Doubles Ubers!

[CorruptedOmega]

approved by Arcticblast
previous thread by KyleCole
art by Sobi
Disclaimer: This is a thread to comment and discuss on the Doubles Ubers meta game. This meta game is not official and is thus to be considered an Other Meta game, only relevant to Doubles OU and reliant on main Doubles OU rules.

Doubles Ubers is a meta game where most Doubles OU bans are lifted and thus you can enjoy a more free environment. Feel free to discuss tactics, teams, Pokémon, and rules on this thread. This is also the place to post Doubles Ubers replays and to organize tournaments.

Doubles Ubers can be played on Pokémon Showdown on its ladder or via challenge. The active clauses are Species Clause, Moody Clause, OHKO Clause, Evasion Clause, and Endless Battle Clause; thus rules in place are the following:
Pokémon from all six generations that are not unreleased nor illegal and do not share Pokédex number are allowed.
All released abilities that are not Moody are allowed.
All released items are allowed.
All moves but Dark Void and OHKO moves are allowed.
Combinations of moves, abilities, and items that cause battles to be endless are banned.
Team Preview is present.
Mega Rayquaza is NOT banned.

Sample Teams:
Mew + Mega Ray Offense by KyleCole

Importable

Lead with Mega Ray 90% of the time and xern the other 10%. Fake Out turn one while the partner sets up via SD/Geomancy or attacks. Turn 2 Ally Switch if your opponent is threatening to KO your partner this turn, Transform otherwise. Super Fang is used turn 1 occasionally if fake out isn't needed and Mega Ray / Geo Xern will not be able to KO a threat turn 2. For example opposing Arceus Steel, or Ho-oh & Pdon vs Xern will require a super fang. Pretty much sweep from there, you're going to know in the first 5 turns if you win the game or not with this team.

Rayquaza-Mega @ Life Orb
Ability: Delta Stream
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Ascent
- Extreme Speed
- Swords Dance
- Protect

Mew @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fake Out
- Transform
- Ally Switch
- Super Fang

Xerneas @ Power Herb
Ability: Fairy Aura
EVs: 212 HP / 252 SpA / 44 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dazzling Gleam
- Geomancy
- Protect
- Hidden Power [Ground]

Arceus-Steel @ Iron Plate
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Judgment
- Earth Power
- Icy Wind
- Protect

Ho-Oh @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 200 Atk / 52 SpD / 8 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Sacred Fire
- Brave Bird
- Tailwind
- Protect

Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rock Slide
- Precipice Blades
- Fire Punch
- Protect

Double Primal Semi TR by n10sit

Importable

dual primal TR. shit is slow and has mega kang to help set it up. not really a whole lot to say about it. hoopa helps tremendously vs ghosts and other cress, has drain punch for other kang. kyogre is team wincon not groudon. super simple team.

Cresselia @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 100 Def / 156 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Ice Beam
- Helping Hand
- Trick Room
- Skill Swap

Dialga @ Shuca Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Dragon Pulse
- Flash Cannon
- Trick Room
- Protect

Kangaskhan-Mega @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Scrappy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Fake Out
- Double-Edge
- Sucker Punch
- Low Kick

Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Precipice Blades
- Fire Punch
- Stone Edge
- Protect

Kyogre-Primal @ Blue Orb
Ability: Primordial Sea
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
- Protect

Hoopa-Unbound @ Life Orb
Ability: Magician
EVs: 252 Atk / 112 Def / 144 SpA
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Hyperspace Fury
- Hyperspace Hole
- Drain Punch
- Protect

HypnoGravity by Omega

Importable

Pretty simple HypnoGravity team, most of the time just lead Meowstic + sleep (ab)user. After sleeping a few mons switch to a primal and decimate your opponent. I chose Gengar as the mega here of course for fast Hypnosis, but also because it can trap opposing Primals and allow you to deal with them much more easily. The team really hates Thundurus but Groudon can deal with it pretty easily.

