Inheritance Inheritance (Magic Bounce and Good as Gold Banned!)

[Dunfan]

New tech dropped! Me and bake lando were theory crafting last night and they introduced me to something absolutely silly, and I think a super anti-meta pick, as well as us creating an absolutely out of pocket 0 counterplay counter to said mons biggest counter- I'd like to introduce you all to Iron Crown!



@
Iron Crown @ Leftovers/Life Orb/Colbur Berry
Ability: Magic Guard
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Psyshock/Psychic Noise
- Calm Mind
- Recover
- Flash Cannon/Focus Blast

So, lets get into the sauce of why Crown is absolutely disgusting. The main thing is this man has BULK, it can eat a surprising amount of hits, has magic guard so hazard spam and SALT CURE doesn't effect it. Alongside being a steel that isn't weak to Body Press, this gives it massive amounts of switch in oppurtunities. It also has solid speed, outspeeding a number of threats, Tusk being the main one. While it admittedly I find has trouble against some faster hard hitting offensive mons like Roaring Moon, it is one of THE hardest counters to stall and comfey inheritors in the game.

Let's look at the movepool and discuss it a bit. Recover and Calm Mind are basically mandatory, but the other 2 are up in the air in my opinion. Bake Lando used Psyshock exclusively when I was testing this with them, though I'm theorycrafting Psychic Noise as a more versatile option that allows it to still beat special walls like Blissey while ALSO heavily threatening the 2 big physical walls in Tusk and Hands. Flash Cannon and Focus Blast is up to you in my opinion, Cannon is reliable STAB to help you not tear through your Psy PP, whereas Focus Miss allows you to heavily threaten Moon on the switch in or other darks. But we're forgetting something, aren't we?

Now, on close inspection you may think 'wait a minute, doesn't this just uber lose to the most common special wall Hoodra/Cyclizar?' YES. However~ me and bake cooked up a really shiesty team member that Hoodra users will have genuinely no way to outplay.




@

Gholdengo @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Pain Split/Rest
- Will-O-Wisp/Toxic/Toxic Spikes/Taunt
- Toxic Spikes/Defog

This... thing. This unholy abomination, a crime against nature itself. Now, let me preface this- I despise the state of hazards right now in Inheritance, I think Gholdengo, or rather Good as Gold being free is contributing to a very unhealthy metagame- but this puts a smile on my face. Now, let's go over why this thing absolutely destroys any chance of a Hoodra user being able to check Crown. First off, Gas allows it to disable its regen, and because Crown will always outspeed Hoodra, you always will get the first switch, meaning you ALWAYS get to disable Hoodra's regen. You also are a ghost and steel type, meaning you resist Uturn and DTail, immune to its rapid spin, and Colbur will make its first knock off hurt a little less. You also threaten it with wisp, have pseudo recovery in Pain Split or Rest, can setup Tspikes, Taunt, Defog, quite a few options shockingly- as well as Shadow Ball for STAB! Hoodra CANNOT threaten you in any meaningful way, meanwhile you can disable its damage with Wisp, can Defog hazards away while having STAB SBall for opposing GaG users (who tf runs a non-ghost GaG mon?), genuinely the only thing this is missing is reliable recovery. Combined with Crown, this makes for a hilarious core where Crown's biggest counter cannot even function properly.

Side note because I do want to rant about this, I feel GaG should be banned or restricted because, from my games the state of most matches is who can stack up hazards first, and/or who can disable the opponent's GaG mon first. It's less about the pokemon and more spike stacking carrying every single team that isn't mono boots. If we banned GaG as well, mons like Pecharunt getting preemptive bans because we don't want the hazard stacking metagame to be even WORSE would be, for the most part fixed. As it stands I find hazards to be way too dominating of a presence in every single match due to Good as Gold's presence, and the metagame would be far healthier without it.

Lastly, I want to hugely thank bake lando for theory crafting this! They're who introduced me to the hilarity of Iron Crown and I think it's a shame I don't see Poorly Named Cobalion more. Cheers, and take care everyone :) happy hunting!

Validator moment. (EDIT: IV related, 20 does not work, but 21+ does)

 

[Don Vascus]

I bring thee resources!

Inheritance has samples!! And Sample submissions are open!!
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Post them here or send them to me so that i add them! Just like, dont send a bad team or thats hard to use

 

[Mywookiearmy]

I bring thee resources!

