs a defogger (in Zapdos) when steel apparently doesn't need Heatran. Sure, you can claim usage stats on Heatran, but we should probably face the fact that steel itself is harshly crippled. Steel lost the other parts of its immunity core, which I would claim are critical to the success of Heatran. Somehow, electric falls into complete and utter disaster without a defogger, but steel without Heatran is fine and dandy?
Here the original point I'd actually like to somewhat agree with considering its specifics. Like you said I can indeed mention the usage stats, being that in the UU Metagame, Heatran is unsurprisingly banned due to usage, something that could potentially happen to Zapdos too. The point here again is that Zapdos is far more than Defog. Yes your post is centralized around that key point, but I would strongly argue that in UU Monotype tier, Electric needs Zapdos just as much as, if not more than Steel would appreciate Heatran.

The replacements for Zapdos on Electric are effectively non-existent. Assuming Rotom sticks around, the only mon that would provide similar amounts of bulk in terms of a wall, would be Stunfisk, a mon without the Ground immunity and using Rest as a form of recovery (Pain Split isn't great with its high HP)... Something hardly ideal, and also unsuitable considering the Hyper Offence build that would be forced.

Now replacements for Heatran. Obviously no direct Fire immunities are supplied, but there are numerous mons that can be extremely effective in sponging up Fire type attacks. S Rank on Steel for a reason, Empoleon is the obvious option, having fantastic Special bulk and also supplying Hazard control. On the Physical side there is also normal Aggron, which whilst having two 4x Weaknesses, does a great job of sponging Physical Fire type attacks. There's also Mega Aggron which takes even super effective hits well thanks to Filter, and can cripple in return with Thunder Wave. Whilst you could argue this is hardly the same as Heatran, not being immune to the attacks, they are similar in that they're both still weak to Ground, and aren't beaten by Heatran in terms of recovery either. And in terms of Fire coverage too, whilst no mons offer the same STAB, mons that perform greatly in the UU Mono Metagame being Durant and Lucario, hit the same types as Fire in Ice, Grass and Steel.

I understand you raised later in the post you mentioned about saying "X Type has Y Mon" and viability, but these are perfectly viable options. I don't like to Theory Mon as I understand Replays are better, but I didn't see much of an option towards the end there. More to the point, also considering the viable screens support and strong offensive options the type still has, to directly use your words, in the UU Monotype Metagame, Steel is indeed "fine and dandy", and I'd strongly advise other people give it a try to prove that.


"2. Ghost literally only has Drifblim for hazard control, because Mega Sableye is banned. But no, electric needs to have defog."
I have further questions on why electric is in such immense peril without a defogger. Let's look at ghost. Mega Sableye, the magic bouncer, is gone. Their only hazard control is now... Drifblim. Please. Drifblim doesn't get recovery or successful defensive stats or abilities to make it a viable defogger. I mean, it's literally not even ranked on the UU or OU monotype VR. So are you going to unban Mega Sableye to provide hazard control? Or do you think it's okay to force a type like ghost, which was already weak enough and weakened further by significant bans, to run a Pokemon like Drifblim? Don't kid yourself, you're not running Drifblim on ghost for specifically defog. (If you are using it, you're probably using some god forsaken set like flare boost or unburden. Just check usage stats) If ghost can survive without defog, why can't electric? (As a side remark, not part of the discussion, ghost has Shedinja for crying out loud. That Pokemon can't even function without hazard removal!)
I'm not going to argue that Ghost is a great type in the UU Mono Metagame because it isn't, LTLC and usage stats really didn't do it a favor. It's key offensive options have vanished, but that isn't an aspect that applies to Zapdos, as this is about the Defensive part of the two types. (Again this is about how Zapdos is far more than just Defog, simply being the only form of it for the type) Ignoring the passively aggressive way in which you figured someone (presumably me) would tell you to use Driftblim, I'd just like to point out that no, that's not what I'm telling anyone using Ghost to do.