Gengar @ Gengarite
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Bomb
- Shadow Ball
- Hypnosis
- Protect

Meowstic (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fake Out
- Gravity
- Thunder Wave
- Charm

Shaymin-Sky @ Focus Sash
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Seed Flare
- Grass Whistle
- Tailwind
- Protect

Groudon @ Red Orb
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Precipice Blades
- Fire Blast
- Substitute
- Protect

Kyogre @ Blue Orb
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Water Spout
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Protect

Xerneas @ Power Herb
Ability: Fairy Aura
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Dazzling Gleam
- Geomancy
- Protect

RayOgre by qsns

Importable

Team is built around weakening GeoXern checks. Ogre + Xern is really nice because you're able to force damage on PDon as they switch into Kyogre's Ice Beam, putting faster variants in range of a +2 Grass Knot. Bulky Ogre still hits like a goddamn truck and I chose to go with Origin Pulse > Water Spout because the only Speed Control this team has is a Thundurus. Band Rayquaza OHKOs like everything except for fat steels and if you can force damage/kill them, Xern has a much easier time. Adamant because I like OHKOing everything and you still outspeed Jolly Kangaskhan. Thundurus TWaves shit and lures in Groudon w/ HP Water. Amoonguss switches into opposing Xern and Kyogre + redirects for Xern, and Lando-T provides Intimidate and a good switchin to PDon.

Rayquaza-Mega @ Choice Band
Ability: Delta Stream
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Ascent
- Extreme Speed
- V-create
- Waterfall

Kyogre-Primal @ Blue Orb
Ability: Primordial Sea
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Scald
- Protect

Thundurus @ Focus Sash
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA
- Thunderbolt
- Thunder Wave
- Hidden Power [Water]
- Taunt

Xerneas @ Power Herb
Ability: Fairy Aura
EVs: 44 Def / 212 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Geomancy
- Dazzling Gleam
- Grass Knot
- Protect

Amoonguss @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Spore
- Rage Powder
- Foul Play
- Protect

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Superpower
- Rock Slide

If you have a successful Doubles Ubers team you want added to the sample teams, post it in the thread and I'll take a look!

Some Topics to post about:

• Effects of HypnoGravity being legal?
• New VR shifts?
• Solid checks to Xerneas? (since so many people complain about it)

 

[CorruptedOmega]

Welcome to the Smogon Doubles Ubers Viability Rankings post. The thread is open to discussion and if you can make a great post about why something should have a different rank then I'll make the change! Please don't bandwagon posts. Thanks to KyleCole for the vrankings in the old thread!

All the rankings are alphabetical.

Tier One
Pokemon that have a good matchup vs a large portion of the metagame, are either quite powerful or offer great team support, and can fit on almost any team. You can't really go wrong by using these Pokemon.

Primal Groudon

Primal Kyogre

Mega Rayquaza

Xerneas

Tier One and a Half
Pokemon that are generally strong, but can be dead weight in some matchups, don't have great matchups vs a lot of Tier 1, or are only particularly useful for checking a certain team style.

Aegislash

Arceus

Dialga

Mega Gengar

Ho-Oh

Mega Kangaskhan

Tier Two
Pokemon which have broad applications on a variety of teams but are simply less effective than the Pokemon in the higher tiers. This also includes Pokemon which, while good, only fit on a specific team style or require heavy support but are still stronger than Pokemon in the tiers below.

Amoonguss

Arceus Ghost

Arceus Ground

Arcues Steel

Ferrothorn

Kyurem White

Landorus Therian

Latios

Mega Mawile

Mew

Mewtwo

Palkia

Shaymin Sky

Mega Salamence

Thundurus

Yveltal

Tier Three
Pokemon that can only serve a specific role not needed by most teams, but can still perform excellently.

Bronzong

Cresselia

Crobat

Deoxys Attack

Giratina Origin

Hitmontop

Jirachi

Kyogre

Liepard

Meowstic

Mega Mewtwo Y

Rayquaza

Sableye

Talonflame

Whimsicott

Zapdos

Zekrom

Tier Four
Pokemon whose roles are almost never needed, and in most cases weigh the team down due to their use. Pokemon in this tier are far more situational and costly than those in higher tiers.

Arceus (all other forms not listed)

Mega Diancie

Giratina

Klefki

Lugia

Mega Mewtwo X

Reshiram

Weavile

Feel free to voice your concerns below, I am open to any and all suggestions.

 

[CorruptedOmega]

The VR has been posted. I will continue to update it with things I've forgotten. Note that all rankings are alphabetical.

I'd like to preface discussion with this: the fact that HypnoGravity has gone unnoticed and undiscussed is absolutely absurd.

Meowstic @ Focus Sash
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fake Out
- Gravity
- Thunder Wave
- Charm

Gengar @ Gengarite
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Bomb
- Disable
- Hypnosis
- Protect

Meowstic has access to Gravity, a faster Fake Out than both Kangaskhan and Mew, and speed control in the form of Thunder Wave. Meanwhile Gegar is able to trap your opponent and fire off Hypnosis with near perfect accuracy. HypnoGravity teams actually benefit from a format with behemoths like Groudon and Xerneas run rampant, since the little offensive presence they provide in themselves can easily be compensated by their strong allies in the back. Another great partner for these two is Whimsicott, who boasts Prankster Grass Whistle, Tailwind, and Encore. I hope you're running Lum Berries or a Taunt user because otherwise you'll be in for a bad time.

