Other Metagames (Gen 8 AG) Rate My Team

[Kaiser747898]

Marshadow @ Focus Sash
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spectral Thief
- Shadow Sneak
- Close Combat
- Stone Edge

Marshadow's role is to counter set-up Pokemons like Xerneas or Zacian-Crowned with it's Spectral Thief. It's other role is to take care of Calyrex-Shadow with Shadow Sneak, which is a guaranteed OHKO, stopping it from sweeping teams. Close Combat is a STAB high power move just used to take out Pokemon that resist Ghost-type moves. Stone Edge is to deal with Flying-types that are super-effective against Marshadow. Focus Sash is to ensure Marshadow doesn't get OHKO'd by super-effective moves against it before it can Spectral Thief the stat-boosts. After using up its Focus Sash for Spectral Thief, Marshadow's role changes to being a glass-cannon, Shadow Sneaking Pokemon that are faster or have priority moves, and using the other moves to deal massive damage.

Lugia @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Aeroblast
- Psychic
- Earth Power

Lugia's role is to clear entry hazards, which heavily affect the team, especially Marshadow. It's Multiscale ensures it will survive a hit, letting it use Defog. Aeroblast and Psychic are strong STAB moves which let it deal decent damage against Pokemon after using Defog. Earth Power is a decently high power move that gives it the most type coverage possible. Heavy-Duty Boots stops it's Multiscale from being removed.(Calculated using Type Coverage Calculator from Pokemondb)

Groudon @ Leftovers
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stone Edge
- Precipice Blades
- Thunder Punch
- Shadow Claw

Groudon is my go-to starter, having good speed and attack with massive type coverage. Stone Edge is useful against Fire-types who try to take advantage of Drought, and is also an alternative for Thunder Punch, which cannot hit Landorus. Precipice Blades is a strong STAB ground type move which can faint or at least heavily damage Pokemon that take neutral damage from it. Thunder Punch is strong against Flying and Water types, giving it a chance against Water Pokemon. Additionally, Thunder Punch doesnt have a chance to miss, unlike Stone Edge, so in times where I don't want to miss, it's a good move. Shadow Claw can take care of Calyrex-Shadow if the opponent starts with it, since it doesn't have insane stat boosts yet, and Groudon is fairly tanky. Leftovers is for more survivability.

Kyurem-White @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Turboblaze
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Blizzard
- Draco Meteor
- Fusion Flare
- Flash Cannon

Kyurem-White is my Special Attack sweeper. Blizzard and Draco Meteor are strong STAB moves that can heavily damage or even faint Pokemon that don't resist them. Fusion Flare is a decently powerful Fire type move that can take out Steel-types, which threaten to faint it with their high survivability. Flash Cannon is a Steel-type move that can take out Fairy types, with it's decent Power. Choice Scarf makes it move faster, letting it avoid getting OHKO'd before it can do anything.

Zacian-Crowned @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Intrepid Sword
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Behemoth Blade
- Play Rough
- Ice Fang
- Close Combat

Zacian-Crowned is primarily used to take out Dynamaxed Pokemon that are too strong, or Dragon types that pose a big threat. Behemoth Blade deals double damage against Dynamaxed Pokemon, so Zacian can easily take them out. Play Rough also counters Dragon types that try to set up Dragon Dance. Ice Fang is a decent move that can faint Ground types before they can faint Zacian. Close Combat is a strong move that can take out Pokemon that the other moves can't.

Zeraora @ Choice Band
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Plasma Fists
- Grass Knot
- Close Combat
- Knock Off

Zeoraora's role is a Physical Sweeper. It's high power plus STAB Plasma Fists can easily take out Pokemon that are weak to it, and heavily damage Pokemon that are neutral. Grass Knot is used to take care of Ground types, specifically Groudon, as it is very heavy. Close Combat is a powerful move used to take care of types that Plasma Fists can OHKO. Knock Off is a good starting move and stops enemies from gaining an advantage through items. Choice Band is to boost it's attack, as it's Speed is already faster than most Pokemon.

Thanks for taking the time to read my team. Feel free to post improvements!