This isn't as related to your post because I understand you only questioned if Zapdos should be banned towards the end, but here I'm mentioning how Ghost still has it's defensive core of Sableye and Jellicent. Yes it's offense won't be giving them any breaks, but both mons have access to Recover, something I've already mentioned that Electric has almost none of. Jellicent is an extremely viable special wall, and whilst Sableye doesn't possess the same bulk as it's Mega form, it can still viably hold the Mega Stone in order to do a better job at absorbing Knock Offs. For now, the usage system means that the viability of Ghost cannot be helped, but in relation to this post its defensive core still remains relatively in shape, far from what Electric's would be without Zapdos.

"3. Fairy has access to Togekiss in OU, but doesn't use it because they just don't need it. As it turns out, sometimes you don't need hazard control."
Let's continue with fairy. Fairy's only defogger is Togekiss, unless you want to use Togetic. Further, Fairy has no rapid spinner, and lost its magic bouncer in Mega Diancie. Is this fair to fairy? I'm not sure if it's even fair to force fairy to use Togetic when Zapdos is allowed on electric, but that's beyond the point. The more important matter is to consider whether fairy even needs defogging. If you look at usage stats, Togekiss almost never even uses defog (12.3% usage). Fairy seems to be doing just fine without defog, so why can't electric?
This one's relatively simple for whatever context it applies to. I see you've referenced OU Monotype but I understand this should be about the UU Mono tier. I'd just like to bring up a comment I see in "Fairy seems to be doing fine without defog". You may have tried the type in UU and that's fair enough, but I think it's fair to say, and a lot of people would agree with, is that Fairy is hardly a prominent type in UU Mono, not having the same offensive and setup options. Something to note there is that no, I don't think loss of Defog Togekiss, or Magic Bounce in particular is the cause of this.

Sidenote Togetic is actually perfectly viable in UU Mono, but no I'm not trying to force people to use it. Fairy's form of hazard removal/prevention was banned due to usage, and nothing can be done about that. Electric's form of this, assuming usage stats below threshold, will only be banned if it is deemed broken for the tier.

4. Electric doesn't need defog as badly as fire needs hazard control. Seriously man?
And, when rereading Tylacto's argument, I had to reread multiple times the context of electric's immense reliance on defog out of sheer incredulity. In quotation: "However what I really don't think it can function almost at all without, is Zapdos. i understand if often causes large problems for Bug, but it's similar to Fire in terms of Hazard removal, except this really is the only form of Hazard removal for the entire type." Electric is as crippled by hazards as fire? This is fire, whose only rock resistant Pokemon are banned. And you want to claim electric, with no inherent weakness to rock at all beyond exactly this problematic Zapdos, similarly agreed to be problematic Thundurus-formes, and I suppose sturdy Magnezone, is similarly crippled? Electric is in such dire need of hazard removal, you're comparing it to fire?
Yay a mention, and sorry for the incredulity but even after going back and re-reading it myself, I can assure you the post is about Electric's reliance on Zapdos, far from just Defog itself. (although again I understand that's what your post is centered around)

The comparison to fire was made not off the form of weakness to hazards. However you've already mentioned what Stealth Rocks can do to the type, and not to oblige to your "X type has Y mon" point, but Moltres is actually reasonably reliable in UU Mono despite its rocks weakness, and I could mention Taunt lead Infernape but I understand at this moment in time Electric also has Prankster Taunt Thundurus although that mon in itself is a different discussion.

What I'd like to address here, is that despite losing it's best forms of Hazard removal, Fire is still extremely viable in UU Mono as a form of Hyper Offence. Without Zapdos, this is what Electric would also be forced to try and attempt, however this is where the differences appear. Fire's forms of offence simply blow Electric's away. I'd already mentioned how Electric lacks many powerful attackers who also possess the speed without having to be choiced in some way, where as Fire has the options of Darmanitan, Entei, and Volcarona, the latter being something completely unmatched on Electric in terms of dangerous setup. (No CM Raikou and NP Thundurus do not compare), and almost all types have difficulty switching in to the first two.


