Metagame Foresighters

[Hiusi guy]

How would Substitute and pivoting moves work in this meta? For sub, does it take the health from the setter or the mon out, and for pivoting moves, would they just cause the mon out to switch out?

For the substitute question we don't know yet, but for the pivot question it's safer to assume that it'll switch the pokemon that's in

 

[Gambit_Gamin]

How would Substitute and pivoting moves work in this meta? For sub, does it take the health from the setter or the mon out, and for pivoting moves, would they just cause the mon out to switch out?

Since Hiusi Guy answered the second question, I'm assuming that for sub it would take the health out from the mon currently on the field.

 

[AIPS]

Transform Chansey / Blissey alert! It can also Final Gambit if you're funny.

You can also cook with Skill Swap Regigigas and Slaking.


This is me going through the list of all moves and thinking of interesting interactions:

How will moves like Dig work, is it just the damage?

Will Outrage and it's clones lock you? Rollout? Speaking of Locking- Jaw Lock, Fire Spin and Block might be annoying.

Beak Blast?

Will Throat chopping a future sound move work? Taunting a future setup move?

Can a Future move activate Throat Spray or Blunder Policy?

Lash Out with stat drops? Will Assurance remind me of Linked as well?

Endeavor / Flail / Revenge or Eruption / Water Spout / Dragon Energy with the HP of which Pokémon?

I'm guessing Rage Fist will interact with the move's user, not the one switching in, same for Stored Power Trip and speed and weight moves.
Revelation Dance and Hyperspace Fury as well, probably.

Is Payback always 100BP because it attacks last?

Counter / Mirror Coat / Metal Burst / Comeuppance?

Focus Punch?

Will Future Copycat use the last move before initiated, or before activated?

Will Charge / Electromorphosis work on a future move? If so then when should it be activated?

 

[InkyDarkBird]

Screens seem kind of powerful given how the main new strategy seems to be switching around Pokemon to be able to use stronger offensive moves or better utility moves on Pokemon that don't get them.
Light Clay should be on the watchlist.

 

[TDLoriat]

Thoughts:

• Rapid spin slot one into kingambit switch seems terrifying because no ghosts want to stay in and get kowtowed so no spinblocking
• full effect trick rooms are nice
• screens should be watchlisted
• actual weather moves might be decent
• delayed status moves into a switchin to counter theirs
• watch out for wish passing in a turn later than thought possible on a ton of pokemon
• on average its better to run a filler first slot or team based utility, so offensive mons are probably worse methinks

All in all, I hope my vote goes towards an incredibly stall heavy meta that Iwont have to deal with

 

[Pangowo.wav]

If i run, say, Wave crash in the first slot of a Moxie Quaquaval, and flip turn into an Araquanid, would moxie activate? or would Water Bubble be the only ability in play?

 

[Notgamingreally]

If i run, say, Wave crash in the first slot of a Moxie Quaquaval, and flip turn into an Araquanid, would moxie activate? or would Water Bubble be the only ability in play?

Sighted moves like fsight and dd only count the in mon ability yeah

 

[MegaFlygon1234]

my god, imagine minimize toxapex or other tanks in this meta

 

[Jhormungard]

(Approved by Isaiah)

View attachment 607321
(AMAZING ART BY IMakeNoSense)

Foresighters​

Ever heard of the move Future Sight? The mechanic surrounding this move is that when used, it won't instantly hit the target. However, after two turns, the move will hit. So, what if you could use a move that could act like Future Sight? In this metagame, one move in the first moveslot will act as Future Sight.


Rules:

Mechanic: The move in the first moveslot uses the same mechanic as Future Sight.
Example:

Example

Deoxys-D
Ability: Pressure
IVs: 0 Atk
- Agility
- Teleport
- Recover
- Psycho Boost
Let's say you have Deoxys-Defense. First turn, you use Agility, but since it acts like Future Sight, nothing happens. Next turn you teleport to Gholdengo. This turn, Gholdengo uses Nasty Plot. At the end of the turn, however, the Agility from Deoxys occurs and Gholdengo also gets a Speed Boost. Now, your Gholdengo is at +2 SpA and +2 Speed and threatens to sweep.