Inheritance has samples!! And Sample submissions are open!!
​

Post them here or send them to me so that i add them! Just like, dont send a bad team or thats hard to use

POG SAMPLES!! I'll throw my hat in the ring, someone's gotta rep stall and this team put in work for me! :D (also don't mind me I just learned Ctrl+K works my mind is literally exploding)

Coalossal Cha Cha Stall
​

 

[omegamark64]

Excuse me? Can some one explain me why this happens only with raging bolt? I tried with thundurus therian and zapdos but they are not rejected

 

[Mywookiearmy]

Excuse me? Can some one explain me why this happens only with raging bolt? I tried with thundurus therian and zapdos but they are not rejected
View attachment 596271
View attachment 596273

I believe it has something to do with the IVs. Same thing happens for Iron Crowns when inheriting, 20 Atk IVs (what its set to) is invalid but 21 works. prob just spaghetti code shenanigans

 

[Mywookiearmy]

Hey you there, yes YOU. Are you tired of Hoodras regenning constantly? Do people having suicide glimmora leads just really irk you? Do you like making people cry? Well, I have another set made for the glory of the Crown that I want to share with you all.





Iron Crown @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Bounce
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 21 Atk
- Psychic Noise
- Calm Mind
- Morning Sun
- Skill Swap

This is made to bully Hoodras, hazard spammers, and NOTHING else. Psychic Noise is a broken move, Magic Bounce makes children cry, and the secret sauce- Skill Swap. This move is dumb, and I love it so much. Oh, you want to Uturn out? Nah, you don't get regen anymore, it's mine. You want to *checks notes* use Technician? No, that's also mine. Protean? Magic Guard? Adaptability? Dancer (yes I fought someone using Oricorio)? UNAWARE? Kneel peasant, all must pay tribute to the Crown.

I am so sick of seeing Hoodra and addicted to this child's reimagining of one of the most forgettable legendaries that I make these sets :)

 

[Don Vascus]

Hey you there, yes YOU. Are you tired of Hoodras regenning constantly? Do people having suicide glimmora leads just really irk you? Do you like making people cry? Well, I have another set made for the glory of the Crown that I want to share with you all.





Iron Crown @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Bounce
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 21 Atk
- Psychic Noise
- Calm Mind
- Morning Sun
- Skill Swap

This is made to bully Hoodras, hazard spammers, and NOTHING else. Psychic Noise is a broken move, Magic Bounce makes children cry, and the secret sauce- Skill Swap. This move is dumb, and I love it so much. Oh, you want to Uturn out? Nah, you don't get regen anymore, it's mine. You want to *checks notes* use Technician? No, that's also mine. Protean? Magic Guard? Adaptability? Dancer (yes I fought someone using Oricorio)? UNAWARE? Kneel peasant, all must pay tribute to the Crown.

I am so sick of seeing Hoodra and addicted to this child's reimagining of one of the most forgettable legendaries that I make these sets :)

Of note: more often than not bulky hazard setters are part ground, so you're somewhat unreliable against them. This is why enamorus T is so common as an magic bouncer, it scares out all of ting lu, big donphan and metal hariyama and its not scared of other bulky donors like suicune

 

[Talpr0ne]

Here's a fun little wallbreaker set if you hate Levitate, Fur Coat and Unaware.

Great Tusk @ Life Orb
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Close Combat
- Rock Slide
- Dragon Dance

 

[Mywookiearmy]

Of note: more often than not bulky hazard setters are part ground, so you're somewhat unreliable against them. This is why enamorus T is so common as an magic bouncer, it scares out all of ting lu, big donphan and metal hariyama and its not scared of other bulky donors like suicune

Oh 100%, and 9/10 times Enam is better as a bouncer, but it’s too slow to meme with Skill Swap effectively ;)

 

[Dorsia]

Could this set work?

into

Toxapex @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock
- Clear Smog
- Will-O-Wisp / Yawn
- Recover

Magcargo has terrible stats/typing but surprisingly provides some utility. Flame Body combined with Rocky Helmet punish Triple Axel abusers.
It learns both Acid Armor & Iron Defense but no Body Press, is this a joke??

 

[Schpoonman]

Yawn is banned up SMC, but the rest of that set looks good.

 

[CoolTrainerGary]

Just tried tinkering in the builder and Mighty Cleave is what's setting off the illegality. Something's not right.

EDIT: IB with any Rock-type move is coming back as illegal.

