Gen 1 Kingler (NU, Partial Rewrite) [QC 2/1] [GP 1/1]

Sabelette

from the river to the sea
is a Site Content Manageris a Community Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Minor* edits to an old analysis and a little elaboration on some parts.

*After QC this has become a bigger set of edits, maybe bigger than a partial rewrite? GP team feel free to provide guidance.

[OVERVIEW]
Swords Dance Kingler is the strongest wallbreaker and a potent sweeper in RBY NU. At +2, Hyper Beam can OHKO much of the tier, including threats like Mr. Mime, Raticate, and Venomoth, and nearly KO anything except Rock-types. Additionally, Body Slam followed by Hyper Beam will KO any Normal-neutral foe at +2. Rock-types are washed away by Crabhammer, a powerful STAB move that will almost always score a critical hit. It easily OHKOes Golem and 2HKOes Kabutops, coming just short of OHKOing Charizard and Ninetales. Kingler also has decent physical bulk, avoiding 2HKOs from some strong physical attacks such as Golem's Earthquake and opposing +2 Kingler's Body Slam. Due to its power and bulk, Kingler often forces switches and can fish for paralysis with Body Slam as opponents react to a potential Swords Dance sweep.

However, Kingler is very slow for RBY NU, outsped by a myriad of prominent offensive threats. This means it requires extensive paralysis support from teammates to safely sweep and is ruined by getting paralyzed itself; this threat is compounded by Crabhammer's and Hyper Beam's middling accuracy. Also, even neutral special attacks such as Mr. Mime's Psychic 2HKO it. Kingler's weakness to Electric means it is forced out by Thunderbolt users such as Mr. Mime, Clefable, Nidoking, and Electrode, and even Fire Blast is a major threat to it.

[SET]
name: The Cringe Crab (Swords Dance)
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: Body Slam
move 3: Hyper Beam
move 4: Crabhammer

[SET DESCRIPTION]
===================

Swords Dance defines Kingler's sweep and can reapply paralysis Speed reduction in situations where it needs to set up on a Thunder Wave or Body Slam user. Body Slam is a very powerful attack after a boost and threatens switch-ins with paralysis, which helps Kingler sweep and support its team. Hyper Beam is an outstanding finishing move, dealing massive damage to almost anything and outright OHKOing frailer foes at +2. Crabhammer hits Rock-types, complementing Kingler's physical damage output, and removes Fire-types after mild chip or Body Slam.

Kingler's low Speed means it highly appreciates paralysis support from teammates such as Mr. Mime and Clefable. Kingler also appreciates teammates that can switch into Thunder Wave and Thunderbolt, such as Golem and Nidoking. Early-game, Kingler can wallbreak with Crabhammer and spread paralysis with Body Slam. It appreciates opportunities to enter the field against Charizard, Golem, and Blastoise, preferably as a revenge killer rather than switching into attacks, then using Body Slam, Crabhammer, or Swords Dance to remove one or two major threats, paving the way for its allies to sweep. If Kingler is saved for late-game, when the opponent's team is weakened and paralyzed, and sent in to revenge kill a foe lacking paralysis, it can easily use Swords Dance to sweep. Whether wallbreaking or sweeping, Kingler will want to stay and fight until it drops unless it has a safe switch and is still healthy. Kingler users should note the state of the opponent's team and whether significant checks like Mr. Mime remain healthy to decide whether to set up or use its raw power.

Other Options
===================

Kingler should generally not run any other moves than the four listed in the set. Stomp is much weaker than Body Slam and makes Kingler even more reliant on its team to spread paralysis. Blizzard only hits the relatively niche Exeggcute effectively, 2HKOing it but giving up far more relevant moves. Similarly, Surf's accuracy may sound appealing, as it still OHKOes Golem, but this makes Kingler unable to stop Fire-types and Kabutops. Substitute is held back by Kingler's bad Special, and does not address Kingler's weakness to Thunder Wave.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-type Attacks**: Electrode, Nidoking, and Mr. Mime outspeed Kingler and can 2HKO it with Thunderbolt, with Electrode even having a chance to OHKO bolstered by its high critical hit rate. Clefable is slower than Kingler and takes heavy damage from boosted Body Slam, but it can paralyze and 2HKO Kingler and does not fear Body Slam paralysis.

**Paralysis**: Thunder Wave users such as Clefable and Mr. Mime can dash any chance of Kingler sweeping late-game. Getting paralyzed means Kingler can no longer outspeed some of the slowest Pokemon in RBY NU or outspeed faster paralyzed foes.

**Faster Special Attackers**: Kingler's poor Special means even moderately strong special attacks like Mr. Mime's Psychic 2HKO it. Even Moltres's Fire Blast, which Kingler resists, will always 3HKO it. Its low Speed exacerbates this issue, as it can't outspeed most of the threats that threaten to KO it.