 

[Fc]

Hi! I think this team has a decent foundation with some of the mons, given that quite a few of them are fairly solid and are decent partners for each other. The sets do need some work, though, to make them more standard for the current meta, as well as a few unviable Pokemon showing up on the team like Lugia and Zeraora. I have some changes for every mon, big and small, that I think will improve the team a lot.

Major Changes:

-->
Lugia is unviable in the current metagame, with it walling essentially nothing and being heavily outclassed by Lunala in terms of similar abilities. Also, given your set has no recovery it won't stick around in a game making it a useless wall. Yveltal on the other hand, is the second best Pokemon in the metagame. Having a check to Calyrex-S is so important that Yveltal is all but required on teams, so it's needed here. The speed outruns Lando-T as well as more important targets like Max Speed Groudon, with just standard moves to accompany it.

Set

Yveltal @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Dark Aura
EVs: 64 HP / 252 SpD / 192 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Foul Play
- U-turn
- Roost
- Defog

-->
Zeraora is another unviable Pokemon, not breaking anything in the tier pretty much. Its high speed is unimpressive given the attack stat, where Zacian-C and Calyrex-S outpace it and have insane stats to go with that. Necrozma-DM shores up a lot of weaknesses on the team, mainly to Zacian-C and Xerneas. I'm recommending the Dragon Dance set to make the mon less susceptible to Gothitelle, but this can always run Stealth Rock > Dragon Dance and Groudon Thunder Wave > Stealth Rock, up to you. I just think this is probably for the best. The Speed outruns Adamant Zacian-C at +2, but you can put 120 Speed EVs to outrun both Jolly Zacian-C and Calyrex-S at +2. This comes with reduced bulk meaning Zacian-C is a bit bigger of a threat, but I'd run Leftovers if you make that change and just play smart between this and Groudon which should check Zacian-C alright.

Set

Necrozma-Dusk-Mane @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Prism Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 224 Def / 32 Spe
Impish Nature
- Sunsteel Strike
- Earthquake
- Moonlight
- Dragon Dance

Minor Changes:


Focus Sash Marshadow is a common pick that people use, but it's one of the worst ways you can take a team with Marshadow. Any prior chip damage or entry hazards and the Marshadow is just useless, not to mention that because it's Focus Sash the damage output it does is so pitifully weak you're walled by even things that you should be breaking with Super Effective coverage like Necrozma-DM, given that without an item Spectral Thief is doing around 40 max which is terrible damage. The role of beating set up sweepers is also just 100% better with Ditto, since it's a reliable pick that actually does damage instead of just a small chance of succeeding at stopping a single thing unreliably. Choice Band on the other hand is a great set which I'd recommend here. Life Orb also works which I'll provide the set for, but I think banded is just easy to slap on teams. It's a solid breaker overall and is a good fit with Groudon since Ice Punch can lure Zygarde.

Sets

Marshadow @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spectral Thief
- Shadow Sneak
- Close Combat
- Ice Punch

Or

Marshadow @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Spectral Thief
- Shadow Sneak
- Close Combat
- Ice Punch / Bulk Up

4 attacks Groudon is just kinda bad, with Thunder Punch hitting nothing your other moves do and Shadow Claw being very risky given if you try to take on a Calyrex-S you're fairly likely for it to either switch if you're full health and it's not Choice Specs, or to just lose if it has any boosts. This set I'm recommending is a great balance between defense and offense, with Swords Dance to boost Precipice Blades and Stone Edge, the only 2 attacks you really need tbh. Stealth Rock is always good, and running it here frees up Dusk Mane to run Dragon Dance meaning it can be a sweeper and less trappable by Gothitelle. The Attack EVs let you always OHKO max HP Yveltal with Stone Edge after a Swords Dance, the Speed outruns Calyrex-I and just 1 above that, and the rest is in Max HP and Defense to boost the bulk against things like Marshadow and Foul Play Yveltal.

Set

Groudon @ Leftovers
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 HP / 108 Atk / 132 Def / 16 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stone Edge
- Precipice Blades
- Swords Dance
- Stealth Rock

Kyurem-W is a solid pick, but it has a fairly distinct niche in that it is one of the best Kyogre checks while also having access to Sheer Cold. A 30% chance to just remove something from the game is great in longer matches, so that should be what it does here, especially since you don't have a dedicated Kyogre answer to begin with. Standard Utility Umbrella set, enough speed for Lando-T and max Speed Kyogre, with normal coverage to break things.