 

[CorruptedOmega]

(pardon the double post)

Thanks to Sobi, we now have some beautiful artwork! If you want to check out his other work, click here.

In other news, I removed my own team from the samples because it literally just clicked X against HypnoGravity. Instead I replaced it with n10sit's, which he's peaked the ladder with. I also added my HypnoGravity team.

If there's a DUbers tournament held after DPL, I think we can all agree that HypnoGravity should be banned.

That's all for now folks.

 

[skies]

bad bitch (Xerneas) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Fairy Aura
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Aromatherapy
- Thunder Wave
- Rock Slide
- Dazzling Gleam

Here is a fun Xerneas set I've been messing around with lately. Obviously it's not the best set, and the EV spread could be adjusted as needed, but it's seriously so fun. The basic idea is to counter Mega Kangaskhan, really. Most Kangaskhan will go right for the Fake Out hoping to prevent Geomancy, only to get met with a nasty surprise. Beyond this, Precipice Blades from 252+ Primal Groudon has a 1% chance to 2HKO; +2 Extreme Speed from Arceus is lived with cushion room; Latios' Psyshock isn't a 3HKO (and its Psychic is unlikely to 2HKO!); and so on. This thing is insanely bulky, and has solid offensive stats to back it up. I felt Ho-Oh was threatening, so I added Rock Slide, which will always 2HKO it. Be sure to bring a long a solid stop to the Primals, as this Xerneas can't do anything to either of them besides potentially paralyze Kyogre. Geomancy is superior in almost all cases, but this version of Xerneas is great for teams that need a strong physical wall.

 

[CorruptedOmega]

bad set (Xerneas) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Fairy Aura
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Aromatherapy
- Thunder Wave
- Rock Slide
- Dazzling Gleam

Hey fren I don't want to come off as mean, but Xerneas without Geomancy is entirely unviable in DUbers. Even if this weren't the case, your set would still need some big modifications. Aromatherapy isn't used in Doubles, since statusing is less prevalent and you'd be better off putting another move in that slot instead (such as Protect or a coverage move). Rock Slide does negligible damage to anything that isn't named Ho-Oh, which isn't super common in the first place. Finally, Dazzling Gleam is rather weak due to spread damage decrease and its low BP. I get what you're tryna go for here, but effective Singles sets and effective Doubles sets have little in common. Gl though

Edit: you could use Rocky Helmet Arceus to do the same thing but with better stats and supportive movepool, although it's still inferior to the SD+Extreme Speed set.

 

[skies]

Hey man I don't want to come off as mean, but Xerneas without Geomancy is entirely unviable in DUbers. Even if this weren't the case, your set would still need some big modifications. Aromatherapy isn't used in Doubles, since statusing is less prevalent and you'd be better off putting another move in that slot instead (such as Protect or a coverage move). Rock Slide does negligible damage to anything that isn't named Ho-Oh, which isn't super common in the first place. Finally, Dazzling Gleam is rather weak due to spread damage decrease and its low BP. I get what you're tryna go for here, but effective Singles sets and effective Doubles sets have little in common. Gl though

Edit: you could use Rocky Helmet Arceus to do the same thing but with better stats and supportive movepool, although it's still inferior to the SD+Extreme Speed set.

I am very much aware of that. I explicitly stated it in my post. I'll pull replays soon, I'm not home atm, but I very much think non-Geo has a niche.

 

[qsns]

droppin a HOT SQUAD here:

ray ogre dubers

Rayquaza-Mega @ Choice Band
Ability: Delta Stream
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Ascent
- Extreme Speed
- V-create
- Waterfall

Kyogre-Primal @ Blue Orb
Ability: Primordial Sea
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Scald
- Protect

Thundurus @ Focus Sash
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA
- Thunderbolt
- Thunder Wave
- Hidden Power [Water]
- Taunt

Xerneas @ Power Herb
Ability: Fairy Aura
EVs: 44 Def / 212 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Geomancy
- Dazzling Gleam
- Grass Knot
- Protect

Amoonguss @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Spore
- Rage Powder
- Foul Play
- Protect