Any update on Iron Boulder? All of the other paradox pokemon issues are solved by tinkering with IVs, but is not usable right now regardless.

 

[Iynhe]

Here I am with the team I played with this month.

https://pokepast.es/79e0a085f09380ea

Latios: Inherits from Hydrapple. Regen offensive mons sometimes are fun. This one specifically didn't work that much, but I had fun anyway.
Jolteon: Inherits from Cranidos. If I can, I slap a SFLO mon on my teams. BoltBeam is an amazing combination. There you go. Fire Blast and Earth Power are coverage for when I want to, they worked. A really nice cleaner.
Manaphy: Inherits from Quaquaval. Everyone needs to remove hazards, Manaphy is a good mon, so sbem. Moxie is usually useless but whatever, Roost and pivot are more important. Is there probably a better mon to Inherit from? Maybe, yeah, but I am not here to become better in every format I like, I don't have the time.
Diancie: this inherits from Deoxys Defense. Fun mon, so many useful moves. Teleport is a good pivot move.
Terrakion: inherits from Lycanrock-Dusk. I love Adapt CB Terrakion in AAA but I also needed a sash mon (to stop stuff in a pinch) that could set up (to break stuff).
Corviknight: iirc inherits from Squawkabilly (Blue, because I like blue.) A set I stole from AAA, it's an amazing physical wall. Protect instead of Defog since I already have manaphy and it works with Leftovers.

Jolteon and Corviknight are the two sets I recommend trying. The rest are memes, I came here for a fun time, not a high ladder one.

 

[dehzao]

I've played against an Urshifu today. When I putted in my team, it said it was banned.

I've played against Walking Wake today. When I putted in my team, also said it was banned.

Can someone explain me this?

 

[CoolTrainerGary]

I've played against an Urshifu today. When I putted in my team, it said it was banned.

I've played against Walking Wake today. When I putted in my team, also said it was banned.

Can someone explain me this?

You need to post the full set that you are inputing into your teambuilder. It means you are making an error when selecting the moves/abilities.

 

[Mywookiearmy]

Here I am with the team I played with this month.

https://pokepast.es/79e0a085f09380ea

Latios: Inherits from Hydrapple. Regen offensive mons sometimes are fun. This one specifically didn't work that much, but I had fun anyway.
Jolteon: Inherits from Cranidos. If I can, I slap a SFLO mon on my teams. BoltBeam is an amazing combination. There you go. Fire Blast and Earth Power are coverage for when I want to, they worked. A really nice cleaner.
Manaphy: Inherits from Quaquaval. Everyone needs to remove hazards, Manaphy is a good mon, so sbem. Moxie is usually useless but whatever, Roost and pivot are more important. Is there probably a better mon to Inherit from? Maybe, yeah, but I am not here to become better in every format I like, I don't have the time.
Diancie: this inherits from Deoxys Defense. Fun mon, so many useful moves. Teleport is a good pivot move.
Terrakion: inherits from Lycanrock-Dusk. I love Adapt CB Terrakion in AAA but I also needed a sash mon (to stop stuff in a pinch) that could set up (to break stuff).
Corviknight: iirc inherits from Squawkabilly (Blue, because I like blue.) A set I stole from AAA, it's an amazing physical wall. Protect instead of Defog since I already have manaphy and it works with Leftovers.

Jolteon and Corviknight are the two sets I recommend trying. The rest are memes, I came here for a fun time, not a high ladder one.

Besides a lot of things with the team, there are 3 things I am a bit confused by.
1. Corviknight, Squawk gets Taunt, Foul Play and Parting Shot. Since this is your physical wall it will likely be eating a knock at some point in the game so Protect is essentially a dead slot.
2. Quaq... gets Torrent. Still not a great ability but like- just use Torrent instead since it's a support set ;-;
3. You have a LOT of pivoting, but nothing to take advantage of said pivots. Jolteon just ain't cutting it power-wise this gen imo though it IS quite fast, alongside this Latios/Hydrapple isn't... that strong. It's also a regen mon with LO but no pivot move, the best reason to use an offensive regen mon (and no Draco Meteor?). Terrak has a strong STAB CC but it's Gen 9'd so bad that it's a tad too slow imo to be a setup sweeper (gets outsped by Moth, you do NOT want to get outsped by Moth). Also no Accelerock? If it had a Choice Band it would at least be a decent wallbreaker and able to take advantage of all the pivots.