Clauses: Standard OMs, Sleep Moves Clause, Terastal Clause
Banlist:
Banned Pokemon:

Banned Pokemon

Annihilape
Arceus(All Forms)
Baxcalibur
Calyrex-Ice
Calyrex-Shadow
Chien-Pao
Chi-Yu
Deoxys
Deoxys-A
Dialga(Base+Origin)
Espathra
Eternatus
Flutter Mane
Giratina(Base+Origin)
Groudon
Ho-oh
Koraidon
Kyogre
Kyurem-B
Kyurem-W
Landorus-I
Lugia
Lunala
Magearna
Mewtwo
Miraidon
Necrozma-Dawn-Wings
Necrozma-Dusk-Mane
Palafin
Palkia(Base+Origin)
Rayquaza
Reshiram
Shaymin-Sky
Solgaleo
Spectrier
Ursaluna-Blood
Urshifu(Single+Rapid)
Zacian(Base+Crown)
Zamazenta-Crowned
Zekrom

Banned Moves:

Banned Moves

Shed Tail
Last Respects
Baton Pass
Dire Claw

Restricted Moves: (Moves banned in Slot 1)

Restricted Moves

Tail Glow
Shell Smash
Quiver Dance
Victory Dance
Clangorous Soul
Shift Gear
Dragon Dance
Tidy Up
Belly Drum

Banned Abilities:

Banned Abilities

Moody
Shadow Tag
Arena Trap
Sand Veil
Snow Cloak

Banned Items:
King’s Rock
Razor Fang
Watchlist:
Swords Dance
Nasty Plot

Strategy:

Chilly Reception + Regenerator is an incredible combo with two incredible supporting moves able to be Future Sighted as in Slack Off to benefit support mons that don't have access to healing moves and Thunder Wave to put pressure on opposing mons.
I think this mon is going to be good. Good as Gold is busted and being immune to almost every status move is just wild, and Gholdengo can also take use of Future Sighted Recovers and Thunder Waves.

Resources:

Playability: This format isn’t yet playable.

Council:
Gambit_Gamin (Leader)
PrimalKyogre
DosDogs
Hiusi guy
prunyy
Ban History: Nothing yet.

(Viability Rankings and Sample Teams will be added eventually.)

What happens with moves that kill the user like Lunar Dance, Memento, Healing Wish and Self-Destruction?
How will Rage Fist count the hits? It will count being hit on the cast turn or on the turn the move happens, will it count the hits on the caster or the user?

 

[chartung17]

What happens with moves that kill the user like Lunar Dance, Memento, Healing Wish and Self-Destruction?
How will Rage Fist count the hits? It will count being hit on the cast turn or on the turn the move happens, will it count the hits on the caster or the user?

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9purehackmons-2070314845
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9purehackmons-2070318996
I'm not sure about self-destructive moves since there's no precedent to go on.
Future Sight uses the special attack of the caster not the mon currently on the field, and it uses their special attack at the time the attack hits (which resets to +0 if they are not on the field). The caster's ability is also ignored when they are no longer on the field. Similarly, Rage Fist should do damage based on the number of times the caster has been hit at the time the attack happens, but it might just use the base 50BP if the caster is not on the field at the time.

 

[Gambit_Gamin]

my god, imagine minimize toxapex or other tanks in this meta

thats why there's an evasion clause

 

[TDLoriat]

Moves I hope are banned (in slot one or maybe entirely)
No retreat
Block
Fillet Away
Cotton Guard
Doodle
Skill swap
Substitute (shed tail with extra steps)
Potential watchlist additions:
Focus energy
bulk up
calm mind
Agility
Iron defense
Amnesia
Cosmic power
Parting shot


Those are my 3 cents but I have a question based on mechanics:
If i have my blissey (ew) use softboiled (cringe i know) in the first slot and then switch in my Ogerpon Wellspring (Based and epic), will I gain 50% of blissey's hp stat of 50% of Ogerpon's Hp stat back? Which is healthier?

 

[Gambit_Gamin]

Moves I hope are banned (in slot one or maybe entirely)
No retreat
Block
Fillet Away
Cotton Guard
Doodle
Skill swap
Substitute (shed tail with extra steps)
Potential watchlist additions:
Focus energy
bulk up
calm mind
Agility
Iron defense
Amnesia
Cosmic power
Parting shot


Those are my 3 cents but I have a question based on mechanics:
If i have my blissey (ew) use softboiled (cringe i know) in the first slot and then switch in my Ogerpon Wellspring (Based and epic), will I gain 50% of blissey's hp stat of 50% of Ogerpon's Hp stat back? Which is healthier?

My assumption would be that Soft-Boiled would gain ack 50% of Ogerpon's HP, but we won't know till tomorrow

 

[drampa's grandpa]

Initial thoughts:

You can always see foreseen attacks coming from aways away here. This should in theory make it really easy to use pivots, and especially pivot moves. You can just switch to something that resists / is immune to the move that's incoming.