(Your fifth point was addressed numerous times throughout the others.)


After all that theorymonning however I'd like to reiterate the point raised by scpinion about how replays would be extremely helpful in determining if or not Zapdos should be deemed broken in the tier if that is what anyone would like to prove.

It might come as a surprise for some but I too agree that Electric needs some form of nerf before the unthinkable happens and large amounts of people begin to use it, potentially centralizing the UU Mono Tier.



(In my opinion two of the far more both balanced and worth trying options)
This is the option I believe is worth trying first for various reasons. Whilst Rotom is also a key part of the standard Defensive core for Electric, it is far less fundamental than Zapdos. It's forms of recover are far less reliable, only having Pain Split and Rest. It also doesn't have access to hazard removal unlike Zapdos (surprise surprise), so banning it would not force Electric into an awful form of Hyper Offence.

The point that most people like to raise if that "it can just be replaced by another Rotom form". I understand this is OU Monotype, but by looking at a particular core challenge with Rotom-Mow (argueably the second best form for the type), you can see just how much more the type struggles, the winning peak only being 1499 ELO.

This is because of how important Rotom-Wash's defensive typing brings to Electric. Without it, in UU Mono Electric would now be using Rotom-Mow, or potentially Rotom-Heat. Far from just a direct replacement, this influences the entire team. Rotom-Mow provides an Ice weakness in place or an Ice resistance and also a Bug weakness, something that forces more pressure onto Magnezone, the only mon on the type aside from Magneton that resists the new weakness. And it's a similar situation with Rotom-Heat, except now there's a new Rock weakness, which is never healthy for the already large EdgeQuake weakness in the type. I won't mention a Water weakness as it's negligible considering the type it's on, however it will still have an influence. And Mow/heat also don't actually bring anything new to the table, aside from no more Grass weakness, they're really not giving other types much more to think about, apart from how now their main form of offence reduces their Special Attack by two stages, being Overheat and Leaf Storm.

Banning Rotom-W would allow far more holes to appear in Electric teams and I'd love to give it a go to see how it copes. It could also encourage diversity, something positive in the spirit of the UU tier, seeing that defensive Magnezones, or even Magnetons could even appear on teams to counter the new weaknesses. Aside from that, if a Rotom-W ban didn't have as much as an impact as expected, what's to stop us simply taking it further?


This seems to be the more popular option, with it's positives and negatives in terms of a ban. The justification for this tends to be based around the sweeping potential it has with Nasty Plot combined with it's impressive speed tier. Personally I don't feel this is the correct reasoning, as assuming the Thundurus is running the incredibly helpful support option of Prankster Thunder Wave.

What doesn't get mentioned however, is that after these two moves, Thundurus will likely be running Thunderbolt and either Grass Knot/HP Ice, and importantly, not both. With only one of the coverage moves, Thundurus can sweep far less types than it seems to be being made out that it can. Seismitoad absorbs HP Ice's for Ground, and Landorus/Gliscor can absorb Grass Knots. This is all whilst a team can a lot of the time kill off Thundurus with a Scarfer due to it's lacklustre bulk. The sweeping potential only truly appears if the user gives up Thunder Wave, which leaves their team far more weak to setup.

What I think is far better reasoning for the potential banning of Thundy-I, is how it can run either Physical or Special, and the unpredictable is constant in that even in the Nasty Plot set, the opponent will not find out what coverage it is running until it is too late. Experienced users would often be able to tell if a Thundurus is Physically based due to looking at the rest of the team, however this isn't always fair on users not familiar with the type and how it is ran. Addressed in the section about Zapdos, Thundurus is on of the only Electric mon with impressive offensive stats and the speed to back it up without having to be choiced, and for these reasons I feel that a single ban on Thundurus-I could potentially be beneficial for the tier to see the impact that it has on the type.


With that being said I think it's great we can have this discussion about UU Monotype, the tier slowly becoming more stable, I just hope it doesn't take over the whole thread.

 

(Far more than just Defog)



Nice post btw, although I presume it was intended to have a reply so here this is better late than never.