With no speed control and no special wall (Diancie doesn't count) your team just gets bowled over by Moth once Diancie gets chipped at all or hazards are setup (actually it's not like Diancie threatens Moth back lol), you have no real way to break through a team with AV Ting-Lu and defensive Great Tusk or Hands, and you just die to Chien-Lmao. I actually think Deoxys-D inheriting is actually kinda heat tho (didn't realize it got TP) but this team just auto-loses to so many of the most popular mons/sets. Keep cooking though because wacky sets like this are the lifeblood of OMs imo and are what I love about them compared to standard tiers! (and maybe you'll find a hidden tech :o I rocked Coalossal to incredible success in Godly Gift last gen)

 

[Don Vascus]

Good news everyone!

Inh has a VR now!!!!
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Its a rudimentary one because we are very likely to ban something soon, and I might periodically add sets to the ranked mons.

 

[dhelmise]

with that, inheritance uu is a thing now:

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/uu-om-megathread.3735355/#post-9953236

 

[Iynhe]

I am a bit confused.

As you should XD
I didn't post the team because I thought it's a good team. I lost with it so many times XD But i had other things to think about, so I didn't really try to improve it past a certain point. I just wallowed in low ladder and had a bit of fun.
Next time the format comes around I'll change everything.

Just to answer some things though:
I dislike torrent, but yeah, it would make more sense. I didn't put draco meteor on Latios because I didn't want to forcefully switch after using it once without using NP beforehand. No accelrock because... idk, to be honest. It's much better since so many things outspeeds terrak now (sigh.)

I also love non-classic sets and it's what I love about pokemon in general. I'll keep cooking :P

 

[Talpr0ne]

Blissey (Clefable, Volbeat, Clefairy)
Chansey (Clefable, Volbeat, Clefairy)

This looks weird. Why list essentially the same donor twice? Volbeat over Illumise is also weird since it's the latter that has Wish.
In general the final evolution should be listed as a donor unless the pre-evo has a noteworthy unique ability, or is just banned.
Quagsire should also be listed in every instance over Clodsire because they have a almost identical movepool except Quag has Encore and Clod has some coverage moves nobody cares about like Megahorn and Gunk Shot.

 

[Don Vascus]

This looks weird. Why list essentially the same donor twice? Volbeat over Illumise is also weird since it's the latter that has Wish.
In general the final evolution should be listed as a donor unless the pre-evo has a noteworthy unique ability, or is just banned.
Quagsire should also be listed in every instance over Clodsire because they have a almost identical movepool except Quag has Encore and Clod has some coverage moves nobody cares about like Megahorn and Gunk Shot.

In general in the VR Clefairy means you're running magic guard, and clefable means you're running unaware. This reflects how the game shows it to you, because clefable and Clefairy have the same movepool bar 4 moves, three of which you aren't gonna run.

Volbeat is listed as the prankster donor over illumise because it has seismic toss.

Im not gonna bother with the Clodsire vs quagsire thing, its too pedantic

 

[Don Vascus]

Double post time!

Vote	DOn VasCUS	pannu	anaconja	Clefable	RESULT
Chien-Pao and Weavile	BAN	BAN	BAN	BAN	4-0 BAN

Chien Pao and Weavile are Banned From Inheritance!

​

Since the reintroduction of Triple Axel into the game, and with it Technician Triple Axel, Chien Pao has become one of the scariest pokemon in the tier. Sporting essencially a 180 BP STAB move, it could at least 2hko everything but the bulkiest resists such as Toxapex and Suicune, and Metal Hariyama wielding a bulk boosting ability such as Fur Coat or Intimidate. These checks also have to run Rocky Helmet to deal with it, as Pao could otherwise click its move without punishment, but Cinccino and Ambipom, the main donors for it, learn Knock Off, making it very easy to remove the helmet. Clicking Taxel with your Dark/Ice type has gotten much more better from last generation too. Cinccino, who last gen already sported Bullet Seed to hit bulky Water Types, now also has Tidy Up in its repertoire to become a fearsome sweeper that outruns every viable scarfer in the tier. Ambipom has also the fearsome Beat Up which doesnt do contact and, with proper teambuilding, can reach power levels rivaling Taxel and could go throw what few checks it had. Let us not forget that Pao is the second fastest relevant pokemon in the tier after Deo S. Running Helmet Suicune as your Pao check is as reliable as hoping it misses one and you kill it back. This obcenity is too much for the tier and thus it has been voted to be banned.