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Superpower
- Rock Slide

Team is built around weakening GeoXern checks. Ogre + Xern is really nice because you're able to force damage on PDon as they switch into Kyogre's Ice Beam, putting faster variants in range of a +2 Grass Knot. Bulky Ogre still hits like a goddamn truck and I chose to go with Origin Pulse > Water Spout because the only Speed Control this team has is a Thundurus. Band Rayquaza OHKOs like everything except for fat steels and if you can force damage/kill them, Xern has a much easier time. Adamant because I like OHKOing everything and you still outspeed Jolly Kangaskhan. Thundurus TWaves shit and lures in Groudon w/ HP Water. Amoonguss switches into opposing Xern and Kyogre + redirects for Xern, and Lando-T provides Intimidate and a good switchin to PDon.

Fun team + fun tier to ladder in though the ladder is even shittier than normal dubs one haha

 

[CorruptedOmega]

I feel obnoxious responding every other post but w/e

I added qsns' team to the samples and polished up the VR by adding a tier 4 and updating the tier descriptions. I've also added a bunch of mons to the VR, mostly to the lower tiers. Feel free to discuss.

 

[n10siT]

Lemme come in hot with some VR ideas while I'm in line/eating at chipootles

Latios has to move down. This thing is not that good. It being in the same tier as mega kang is a complete joke. Tier 3?

Mewtwo X is bad tier bad. I've used this, or tried to, at great lengths and it's just awful. Unranked imo. (Diancie and reshiram might be this bad too but I've never used them or seen them used)

EDIT: The Below was accidentally deleted, so it is being reposted

dual primal TR. shit is slow and has mega kang to help set it up. not really a whole lot to say about it. hoopa helps tremendously vs ghosts and other cress, has drain punch for other kang. kyogre is team wincon not groudon. super simple team.

importable

Cresselia @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 100 Def / 156 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Ice Beam
- Helping Hand
- Trick Room
- Skill Swap

Dialga @ Shuca Berry
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Dragon Pulse
- Flash Cannon
- Trick Room
- Protect

Kangaskhan-Mega @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Scrappy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Fake Out
- Double-Edge
- Sucker Punch
- Low Kick

Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Precipice Blades
- Fire Punch
- Stone Edge
- Protect

Kyogre-Primal @ Blue Orb
Ability: Primordial Sea
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
- Protect

Hoopa-Unbound @ Life Orb
Ability: Magician
EVs: 252 Atk / 112 Def / 144 SpA
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Hyperspace Fury
- Hyperspace Hole
- Drain Punch
- Protect

 

[CMG]

This thread seems to be really forgotten by everyone but anyway I'll do a nomination to try to revive it.

Arceus Steel Tier 2 --> Tier 1.5

I've not been able to play this tier a lot, cause ladder is quite dead and there are no tournaments. Even though, I've played some battles with friends and also seen a few ones. I've found myself using this mon a lot, and imo is as good as regular arceus. It's solid check for mega rayquaza, xerneas, rayquaza, mega kangaskhan, arceus, mega gengar and dialga (because of earth power), kyurem-w, latios, palkia and so on. It's very powerful with insane coverage on both special and physical side (ice beam, dark pulse, dragon pulse, earth power, energy ball, flamethower, flash cannon, focus blast, psychic... and that's only the special side...). It also has access to super helpful support moves such as icy wind, tailwind, thunder wave, toxic, will o wisp...
Also, it has rather nice defenses.

 

[Yellow Paint]

Thanks for bumping the thread, but omg steelceus is so disappointing. First off, the only advantage steelceus has over other arceus forms is a flying and fairy resist at the expense of steel's awful coverage against big threats like pdon, ogre, and ho oh. Base 120 offenses are just too weak for this format, especially when you have to run iron head to actually beat xern and all your coverage is non stab. see:
252 SpA Arceus-Steel Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Rayquaza in Strong Winds: 186-220 (52.9 - 62.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Arceus-Steel Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Primal Groudon: 204-240 (50.4 - 59.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

All of your other points about coverage and support moves etc just aren't relevant because every other arceus form can do the exact same thing and mewtwo can do it even better. Ekiller and ghostceus are good because of stab espeed and shadow force.