**Burn**: Kingler, as a Water-type, may eventually need to switch into Fire Blast, which has a 30.1% chance to burn. A burned Kingler must use Swords Dance to negate the Attack drop but can at least use Crabhammer unhindered.

[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[LTG, 473639], [Sabelette, 583793]]
- Quality checked by: [[pac, 520967], [SBPC, 468904]], [MrSoup, 375193]], [juoean, 486979]]
- Grammar checked by: [[Adeleine, 517429], [CyroGyro, 331519]]
 
Last edited:

MrSoup

my gf broke up with me again
is a Tiering Contributor
RBTT Champion
doing this on mobile so sorry for the whack format. Lmk if you have any suggestions for qcs.

Paragraph 1:
- Do you mean bslam + beam will kill every neutral target once at +2? Clarify bc normal slam plus beam doesn’t kill stoise for example.
- Maybe mention kingler forcing a lot of switches that allow it to fish for para here? You say it later but it may be a Pokémon highlight
- maybe mention having the highest base attack in the tier?

paragraph 2:
- no comments

paragraph 3:
- para reapplication comment seems niche for nu but is a potential consideration

paragraph 4:
- no comment

paragraph 5:
- not true about blizzard, it does allow a safer 2 hit on little eggs although extremely niche as well as being a potential freeze fish

Checks and counters:
- mention that clef also doesn’t fear bslam para like the other electric attacking users, allowing it to switch in in a pinch without fear.

qc1/1
 
a few entirely optional comments, i am not the most experienced with this mon

~ is the fblast burn chance really relevant? kingler cant switch into tales or molt regardless, as fire blast is a 3hko usually and always respectively while kingler doesnt ohko back, switching into zard fblast doesnt seem like a good idea and i dont think ive seen that. in general idt kingler really switches into attacks in general?

~ re soups comment is clef's paraslam immunity rly relevant here, i have never seen clef used as a kingler switchin and cant rly imagine why you'd ever spend clefable's precious hp for that. at most maybe its relevant in that clefable can twave a +2 kingler without fearing being paraslammed and outsped after twave.

~ re stomp i think just that kingler is slow, i dont think +2 stomp into +2 hbeam misses kos but spreading paralysis widely doesnt rly work in nu (and even if it did you wouldnt need to rely on stomp idt), but things like being able to body slam into crabhammer to ko charizard are relevant, while stomp doesnt rly do anything bc kingler is only faster than clefable of common mons and its not like clef wants to take a +2 hbeam anyway. (agree for the same reason para application isnt rly relevant).

~ overall i dont think kingler either hard switches in much except maybe into golem, and on the flip side it doesnt have switchins so outside of maybe predicting hbeams (which golem doesnt typically get that much out of anyway vs kingler, but maybe kabu can sometimes?) i think u mostly j attack it with whatever is out right?
so j in general i feel like less emphasis on switching in, and more on eg what matchups give it opportunities to attack or setup (mainly zard and golem i think), when should kingler try to set up vs just attack with the few turns it does have, and what can revenge it after what (eg everything other than zard revenges it after 2 stosses tho kabu needs to hbeam, mr. mime can revenge it after one stoss, things like that).
again these are just examples not suggesting u try to include all of these different things or even any of them but i think this sort of thing is more relevant than whether u have teammates that can switch into thunderbolt or switching into fire blasts.

i think u already have sufficient qcs but if not then i am giving qc 2 (regardless of what if anything u choose to edit based on these comments).
 

Sabelette

from the river to the sea
is a Site Content Manageris a Community Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Keep in mind that this is a partial rewrite and I'm not trying to fully rewrite every single part of the old analysis, but I'll take a second look and implement what I can.
 
GP 1/1
[OVERVIEW]
Swords Dance Kingler is the strongest wallbreaker and a potent sweeper in RBY NU, with its base 130 Attack topping the tier. At +2, Hyper Beam can OHKO much of the tier, including threats like Mr. Mime, Raticate, and Venomoth, and nearly KO anything except Rock-types. Additionally, Body Slam followed by Hyper Beam will KO any Normal-neutral foe in the tier at +2. Rock-types are washed away by Crabhammer, a very powerful STAB move that will almost always score a critical hit. Crabhammer It easily OHKOes Golem and 2HKOes Kabutops, coming just short of OHKOing Charizard and Ninetales. Kingler also has decent physical bulk, avoiding 2HKOs from some strong physical attacks such as Golem's Earthquake and opposing +2 Kingler's Body Slam. Due to its power and bulk, Kingler often forces switches and can fish for paralysis with Body Slam as opponents react to a potential Swords Dance sweep.

However, Kingler is very slow for RBY NU, outsped by a myriad of prominent offensive threats in the tier. This means it requires extensive paralysis support from teammates to safely sweep and is ruined by getting paralyzed itself; this threat is compounded by Crabhammer's and Hyper Beam's middling accuracy. Also, while Crabhammer's sheer power makes up for Kingler's low Special offensively, even neutral special attacks such as Mr. Mime's Psychic 2HKO it. Kingler's weakness to Electric means it is forced out by Thunderbolt users such as Mr. Mime, Clefable, Nidoking, and Electrode, and even Fire Blast, which it resists, is a major threat to it.