Set

Kyurem-White @ Utility Umbrella
Ability: Turboblaze
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 32 HP / 252 SpD / 224 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Freeze-Dry
- Roost
- Fusion Flare
- Sheer Cold

Just a few changes to Zacian-C, now that you have Stealth Rock support on Groudon running Assurance is great because it catches Necrozma-DM switching in to wall Zacian-C and actually lets you beat one of your best checks. Wild Charge was chosen to break things like Ho-Oh and Kyogre, and an Adamant Nature instead of Jolly to make the aforementioned Assurance into Close Combat on switch in KO Dusk Mane more reliably.

Set

Zacian-Crowned @ Rusted Sword
Ability: Intrepid Sword
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Behemoth Blade
- Assurance
- Wild Charge
- Close Combat

Updated RMT (pokepast.es)
This is the updated team, I hope it works well for you! With just a few mons changed and the sets fixed up I think the team looks a ton better, and it should be pretty reliable too given how only a few things can get out of hand now, but the Groudon seems like it can cover for a lot of the physical threats that might be the problems.

 

[Kaiser747898]

Thanks for the recommendations. I totally agree with what you've said. I have a question though. Isn't running Utility Umbrella kind of a waste? I personally think using Wide Lens would be better since it make Sheer Cold easier to hit.

 

[TGA]

Thanks for the recommendations. I totally agree with what you've said. I have a question though. Isn't running Utility Umbrella kind of a waste? I personally think using Wide Lens would be better since it make Sheer Cold easier to hit.

Uttility umbrella make sogre water moves do less damage due to no weather effect and sheer cold is not affected by wide lens

 

[Kaiser747898]

Ah, OK. Thanks for the explanation. I didn't know OHKO moves weren't affected by Wide Lens.

 

[Kaiser747898]

Update for anyone that is interested:
First, I removed Marshadow. Choice Band was strong but it just wasn't my style, and Focus Sash was annoying to deal with since Marshadow did almost no damage against dedicated walls. Instead, I replaced Marshadow with Giratina-Origin (248 HP, 252+ATK, 8SpD)(Defog, Poltergeist, Dragon Claw, Shadow Sneak). I really like how Giratina is so far, with good damage and enough tankiness to pull off Defog. Since Giratina is my Defogger now, I changed Yveltal to Life Orb Special Sweeper (Oblivion Wing, Dark Pulse, Roost, Sucker Punch). It's been working great, but after a few attacks he's easy to kill, but Oblivion Wing solves that. I changed Groudon a bit(252 ATK, Speed, 4 SpD) and for his moveset, I replaced Stone Edge with Thunder Punch(It works better) and Stealth Rock with Heat Crash. If Groudon outspeeds I set up Swords Dance to faint a few Pokemon, since he has the bulk to survive an attack. If not, I just go for the supereffective or strongest move.It's been working super well, Groudon gives me a massive advantage with this set. Kyurem-White was changed quite a bit. I changed his IVs to more bulk and SpATK and less speed. (252HP,SpATK,4SpD) and also changed Utility Umbrella to Leftovers. It's moveset became Freeze-Dry, Roost, Fusion Flare and Flash Cannon. Just a standard Bulky Special Sweeper, but it's works great! Zacian-C's IVs didn't change, but I removed Assurance and Wild Charge for Play Rough and Ice Fang. Not much of a change, but it makes dealing with Pokemon easier. Lastly, I removed Necrozma-DM and replaced him with Palkia (252+SpA, 248HP, 8 SpD) with the moveset Spacial Rend, Rest, Sleep Talk and Hydro Pump with Lustrous Orb. It's working pretty well against Pokemon that don't have supereffective moves that are Physical.

 

[Fc]

snip

I'm gonna be honest, most of these changes are strictly downgrades from the ones you're changing them from. The sets I gave for the most part either came from ones I've used in multiple tournament games, or from places like the set compendium which has standard solid sets for all the mons. I'll try to address all the things you've changed, since I really believe for consistency if you want to take the team higher on ladder or even join tournaments like the summer seasonal the other sets are just better.