On the defensive side, aegislash is a much better option since it actually ohkos xern with gyro, has a better pdon/ogre matchup with wide guard, and has a secondary ghost stab that hits quite a lot neutrally.

for the sake of not being entirely destructive, aegislash 2->1.5, mewtwo 3->2

btw you guys should try out vivillon, nobody runs goggles and it outspeeds all but the 252+spe mons

 

[CMG]

When your hold post gets destroyed by someone who knows more than you about the tier :(

Yeah I have to admit you're right, reading your post changed my mind. Again, I'm not very experienced in the tier (I didn't even try aegislash). I just wanted to get into the tier and revive the thread a bit, cause I really like these kind of tiers like DUU and DUbers. Btw, I strongly recommend you to visit the DUU thread, the tier is very interesting and some of use are putting a lot of effort into it. Going back to the matter, if my little experience wasn't enough, I wrote the post quite late and I was tired. I just realized what you said about coverage isn't relevant cause every other form also has access to it right now when I read it again, my fault. Thank you for explaining why I was wrong. It's always helpful to learn from more experienced players.

Also, I just realized Mega Mewtwo X is not even in Tier 4. I can understand that in most situations is worse than the Y version but I think it deserves Tier 4 at least

 

[The Pokemon Chap]

When your hold post gets destroyed by someone who knows more than you about the tier :(

Yeah I have to admit you're right, reading your post changed my mind. Again, I'm not very experienced in the tier (I didn't even try aegislash). I just wanted to get into the tier and revive the thread a bit, cause I really like these kind of tiers like DUU and DUbers. Btw, I strongly recommend you to visit the DUU thread, the tier is very interesting and some of use are putting a lot of effort into it. Going back to the matter, if my little experience wasn't enough, I wrote the post quite late and I was tired. I just realized what you said about coverage isn't relevant cause every other form also has access to it right now when I read it again, my fault. Thank you for explaining why I was wrong. It's always helpful to learn from more experienced players.

Also, I just realized Mega Mewtwo X is not even in Tier 4. I can understand that in most situations is worse than the Y version but I think it deserves Tier 4 at least

Quite. Mega Mewtwo X deserves a spot in Tier 4 at the very least.

 

[CMG]

Here again with a core that I find interesting to build around. Inspired by the absence of Mega Mewtwo X, I looked for a good mon to support it

Mewtwo-Mega-X @ Mewtwonite X
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Low Kick
- Zen Headbutt
- Rock Slide
- Protect


Weavile @ Focus Sash
Ability: Pickpocket
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Knock Off
- Icicle Crash
- Ice Shard


The point of Weavile is that he gets rid of the main counters / checks for Mewtwo, being mainly Giratina, Lugia, Mewtwo, Mewtwo Y, Rayquaza, Mega Rayquaza and Mega Salamence. Also, he can knock off opposing Xerneas' Power Herbs, locking them into the two-turn-long Geomancy. Getting into the sets, Mewtwo's set is standard except for Rock Slide, which makes you able to catch off guard Ho-ohs and OHKO them. There's also another option for this slot: Aqua Tail. Pair this core with Kyogre, which helps dealing with Groudon, and if there's a Groudon in front of your Mewtwo + Weavile, switch Weavile out into Ogre and Aqua Tail Groudon. Easy kill. Weavile's set is completely standard and needs no explanation.

I'll try to build a team around this, and I'll post it in the thread. Meanwhile, let me know your opinion about the core, and you can complete the core with another mon or post your own team too!

Mega Mewtwo X UR --> Tier 4

 

[CMG]

Hi everybody.
Some days after posting in this thread for the last time I started to lose interest in this tier. I didn't even start to build the team I said. The purpose of posting here was bumping the thread and, although I haven't played even 30 games of Dubers, I wanted to give this tier a shot. After my first post I received an answer by Yellow Paint (thank you). I answered him, and also suggested to get Mega-Mewtwo-X into Tier 4 of the Viability Rankings and I got NO response. I don't even know if CorruptedOmega read these last posts, cause Mewtwo X is still out of the VR and he didn't even leave a reply. In short, all I want is to revive the tier Dubers and this thread, but I feel like nobody cares, because otherwise they would've answered. Despite all that, I still want to give it a chance, so please go answer, I'd be thankful to see any replies. That would help a lot. Also I wanna suggest holding a tour or something, so that we can play a bit

 

[Yellow Paint]

Yeah unfortunately this format just doesn't have the playerbase to support much activity, and for good reason too. Once you play enough to learn the big threats, there really isn't much more room for metagaming without the sheer participation to actually develop a meta. Dubers has the same "staleness" problem that singles ubers has had in the past, except we have it even worse cause like max 10 people in the community even play outside of minitours. You really can't expect activity or a tour when nobody wants to play in the first place, so you honestly might just have to wait for gen7 for a new spike in interest. Maybe we'll get enough would be vgcers once the new season converts to aloladex to have a minitour.