Yes I understand that on the whole you mentioned that the point you were addressing was centered around the "Defog" argument. I think you're seeing it as overstated, simply because that is far from the only reason, but it's the one that tends to crop up the most.

This is because Zapdos is far more than just a Defogger. Zapdos is the only viable option for reliable recovery on Electric, having access to Roost where as barring the, at some times sketchy option of Pain Split on Rotom, every other mon is confined to Rest. This makes Zapdos almost the type's only defensive wall that can consistently last throughout a game. Effectively what I'm saying there, is that without Zapdos, Electric is forced into a team based around Sticky Webs and Hyper Offence, something Chleg has already raised, but the important point being that Electric doesn't have the offensive and sweeping potential other types such as Rock and Fire have in order to be able to effectively pull off Hyper Offence.

Looking over your post, there were alot of references to the standard OU Monotype tier, but considering this is about UU Monotype, I'll try to bear both in mind to address all the points.


"1. Steel needs Heatran more than electric needs defog."


Here the original point I'd actually like to somewhat agree with considering its specifics. Like you said I can indeed mention the usage stats, being that in the UU Metagame, Heatran is unsurprisingly banned due to usage, something that could potentially happen to Zapdos too. The point here again is that Zapdos is far more than Defog. Yes your post is centralized around that key point, but I would strongly argue that in UU Monotype tier, Electric needs Zapdos just as much as, if not more than Steel would appreciate Heatran.

The replacements for Zapdos on Electric are effectively non-existent. Assuming Rotom sticks around, the only mon that would provide similar amounts of bulk in terms of a wall, would be Stunfisk, a mon without the Ground immunity and using Rest as a form of recovery (Pain Split isn't great with its high HP)... Something hardly ideal, and also unsuitable considering the Hyper Offence build that would be forced.

Now replacements for Heatran. Obviously no direct Fire immunities are supplied, but there are numerous mons that can be extremely effective in sponging up Fire type attacks. S Rank on Steel for a reason, Empoleon is the obvious option, having fantastic Special bulk and also supplying Hazard control. On the Physical side there is also normal Aggron, which whilst having two 4x Weaknesses, does a great job of sponging Physical Fire type attacks. There's also Mega Aggron which takes even super effective hits well thanks to Filter, and can cripple in return with Thunder Wave. Whilst you could argue this is hardly the same as Heatran, not being immune to the attacks, they are similar in that they're both still weak to Ground, and aren't beaten by Heatran in terms of recovery either. And in terms of Fire coverage too, whilst no mons offer the same STAB, mons that perform greatly in the UU Mono Metagame being Durant and Lucario, hit the same types as Fire in Ice, Grass and Steel.

I understand you raised later in the post you mentioned about saying "X Type has Y Mon" and viability, but these are perfectly viable options. I don't like to Theory Mon as I understand Replays are better, but I didn't see much of an option towards the end there. More to the point, also considering the viable screens support and strong offensive options the type still has, to directly use your words, in the UU Monotype Metagame, Steel is indeed "fine and dandy", and I'd strongly advise other people give it a try to prove that.


"2. Ghost literally only has Drifblim for hazard control, because Mega Sableye is banned. But no, electric needs to have defog."


I'm not going to argue that Ghost is a great type in the UU Mono Metagame because it isn't, LTLC and usage stats really didn't do it a favor. It's key offensive options have vanished, but that isn't an aspect that applies to Zapdos, as this is about the Defensive part of the two types. (Again this is about how Zapdos is far more than just Defog, simply being the only form of it for the type) Ignoring the passively aggressive way in which you figured someone (presumably me) would tell you to use Driftblim, I'd just like to point out that no, that's not what I'm telling anyone using Ghost to do.