First, I removed Marshadow. Choice Band was strong but it just wasn't my style, and Focus Sash was annoying to deal with since Marshadow did almost no damage against dedicated walls. Instead, I replaced Marshadow with Giratina-Origin (248 HP, 252+ATK, 8SpD)(Defog, Poltergeist, Dragon Claw, Shadow Sneak). I really like how Giratina is so far, with good damage and enough tankiness to pull off Defog.

Giratina-O can probably work, as it's another Ghost-type and actually covers for the Groudon MU better. The standard set has Stone Edge > Dragon Claw, though, as Dragon STAB doesn't hit a ton of switch ins to an unrevealed Giratina since no dragons wanna switch in fearing potential draco meteor. Also, the 8 SpD can be moved to defense, as it actually allows you to live Yveltal Foul Play always. Adding 16 Speed EVs will also allow Giratina to outrun Jolly Calyrex-I which may come in handy, and para'd Calyrex-S which is rarely gonna come in handy but it's not a lot of investment.

252+ Atk Dark Aura Yveltal Foul Play vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Giratina-Origin: 422-500 (83.8 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

I really like how Giratina is so far, with good damage and enough tankiness to pull off Defog. Since Giratina is my Defogger now, I changed Yveltal to Life Orb Special Sweeper (Oblivion Wing, Dark Pulse, Roost, Sucker Punch). It's been working great, but after a few attacks he's easy to kill, but Oblivion Wing solves that.

If you're set on keeping Yveltal offensive I'd give it 68 SpDef EV's so that it always lives 2 hits from Choice Specs Calyrex-S, but honestly if you're not using it as the primary Defogger I feel like Choice Scarf Yveltal could be a good option here. It helps check Baton Pass Calyrex-S pretty well, and generally helps a lot against hyper offense which you may struggle against. This is just one spread I'm suggesting, but a lot can be used.

Set

Yveltal @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Dark Aura
EVs: 16 HP / 240 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Foul Play
- U-turn
- Roost
- Oblivion Wing

After this change, though, the rest are just worse than the originals.

I changed Groudon a bit(252 ATK, Speed, 4 SpD) and for his moveset, I replaced Stone Edge with Thunder Punch(It works better) and Stealth Rock with Heat Crash. If Groudon outspeeds I set up Swords Dance to faint a few Pokemon, since he has the bulk to survive an attack. If not, I just go for the supereffective or strongest move.It's been working super well, Groudon gives me a massive advantage with this set.

If you want to go with an offensive Groudon, I'd recommend the set I'll paste below. It's a more offensive set that breaks pretty well given the right conditions, and is probably one of the best ways to have an offensive Groudon on this team. Thunder Punch is definitely not better than Stone Edge, as it literally has nothing over either Stone Edge or Precipice Blades in pretty much every matchup barring extremely niche ones like Skarmory, which there are better ways of dealing with like just clicking Dynamax. Dynamax is also the reason Heat Crash is niche, and while I'm actually a fan of it I feel like here isn't the most optimal place to use it. If you did want to, though, I'd 100% say use it on the set I suggested in my last post with Heat Crash > Stealth Rock

Calcs

252+ Atk Groudon Precipice Blades vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Kyogre: 261-307 (76.5 - 90%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Groudon Thunder Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Kyogre: 218-258 (63.9 - 75.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


+2 252+ Atk Groudon Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Yveltal: 550-648 (120.8 - 142.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Groudon Thunder Punch vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Yveltal: 414-488 (90.9 - 107.2%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO

Doesn't even OHKO Yveltal, which is a huge part of Stone Edge's benefits

Alternative offensive Groudon Spread

Groudon @ Lum Berry
Ability: Drought
EVs: 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rock Polish
- Swords Dance
- Precipice Blades
- Stone Edge

Heat Crash Groudon Set

Groudon @ Leftovers
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 HP / 108 Atk / 132 Def / 16 Spe
Impish Nature
- Swords Dance
- Heat Crash
- Stone Edge
- Precipice Blades

Kyurem-White was changed quite a bit. I changed his IVs to more bulk and SpATK and less speed. (252HP,SpATK,4SpD) and also changed Utility Umbrella to Leftovers. It's moveset became Freeze-Dry, Roost, Fusion Flare and Flash Cannon. Just a standard Bulky Special Sweeper, but it's works great!

