SS PU Just another stall team

[austinxhensl]

Munchlax @ Eviolite
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Body Slam
- Whirlwind
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

This is my favorite wall in the tier, bodyslam because his base 85 attack is good, and to spread paralysis on things like silvally poison and offensive mawiles who are switching into him. whirlwind because this team is built around being able to consistenly keep hazards on the field and doing damage through them.

Shiinotic @ Leftovers
Ability: Effect Spore
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Leech Seed
- Giga Drain
- Moonblast
- Strength Sap

I chose this poke because he can deal with basculin and all silvally ground sets with ease, leech seed over spore because of t-spikes and the ability to pass some recovery to silvally. giga drain and moonblast for the double stab coverage. and strength sap for reliable recovery. this is my switch in against most fighting types once ive scouted for poison jab, fraxure once scouted, and the physical attacking grass trio.

Hippopotas @ Eviolite
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Slack Off
- Toxic/ Whirlwind
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake

where do i start with hippo, hes almost as tanky as his evolution with eviolite, he sets up sand for more passive damage, hes also my stealth rocks setter and sand also helps silvally take more hits from the special side. you can take toxic to cripple stall teams or whirlwind for additional phasing. slack off for mandatory recovery. he is also my primary switch against any mawile set being able to 2hko both offensive sets and the stall breaker fast taunt set and reliably 3hko the physically defensive set.

Silvally-Rock @ Rock Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Parting Shot
- Defog
- Surf
- Multi-Attack

unpopular opinion, silvally is the best rock type in the tier. parting shot is better than for defensive sets as it lowers the attacking stats of opposing mons and avoids rocky helmet. defog because my hazards setters all have ways to keep themselves in the game and hazards against me are a bad time. surf because carkoal is one of the biggest threats to the team and multi-attack is a 3hko against sp def and 4hko against phys defensive, assuming i dont get burned. I went for rockvally because he checks some of the bigger offensive threats to me such as flyvally, firevally, noctowl, vespiquen, carkoal, and heatmor. all of which are common. his biggest drawback is not being able to use leftovers or a recovery move other than rest.

Mareanie @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Toxic Spikes
- Knock Off
- Haze
- Recover

mandatory bulky water here, this spot used to be taken by a physically defensive ludicolo, but mareanie does a couple things better as well as providing toxic spikes to the team. knockoff is there for the many, many boots and eviolite users, haze for the physical setup sweepers and recover for recovery (yes that was a pun.) this is my secondary switch into fighting types and fraxure while i scout for their set.

Pincurchin @ Leftovers
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Recover
- Spikes
- Zing Zap
- Liquidation

this thing is insanely underestimated by a lot of people, spikes for mandatory hazards stacking, recover to keep it in play for longer, zing zap and liquidation for coverage and giving myself another check to carkoal and firevally/flyvally and liquidation can also put a dent into incoming groundvallys if predicted.




https://pastebin.com/GcgVD4Xp and finally here is the importable so you guys can try it out for yourselves

 

[ShuckleDeath]

Hello austinxhensl,

I like the core idea of Munchlax with a Fighting-type resist that's pretty easy to use on its own, but I feel using stall is a bit difficult in PU right now. The metagame is very volatile right now as well as we are in the process of weaning things out of the tier, so you need to take this rate with a grain of salt as some of the things I try to cover may not apply very soon. I think the team does a nice job with defensive type synergy covering most of the Metagame. Unfortunately, in this current state, it actually folds pretty hard to quite a few team archetypes which make this stall team in particular very match up reliant. Set up Pokemon like Noctowl, Mr. Mime(and other Psychic-types), some Silvally forms, and Pawniard can break this team pretty easily. Changes can help, but to completely cover all of these things would change the team to the point of being totally different. I think the best way to go for this team is just to add as much support as possible while trying to cover more. Not an easy feat but I have some suggestions that will help.

Set Changes:

Set

Munchlax @ Eviolite
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 88 HP / 168 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Body Slam
- Whirlwind
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Munchlax is so specially bulky that it can afford to invest in defense which is something you should take advantage of. While the standard is 252 defense and 252 special defense EVs, 88 HP EV investment along with max special defense lets Munchlax survive +2 special attack Modest Noctowls Hurricane, this lets you try and play the odds and gives you a pseudo-counter with Whirlwind and paralysis chance and miss chance. Alternatively, 40 Attack EVs with the addition of Ice Punch will 2HKO zero bulk invested Noctowl before Stealth Rock damage, Body Slam already 2HKOs after Stealth Rock damage.