Weavile has been grouped with its superior version as it has the same attack, and its still speed ties Darkrai and outspeed most of the metagame. The nature of Inheritance means that it could easily replace Pao and force the exact same situations as before, so we didn't bother to find out if it was less broken or not.

thank you in advance dhelmise for implementing the change


As for whats next, the Inh council is planning to make a suspect for a pokemon who was banned before it could even have the chance to show its full potential, so stay tuned for that.

 

[Don Vascus]

A bit late, but Inheritance is conducting its first suspect test of the generation to free ursaluna back into the tier! Go participate on it!

 

[VannAccessible]

I love this meta. Sadly the ladder isn't very active at the moment. I've been hopping on for suspect laddering off and on the past few days and have only had a scant few battles. I can see getting to 25 being difficult. In theory, Ursaluna seems managable enough. Between being generally slow and squishy on the special side, Unaware walling boosting sets, Fur Coat handling band sets, and Psychic Terrain and Ghosts handling ExtremeSpeed. It's a good donor though and definitely has a place managing HO as the best potential ESpeed user.

Can we talk about how oppressive Iron Moth is? Drought pushes it over the edge into being broken, IMO with VERY few true counters.

Its two best sets:

Iron Moth @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Drought
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Overheat
- Solar Beam / Scorching Sands / Psyshock
- Nasty Plot
- Encore

Iron Moth @ Choice Specs
Ability: Drought
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Overheat
- Solar Beam
- Scorching Sands
- Psyshock

Drought Moth cannot be answered defensively without resorting to pretty specific stuff such as:

RegenVest Latias: Resists both Fire and Psyshock, and can hit back with its own Psyshock or force it out with Future Sight. Only weak to the rate Shadow Ball.

Flash Fire Corviknight with Earthquake: While hilarious as a true check (barring Shadow Ball, again) this leads Corv without consistent recovery and unable to handle the physical attackers its meant to counter.

Levitate / Earth Eater Coalossal: I've seen Coalossal listed as a check, but Scorching Sands exists. So is this a thing? It would be a true counter, but man... this is a very specific use of a team slot. Still, Stealth Rock weak and no recovery.

Magic Guard Moltres: A rare option for a hazard immune Fire type also unbothered by Scorching Sands. Knock Off or TWave are good options against IM. But still look out for Encore.

Sand Stream / Cloud Nine: These abilities could turn off the sun on mons like Swampert, Tyranitar, or Blissey, but they necessitate pretty specific team structures. Blissey still loses to Psyshock and the Sand Streamers hate being burned by Scorching Sands.

Chansey: Can take Moth's hits like a champ, but again, cannot hit back because it does not have offensive stats, and can easily be pressured by hazards since it cannot hold HDBs.

The options get even worse from here.

Ice Scales: IS is a great ability, this is true, but Frosmoth's movepool is as barren as Antarctica and devoid of much of anything to hit Iron Moth back with. It is also reliant on Rest for recovery and also still susceptible to Psyshock and Encore.

Non Latias RegenVesters: Universally chipped by hazards before even considering the other issues. Solar Beam hits waters (which also can't use their STAB with hit Moth for SE damage because of Sun, Psyshock gets stuff that's squishy on the physical side like normal Goodra. Roaring Moon and Ting-Lu hate potential burns from Scorching Sands. Overheat just blasts through non-Fire resistant options like Ting-Lu and Hoodra.

Non-Corv Flash Fire Steels: Scorching Sands.
---------------------

Granted it can’t hit everything at once, but it doesn’t need to. Ultimately, Moth itself isn't even the issue, as Heatran or Chandelure could do the same dumb stuff with the same efficacy against defense. Drought is the problem here. Besides making really stupid fire wallbreakers, it supports its team with Sun, allows Protosynthesis shenanigans. It's not as bad as Drizzle was, but it’s pretty overwhelming.

Thoughts?

 

[Don Vascus]

In order to help people with getting reqs, we have decided to host some suspect tours!

The times for these will be the following (all times in GMT-5)

- Sunday 18 at 2pm

- Wednesday 21 at 5pm

- Friday 23 at 5pm

- Saturday 24 at 1pm (Saturday's daily tour)

Should any of these tours have 8 or more players on it, both the winner and the runner up will get reqs. Othewise, only the winner gets reqs.

I encourage and recommend players to also ladder around the time of these tours as they'll guarantee that people interested on playing will be active. Good luck!