 

[CMG]

We still have to wait a bit until gen7 comes out, so I'd like to start getting this tier decent before that
That's the thing, VGC is pretty similar to DUbers. If we could popularize this tier a bit we could get some VGC players, and the playerbase of the tier would increase, and thus, maybe create a decent meta. That's the theory, but could we achieve that? What I thought is holding a tour because usually that catches attention quite well. Maybe as you say that wouldn't result successful but I have no other idea. Please give yours if you have any ones

 

[CorruptedOmega]

I feel like RayOgre is a really under appreciated team archetype and I've been making a whole lot of RayOgre teams lately, so I thought I might as well go ahead and share my general approach to their teambuilding and show some good examples.

1: Mega Rayquaza
Rayquaza is one of the most dominant forces of the DUbers metagame, capable of 2HKOing just about anything besides bulky Steel-types. On top of that it has a great movepool with access to coverage moves such as V-Create and Waterfall/Water Pulse, priority in the form of Extreme Speed, and Speed control with Tailwind. Rayquaza teams tend to be more "anti-meta", meaning they intentionally over prepare for big metagame threats such as Primal Groudon, Xerneas, etc.
2: Primal Kyogre
Primal Kyogre pairs beautifully alongside Rayquaza since Kyogre's biggest check is Primal Groudon. Rayquaza doesn't mind taking Groudon's Fire- and Ground-type attacks, and with Air Lock and Delta Stream Rayquaza allows Kyogre to KO Primal Groudon through Harsh Sun. The two also have good offensive synergy, since Rayquaza KOs bulky Grass-types that Kyogre can't hit hard while Kyogre chunks the health of Steel-types with Water Spout or Origin Pulse.
3: Primal Groudon Check/Ground Immunity
Groudon can still pose quite a problem if one or the other of the RayOgre core goes down, so having another Primal Groudon check is a necessity. There a handful of options to choose from, such as Ho-Oh, Latios, Landorus-Therian, or a Primal Groudon of your own, but it's best if your check is defensive in nature rather than offensive, otherwise you may find youself being swept by Groudon in the late game.
4: Xerneas
Because why not? Xerneas is another dominant force of the DUbers metagame, readily capable of sweeping teams or at least picking up a couple of KOs. It also scares off Dragon-types that may hinder Rayquaza, and provides the team with a lot more offensive presence.
5: Redirection
Any team appreciates redirection support, but RayOgre teams do in particular. Redirection allows Rayquaza to set up more easily if it's a Swords Dance or Tailwind variant, allows Kyogre to fire off powerful Water-type attacks, or allow Xerneas to Geomancy.
6: HypnoGravity Check and Speed Control
A HypnoGravity check is mandatory for most DUbers teams, otherwise you'll find half of your team asleep and being slowly dismantled. It is also useful to have a form of Speed control in this slot (typically Thunder Wave), so fast Pokemon such as Salamence and boosted Xerneas don't trample your team.

Examples

CorruptedOmega's SD Mega Ray Ballance

qsns's RayOgre

Matame's RayOgre TR

 

[CMG]

One question about that, is it better to use fast ogre or slow?

 

[CorruptedOmega]

It's mostly up to your preference, but I like to use 252 Modest to outspeed or at least speed tie with opposing Groudon.

 

[FloristtheBudew]

You might struggle to get VGC players into doubles ubers. Mainly since most of the VGC playerbase can't stand the format we have this season. There are some changes present in the tier compared to VGC 16, that could maybe get a few. But I wouldn't hold anything to it.

 

[Matame]

I think i played like 30 games of dubers back in decenber when i first started mons, and i just got bored really quickly. I think its fair to make the comparison with vgc 16 and dubers, but the big difference is vgc 16 has a plaerbase, which gives it room to develop meta trends. I dont think anything has changed since ive last played it and honestly i havent really many people play it either outside of the occasional friendly. I doubt its that big of a deal since s/m are coming around which may or may not make dubers a more enjoyable meta (and vgc 17 might not include ledgendaries which will give dubers at least somewhat of an edge).

 

[CMG]

So you think there are very few to none opportunities of getting new players into the tier, right? If so, I guess I'll stop trying to bump the thread and the tier in general. It's kind of silly trying to do it by myself if nobody else thinks we can really get new players (I understand your opinion, and also I agree a bit)

 

[Li Xiao Long]

Question: Were/are there any tournaments featuring Doubles Ubers?