The issue with doing this is that it no longer beats Kyogre reliably. The main thing it can do with Utility Umbrella is outspeed all Kyogre sets that can dish out enough damage (Just specs pretty much) and roost off the hits. The old spread with Utility Umbrella is just better and more consistent. Similarly, Flash Cannon only hits Pokemon like Tyranitar and Xerneas, 2 things that if you actually stay in on you're just losing the Kyurem. It's not worth it ever, and Sheer Cold's option to just delete a Pokemon from the game is way better.

Zacian-C's IVs didn't change, but I removed Assurance and Wild Charge for Play Rough and Ice Fang. Not much of a change, but it makes dealing with Pokemon easier.

These changes just don't really make sense. Ice Fang is strictly worse than Play Rough, doing less damage to even 4X Pokemon like Zygarde. Play Rough can be used > Behemoth Blade if you want it, but otherwise I'd stick to Assurance and Wild Charge. Both are so crucial at helping break checks like Ho-Oh and Necrozma-DM that changing them isn't worth it for other worse options.

Lastly, I removed Necrozma-DM and replaced him with Palkia (252+SpA, 248HP, 8 SpD) with the moveset Spacial Rend, Rest, Sleep Talk and Hydro Pump with Lustrous Orb. It's working pretty well against Pokemon that don't have supereffective moves that are Physical.

There's multiple issues with this, with a big one being just having to change Necrozma-DM. Necrozma-DM is such an incredible Pokemon, you're essentially always better having it on a team than not. It covers Zacian-C, Xerneas, Galarian Darmanitan, defensive Eternatus, etc while providing incredible utility. This team is 100% better off with it than Palkia. The second issue with this change is that the palkia set doesn't beat much. Palkia's main and only draw is beating Kyogre, which this set doesn't do, as Calm Mind sets just set up on it and win. If you opt to make Groudon offensive, I'd recommend making NDM Stealth Rock with a slightly different spread to help here.

Updated RMT Giratina-O Version (pokepast.es)
Updated RMT Giratina-O Scarf Yveltal Version (pokepast.es)
Here are the 2 versions based on the Yveltals, and these are the way I'd make edits if you were to do so. I don't think that the ways you took it were the most optimal, and while I think you can definitely work with both Giratina-O and an offensive Groudon set, the rest of the things should stay close to the same to keep the team as consistent as possible.

 

[Kaiser747898]

I'm gonna be honest, most of these changes are strictly downgrades from the ones you're changing them from. The sets I gave for the most part either came from ones I've used in multiple tournament games, or from places like the set compendium which has standard solid sets for all the mons. I'll try to address all the things you've changed, since I really believe for consistency if you want to take the team higher on ladder or even join tournaments like the summer seasonal the other sets are just better.


Giratina-O can probably work, as it's another Ghost-type and actually covers for the Groudon MU better. The standard set has Stone Edge > Dragon Claw, though, as Dragon STAB doesn't hit a ton of switch ins to an unrevealed Giratina since no dragons wanna switch in fearing potential draco meteor. Also, the 8 SpD can be moved to defense, as it actually allows you to live Yveltal Foul Play always. Adding 16 Speed EVs will also allow Giratina to outrun Jolly Calyrex-I which may come in handy, and para'd Calyrex-S which is rarely gonna come in handy but it's not a lot of investment.

252+ Atk Dark Aura Yveltal Foul Play vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Giratina-Origin: 422-500 (83.8 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


If you're set on keeping Yveltal offensive I'd give it 68 SpDef EV's so that it always lives 2 hits from Choice Specs Calyrex-S, but honestly if you're not using it as the primary Defogger I feel like Choice Scarf Yveltal could be a good option here. It helps check Baton Pass Calyrex-S pretty well, and generally helps a lot against hyper offense which you may struggle against. This is just one spread I'm suggesting, but a lot can be used.

Set

Yveltal @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Dark Aura
EVs: 16 HP / 240 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Foul Play
- U-turn
- Roost
- Oblivion Wing

After this change, though, the rest are just worse than the originals.