This isn't as related to your post because I understand you only questioned if Zapdos should be banned towards the end, but here I'm mentioning how Ghost still has it's defensive core of Sableye and Jellicent. Yes it's offense won't be giving them any breaks, but both mons have access to Recover, something I've already mentioned that Electric has almost none of. Jellicent is an extremely viable special wall, and whilst Sableye doesn't possess the same bulk as it's Mega form, it can still viably hold the Mega Stone in order to do a better job at absorbing Knock Offs. For now, the usage system means that the viability of Ghost cannot be helped, but in relation to this post its defensive core still remains relatively in shape, far from what Electric's would be without Zapdos.

"3. Fairy has access to Togekiss in OU, but doesn't use it because they just don't need it. As it turns out, sometimes you don't need hazard control."


This one's relatively simple for whatever context it applies to. I see you've referenced OU Monotype but I understand this should be about the UU Mono tier. I'd just like to bring up a comment I see in "Fairy seems to be doing fine without defog". You may have tried the type in UU and that's fair enough, but I think it's fair to say, and a lot of people would agree with, is that Fairy is hardly a prominent type in UU Mono, not having the same offensive and setup options. Something to note there is that no, I don't think loss of Defog Togekiss, or Magic Bounce in particular is the cause of this.

Sidenote Togetic is actually perfectly viable in UU Mono, but no I'm not trying to force people to use it. Fairy's form of hazard removal/prevention was banned due to usage, and nothing can be done about that. Electric's form of this, assuming usage stats below threshold, will only be banned if it is deemed broken for the tier.

4. Electric doesn't need defog as badly as fire needs hazard control. Seriously man?


Yay a mention, and sorry for the incredulity but even after going back and re-reading it myself, I can assure you the post is about Electric's reliance on Zapdos, far from just Defog itself. (although again I understand that's what your post is centered around)

The comparison to fire was made not off the form of weakness to hazards. However you've already mentioned what Stealth Rocks can do to the type, and not to oblige to your "X type has Y mon" point, but Moltres is actually reasonably reliable in UU Mono despite its rocks weakness, and I could mention Taunt lead Infernape but I understand at this moment in time Electric also has Prankster Taunt Thundurus although that mon in itself is a different discussion.

What I'd like to address here, is that despite losing it's best forms of Hazard removal, Fire is still extremely viable in UU Mono as a form of Hyper Offence. Without Zapdos, this is what Electric would also be forced to try and attempt, however this is where the differences appear. Fire's forms of offence simply blow Electric's away. I'd already mentioned how Electric lacks many powerful attackers who also possess the speed without having to be choiced in some way, where as Fire has the options of Darmanitan, Entei, and Volcarona, the latter being something completely unmatched on Electric in terms of dangerous setup. (No CM Raikou and NP Thundurus do not compare), and almost all types have difficulty switching in to the first two.


(Your fifth point was addressed numerous times throughout the others.)


After all that theorymonning however I'd like to reiterate the point raised by scpinion about how replays would be extremely helpful in determining if or not Zapdos should be deemed broken in the tier if that is what anyone would like to prove.

It might come as a surprise for some but I too agree that Electric needs some form of nerf before the unthinkable happens and large amounts of people begin to use it, potentially centralizing the UU Mono Tier.



(In my opinion two of the far more both balanced and worth trying options)
This is the option I believe is worth trying first for various reasons. Whilst Rotom is also a key part of the standard Defensive core for Electric, it is far less fundamental than Zapdos. It's forms of recover are far less reliable, only having Pain Split and Rest. It also doesn't have access to hazard removal unlike Zapdos (surprise surprise), so banning it would not force Electric into an awful form of Hyper Offence.

The point that most people like to raise if that "it can just be replaced by another Rotom form". I understand this is OU Monotype, but by looking at a particular core challenge with Rotom-Mow (argueably the second best form for the type), you can see just how much more the type struggles, the winning peak only being 1499 ELO.