(Rock)

set

Silvally-Rock @ Rock Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 248 HP / 108 SpD / 152 Spe
Careful Nature
- Parting Shot ---> U-turn
- Defog
- Surf ---> Ice Beam
- Multi-Attack

The new Speed EVs lets Silvally-Rock outpace Timid max speed Noctowl. This allows Silvally-Rock to Switch into a Hurricane and threaten an OHKO with Multi-Attack, keep in mind the OHKO is not a 100% chance it is slightly less than a 70% chance. I tested this team a little and went 5-0 with it and I found dishing out chip damage was very hard and tedious in some match-ups. U-turn over Parting Shot gives this team another tool to chip a little at a time, which over the course of a long game really matters and is quite important. The Surf slot has options but there is not possible to fit them all on one set, unfortunately. Surf doesn't add much as you already beat Carkol with Silvally-Rock and the team has numerous ways of handling it. Ice Beam, however, hits Vibrava which actually is pretty hard for your team to get past. Flamethrower is also highly accepted because even after changes Pawniard is with a doubt in my mind the biggest threat to this team, so having just one more move to hit Pawniard with may just be the best option here. I would suggest you experiment with both, as you may find Pawnaird can be dealt with between Hippopotas and Mareanie or Vibrava is dealt with between Toxic damage and PP stall.

Set

Mareanie @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Impish ---> Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Toxic Spikes
- Knock Off ---> Scald
- Haze
- Recover

Knock Off was really nice to help threaten bulky NFEs a little more, however, Scald really Helps against Pawniard which seems more crucial. Between Burn chance, Haze and Recover you have an actual counter to Pawnaird whereas Knock Off leaves you just that much weaker to it.

Pokemon Changes:

--- >

Set

Dusclops @ Eviolite
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Night Shade
- Haze
- Rest
- Toxic

Dusclops gives you a spinblocker which will help in winning the longterm hazard war, which is the most critical thing this team can accomplish. Hazards really are this teams win condition and it is also weak to opposing hazards to a degree so having the opponent be able to Rapid Spin your hazards away while keeping theirs is pretty much an auto loss. Dusclops also helps deal with Fighting-types and is a decent check to Psychic-types. I thought a second user of Haze could be really beneficial so this is the set I thought might do the best here. Calm Mind sets could also be great as they can be used as a win-con. Night Shade over Seismic Toss as having two Pokemon not being able to damage Ghost-types seems shaky and you can do damage on Normal-types with Toxic or Toxic Spikes, whichever one gets to the first really. Even though the team is Toxic Spikes having multiple Toxic users is still really nice as you want to hit common Heavy Dooty Boots users and levitaters. Rest is used to add some sort of longevity to Dusclops.

--->

Set

Leafeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 248 HP / 156 Def / 104 Spe
Impish Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Wish
- Protect
- Heal Bell

The speed is used for Timid Glaceon, being able to outpace and take it out when Glaceon is in range helps take pressure off your Munchlax. Typing gives you a replacement check to Silvally-Ground and a resistance to Water-type attacks. Other than that this set is just a bread and butter cleric passing Wish to Silvally-Rock fairly easily and Heal Bell stops the team from folding to Toxic or another status. Leafeon was very useful in testing because having that Wish and Heal Bell support is so needed on a stall team it really allows the team to try and outlast the opposing team, which I found early game is just in a huge effort to win the hazard war, if you can win the hazard war this team does a pretty nice job at finishing matches. Without Wish and Heal Bell Silvally-Rock and your Hazard setters really struggle to stay healthy long enough to not just win the hazard war but check things in the mid to late game.

Team Changes <-- Click for importable.

 

[TJ]

hi, austinxhensl - thanks for posting the team.

This was a difficult team to rate without changing most of the team's structure and overlapping with some of Shuckle's ideas. After reading your team descriptions and playing around a bit with the team, I've found a few issues that could be fixed. For example, the team's match up against magic bounce users like hattrem and natu isn't the greatest, while opting for electric surge on pinchurrin means that your munchlax is unable to check and counter some of the threats that its tasked to handle like Noctowl, since it can't use rest while electric terrain is present. Additionally, stall in general without an unaware user like pyukumuku usually falls flat, since certain setup sweepers like silvally ground can beat haze mareanie.