This would make defensive playstyles super broken if the mechanic applied to all moves, but fortunately you can just clobber overconfident opponents with your regular movepool.


Here's a good utility pivot! Can spread U-Turns, Knock Off, or a hazard of your choosing. No set go make your own >;(
...

A second generalized meta thought is that moves that really appreciate being spammed do not make for good foreseen moves. Possibly the best example of this is Torch Song, which is amazing for stacking boosts in standard, but cannot put the same kind of pressure on here due to a limited number of turns to be clicked.


Skeledirge @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Unaware
Tera Type: Watever
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Roar
- Slack Off
- Torch Song
- Earth Power

Lol what's all this about passing setup I'm passing ROAR.



Pass me a skill swap bruh

 

[skippergamez]

I’m on the fence about Regigigas/Slaking + Skill Swap. It’s very gimmicky and if you have a Fighting type it’s pretty easy to switch it in the second Skill Swap is used. But it is very easy to set up and use broken mons. It’ll either be a key part of low ladder hell or insane and it’s hard to judge.

 

[cinnasaur]

Huh, would Focus Punch work in the first slot?

 

[k.r.o.b.]

how do outrage-like moves work?

 

[TDLoriat]

I love threatening item slots

Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 Spe
Impish Nature
- Knock Off/Toxic
- Protect
- Stealth Rock / Spikes
- Toxic/Earthquake

A big thing to look out for is belated toxics, which force in steels or poisons into scary places, and knocks force a big sacrifice.

 

[ULTRAV01D]

I think one of the biggest threats is actually whirlpool (and fire spin).

Sherlock (Slowking-Galar) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Whirlpool
- Chilly Reception
- Slack Off
- Psychic

You can easily set up a trap where you set up whirlpool, use chillly reception, and then do whatever you want to do on the incoming mon.

edit: you can also use block on this set

 

[Codename C.A.T]

yall want an ho sample?

core of the team, sets up screens and passes agilities beautifully with teleport. you could try deo-s but i doubt itd be nearly as effective
general wallbreaker and recover passer, stops the team from being too physical heavy and can help against stalls
sub passer that kinda just does gambit things but sometimes at +2 speed. not much to say about this one, if youve used kingambit in ou its basically just that but no tera
this mon is fuckin stupid with an agilipass and screens up, with an sd you beat tusk outright and can kill everyone else because you just have fat ass bulk on your side. fs slot doesnt matter, im just running sub because its the first thing i thought of
backup sweeper in case hands doesnt get the job done. roar is a neat tech but aside from that it just does the same thing as regular ursaluna, just way faster. hope you got a steel bird
nice glue to hold the team together against opposing ho with scarf fs twaves, lunar dances, and trick scarfs to mess with leads. very helpful mon, replace ice beam with whatever

will post meta thoughts in a separate post after i ladder more

 

[Iknowup]

PSA: For OMs like this one and fortemons that can let functionally fainted mons continue to attack, the move "endeavor" can essentially become a 100% accuracy, sturdy ignoring, one time use guillotine under the right circumstances.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9foresighters-2071331431

Beware .

 

[KaenSoul]

I'm going to explain the mechanic that seems to be confusing the most people.
Two foresight moves can't target the same side of the field at the same time.
This means that if a move just targeted the opponent, that opponent can't use a self-targeting move, but you can, unless they target your side too.
This allows you to block moves, and for your moves to be blocked.

 

[Showsni]

Are there moves which target both sides of the field, to deny any Foresight moves your opponent attempts?

 

[Magic Mayhem Maiden]

Are there moves which target both sides of the field, to deny any Foresight moves your opponent attempts?

Not sure if it works, but here's all of the moves https://pokemondb.net/move/group/multi-target (specifically in the "All" section).

From the list: Court Change, Haze, and Trick Room seem to be the most interesting, and the other field-setup moves might be usable now that you don't need to waste two turns of the field effect.

 

[chartung17]

Not sure if it works, but here's all of the moves https://pokemondb.net/move/group/multi-target (specifically in the "All" section).

From the list: Court Change, Haze, and Trick Room seem to be the most interesting, and the other field-setup moves might be usable now that you don't need to waste two turns of the field effect.

Haze, Court Change, and Trick Room all count as targeting the user's side and not the opponent's, and they all fail "because the target is the user" if the user is still on the field two turns later.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9foresighters-2071559789
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9foresighters-2071561648
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9foresighters-2071563963

If the user leaves the field before the move lands, then they work (or at least Trick Room does, I didn't test the others).
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9foresighters-2071565965