If you want to go with an offensive Groudon, I'd recommend the set I'll paste below. It's a more offensive set that breaks pretty well given the right conditions, and is probably one of the best ways to have an offensive Groudon on this team. Thunder Punch is definitely not better than Stone Edge, as it literally has nothing over either Stone Edge or Precipice Blades in pretty much every matchup barring extremely niche ones like Skarmory, which there are better ways of dealing with like just clicking Dynamax. Dynamax is also the reason Heat Crash is niche, and while I'm actually a fan of it I feel like here isn't the most optimal place to use it. If you did want to, though, I'd 100% say use it on the set I suggested in my last post with Heat Crash > Stealth Rock

Calcs

252+ Atk Groudon Precipice Blades vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Kyogre: 261-307 (76.5 - 90%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Groudon Thunder Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Kyogre: 218-258 (63.9 - 75.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


+2 252+ Atk Groudon Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Yveltal: 550-648 (120.8 - 142.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Groudon Thunder Punch vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Yveltal: 414-488 (90.9 - 107.2%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO

Doesn't even OHKO Yveltal, which is a huge part of Stone Edge's benefits

Alternative offensive Groudon Spread

Groudon @ Lum Berry
Ability: Drought
EVs: 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rock Polish
- Swords Dance
- Precipice Blades
- Stone Edge

Heat Crash Groudon Set

Groudon @ Leftovers
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 HP / 108 Atk / 132 Def / 16 Spe
Impish Nature
- Swords Dance
- Heat Crash
- Stone Edge
- Precipice Blades

The issue with doing this is that it no longer beats Kyogre reliably. The main thing it can do with Utility Umbrella is outspeed all Kyogre sets that can dish out enough damage (Just specs pretty much) and roost off the hits. The old spread with Utility Umbrella is just better and more consistent. Similarly, Flash Cannon only hits Pokemon like Tyranitar and Xerneas, 2 things that if you actually stay in on you're just losing the Kyurem. It's not worth it ever, and Sheer Cold's option to just delete a Pokemon from the game is way better.


These changes just don't really make sense. Ice Fang is strictly worse than Play Rough, doing less damage to even 4X Pokemon like Zygarde. Play Rough can be used > Behemoth Blade if you want it, but otherwise I'd stick to Assurance and Wild Charge. Both are so crucial at helping break checks like Ho-Oh and Necrozma-DM that changing them isn't worth it for other worse options.


There's multiple issues with this, with a big one being just having to change Necrozma-DM. Necrozma-DM is such an incredible Pokemon, you're essentially always better having it on a team than not. It covers Zacian-C, Xerneas, Galarian Darmanitan, defensive Eternatus, etc while providing incredible utility. This team is 100% better off with it than Palkia. The second issue with this change is that the palkia set doesn't beat much. Palkia's main and only draw is beating Kyogre, which this set doesn't do, as Calm Mind sets just set up on it and win. If you opt to make Groudon offensive, I'd recommend making NDM Stealth Rock with a slightly different spread to help here.

Updated RMT Giratina-O Version (pokepast.es)
Updated RMT Giratina-O Scarf Yveltal Version (pokepast.es)
Here are the 2 versions based on the Yveltals, and these are the way I'd make edits if you were to do so. I don't think that the ways you took it were the most optimal, and while I think you can definitely work with both Giratina-O and an offensive Groudon set, the rest of the things should stay close to the same to keep the team as consistent as possible.

I read through all of the changes you said, and even though it sounds much better than my original team, I'm still not going to change it. I played a few matches with the previous team and this one, and it honestly doesn't feel any better. It might be because I don't know how to properly utilize these sets, especially since I only recently started getting serious about competitive battling and teambuilding. I'll stick with my original team for now since I know how I want it to work, so it would yield better results than using a set I don't understand. Thanks for your suggestion though, I might tweak the team a little to address the problems you brought up that I think matter, but there isn't going to be much of a change.

This is a more detailed explanation on why I don't want to change:

One thing you'll notice is that I talk a lot about accuracy in here. This is I hate missing, especially when there's no point for the risk. In a fight where if you hit, you win, but then you miss just for a move that does a bit more damage (this is an example, I dont mean all the time), I just don't think it's worth it.

I just finished typing, and I realized I wrote EVs as IVs...
I'm tired, so I'm not going to change it, so just pretend that it's EVs.