This is because of how important Rotom-Wash's defensive typing brings to Electric. Without it, in UU Mono Electric would now be using Rotom-Mow, or potentially Rotom-Heat. Far from just a direct replacement, this influences the entire team. Rotom-Mow provides an Ice weakness in place or an Ice resistance and also a Bug weakness, something that forces more pressure onto Magnezone, the only mon on the type aside from Magneton that resists the new weakness. And it's a similar situation with Rotom-Heat, except now there's a new Rock weakness, which is never healthy for the already large EdgeQuake weakness in the type. I won't mention a Water weakness as it's negligible considering the type it's on, however it will still have an influence. And Mow/heat also don't actually bring anything new to the table, aside from no more Grass weakness, they're really not giving other types much more to think about, apart from how now their main form of offence reduces their Special Attack by two stages, being Overheat and Leaf Storm.

Banning Rotom-W would allow far more holes to appear in Electric teams and I'd love to give it a go to see how it copes. It could also encourage diversity, something positive in the spirit of the UU tier, seeing that defensive Magnezones, or even Magnetons could even appear on teams to counter the new weaknesses. Aside from that, if a Rotom-W ban didn't have as much as an impact as expected, what's to stop us simply taking it further?


This seems to be the more popular option, with it's positives and negatives in terms of a ban. The justification for this tends to be based around the sweeping potential it has with Nasty Plot combined with it's impressive speed tier. Personally I don't feel this is the correct reasoning, as assuming the Thundurus is running the incredibly helpful support option of Prankster Thunder Wave.

What doesn't get mentioned however, is that after these two moves, Thundurus will likely be running Thunderbolt and either Grass Knot/HP Ice, and importantly, not both. With only one of the coverage moves, Thundurus can sweep far less types than it seems to be being made out that it can. Seismitoad absorbs HP Ice's for Ground, and Landorus/Gliscor can absorb Grass Knots. This is all whilst a team can a lot of the time kill off Thundurus with a Scarfer due to it's lacklustre bulk. The sweeping potential only truly appears if the user gives up Thunder Wave, which leaves their team far more weak to setup.

What I think is far better reasoning for the potential banning of Thundy-I, is how it can run either Physical or Special, and the unpredictable is constant in that even in the Nasty Plot set, the opponent will not find out what coverage it is running until it is too late. Experienced users would often be able to tell if a Thundurus is Physically based due to looking at the rest of the team, however this isn't always fair on users not familiar with the type and how it is ran. Addressed in the section about Zapdos, Thundurus is on of the only Electric mon with impressive offensive stats and the speed to back it up without having to be choiced, and for these reasons I feel that a single ban on Thundurus-I could potentially be beneficial for the tier to see the impact that it has on the type.


With that being said I think it's great we can have this discussion about UU Monotype, the tier slowly becoming more stable, I just hope it doesn't take over the whole thread.

I just want to clarify something to you about your point on the different rotom forms. It is very possible even now to replace rotom wash, the most painful reason why my elo and gxe were low was because throughout the challenge I was getting haxed very bad (and this is not me complaining, you can ask Vin Pyre who watch me ladder most of the time xD). Also, SubMindRaikou made a team that managed to get that to work, I think you should check that out bc it actually is a very fun team.

Tl;Dr I don't see much harm personally with rotom banned, I can imagine electric doing alright w/o it.
 
I just want to clarify something to you about your point on the different rotom forms. It is very possible even now to replace rotom wash, the most painful reason why my elo and gxe were low was because throughout the challenge I was getting haxed very bad (and this is not me complaining, you can ask Vin Pyre who watch me ladder most of the time xD). Also, SubMindRaikou made a team that managed to get that to work, I think you should check that out bc it actually is a very fun team.

Tl;Dr I don't see much harm personally with rotom banned, I can imagine electric doing alright w/o it.
The point made about the Core Challenge ELO wasn't specifically to do with you, as you certainly weren't the only person to attempt the challenge. I've actually already seen the RMT and whilst I haven't tried it myself I agree it appears to be perfectly capable of working, but from experience any team using Mow I can safely say experiences a hell of alot more stress when it comes to dealing with offensive threats simply due to the new defensive typing, and consequently its success is considerably reduced.

I've already listed my reasons there so naturally I disagree with saying it wouldn't do much harm, although I look forward to trying out new teams in some of the room tours.
 
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