[SET]
name: The Cringe Crab (Swords Dance)
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: Body Slam
move 3: Hyper Beam
move 4: Crabhammer

[SET DESCRIPTION]
===================

Swords Dance boosts Kingler's already great Attack to dizzying heights, allowing it to deal extreme damage to most foes. It also allows Kingler to reapply paralysis Speed drops to outspeed foes in certain Swords Dance defines Kingler's sweep and can reapply paralysis Speed reduction in situations where it may need to set up against needs to set up on a Thunder Wave or Body Slam user. Body Slam is a very powerful attack after a boost, (comma) and threatens switch-ins with paralysis, which helps Kingler sweep and support its team. Hyper Beam is an outstanding finishing move, dealing massive damage to almost anything and outright OHKOing frailer foes at +2. Crabhammer allows Kingler to hit hits Rock-types, accompanying its complementing Kingler's physical damage output, (comma) as well as allowing Kingler to remove and removes Fire-types after mild chip or a Body Slam.

Kingler's low Speed means it highly appreciates paralysis support from teammates such as Mr. Mime and Clefable. Kingler also appreciates teammates that can switch into Thunder Wave and Thunderbolt, such as Golem and Nidoking. Early-game, Kingler can wallbreak with Crabhammer and spread paralysis with Body Slam. It appreciates opportunities to enter the field against opposing Charizard, Golem, and Blastoise, preferably as a revenge killer rather than switching into attacks., (comma) then using Body Slam, Crabhammer, or Swords Dance to break through the opposing team and remove one or two major threats, paving the way for its allies to sweep once their major checks have been removed. If Kingler is saved for late-game, when the opponent's team is weakened and paralyzed, and sent in to revenge kill a foe lacking paralysis, it can easily use Swords Dance to set up and sweep a weakened and paralyzed team. Oftentimes in either situation Whether wallbreaking or sweeping, Kingler will want to stay and fight until it drops unless it has a safe switch and is still healthy. Kingler users should note the state of the opponent's team and whether significant checks like Mr. Mime remain healthy to decide whether to set up Swords Dance or use Kingler's raw power in the early- to mid-game to punch holes for teammates to exploit or use its raw power.

Other Options
===================

Kingler should generally not run any other moves than the four listed in the set. It could theoretically attempt to run Stomp over Body Slam to flinch foes, but Stomp is much weaker than Body Slam and makes Kingler even more reliant on its team to spread paralysis. Blizzard may sound useful, but due to Kingler's low Special it only hits the relatively niche Exeggcute effectively, 2HKOing it but giving up far more relevant moves. Similarly, Surf's accuracy may sound appealing, (comma) as it still OHKOes Golem, but this makes Kingler unable to stop Fire-types or and Kabutops. Substitute initially appears enticing as a method to enable setup; however, while Kingler may have decent physical bulk, it is once again held back by its Kingler's bad Special, which causes Substitute to usually be a waste. Also, Substitute and does not address Kingler's weakness to Thunder Wave.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-type Attacks**: Electrode, Nidoking, and Mr. Mime outspeed Kingler and can 2HKO it with Thunderbolt, with Electrode even having a chance to OHKO, (comma) further bolstered by its high critical hit rate. Clefable is slower than Kingler and takes heavy damage from boosted Body Slam, but it can paralyze and 2HKO Kingler and does not fear Body Slam paralysis.

**Paralysis**: Thunder Wave users such as Clefable and Mr. Mime can dash any chance of Kingler sweeping late-game. Getting paralyzed means Kingler can no longer outspeed some of the slowest Pokemon in RBY NU or outspeed faster paralyzed foes.

**Faster Special Attackers**: Kingler's poor Special means even moderately strong special attacks like Mr. Mime's Psychic 2HKO it. Even Moltres's Fire Blast, which Kingler resists, will always 3HKO it. Its low Speed exacerbates this issue, as it can't outspeed most of the threats that threaten to KO it.

**Burn**: Kingler, as a Water-type, may eventually need to switch into Fire Blast., (comma) which has a 30.1% chance to burn. A burned Kingler must use Swords Dance to negate the Attack drop but can at least use Crabhammer unhindered. However, Fire Blast's 30.1% chance to burn can greatly hinder Kingler's unboosted damage output, forcing Kingler to use Swords Dance to negate the burn Attack drop. However, a burned Kingler can still use Crabhammer unhindered.

[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[LTG, 473639], [Sabelette, 583793]]
- Quality checked by: [[pac, 520967], [SBPC, 468904]], [MrSoup, 375193]], [juoean, 486979]]
- Grammar checked by: [[Adeleine, 517429], [CyroGyro, 331519]]
 

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