For the first team, Groudon with Rock Polish and Swords Dance is two set-up moves, which Groudon probably won't have the time to use. Even if I only use 1 of them, Groudon's speed isn't enough for it to use an attack after Swords Dance most of the time. I don't have a problem with Rock Polish, in fact, I might even switch out Swords Dance for it! But with only 2 attacks, Groudon's type matchup is pretty limited, with Thunder Punch being able to cover Flying types and Water types with no chance of missing, which is vital in the situation where Groudon uses a set-up move and doesn't have enough health to take another hit. Heat Crash, Precipice Blades and Thunder Punch just covers more Pokemon (type coverage calculator) in general. Lum Berry isn't too useful either.

For Giratina-O, why Stone Edge? Aside from the fact that Rock is super effective against Ice-types, there's really no point in using it. Dragon Claw does way more damage with STAB plus Griseous Orb boost, and it won't miss either. I understand that Dragon Claw won't have super effective damage almost all the time, but it still does more damage than Stone Edge. The stat spread does make sense though.

I actually like the change to Yveltal in this set. High speed means most of the time he can move first, and adding SpDef to ensure that Yveltal can survive is good. His SpAtk doesn't drop much either. Heat Wave is a decent move too. Good job! I completely agree with this change.

For Kyurem-W, I'm sorry to say, but I completely disagree with the changes. Using Sheer Cold which has horrible accuracy for a OHKO, which most of the time is not going to happen, is just not worth it. Although the occasional hit is greatly rewarding, it's much better just attacking, so using up a slot for an occasional hit isn't worth it for me. As for why Flash Cannon, it's just a sort of filler move, honestly :p. It's useful in some situations, so I'm willing to discard it for another move if someone convinces me to, but I'm not going to change it for now. As for the IV spread, having 252HP Ivs is already enough to survive one hit from a Choice Specs Kyogre with Water Spout. Even if I can't OHKO it this turn, it'll take a bunch of damage from Freeze-Dry with STAB plus 252 SpAtk IVs, so Water Spout will barely scratch me, especially with Leftovers. So I'm not going to change anything for this one.

For Zacian-C, I understand why you would want Ice Fang gone. It's a mediocre move with only decent power. But then, isn't Assurance in the same boat? It's actually weaker than Ice Fang! It's good against checks, yes, but if it's a switch into Necrozma-DM, a Close Combat after an attack is enough to take care of it, even if it's not very effective. If it's just a normal faint-in, I just switch Zacian-C out. As for Wild Charge, I don't see much use in it other than Flying types, specifically Ho-Oh. The recoil isn't worth it as most of the time I would want Zacian-C as healthy as possible so that it can switch in against Dynamaxed Pokemon or Dragon types. The only use it has is countering Ho-Oh, while I could just switch out.

For Necrozma-DM, I initially thought it would be really good, but after using it, I was disappointed. Again, it could be my incompetence in using it that led to it being bad. It didn't have enough power to take out most things, and if I used a turn setting up Stealth Rock, the opponent would switch into a Pokemon with super-effective moves, forcing me to switch.Prism Armor is useful, but it just isn't enough most of the time. Moonlight doesn't help either, as it's speed is quite low. It just felt wrong, using it, as if I was messing around. The issue with Palkia that you raised is reasonable, so I'm open for new suggestions. I do have a small idea, which is to run it with Choice Band and 252HP and ATK IVs and 4 in SpDef, with Sunsteel Strike, Earthquake, Knock Off and Psychic Fangs. It's much simpler, so I think it fits me more, but let me know what you think if you still want me to use Necrozma-DM. Rocky Helmet doesn't help much, as most people that i met switched into SpAtk Pokemon.

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For the next one, I'm only going to address the change.

Choice Scarf Yveltal makes it so that it's damage output is lower, plus It can't use Roost(I don't know why you put it there, might just be a mistake) so it's survivability is lower. Oblivion Wing can't handle the burden of not having Roost, and U-Turn doesn't fit well in my team in my opinion. My team is mostly every Pokemon functioning by itself, instead of a coherent unit, so U-Turn switching into something else doesn't give it any advantage.

I'm hope this explains why I won't change much. Some of my logic may sound dumb, but this is just my train of thought. Still, thank you for taking the time to write the suggestions. You made me understand some things I didn't know before.