Set Changes:

set

Pincurchin @ Rocky Helmet / Leftovers
Ability: Lightning Rod
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Recover
- Discharge

While unorthodox, the first change that im going to propose to you is using lightning rod over electric surge on pinchurchin. As mentioned earlier, Munchlax is unable to use Rest under electric terrain meaning that it can no longer consistency beat threats like Specs Noctowl and Lapras for your team. Lightning Rod pinchurhin also provides you a secondary electric immunity / volt stop and takes some pressure off of Hippopotas. I understand that you still probably want to use toxic spikes on this team in tandem with sandstorm spikes + whirlwind hippo/munch, so I added toxic spikes over liquidation since I ended up replacing mareanie. Your team doesn't really benefit from having liqidation on pinchurchin anyways as shiinotic + pyukumuku already naturally check silvally ground. Additionally, I would recommend replacing zing zap with discharge as it allows pinchurchin to potentially cripple flying types like natu and grounded poison and steel types not affected by toxic spikes. Rocky Helmet is another option that you could consider over leftovers on max defense pincurchin since it annoys physical attackers like pawniard / persian.

set

Shiinotic @ Rocky Helmet / Leftovers
Ability: Effect Spore
EVs: 248 HP / 176 Def / 84 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spore
- Giga Drain
- Moonblast
- Strength Sap

Next, if you do end up replacing electric surge with lightning rod on Pinchurchin, that will mean that you can run spore over leech seed. While there is nothing wrong with your original Shiinotic EV spread (other than a missing 4 EVs), I believe that this spread is more optimal in the metagame at the moment as it allows shiinotic to check special attackers like mixed ice beam basculin more easily.

Pokemon Changes:

--->

set

Pyukumuku @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Block
- Toxic
- Rest
- Spite

I understand the appeal around regenerator + toxic spikes + haze on mareanie, but I think your team struggles too much against some of the more prevalent SD Silvally forms (fire, ground, flying, dragon). This is why I find pyukumuku to work better on your team as it also has the additional utility of reliably trapping common pokemon/ threats to stall like offensive mawile and pawniard with block + spite or soak. Pyukumuku in general is more reliable at checking physical attackers like persian, heatmor, pawniard, and throh (lacking storm throw) anyways as these pokemon often cripple mareanie with knock off.


--->

set

Vespiquen (F) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Toxic
- Defog
- U-turn
- Roost

Finally, I think replacing Silvally Rock with Vespiquen as your hazard remover would be a good idea. Your team appreciates a secondary fighting + knock off resist and vespiquen can also consistently remove opposing hazards and pressure hattrem out with uturn, which is a pretty scary threat to your team since you rely on hazards as your wincon. spdef munchlax is already your noctowl check, so silvally rock overlaps with it in this role too.

New Importable <--- Click

 

[austinxhensl]

hi, austinxhensl - thanks for posting the team.

This was a difficult team to rate without changing most of the team's structure and overlapping with some of Shuckle's ideas. After reading your team descriptions and playing around a bit with the team, I've found a few issues that could be fixed. For example, the team's match up against magic bounce users like hattrem and natu isn't the greatest, while opting for electric surge on pinchurrin means that your munchlax is unable to check and counter some of the threats that its tasked to handle like Noctowl, since it can't use rest while electric terrain is present. Additionally, stall in general without an unaware user like pyukumuku usually falls flat, since certain setup sweepers like silvally ground can beat haze mareanie.




New Importable <--- Click

Thanks, the idea around electric surge was more to combat type null resttalk sets but I have lost about as many as i won because of it because of its ability to hamper munchlax. I never really thought of pyukumuku because when i looked at the movepool I was turned off by it but I will give it a try and see if i have any more success with it. I am still trying to grasp the changes since I lost interest early in gen 6 but am starting to enjoy coming back to pokemon. thanks for the reccomendations

 

[austinxhensl]

Hello austinxhensl,

I like the core idea of Munchlax with a Fighting-type resist that's pretty easy to use on its own, but I feel using stall is a bit difficult in PU right now. The metagame is very volatile right now as well as we are in the process of weaning things out of the tier, so you need to take this rate with a grain of salt as some of the things I try to cover may not apply very soon. I think the team does a nice job with defensive type synergy covering most of the Metagame. Unfortunately, in this current state, it actually folds pretty hard to quite a few team archetypes which make this stall team in particular very match up reliant. Set up Pokemon like Noctowl, Mr. Mime(and other Psychic-types), some Silvally forms, and Pawniard can break this team pretty easily. Changes can help, but to completely cover all of these things would change the team to the point of being totally different. I think the best way to go for this team is just to add as much support as possible while trying to cover more. Not an easy feat but I have some suggestions that will help.



Team Changes <-- Click for importable.

Thanks for the rate! I agree with pawniard being possibly the biggest threat to the team but i also feel like without spikes support the team kind of loses its win condition of "win hazards war and sweep" but I will try to use your reccomendations further.